Ratings vs West Brom

[Borks]

Have a day off will ya and spare us all from this monotonous drivel that you spill on a daily basis.

Sorry mate, he was excellent last night, loved that ball he decided not to go for when the keeper came out and headed it.

 

[JonnySpurs]

Not gonna bother with individual ratings as I don't think it matters in the grand scheme of things.

We were absolutely brilliant in the 1st half and should've been at least 2-0 by HT. Maybe that led to some complacency in the 2nd half because WBA stepped up a gear and we simply didn't. It actually a lot like Spurs olf old at times and I often felt like their goal was coming. I'm disappointed that Poch didn't try to change something but for the most part I feel like we were more unlucky than anything else. How Kane's chance didn't go in I'll never know and I honestly don't feel like Lamela could've done much better with his attempt that hit the post. On a different day we've won that game 3-0.

Dembele was masterful.
Back 4 all largely did their jobs to good effect.
Felt like Hugo could've done better with the goal. Sometimes it feels like he can lost amongst the giants on corners.
Eriksen was his usual quality self.
Dier seemed to struggle at times but still did a lot of good. Hope his injury isn't bad, walked off so that's promising.
Lamela grafted as always but lacked a final ball. Doesn't cross enough IMO but also so unlucky not to score.
Kane also unlucky not to score. Great work in 1st half but became isolated in 2nd half.

It aint over til it's over, either way it's been an awesome season.

 

[Japhet]

Gave it to Danny Rose who, for me, just shaded it from Moussa. Rose is always up for a scrap and we could have done with more of that last night.

 

[JimmyG2]

Let me know when I can stop laughing you utterly boring ****.

Does that mean that Christian and I are both on your hate list.
I am privileged to be in the same category as our best player.
Keep Calm and Carry On Laughing.

**** I may be. Boring I sincerely hope not.

 

[Drink!Drink!]

Shout outs for rose and dembele

I thought not having another proper striker as an option to support Kane really hurt us last night, we've been so lucky in generally getting away with this, but winning the actual title with one striker- reality bit tonight

 

[Wheeler Dealer]

Dembele was MOM.. Alli was largely ineffective. Lamela was OK, but never really looks like being the game changer we all were hoping for. Eriksen was great first half, didn't get the same level of space and time second half.
When we needed to change game, this is where we are exposed, as Chadli, Son and Mason are unlikely to add the desire level of quality to change game in our favour.. This is where our squad depth, albeit OK doesn't deliver the impact strategy other clubs enjoy.

 

[cliff jones]

Come on then @cliff jones @davidmatzdorf @boris @UpTownSpur, you've all rated my post as spam (not that I care about ratings as you can probably tell from my overall ratings), I'd love to hear your thoughts on how great Eriksen was and how terrible Lamela was. I suspect your replies will have some mentions of "involved in everything" or "lots of running" despite being myths but we'll wait and see.

I guess this comes off as I actually care about ratings but it's more about wondering what those who do actually think (does that make sense?).

I will give you the courtesy of a response.i find your constant quibbling about Eriksen this and Lamela that fkin tiresome. You don't really say anything new each time. We are all gutted today, did enough to win the game but fine margins at both ends meant we missed out. I think both players have been great lately, and I'm proud we have them in our team. Both came perilously close last night, such a shame...

Dembele mom, awesome.

 

[cliff jones]

Shout outs for rose and dembele

I thought not having another proper striker as an option to support Kane really hurt us last night, we've been so lucky in generally getting away with this, but winning the actual title with one striker- reality bit tonight

I think your post says it all really. There have been several,drawn home games this year where we've run out of ideas facing the parked bus in the last twenty mins. Rotating the wide forwards from the 65 min mark doesn't seem to cut it. A second cf to make two up top may well have made the difference. Not to mention of course the option to keep Kane fresher by starting alternative cf particularly in the cups.

Because Kane is indestructible we've rather got away with it this season, but injury and or loss of form can strike at any time.

This risk just has to be managed responsibly by getting a high level cf in ready to start training when the euros are over and done with. I think Arnie at Stoke could be a great signing, but I doubt they'd deal, as of course Wham won't over Sakho. Might well mean we have to shop in France.

 

[jonathanhotspur]

After our goal I felt a weird complacent vibe in the team/crowd . We've won so much recently ,so we all thought 'here we go again '. We came so close to scoring another too . Home and dry we thought .

One thing not mentioned in this thread is the complete change in WBA tactics for the 2nd half . There was an article on the front page on how to beat Spurs tactically and Pulis followed it to the letter 2nd half . High press us and we stop playing , simple as that .
http://www.premierleague.com/en-gb/...40416-talking-tactics-spurs-vs-west-brom.html

We conceded a goal ...and for the last 20 mins ....we failed to create another chance !! Spam did the same to us . We don't seem to have the tactics/personnel to counteract it . The whole league will have observed and learned from our discomfort . Personally I think we need new and highly skilled blood in the window to break through the high presses we are inevitably going to face next season .Plain gritty hard work aint gonna do it imo .

Weird match of 2 halves Dembo Mom (8)

Funny, I had read that article before the game, too. And what a great article it is. As much as I hate Pulis, you have to give them some credit for how they made life so awkward for us in that second half.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

After our goal I felt a weird complacent vibe in the team/crowd . We've won so much recently ,so we all thought 'here we go again '. We came so close to scoring another too . Home and dry we thought .

One thing not mentioned in this thread is the complete change in WBA tactics for the 2nd half . There was an article on the front page on how to beat Spurs tactically and Pulis followed it to the letter 2nd half . High press us and we stop playing , simple as that .
http://www.premierleague.com/en-gb/...40416-talking-tactics-spurs-vs-west-brom.html

We conceded a goal ...and for the last 20 mins ....we failed to create another chance !! Spam did the same to us . We don't seem to have the tactics/personnel to counteract it . The whole league will have observed and learned from our discomfort . Personally I think we need new and highly skilled blood in the window to break through the high presses we are inevitably going to face next season .Plain gritty hard work aint gonna do it imo .

Weird match of 2 halves Dembo Mom (8)

I actually did mention, and I and @mpickard2087 have both mentioned a few times previously how both our CM's but particularly Dier aren't always great when teams decide to press us higher. Dembele was better last night, but Dier, not for the first time (West Ham, Liverpool away going all the way back to the West Brom away and Stoke home games as examples) does not like being pressed. He is not designed to take the ball under duress, drop a shoulder and play a ball that breaks the press. He wants the ball in space and with time. When the opposition press he tends to retreat into the back line to find that space, it drags the whole team backwards and we end up with very stretched games. If Dier were the type to be able to "play make" from deep i.e.,pick up the ball under pressure and play a quick incisive pass that breaks the lines and launches a counter it would mitigate more.

I very much agree with the complacency thing, I said exactly the same at half time in the match thread. You could sense it and virtually the same thing happened in the away game to Wset Brom if I remember correctly.

There is so much right about Poch, but there are times when his in game management could be better. You could see that second half getting further away from any control, he might not have been able to halt it, but it would have nice to see him try, and make a tactical alteration that at least could be seen as a logical attempt to counter the slide, even if it failed.

 

[Gilzeanking]

I If Dier were the type to be able to "play make" from deep i.e.,pick up the ball under pressure and play a quick incisive pass that breaks the lines and launches a counter it would mitigate more.
You could see that second half getting further away from any control, Poch might not have been able to halt it,
, ..but it would have nice to see him try, and make a tactical alteration that at least could be seen as a logical attempt to counter the slide, even if it failed.

¥es , around the time Rondon narrowly missed with the header it seemed clear that we needed a change .

Wimmer into the back 4, Verts into the Dier role ? ( Getting Verts on to the ball more being my pet subject....! )

 

[jonathanhotspur]

I actually did mention, and I and @mpickard2087 have both mentioned a few times previously how both our CM's but particularly Dier aren't always great when teams decide to press us higher. Dembele was better last night, but Dier, not for the first time (West Ham, Liverpool away going all the way back to the West Brom away and Stoke home games as examples) does not like being pressed. He is not designed to take the ball under duress, drop a shoulder and play a ball that breaks the press. He wants the ball in space and with time. When the opposition press he tends to retreat into the back line to find that space, it drags the whole team backwards and we end up with very stretched games. If Dier were the type to be able to "play make" from deep i.e.,pick up the ball under pressure and play a quick incisive pass that breaks the lines and launches a counter it would mitigate more.

I very much agree with the complacency thing, I said exactly the same at half time in the match thread. You could sense it and virtually the same thing happened in the away game to Wset Brom if I remember correctly.

There is so much right about Poch, but there are times when his in game management could be better. You could see that second half getting further away from any control, he might not have been able to halt it, but it would have nice to see him try, and make a tactical alteration that at least could be seen as a logical attempt to counter the slide, even if it failed.

I am not convinced that complacency was an issue last night. I thought it was more anxiety, if anything.

Also, I think our bench looks consistently weak in the attacking department.

 

[Gilzeanking]

I am not convinced that complacency was an issue last night. I thought it was more anxiety, if anything.

.

Towards the end yes John , but after our goal and before they scored..

 

[talkshowhost86]

Lloris - 6 - One great save but unfortunately looked weak for the goal.

Walker - 5 - Defended reasonably and drove forwards well, but as is often the problem (or certainly used to be be) he didn't deliver a lot in terms of end-product.

Rose - 7 - Got into more useful positions than Walker and deserved an assist really. Defended well but guilt as everyone else in giving the ball away in the second half.

Vertonghen - 6 - Defended well but couldn't cope that well with the pressing in the second half.

Alderweireld - 7 - Did his best to carry us forwards and didn't do too much wrong.

Dier - 5 - Did well in the first half but as others have said, when they started to press he faded, and by the time he went off injured he wasn't contributing much at all.

Dembele - 8 - Our best player and the only one who looked like creating anything in the second half. Still wish he'd shift it a bit quicker though sometimes.

Lamela - 6 - Worked hard but didn't really deliver much. Took ages on the ball at times when quicker thinking might have got us in on goal.

Alli - 5 - Poor performance after the first 10 minutes. Again doesn't deal well with pressure and seemed very reluctant to shoot. Might be time for a rest for him.

Eriksen - 6 - Saw a lot of the ball, but in dropping repeatedly into midfield we lost a creative force further forwards. If he's going to play there, then we needed Son on earlier in place of Dier or Dembele.

Kane - 5 - Very poor by his high standards. May as well have not been on the pitch in the second half.


Overall we simply didn't cope with the pressure. The crowd got very nervous when we didn't score early, and whilst we did manage to get a goal that nervousness seemed to creep onto the pitch in the second half and we were absolutely dreadful. Poch was very slow to try and do anything about it and ultimately we were a bit lucky not to lose the game.

It's a shame, and ultimately the end of the title bid, but this team has a lot more in it and a nervy performance is perhaps understandable in such a young team.

 

[jonathanhotspur]

I must admit that I feel we were shafted by the tv schedule and I also believe that Leicester are doped to the eyeballs.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

I am not convinced that complacency was an issue last night. I thought it was more anxiety, if anything.

Also, I think our bench looks consistently weak in the attacking department.

Towards the end on the first half I definitely felt there was an element of complacency, for the first 30-35 minutes things had been so easy, we were pinging it about, then all of a sudden they stirred and we didn't react the right way, I think a mindset had set in that wasn't quite able to adapt to what was happening, a new threat. I think complacency gave way to anxiety and that anxiety grew as the game wore on.

At times like that I think Poch could show better tactical leadership, he is clearly a good leader in so many ways, as a coach, but you also need that tactical game management leadership at times too, and he's sometimes found a bit wanting. It's a bit all or nothing at times, sometimes you need a bit of pragmatism.

I don't even think he needed to make subs, just re-shape maybe - and it should be something that is worked on in training. When "x" situation happens in game, we adapt our shape/tactics to "y" etc.

You can admire the ethos that sees us kill off ManU 3-0 and Stoke 4-0, but last night was not like those games, clearly we had lost control and there has to be situations where you go for the more pragmatic approach, change shape, stay compact, smother the game, not allow it to get wide open.

It's tough, Poch is still a relatively young coach, early in his career, lots of lessons to learn, I'd much rather his "coached" strengths than say an Pullis/Allardyce "tactical" bias and I know so few managers/coaches excel in both areas.

Just we've seen this a few times with us and sometimes his in game solutions add to the problem not address it. Last night he just didn't really do anything.

 

[UpTownSpur]

Come on then @cliff jones @davidmatzdorf @boris @UpTownSpur, you've all rated my post as spam (not that I care about ratings as you can probably tell from my overall ratings), I'd love to hear your thoughts on how great Eriksen was and how terrible Lamela was. I suspect your replies will have some mentions of "involved in everything" or "lots of running" despite being myths but we'll wait and see.

I guess this comes off as I actually care about ratings but it's more about wondering what those who do actually think (does that make sense?).

I don't often give Spam ratings but felt you deserved it. You made no argument, gave no specific examples of what either player did or didn't do. You'd have written the same thing whatever the score. This kind of thing is what I call "Radical Lamelaism". Hypercritism of other players seen as direct competitors to Lamela, combined with an intolerance of anything negative said about Lamela. I've never quite got it to honest and have always stood up against it. Both players performances have been well and accurately described in this thread so I have nothing to add.

 

[whitesocks]

I gave it to Rose, but Dembele was really good, and if Eriksen had sunk some of his chances then he would have been MOTM by far.

Dier was OK and quite busy - he has had worse games where he has genuinely vanished. But there was none of that snappy forward passing to Eriksen we saw so much of in the first half of the season.
I guess he sensed danger and switched to defensive mode. He has been doing quite a bit of this lately, but we have our defensive record for a reason so his instincts may well be right.
Those posters wanting him out might just get their wish now, and I fear it will be made very clear how important he is.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

But I'm not talking about the United or Stoke games.

But you were the one who first brought up what Lamela did at the Etihad ? What did that have to do with anything I said ?

You're the one who talks twice in one post about the most successful passes in the game, I'm questioning the relevance of that in a game where we draw 1-1 at home to West Brom.

The relevance is about what Eriksen is contributing to the game as a whole.

I'm not having a dig at Eriksen but obviously you feel it necessary to question what I see when watching our players.

This conversation didn't start with me questioning what you see when watching players, it started when you questioned why I was referencing how much Eriksen saw the ball.

Also, it's his job to be the creative player and provide those killer through balls. It's like claiming nobody has made more saves than Hugo for us this season. When Eriksen stars offering the same defensive protection that Lamela does or the same goal threat as Alli then maybe we start putting him on a pedestal for the most assists.

It's nothing like claiming nobody has made more saves than Hugo. It's about evaluating individual contribution and putting that individual contribution in the context of the team dynamic. Lamella gets praise for his work off the ball, Alli gets praise for his goals, why shouldn't Eriksen get praised for his creativity and contribution with the ball?

For the record, last night, Eriksen made as many tackles and interceptions as Alli and Lamela put together. Eriksen offers good defensive protection, without being a tenacious tackler, he covers ground and presses intelligently, he also offers himself for the ball, which is another valuable form of defence, it takes effort, intelligence and willingness to move to give a team mate an option, another reason why him seeing more of it than anyone is something of merit worth mentioning. He also created a great chance for Lamela.

I really don't get what your gripe was with what I said.

 

[shelfboy68]

Not gonna bother with individual ratings as I don't think it matters in the grand scheme of things.

We were absolutely brilliant in the 1st half and should've been at least 2-0 by HT. Maybe that led to some complacency in the 2nd half because WBA stepped up a gear and we simply didn't. It actually a lot like Spurs olf old at times and I often felt like their goal was coming. I'm disappointed that Poch didn't try to change something but for the most part I feel like we were more unlucky than anything else. How Kane's chance didn't go in I'll never know and I honestly don't feel like Lamela could've done much better with his attempt that hit the post. On a different day we've won that game 3-0.

Dembele was masterful.
Back 4 all largely did their jobs to good effect.
Felt like Hugo could've done better with the goal. Sometimes it feels like he can lost amongst the giants on corners.
Eriksen was his usual quality self.
Dier seemed to struggle at times but still did a lot of good. Hope his injury isn't bad, walked off so that's promising.
Lamela grafted as always but lacked a final ball. Doesn't cross enough IMO but also so unlucky not to score.
Kane also unlucky not to score. Great work in 1st half but became isolated in 2nd half.

It aint over til it's over, either way it's been an awesome season.

In the managers defence i dont know what else he could have done because i dont believe we have enough or any real game changers to come off the bench.
We dont have a super sub or anyone to unlock banked defences as yet and it was a real shame that we didnt push harder for berahino or someone like that to give us another option.
Luckily kane has stayed fit and the conditioning at the club has led to fewer injuries which has been a major part in our consistancy this term, hopefully the champions league qualification might result in some decent spending on quality additions it probably wont happen but if it does then we can do well across all fronts next year.