Player Watch Player Watch: Micky van de Ven

[E17yid]

The rebuild is already well under way and has been progressing the last 2 years. We're already at the end of the few windows.

Tbh I don’t even think we need a complete rebuild like most do. Defence needs more attention for sure but I think we have a lot of good players.

I have some concerns about Ange but I love his positive energy and his confidence in his coaching ability to improve players. It’s what we need, sure some need to be moved on but will be interesting to see who he is happy to go after preseason.

 

[Neon_Knight_]

So we didn't spend over €150m to bring in the likes of Lo Celso, Ndombele, Sessegnon and Bergwijn? These were the players that were supposed to take us up another level and bridge the gap.

Granted, only Sess was Prem experienced but it was still a departure from what we had done previously that had clearly worked.

Every time we focus on young up and coming players we make progress, everytime we try to go for thr ready made stars to fill the gaps we flop. In fact, every single spurs star of the modern era has been a player that we have developed and/or brought in under the radar. I can't remember a single big signing that has been successful.

I largely agree, but there have been a few exceptions:
Modric (he had already single-handedly outplayed England)
VDV (OG)
Lloris (already well-established as France no.1 and had been "Ligue 1 Goalkeeper of the Year" in 3 of the past 4 seasons)
Vertonghen (Arsenal also wanted him)
Eriksen (had turned down Europe's elite to prioritise his playing time / development)
Alderweireld (I don't know how Southampton were the only other PL suitors after his very successful loan spell)

You could argue that all of the above weren't quite established as top talents when we signed them (or in VDV's case had fallen out of favour), so perhaps we got in 1-2 years before the "big" club's would have started throwing money at them. This would certainly apply to players like Son, Berbatov & Carrick. It could also apply to VDV Jr., Vicario, Udogie, Kulusevski, Bentancur etc.

We also supposedly came close to players like Hazard, Oscar, Willian, Suarez & Aguero, who were considered some of the top talents in World football, but weren't fully established yet. We supposedly missed out on most of those because we couldn't offer CL football, unlike our rivals who ultimately signed them.

Let's hope VDV Jr. is the the next Super Jan!

 

[mil1lion]

Tbh I don’t even think we need a complete rebuild like most do. Defence needs more attention for sure but I think we have a lot of good players.

I have some concerns about Ange but I love his positive energy and his confidence in his coaching ability to improve players. It’s what we need, sure some need to be moved on but will be interesting to see who he is happy to go after preseason.

Agreed, I think we just need 3 more after Soloman (2 CBs and 1 CM). Our main issue is the bloated squad so just need to trim it down. Then next summer focus most of our energy on a new striker assuming Kane leaves. We need to account for a couple of our current players surprising us under Ange. New signings aren't always necessary when some present ones can improve.

 

[Cornpattbuck]

Central defence has always been about building partnerships and the club seems to have completely forgotten that in recent years despite Jan and Toby hammering the point home not so long ago.

Our centre backs have looked like strangers for awhile now, but I've got a feeling that's the kind of thing Ange will be quick to put right with reinforcements, teamwork and training.

 

[Stamford]

To put this in context the scum bought Saliba for 30m as a future prospect and loaned him out for two years.

we're potentially buying this guy for a similar number after one season of top flight football to start in a defence that just shipped 60. Come on. We need to up our ambition.

 

[robotsonic]

To put this in context the scum bought Saliba for 30m as a future prospect and loaned him out for two years.

we're potentially buying this guy for a similar number after one season of top flight football to start in a defence that just shipped 60. Come on. We need to up our ambition.

We bought Dele for peanuts out of League One. It means nothing.

 

[ButchCassidy]

To put this in context the scum bought Saliba for 30m as a future prospect and loaned him out for two years.

we're potentially buying this guy for a similar number after one season of top flight football to start in a defence that just shipped 60. Come on. We need to up our ambition.

Scum also bought Gabriel for ~€30m after ~one season of top flight football to start in a defense that just shipped ~50 goals - context is what you make of it.

 

[Timberwolf]

To put this in context the scum bought Saliba for 30m as a future prospect and loaned him out for two years.

we're potentially buying this guy for a similar number after one season of top flight football to start in a defence that just shipped 60. Come on. We need to up our ambition.

Real shame we didn't push the boat out for Saliba back then as I'm sure we could've got him if we'd really wanted. I remember watching him at the time and thinking he was the closest thing out there to the next VVD

I think even as an 18/19 year old he could've probably walked into our first 11 given how shite we were at the back. Had an easier route to first team football at Spurs than Arsenal back then, I think.

Anyway, I don't think VdV is ever quite going to be that level of CB, but if he can keep developing his game to match his physical talents he could become very good indeed.

 

[TheChosenOne]

Scum also bought Gabriel for ~€30m after ~one season of top flight football to start in a defense that just shipped ~50 goals - context is what you make of it.

Ben White was £50 mill from Brighton.

 

[ButchCassidy]

Ben White was £50 mill from Brighton.

And yet two players signed for much less start ahead of him at CB.

 

[SuperLuka]

We've already got a new LB (Udogie), plus still have Davies, Sessegnon & Reguilon (+ Perisic, but he's really not a LB) on the books. I have no idea how VDV compares to any of them at LB, but he'd need to be at least second choice there (presumably behind Udogie) to get a meaningful amount of minutes there.
We're unlikely to shift everyone apart from Udogie and it's very possible that Ange will rate one of them enough (perhaps more than VDV!) as our back-up LB.

Udogie is a wingback and not sure he fits Ange system. The other lb options are not good enough.

 

[Neon_Knight_]

Udogie is a wingback and not sure he fits Ange system. The other lb options are not good enough.

I assume you missed what Udogie's agent has said about positive conversations with Ange.

 

[Neon_Knight_]

To put this in context the scum bought Saliba for 30m as a future prospect and loaned him out for two years.

we're potentially buying this guy for a similar number after one season of top flight football to start in a defence that just shipped 60. Come on. We need to up our ambition.

The cost isn't the issue. VDV is at a very different stage of his career than Saliba was.

Saliba signed at the age of 19, while he was only a squad player for a Ligue 1 team and hadn't been selected for his national team yet - i.e. he was a young, raw, unproven talent. He was starting XI for Arsenal at the age of 21.

VDV is 22, a key player for a team in the Bundesliga, and has 11 caps for Netherlands - i.e. older and more proven that Saliba is currently, let alone compared to 2020 Saliba.

 

[EastUpperDK82]

VfL Wolfsburg-news (Kicker)

Two newcomers still without a number: is Zesiger waiting for the Van de Ven transfer ?

New players, new numbers: While Vaclav Cerny and Tiago Tomas have already decided, Cedric Zesiger and Moritz Jenz are still blank on their backs. For a good reason?

If you want to dress up in a new VfL Wolfsburg jersey and have your favorite player's name and number flocked to the shirt, you have to put around 100 euros on the table. Two newcomers with their new shirt numbers are already available in the online fan shop: Vaclav Cerny, the winger signed by Twente Enschede, will wear the 7 in the future. And Tiago Tomas, whose transfer from Sporting Lisbon to VfL was announced on Wednesday, is also with the 11 already available.

What is striking: The two central defenders Cedric Zesiger and Moritz Jenz, who signed with VfL well before the attacking duo, are not yet available. Because the desired numbers are possibly (still) occupied?

Zesiger has played for Young Boys Bern for the past four years and has now said goodbye to Switzerland by winning the double. The 25-year-old made his breakthrough in Bern, and for four years the defender wore the number 5 on his back. The number that currently belongs to Micky van de Ven.

Zwei Neue noch ohne Nummer: Wartet Zesiger auf den Van-de-Ven-Wechsel?

Neue Spieler, neue Nummern: Während sich Vaclav Cerny und Tiago Tomas bereits entschieden haben, sind Cedric Zesiger und Moritz Jenz auf dem Rücken noch blank. Aus gutem Grund?

www.kicker.de

 

[cjsimba]

is this approach - where you line up a deal and have it ready to sign just in case your number one target doesn’t come through - not quite risky?

You’d assume it would really piss Wolfsburg off if we pull out last minute? Surely it would put clubs off dealing with us in future?

imagine if we went through weeks of negotiations with Atletico for PEH only for them to pull out last minute for their top target. We’d be fuming. Why is this any different?

Be good to understand from someone with more knowledge on deals if this approach is common in football or if it’s just us playing a risky and potentially relationship damaging game

 

[Lancaster Spur]

is this approach - where you line up a deal and have it ready to sign just in case your number one target doesn’t come through - not quite risky?

You’d assume it would really piss Wolfsburg off if we pull out last minute? Surely it would put clubs off dealing with us in future?

imagine if we went through weeks of negotiations with Atletico for PEH only for them to pull out last minute for their top target. We’d be fuming. Why is this any different?

Be good to understand from someone with more knowledge on deals if this approach is common in football or if it’s just us playing a risky and potentially relationship damaging game

I guess it just depends how far down the negotiations we go. If everything is ready to go all agreed we just need to say yes then I could see that being rather frustrating from a seller point of view. If we get to the stage where we know what it will take but haven't actually offered it yet, the selling club should not be surprised if the buyer goes elsewhere.

I would think all clubs do this to a greater or lesser degree when lining up deals.

 

[ShriekinKnight]

This account is usually very good with tactical analysis and I'd never made a stylistic comparison between Walker and VdV but that idea gets me a lot more excited about VdV

 

[Joshua]

The cost isn't the issue. VDV is at a very different stage of his career than Saliba was.

Saliba signed at the age of 19, while he was only a squad player for a Ligue 1 team and hadn't been selected for his national team yet - i.e. he was a young, raw, unproven talent. He was starting XI for Arsenal at the age of 21.

VDV is 22, a key player for a team in the Bundesliga, and has 11 caps for Netherlands - i.e. older and more proven that Saliba is currently, let alone compared to 2020 Saliba.

Van de Ven is yet to be capped by the senior Netherlands side. He’s still with the u21’s.

 

[Neon_Knight_]

Van de Ven is yet to be capped by the senior Netherlands side. He’s still with the u21’s.

Thanks for that. I had misread his U21 caps as senior caps

Even so, he's at a different point in his development compared to the 19-year-old Saliba who joined Arsenal, so he's going to be less content with biding his time.

 

[mill]

Thanks a mill !

No worries