Spurs U21’s, U18’s and other youth news – 2015/16 Edition

[edson]

Does anyone have a clue what's happening with Ryan Loft contract wise? He hasn't made any breakthrough at Braintree, where he has been on work experience, and he hasn't even been making any appearances for our U18s or U21s, which his loan allows for. Windy suggested he'd heard the lad had received an additional year on his scholarship. I had high hopes for him when I first saw him as a 15 year old. Big, strong, powerful but with good technique in and around the penalty box. In a strange way he reminded me of Defoe, his link up play outside the box was poor, his control often let him down and his hold up play needed a lot of work but his touch seemed to get better the closer he got to goal. He protected the ball well and knew to shoot early and with power to beat the keeper. He looked like with the right coaching he could really kick on. Sadly, if anything, he's regressed. It wouldn't surprise me if he left this summer or the next.

Not a fan myself I find he gets dominated buy CB his own size far too often and is not the best finisher in the world,he does have a good shot on him and but his all round game is not where it should be and if you was to offer me Loft or Lee Barnard at the same age I would take Barnard all day long.

 

[BehindEnemyLines]

Liverpool 2-0 Down against Swansea. Their defense is terrible. I don't know why Kevin Stewart can be included in their starting line up. Reasonable for us to release him

It'll be just like Istanbul don't you know!

 

[Spurzinho]

Not a fan myself I find he gets dominated buy CB his own size far too often and is not the best finisher in the world,he does have a good shot on him and but his all round game is not where it should be and if you was to offer me Loft or Lee Barnard at the same age I would take Barnard all day long.

Interesting comparison. I always liked Barnard but he was criminally misused until he was about twenty. Up until then, despite being small and lightweight he was, for some inexplicable reason, used as a target man. It wasn't until Glenn Hoddle & Colin Calderwood left and Clive Allen got his hands on him that he converted him into the lethal poacher that he became.

 

[edson]

Interesting comparison. I always liked Barnard but he was criminally misused until he was about twenty. Up until then, despite being small and lightweight he was, for some inexplicable reason, used as a target man. It wasn't until Glenn Hoddle & Colin Calderwood left and Clive Allen got his hands on him that he converted him into the lethal poacher that he became.

I do not like criticizing young players but two player who have got to me this season are Sterling and Loft both have been given a massive opportunity and the backing they need to make it but both are falling short of the improvements they need to be making at this stage of their development and will need to make a massive improvement next year.

 

[edson]

Interesting comparison. I always liked Barnard but he was criminally misused until he was about twenty. Up until then, despite being small and lightweight he was, for some inexplicable reason, used as a target man. It wasn't until Glenn Hoddle & Colin Calderwood left and Clive Allen got his hands on him that he converted him into the lethal poacher that he became.

People talk about Chris Ramsey being a good Coach at Tottenham but for me his job was made a lot easier by Clive Allen who done a top job before Ramsey took over.

 

[Spursidol]

Liverpool 2-0 Down against Swansea. Their defense is terrible. I don't know why Kevin Stewart can be included in their starting line up. Reasonable for us to release him

Think Swansea felt the need to turn up after taking off last weekend v Leicester. Was sorry in many ways to see Kevin Stewart leave, but thought he had a low probability of getting close to our first team squad, happy for him to have gone to Liverpool as it just demonstrates more than anything else how our youth set up compares to Liverpool's - although it has certainly improved under Inglethorpe - and happy to see him inn Liverpool first team as it emphasises Liverpool's problems despite spending megabucks.

 

[Spurzinho]

Clive divided opinion. His coaching seems to have been fairly good; at least ex-players seem to be grateful for his input. I know Jenas, Huddlestone, O'Hara and a few others from that vintage spoke glowingly of him. Barnard's development was in no small part down to Allen. Where I think he rubbed some people up the wrong way was in his team management. I seem to remember Windy having some issues with his style. I don't think Allen was cut out for leadership roles, but was a fairly astute technical and attacking coach.

Ramsey...I never really bought into. The players certainly didn't seem to respect him, at least not the ones I heard from. Ramsey was working with some very good young players and at a time when McDermott was lifting the prestige of our academy but how much Ramsey actually contributed I don't know. As, I say, was never a fan.

 

[Spursidol]

Clive divided opinion. His coaching seems to have been fairly good; at least ex-players seem to be grateful for his input. I know Jenas, Huddlestone, O'Hara and a few others from that vintage spoke glowingly of him. Barnard's development was in no small part down to Allen. Where I think he rubbed some people up the wrong way was in his team management. I seem to remember Windy having some issues with his style. I don't think Allen was cut out for leadership roles, but was a fairly astute technical and attacking coach.

Ramsey...I never really bought into. The players certainly didn't seem to respect him, at least not the ones I heard from. Ramsey was working with some very good young players and at a time when McDermott was lifting the prestige of our academy but how much Ramsey actually contributed I don't know. As, I say, was never a fan.

Interesting comment on Ramsey. The u21's looked very good when Sherwood/Ramsey/Ferdinand were in charge (mind you with a good squad - Mason , Carroll et al) and I always assumed it was Ramsey who was the main technical coach there.

Clive used to bark orders as an old style coach, and it was that which seemed to be the issue.

 

[edson]

Interesting comment on Ramsey. The u21's looked very good when Sherwood/Ramsey/Ferdinand were in charge (mind you with a good squad - Mason , Carroll et al) and I always assumed it was Ramsey who was the main technical coach there.

Clive used to bark orders as an old style coach, and it was that which seemed to be the issue.

Remember Clive at Stevenage giving Tomáš Pekhart a bollocking for being too soft and Clive was right as a matter of fact Clive would often go Berserk at Pekhart I just got the feeling Clive did not rate him.

 

[Spurzinho]

Remember Clive at Stevenage giving Tomáš Pekhart a bollocking for being too soft and Clive was right as a matter of fact Clive would often go Berserk at Pekhart I just got the feeling Clive did not rate him.

To be fair Pekhart was soft, and lazy, and a bit of a donkey. I can completely understand someone of Clive's calibre pulling his hair out. It was a strange piece of recruitment. There were some very good young Czech prospects around at that time but we brought in the most immobile, one dimensional and unmotivated of them. I suspect he was brought in because Jol was a fan of the big man-small man front two, as evidenced by the Mido-Keano partnership and the Berbatov-Keano partnership and the aborted Rasiak-Keano partnership. We didn't have anyone coming through who could do that role and so we identified a six foot four lampost impressionist from the balkans. You live and learn. Pekhart had some moderate success back in the Czech Republic (soon to be Czechia, apparently) but totally bombed out in Germany for both Nurnberg & Ingolstadt. He's currently playing for AEK Athens.

 

[Shea]

Having lost Inglethorpe to Liverpool and with the likes of Ugo in our youth management set up now days

How do we compare to days gone by? Are we lacking for quality men in charge of our young talent? Or do we have new guys in as good if not better than those who have left?

Sorry if it's a stupid question but my knowledge of our youth set up only extends to the occasional view in this thread and I am basically wondering if our best youth prospect are in capable hands to give them the best development chance or if we need to improve this area since Liverpool employed Inglethorpe

 

[edson]

To be fair Pekhart was soft, and lazy, and a bit of a donkey. I can completely understand someone of Clive's calibre pulling his hair out. It was a strange piece of recruitment. There were some very good young Czech prospects around at that time but we brought in the most immobile, one dimensional and unmotivated of them. I suspect he was brought in because Jol was a fan of the big man-small man front two, as evidenced by the Mido-Keano partnership and the Berbatov-Keano partnership and the aborted Rasiak-Keano partnership. We didn't have anyone coming through who could do that role and so we identified a six foot four lampost impressionist from the balkans. You live and learn. Pekhart had some moderate success back in the Czech Republic (soon to be Czechia, apparently) but totally bombed out in Germany for both Nurnberg & Ingolstadt. He's currently playing for AEK Athens.

Agree,can you tell me what you see in Loft because Pekhart is probably a better comparison than Barnard I used earlier both have a powerful shot but that is about it for me.

 

[Spurzinho]

Matt Wells & Kieran McKenna are both very highly rated young coaches. They're also both ex-Spurs who didn't manage to play professionally; McKenna because of career ending injury. After retirement McKenna earned his qualifications at Lougborough Uni & managed their team with success. Wells coached at the Nike academy and was winning plaudits for his work there.

Ehiogu, I don't think, is winning friends and influencing people. I'm not sure if he had any other coaching experience before joining as U14 coach, from there he became U16 coach and from there very quickly moved up to U21 level. Its probably been too much, too quick.

McDermott is one of the most highly rated Heads of Youth Development in the country and quite possibly beyond.

Another young Spur is coaching our youth keepers in Rob Burch. Don't know how well he's doing.

There are a number of ex-pro's coaching our schoolboys but there's no way to judge their performance from the outside.

 

[Spurzinho]

Agree,can you tell me what you see in Loft because Pekhart is probably a better comparison than Barnard I used earlier both have a powerful shot but that is about it for me.

Loft looked, to me, like a young Connor WIckham, back when Wickham was at Ipswich and pulling up trees. I always believed if we had got our hands on Wickham instead of Sunderland then he could have amounted to something. Loft is a hell of a lot more mobile than Pekhart ever was and Loft is a better finisher as well. He moved the ball out of his feet well, protected it well, held off defenders well, got off his shots well. There's still time for Loft but the last two years of development seem to have been an opportunity missed.

 

[edson]

Loft looked, to me, like a young Connor WIckham, back when Wickham was at Ipswich and pulling up trees. I always believed if we had got our hands on Wickham instead of Sunderland then he could have amounted to something. Loft is a hell of a lot more mobile than Pekhart ever was and Loft is a better finisher as well. He moved the ball out of his feet well, protected it well, held off defenders well, got off his shots well. There's still time for Loft but the last two years of development seem to have been an opportunity missed.

Must be me because others seem to like him,will have to see how he does next season.

 

[Spursidol]

lloris
vorm (maybe)
walker (probably)
kwp
yedlin
alderweireld
vertonghen
wimmer
rose
davies
dier
dembele
alli
onomah
lamela
chadli (maybe)
son
kane

will all miss most of pre-season. mason will probably be recovering from surgery and i think ogilvie will still be out injured too so that leaves us with:

mcgee
trippier
ccv
fazio (if he's still here)
ball
bentaleb
carroll
ward
winks
pritchard
eriksen
njie

barely enough to field a team so there should be plenty of opportunities for the youngsters at least in the first few weeks, i'd particularly like to see amos, edwards and harrison get some game time.

The Pre-season is certainly going to be fun !

The Euros 2016 round of 16 will be on 25th to 27th June (and I can't; believe England and Belgium won't get at least that far) with quarter finals 30 June -3 July (historically that can be where England get knocked out in WC tournaments) whilst the final itself isn't until 10 July.

The players will want a 3 week break after that (no time to take a break before Euros 2016) so the players involved in Euros 2016 will be back to start training at the earliest 22 July and possibly as late as 31 July.

Meanwhile in Australia we play on 26th July (Juventos) and 29th July (Athletico Madrid),

Whilst the PL season itself kicks off on 13 August.

So I imagine the u21's and players not on international duty will start pre-season maybe 1 July or at latest the end of first week of July, so they will have a couple of training matches as part of pre-season so as to be relatively fit before the matches in Australia, whilst most of the first team who have been away on international duty will be very early in their pre-season fitness training. So I can't see they will play full matches - or of they do won't manage to play both matches - and its quite possible that some of the players will not be back in time for the matches in Australia especially if Belgium or England get to the finals !.

And that in turn surely means that some of the u21 squad will be involved in first team matches, and probably more than last pre-season.

The first team main pre-season training (at least for England and Belgium players - probably about 8 of our first team looks as if it its going to be mainly shoe-horned into the 2 weeks after the Austraila tour when I imagine there will be one or two other pre-season friendlies scheduled.

 

[Spursidol]

BTW, I assume Domiinic Ball is now back with us after his loan with Rangers - Rangers have completed their league programme (winning it of course) and have the Scottish Cup Final on 21 May, but Ball picked up a yellow card in the semi final win over Celtic which means he is suspended for the final. Rangers also have a match against a Spurs X1 on 11 May to prepare for the Cup Final, but can't see Ball being involved simply because he's not likely to play in a match designed to be a warm up for which he's suspended !

Not sure he'll play in any matches back at Spurs this season, so may be training with the first team ?

 

[LexingtonSpurs]

lloris
vorm (maybe)
walker (probably)
kwp
yedlin
alderweireld
vertonghen
wimmer
rose
davies
dier
dembele
alli
onomah
lamela
chadli (maybe)
son
kane

will all miss most of pre-season. mason will probably be recovering from surgery and i think ogilvie will still be out injured too so that leaves us with:

mcgee
trippier
ccv
fazio (if he's still here)
ball
bentaleb
carroll
ward
winks
pritchard
eriksen
njie

barely enough to field a team so there should be plenty of opportunities for the youngsters at least in the first few weeks, i'd particularly like to see amos, edwards and harrison get some game time.

Yedlin should be back early enough - Copa finals are June 26, and US will be hard-pressed to get that far...Lamela might make it that far

I also don't see anything on South Korea's schedule beyond Friendlies on June 1 and 5, so unless I am missing something, he should be here.

Plus, if Rooney and Wilshere get prominent roles with England, those lads should all be done early...

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Interesting comment on Ramsey. The u21's looked very good when Sherwood/Ramsey/Ferdinand were in charge (mind you with a good squad - Mason , Carroll et al) and I always assumed it was Ramsey who was the main technical coach there.

Clive used to bark orders as an old style coach, and it was that which seemed to be the issue.

I was very much looking forward to seeing what Ramsey did when he was given the QPR job. We'd heard so much about him as a coach, how well qualified he was etc, and I remember reading an article about him (a couple of years before he left Spurs) and how he was looking forward to managing a club one day because he "had his own ideas that weren't necessarily the ones being taught at Spurs". But he was awful as a manager, made some shocking decisions at QPR, tactically dreadful.

I know there are some that still hold Sherwood in high regard on this forum, but I think that Levy knew what he was doing when he got rid of those three - possibly aided by McDermott.

I still think Inglethorpe was a major loss. A very talented coach.

 

[spurs9]

I was very much looking forward to seeing what Ramsey did when he was given the QPR job. We'd heard so much about him as a coach, how well qualified he was etc, and I remember reading an article about him (a couple of years before he left Spurs) and how he was looking forward to managing a club one day because he "had his own ideas that weren't necessarily the ones being taught at Spurs". But he was awful as a manager, made some shocking decisions at QPR, tactically dreadful.

I know there are some that still hold Sherwood in high regard on this forum, but I think that Levy knew what he was doing when he got rid of those three - possibly aided by McDermott.

I still think Inglethorpe was a major loss. A very talented coach.

Ramsey was offered a job when Sherwood left but he turned it down, so he isn't someone we "got rid of" so to speak.