PPV Brighton Poll - Did you pay £15

[brasil_spur]

A fairer comparison to US is the NFL Sunday Ticket package, which gives access to all games not on free TV for about $20/mo last time I checked. That's in no way unreasonable, and I suspect based on better market research. I wouldn't be surprised that if they dropped prices in the UK they'd actually improve revenues.

It's actually mental that since they broke Sky's monopoly on game coverage (in order to ensure cheaper prices for people) that we're now paying something like double for the same coverage and that's before we factor in PPV games.

 

[king26]

nope found a stream

 

[Mattspur]

Out of interest, a question (or two) for the people against PPV. Are you saying that the games not selected for TV coverage shouldn’t be on TV at all? Or do you propose another way to watch the games through legal means?

I’d also be interested to know whether those against PPV actually spend money under usual circumstances to specifically watch Spurs such as purchase season or match tickets. Or do they have a Sky TV subscription which includes PL football and stream the games not on TV, but don’t actually regularly pay to watch specific games. Because I think PPV can seem like a good or bad deal depending on how you usually watch Spurs.

 

[rez9000]

Out of interest, a question (or two) for the people against PPV. Are you saying that the games not selected for TV coverage shouldn’t be on TV at all? Or do you propose another way to watch the games through legal means?

I’d also be interested to know whether those against PPV actually spend money under usual circumstances to specifically watch Spurs such as purchase season or match tickets. Or do they have a Sky TV subscription which includes PL football and stream the games not on TV, but don’t actually regularly pay to watch specific games. Because I think PPV can seem like a good or bad deal depending on how you usually watch Spurs.

It's not PPV per se - there are instances when we do pay per view. Every time we go to the movies, for instance or go to a theme park. Personally, I have no problem with paying for a service on occasion. When I go to the movies, if I go to Chessington or Alton Towers I pay for a ticket.

But let me pose an analogy: anyone here ever taken out a Cineworld Card - you know, you pay x amount a month and you can go to the movies as many times as you want?

How would you feel if you rocked up at your local Cineworld, flashed your card for which you've been paying a subscription every month and wanted to see Captain Guardians of the Endgame and they told you, "yeah, sorry, that particular summer blockbuster isn't included in your card anymore, you have to pay extra for that one."?

Now, that's not the situation with football PPV right now... but it inevitably will be. You only have to look to boxing to see that. Whereas previously a boxing match may have set you back say a tenner, now it's around the £50 mark, and that's ignoring the habit of charging to watch it on TV anyway. Now, who are the main purveyors of PPV boxing matches in the UK? Sky and BT, right?. Who have the rights to Premier League football?

The question that should be asked isn't why shouldn't we pay for matches that we didn't have access to before, but rather: "why do we suddenly have access to matches we didn't used to and are being asked to pay extra for them?"

And furthermore, the question of how much one may or may not pay to attend live matches is irrelevant. I understand the thinking, but it's actually a false equivalent. When one shells out for a match or buys a season ticket, you're paying for the live match and the experience of attending the stadium and the atmosphere inside. The ancillary costs are things you know about before buying the ticket - it's part of your calculation as to whether you're going to go or not. It's not supposed to be thought of as a separate inconvenience for which an alternative exists.

Take a hypothetical season ticket holder who lives on Lordship Lane. What's PPV to him / her? They have no worries about transport and parking and food and so forth (lucky bastards!). How do you think it sits with those without those worries?

And while I understand the thinking and totally sympathise with those who are far away and for whom getting to WHL to watch us live isn't easy, PPV isn't about that - it's about getting us to pay more, not pay in exchange. It's like saying to a heroin addict, 'it's such a shame you can't get any heroin right now. Why don't you have some crack while we wait for the supply to pick up again?" It's robbing Peter to pay Paul.

And when the heroin is back in supply again, do you see the drug-dealer stopping pushing the crack and concentrating solely on pushing heroin? No. They'll push both. Do we honestly believe that once the current situation passes, the TV companies / PL will suddenly go "oh, everything's back to normal is it? OK, so, we can dispense with this extra stream of revenue we've set up. Yes siree, we're all about not making as much money as possible here at Sky Towers / BT Centre / North Wharf Road."

Then, you'll have people shelling out hundreds of pounds to go watch Spurs at WHL and paying PPV. It may seem like an acceptable trade-off now, while one is not available, but in a year, in two years, in five years, it will be a very different story, because we've seen it before (with boxing) and we should heed the lessons.

 

[Schoolboy Spurs]

No. Found a stream.

And the stream was HD quality.

 

[TC18]

I just find it a shame that they had a real opportunity to really change the way we view and consume football in this country and they went with an outdated and overly expensive method.

It's certainly not helped them amongst people I know, with a good 6 of us looking and purchasing other methods of viewing ALL PL games in future and cancelling Sky and BT football packages. I will however continue with Sky purely for the 4K picture quality.

 

[andrewt]

to all the people who have bashed us for paying. I will explain my situation. I don't usually go off like this bu5some of things people have said have only selfish views imo

I'm a business owner and a chef so don't have much free time and when I do get the chance to watch games live on TV I want to take it, I separated from my wife 3 years ago and my boy who is 15 didn't talk to me for around 6 months because of the poisen she spouted he has since seen im not a monster and actually lives with me now.. Bales return was a huge thing for us as bale was his idol and still is, its more of a nostalgia thing reminding us both of a time we were happy in the family unit so we both cried at the news of gb return and I had taken every spurs game off work so I could watch all the matches with him once we new he was fit. so I wasn't gonna let sky asking me to pay £15 to rob me of the moment he scored again last night we both leapt around like idiots and cried again but tears of joy.....some people may think thats sad! And maybe they are right but I'm happy I paid and would again for that moment however the show was a shitshow as many have already said no studio no so called pilundits and all the post match stuff was on sky sports news so I couldn't watch that either

 

[rez9000]

to all the people who have bashed us for paying. I will explain my situation. I don't usually go off like this bu5some of things people have said have only selfish views imo

I'm a business owner and a chef so don't have much free time and when I do get the chance to watch games live on TV I want to take it, I separated from my wife 3 years ago and my boy who is 15 didn't talk to me for around 6 months because of the poisen she spouted he has since seen im not a monster and actually lives with me now.. Bales return was a huge thing for us as bale was his idol and still is, its more of a nostalgia thing reminding us both of a time we were happy in the family unit so we both cried at the news of gb return and I had taken every spurs game off work so I could watch all the matches with him once we new he was fit. so I wasn't gonna let sky asking me to pay £15 to rob me of the moment he scored again last night we both leapt around like idiots and cried again but tears of joy.....some people may think thats sad! And maybe they are right but I'm happy I paid and would again for that moment however the show was a shitshow as many have already said no studio no so called pilundits and all the post match stuff was on sky sports news so I couldn't watch that either

How did you know the moment was coming before you paid the £15, Andrew?

Were one of us to debase your story, to say that it wasn't relevant, or that it had no connection with your obvious emotional investment in it, how would you react? Would you trust that person's opinion? Would you feel that that person has any kind of feeling of fellowship with you or for your experience?

I'd never do that. And what's more, I'd be even less likely to try and take advantage of it to line my own pockets. I'd never seek to exploit people's emotional investment in something, be it their family, their club, their job, their situation, to make money out of them when I'm already doing so.

Can you guess at who would, though?

 

[andrewt]

How did you know the moment was coming before you paid the £15, Andrew?

Were one of us to debase your story, to say that it wasn't relevant, or that it had no connection with your obvious emotional investment in it, how would you react? Would you trust that person's opinion? Would you feel that that person has any kind of feeling of fellowship with you or for your experience?

I'd never do that. And what's more, I'd be even less likely to try and take advantage of it to line my own pockets. I'd never seek to exploit people's emotional investment in something, be it their family, their club, their job, their situation, to make money out of them when I'm already doing so.

Can you guess at who would, though?

I didn't know the moment was coming before I paid obviously, I'm not saying for one moment that I agree with the £15 being a good idea and fwiw I won't pay for wba I had my moment and it was great, my point was everyone has their reasons for doing things and felt like It was worth sharing my reason as people were digging people like me out for paying

 

[Archibald&Crooks]

Every match thread someone, usually the same people, complains about the pundits which is about as fucking boring as me moaning about it. actually it's more boring but whatever. Anyway, now, in this very thread, we've had people moaning that there's no pundits! Seriously! If there were they'd only moan about them. You couldn't make it up, but as usual, it's SC so yeah. You could.

 

[JCRD]

to all the people who have bashed us for paying. I will explain my situation. I don't usually go off like this bu5some of things people have said have only selfish views imo

I'm a business owner and a chef so don't have much free time and when I do get the chance to watch games live on TV I want to take it, I separated from my wife 3 years ago and my boy who is 15 didn't talk to me for around 6 months because of the poisen she spouted he has since seen im not a monster and actually lives with me now.. Bales return was a huge thing for us as bale was his idol and still is, its more of a nostalgia thing reminding us both of a time we were happy in the family unit so we both cried at the news of gb return and I had taken every spurs game off work so I could watch all the matches with him once we new he was fit. so I wasn't gonna let sky asking me to pay £15 to rob me of the moment he scored again last night we both leapt around like idiots and cried again but tears of joy.....some people may think thats sad! And maybe they are right but I'm happy I paid and would again for that moment however the show was a shitshow as many have already said no studio no so called pilundits and all the post match stuff was on sky sports news so I couldn't watch that either

Mate, theyre all jealous that you got to watch uninterrupted coverage whilst theyre were all struggling with the fact that I knew we scored 10 mins before they did and spoilt it for them on the match thread. Im gonna do the same again on sunday argh

I just dont understand how the clubs can justify the reputational damage or otherwise base dont he income they will generate from this which cant be much if at all... I mean I really would be interested to know what the clubs have received in terms of income from the PPV

 

[BringBack_leGin]

I appreciate everyone’s reasons for not paying, I really do, and in many cases agree. I did pay, and I helped my dad (he’s not superb with modern tech) order it too. Especially in these locked down times, one of the easiest ways for me to ‘spend time’ with dad, who lives in north London still, is us both watching a Spurs match on TV live while communicating constantly throughout over WhatsApp about every good and bad moment, every annoyance with the ref, every missed chance, and yes, comments made by commentators that annoy us. Then at both half time and full time we have a chat about everything that’s gone on, regardless of result.

In place of attending together as we have done pretty much every home match since I was a small child, ensuring we watch the exact same thing, same comments, timed the same with no delays, same comments, etc etc, as spurious as my reasoning might seem to some, is easily worth the £15 each for the 8-10 matches it’s likely to amount to. While I actually agree with the overall sentiment against ppv football (I won’t even pay the ppv prices for Ufc events given the amount my BT costs each month and that all events had been free, but I love Spurs more than ufc), I get a value from it that I just wouldn’t get off I watched one stream and I had to try and talk my dad, with his bad eyes and genuine struggles with IT, through to finding another.

I hope if ppv gets binned, all matches are brought back for free that would’ve been shown ppv. If they’re not, and we go back to not having some matches shown, I don’t think that’ll be a good result.

Oh and @SUIYHA you have no right to question people’s self respect and call them names like that just because you disagree with their opinion. Bullies like you who try and put shame on people who have alternative beliefs and points of view are the reason the world is the way it is and why there is divisions everywhere. I hope you get banned. I doubt you will be.

 

[jonnyrotten]

Surely they should realise the industry is in a similar position to music 15 years ago. If they cant sort out an affordable and simple solution for high quality content people will take the illegal option. Its a massive risk to the league.

The question is, if the majority are opting to stream illegally, what is the price point for them to actually pay and put some money back into the club? £7.50?

 

['O Zio]

I appreciate everyone’s reasons for not paying, I really do, and in many cases agree. I did pay, and I helped my dad (he’s not superb with modern tech) order it too. Especially in these locked down times, one of the easiest ways for me to ‘spend time’ with dad, who lives in north London still, is us both watching a Spurs match on TV live while communicating constantly throughout over WhatsApp about every good and bad moment, every annoyance with the ref, every missed chance, and yes, comments made by commentators that annoy us. Then at both half time and full time we have a chat about everything that’s gone on, regardless of result.

In place of attending together as we have done pretty much every home match since I was a small child, ensuring we watch the exact same thing, same comments, timed the same with no delays, same comments, etc etc, as spurious as my reasoning might seem to some, is easily worth the £15 each for the 8-10 matches it’s likely to amount to. While I actually agree with the overall sentiment against ppv football (I won’t even pay the ppv prices for Ufc events given the amount my BT costs each month and that all events had been free, but I love Spurs more than ufc), I get a value from it that I just wouldn’t get off I watched one stream and I had to try and talk my dad, with his bad eyes and genuine struggles with IT, through to finding another.

I hope if ppv gets binned, all matches are brought back for free that would’ve been shown ppv. If they’re not, and we go back to not having some matches shown, I don’t think that’ll be a good result.

Oh and @SUIYHA you have no right to question people’s self respect and call them names like that just because you disagree with their opinion. Bullies like you who try and put shame on people who have alternative beliefs and points of view are the reason the world is the way it is and why there is divisions everywhere. I hope you get banned. I doubt you will be.

The thing is though it's not really about whether we get to watch the games. It's about the fact that they're taking advantage of this awful situation we find ourselves in to test the waters to see how much more they can get away with.

They're banking on the fact that enough people like you will find ways to justify it to themselves and cough up anyway and then before you know it in 5 years time all the headline fixtures like the NLD will be charged at 25 quid PPV on top of your Sky subscription. For the time being it's just the games that wouldn't be on TV otherwise but this is very much the thin end of the wedge and people need to wake the fuck up and realise that.

People need to stop paying this now. Is missing out Spurs Vs fucking Brighton really such a price to pay to nip this in the bud before it's too late?

 

[Tiberius Gracchus]

The thing is though it's not really about whether we get to watch the games. It's about the fact that they're taking advantage of this awful situation we find ourselves in to test the waters to see how much more they can get away with.

They're banking on the fact that enough people like you will find ways to justify it to themselves and cough up anyway and then before you know it in 5 years time all the headline fixtures like the NLD will be charged at 25 quid PPV on top of your Sky subscription. For the time being it's just the games that wouldn't be on TV otherwise but this is very much the thin end of the wedge and people need to wake the fuck up and realise that.

People need to stop paying this now. Is missing out Spurs Vs fucking Brighton really such a price to pay to nip this in the bud before it's too late?

Although I agree with what you said (and I won't be paying PPV) I also think people should spend their money as they fit

 

['O Zio]

Although I agree with what you said (and I won't be paying PPV) I also think people should spend their money as they fit

In most cases I would agree, but the ttrouble in this instance is that them doing so is going to negatively impact everyone in a couple of years time. Most people paying seem to think it's only a temporary thing that won't do any harm but that couldn't be further from the truth. They may be happy to pay 15 quid now because of lockdown and whatever sob story they've got but will they still be happy when they have to pay for a sky subscription just to get all the shit games and then pay PPV for all the big matches in a couple of years time. Maybe some people will still be happy with that in which case, go ahead, but I suspect most people just aren't thinking about the reprocussions properly

 

[Dannyspur]

A Sky day pass from NOW tv is £9.99 with the possibility of seeing 3 or 4 live games over a 24hour period - so £15 for one match seems like taking the piss. If had made it a fiver, they would probably have made more in the long run. Using the numbers in the poll, those who paid generated £585 for Sky and if say two thirds who didn't pay and all those that did had paid £5 they would have made £1086.

.

 

[Mattspur]

It's not PPV per se - there are instances when we do pay per view. Every time we go to the movies, for instance or go to a theme park. Personally, I have no problem with paying for a service on occasion. When I go to the movies, if I go to Chessington or Alton Towers I pay for a ticket.

But let me pose an analogy: anyone here ever taken out a Cineworld Card - you know, you pay x amount a month and you can go to the movies as many times as you want?

How would you feel if you rocked up at your local Cineworld, flashed your card for which you've been paying a subscription every month and wanted to see Captain Guardians of the Endgame and they told you, "yeah, sorry, that particular summer blockbuster isn't included in your card anymore, you have to pay extra for that one."?

Now, that's not the situation with football PPV right now... but it inevitably will be. You only have to look to boxing to see that. Whereas previously a boxing match may have set you back say a tenner, now it's around the £50 mark, and that's ignoring the habit of charging to watch it on TV anyway. Now, who are the main purveyors of PPV boxing matches in the UK? Sky and BT, right?. Who have the rights to Premier League football?

The question that should be asked isn't why shouldn't we pay for matches that we didn't have access to before, but rather: "why do we suddenly have access to matches we didn't used to and are being asked to pay extra for them?"

And furthermore, the question of how much one may or may not pay to attend live matches is irrelevant. I understand the thinking, but it's actually a false equivalent. When one shells out for a match or buys a season ticket, you're paying for the live match and the experience of attending the stadium and the atmosphere inside. The ancillary costs are things you know about before buying the ticket - it's part of your calculation as to whether you're going to go or not. It's not supposed to be thought of as a separate inconvenience for which an alternative exists.

Take a hypothetical season ticket holder who lives on Lordship Lane. What's PPV to him / her? They have no worries about transport and parking and food and so forth (lucky bastards!). How do you think it sits with those without those worries?

And while I understand the thinking and totally sympathise with those who are far away and for whom getting to WHL to watch us live isn't easy, PPV isn't about that - it's about getting us to pay more, not pay in exchange. It's like saying to a heroin addict, 'it's such a shame you can't get any heroin right now. Why don't you have some crack while we wait for the supply to pick up again?" It's robbing Peter to pay Paul.

And when the heroin is back in supply again, do you see the drug-dealer stopping pushing the crack and concentrating solely on pushing heroin? No. They'll push both. Do we honestly believe that once the current situation passes, the TV companies / PL will suddenly go "oh, everything's back to normal is it? OK, so, we can dispense with this extra stream of revenue we've set up. Yes siree, we're all about not making as much money as possible here at Sky Towers / BT Centre / North Wharf Road."

Then, you'll have people shelling out hundreds of pounds to go watch Spurs at WHL and paying PPV. It may seem like an acceptable trade-off now, while one is not available, but in a year, in two years, in five years, it will be a very different story, because we've seen it before (with boxing) and we should heed the lessons.

Thanks for the reply, though you didn't address either of the questions i raised, a appreciate the effort made.

Your Ciniworld analogy is not particularly accurate in my view. It would be more like having a Ciniworld card which allowed you to watch 2 movies a day and you turning up to a 3rd and getting upset that you had to pay for it even though you knew all along that only 2 movies were included. I suppose if you really wanted to see that film but didn't want to pay, you could find it online somewhere, but the experience wouldn't be as good. That's exactly what's going on here with PPV. You can still watch it online if that's what you want, and for matches not involving Spurs I certainly wouldn't pay extra for them. But for my team I'm happy to pay for a better experience.

I will only start worrying about PPV getting out of control when they start putting headline matches on PPV rather than the subscription channels. Who knows what the future holds, but whilst the biggest football clubs may want to continue with PPV after COVID I think the rest of the league will want to get fans back into stadiums and PPV would severely hinder that process so I can't see it continuing.

As to not be hypocritical I'll answer your question of "why do we suddenly have access to matches we didn't used to and are being asked to pay extra for them?" The reason is that stadiums are currently closed due to COVID-19 so the clubs don't have the usual problem of "if the games are on TV fans won't come to the stadium" the reason we are being asked to pay "extra" for them is because you've never paid for them in the first place. These games were never due to be televised and do not form part of any of the packages the PL sold to broadcasters. No one had the rights to show these games. You have not paid one single penny to see a second of live football in any of these matches. Do you expect to watch the games for free?

In regards to PPV, I think the PL made a massive marketing mistake in allowing all the matches to be shown on TV after the restart of the COVID break because essentially they gave their product away for free. Now people just expect it to continue and begrudge having to pay for something they got for free for a short time, rather than thinking how great it was that the PL gave them free football.

 

[yido_number1]

My dad did and I happened to pop round when the match started

I hope you're not in the London lockdown areas? No interhouse mingling!

 

[The Scarecrow]

The 17 people that voted yes remind me of the gimp character in Pulp Fiction

Have some self-respect.

Let people spend their own money however they may like ffs.