Match Threads Spurs vs Brighton & Hove Albion - Match Thread

[Serpico]

Sticking up for Sissoko here after reading too many neg comments-he seems an easy target to trash. Matches as yesterday he does the leg work and fills gaps, the rest were struggling for whatever reason (possibly kick off time?) . Not the talented player we hope to have but honest and hard working. At least he consistently average so turns up every game and gives it all. I like him and hope we can achieve with him in the side.

 

[Everlasting Seconds]

Sticking up for Sissoko here after reading too many neg comments-he seems an easy target to trash. Matches as yesterday he does the leg work and fills gaps, the rest were struggling for whatever reason (possibly kick off time?) . Not the talented player we hope to have but honest and hard working. At least he consistently average so turns up every game and gives it all. I like him and hope we can achieve with him in the side.

The issue yesterday wasn't necessarily Sissoko's strengths or weaknesses or whether or not he is "good" (he isn't). The main issue is that to propel the team forward, we need a CM upgrade on one of Winks or Sissoko, so that we will play with somebody who just plainly is better. It's about what would strengthen the team in the long run.

 

[Japhet]

Salah blags a penalty every other week and Liverpool go on to win things. I couldn't give a toss if Kane engineered a penalty, West Ham engineered a free kick that led to us dropping points...and don't even get me started on the Dier handball v Newcastle.

Whilst yesterday's shitshow officiating helped to secure the 3 points, my main concern was our lack of conviction again. That said, currently sitting 2nd in the league, if Kane has to take a tumble once in a while, fill yet boots lad, many a player has done as much in the past, some even called smart for doing so.

COYS !

I have to agree with you, sadly. It's a shame it's come to this and garbage refereeing and VAR decisions have so much impact. We're constantly looking for wrongs to be righted when we have rafts of technology to try to get correct decisions. Sick of it tbh.

 

[Haddock]

We still look way off defensively in my opinion and it will be even more obvious against better opponents. I just feel like it's too easy to break us down. Our pressing game just doesn't work, it's either that or Mourinho wants to play this way. Often you can see our opponents receiving the ball in the middle of our half, having oceans of time and space. Which in turn makes our whole backline fall further and further back.

It's not only a problem that stems from our midfield, I'd say it's even more on our attackers being lazy during large spells of matches. The collective defensive duty look miles off what it should be. Granted, Brighton didn't create much but the positions and situations they were given the freedom to explore will not end well against better opponents.

To be fair this is a new first eleven and they need to be given time. My only real concern is that Mourinho wants to play this way.

 

[Rosco1984]

We still look way off defensively in my opinion and it will be even more obvious against better opponents. I just feel like it's too easy to break us down. Our pressing game just doesn't work, it's either that or Mourinho wants to play this way. Often you can see our opponents receiving the ball in the middle of our half, having oceans of time and space. Which in turn makes our whole backline fall further and further back.

It's not only a problem that stems from our midfield, I'd say it's even more on our attackers being lazy during large spells of matches. The collective defensive duty look miles off what it should be. Granted, Brighton didn't create much but the positions and situations they were given the freedom to explore will not end well against better opponents.

To be fair this is a new first eleven and they need to be given time. My only real concern is that Mourinho wants to play this way.

Name a chance Brighton created apart from the goal.... Defensively we were superb and we allowed them to have the ball in the areas we wanted in the hopes of breaking on them. It was a clear tactical plan we had 70% possession until we scored and then we visibly dropped our line and stopped pressing a lot of people are mistaking this for being outplayed or outfought we weren't we played to a plan we didn't execute the fast attacking play as well as we have but I think that was due to Brighton not overcommitting as we were hoping they would and leaving men back to stop the counter attack. As soon as they got their goal which was only created as one of our defensive players was scythed down by a clear foul meaning people had to move out of position we went back on the offensive and hit the post twice and scored. I think we executed a plan really well but Brighton didn't fall into the trap but also because of that didn't create a single chance in the game... Defensively we were excellent as we were at Burnley Dier and Alderweireled has to be first choice pairing no Sanchez no panic.

 

[Haddock]

Name a chance Brighton created apart from the goal.... Defensively we were superb and we allowed them to have the ball in the areas we wanted in the hopes of breaking on them. It was a clear tactical plan we had 70% possession until we scored and then we visibly dropped our line and stopped pressing a lot of people are mistaking this for being outplayed or outfought we weren't we played to a plan we didn't execute the fast attacking play as well as we have but I think that was due to Brighton not overcommitting as we were hoping they would and leaving men back to stop the counter attack. As soon as they got their goal which was only created as one of our defensive players was scythed down by a clear foul meaning people had to move out of position we went back on the offensive and hit the post twice and scored. I think we executed a plan really well but Brighton didn't fall into the trap but also because of that didn't create a single chance in the game... Defensively we were excellent as we were at Burnley Dier and Alderweireled has to be first choice pairing no Sanchez no panic.

You're missing the point. If better players than the ones in Brighton are allowed the space we gave up last night we'll be punished.

Yeah, the grand plan. Give me a break. We haven't been defensively solid at all this season so I truly fail to see the reasoning behind us scoring a goal and then willingly giving the initiative to the opponents. That's a narrative constructed after the match.
It's natural to let the foot off the gas a bit when you feel that you're the superior team. But that's the exact problem isn't it? We did it against Newcastle, and we did it against Spammers and we got punished. It's beggars belief that this is a tactical plan.

Look, we won. So I can't say it's disastrous. But to me it's obvious that there's still a lot of work to be done.

 

[Freddie]

The issue with the foul on PEH is the replays used by VAR. They show the ref two slow motion replays 600 times which only seemed to focus on whether he got the ball (which he did, just, with his heel). On the TV replays shown real time you can see it was reckless. They aren't helping him. As for Sissoko, he is so, so bad on the ball. For his other strengths he's a useful squad player

 

[cider spurs]

Matters not if the ball is won, you can't go through a player and take him out like that.

Knobber of the week award goes to the ref.

 

[Time for Heroes]

Not sure what some of you watched, i thought Brighton was excellent after struggling initially in the first 15 minutes.

They will be a real handful for teams this season, very impressed.

 

[Shadydan]

Not sure what some of you watched, i thought Brighton was excellent after struggling initially in the first 15 minutes.

They will be a real handful for teams this season, very impressed.

They looked good because they kept the ball in midfield which is what I expected them to do, they're a pretty team to watch but they don't have a killer instinct, all foreplay no penetration

 

[Thenewcat]

Not sure what some of you watched, i thought Brighton was excellent after struggling initially in the first 15 minutes.

They will be a real handful for teams this season, very impressed.

They had an EG of 0.3. They were neat, tidy and toothless. They deserved what they got from the game

 

[Serpico]

The issue yesterday wasn't necessarily Sissoko's strengths or weaknesses or whether or not he is "good" (he isn't). The main issue is that to propel the team forward, we need a CM upgrade on one of Winks or Sissoko, so that we will play with somebody who just plainly is better. It's about what would strengthen the team in the long run.

Yes agree with a froward CM is what we need but I feel not now when we have slow CB who are protect by Sissoko (who tries to get forward) and Højbjerg deep defensive play. Im not confident in the CBs (yesterday) playing together. They need some pace.

 

[Japhet]

You're missing the point. If better players than the ones in Brighton are allowed the space we gave up last night we'll be punished.

Yeah, the grand plan. Give me a break. We haven't been defensively solid at all this season so I truly fail to see the reasoning behind us scoring a goal and then willingly giving the initiative to the opponents. That's a narrative constructed after the match.
It's natural to let the foot off the gas a bit when you feel that you're the superior team. But that's the exact problem isn't it? We did it against Newcastle, and we did it against Spammers and we got punished. It's beggars belief that this is a tactical plan.

Look, we won. So I can't say it's disastrous. But to me it's obvious that there's still a lot of work to be done.

You can almost see a switch being flicked in our matches when we retreat and batten down the hatches. We're so unreliable when we let teams come at us that I really struggle to understand it as a tactic and hate watching it with an air of inevitability. Christ, we couldn't even hang onto a 3-0 lead for 8 minutes v West Ham.

 

[Serpico]

You can almost see a switch being flicked in our matches when we retreat and batten down the hatches. We're so unreliable when we let teams come at us that I really struggle to understand it as a tactic and hate watching it with an air of inevitability. Christ, we couldn't even hang onto a 3-0 lead for 8 minutes v West Ham.

I feel, what you are seeing is tactically what we are trying to achieve-we just haven't got either, the talent or the understanding what is required. It comes back to coach getting his message across and the players understanding. Lesser teams perform with balance, energy, understanding, a clear formation and bottle. We seem to show nerves all the time . Players are trying too hard to achieve-going second in the league seems to put the pressure on. we saw this before when we had opportunities to go top-it just didn't happen. we need to relax and play fearlessly with joy. not panic and self destruct .Believe we belong amongst the best

 

[Monkey boy]

You can almost see a switch being flicked in our matches when we retreat and batten down the hatches. We're so unreliable when we let teams come at us that I really struggle to understand it as a tactic and hate watching it with an air of inevitability. Christ, we couldn't even hang onto a 3-0 lead for 8 minutes v West Ham.

even after all this time just seeing that last sentence makes me so very angry.

 

[sebo_sek]

You can almost see a switch being flicked in our matches when we retreat and batten down the hatches. We're so unreliable when we let teams come at us that I really struggle to understand it as a tactic and hate watching it with an air of inevitability. Christ, we couldn't even hang onto a 3-0 lead for 8 minutes v West Ham.

The first goal vs Spam was sloppy. Then a freak own goal and a 30-yard screamer after a dubious free kick. I'm not saying it wasn't infuriating, but these freak games happen. The Sanchez OG doesn't go in and it's all over.

Jose wants us to win with as little effort as possible. The boys play 3 games a week. And guess what. Barring Antwerp it's worked so far. We are second in the league, QF of the League cup (beating Chelsea), group stages of the EL (after qualifiers). It would seem we were scraping the bottom after reading some comments.

 

[C0YS]

Sorry but this is total nonsense. The Hojbjerg foul is completely black and white. Whether he touches the ball is irrelevant- his studs are over the top, his follow through is reckless and cleans Hojbjerg out, and anyway Hojbjerg is still in possession.

At the other end of the scale, it amazes me how people don’t know the laws (including Martin Keown on MOTD). Harry Kane is standing directly under where the ball is going to land - it would literally hit him on the head if Lallana doesn’t clatter him. He is completely entitled to be there, and Lallana flies into him. The fact that he wants to be fouled doesn’t mean it isn’t a foul. Doherty’s falls into the ‘seen them given’ category, but Brighton benefited from by far the most egregious error of the game and didn’t create another chance of note. They weren’t unlucky

I think it was a foul but you can defend it. There is no reason to think that Hojbjerg is still in possession if the opposition player touches it, and follow through could be interpreted as a collision. I think you make a good point, what are the laws of a foul.

The .laws are:

following offences against an opponent in a manner considered by the referee to be careless, reckless or using excessive force:

• charges
• jumps at
• kicks or attempts to kick
• pushes
• strikes or attempts to strike (including head-butt)
• tackles or challenges
• trips or attempts to trip

And another one here is possibly relevant:


IMPEDING THE PROGRESS OF AN OPPONENT WITHOUT CONTACT

Impeding the progress of an opponent means moving into the opponent’s path to obstruct, block, slow down or force a change of direction when the ball is not within playing distance of either player.

The fact there was contact in the ball means, the fact he was impeding PEH progress is entirely irrelevant. The question is was it a tackle or challenge that was careless.

Which is:

when a player shows a lack of attention or consideration when making a challenge or acts without precaution. No disciplinary sanction is needed


Now as you see a lot of interpretation goes into this. While March does go over the ball, he is clearly in control and is showing attention, by shaping that leg away from the opposition player, there was no chance of contact with the player between his first leg, the question then is the follow through. The difficulty here is establishing if it was a collision or a foul.

Same with the Kane one right, Kane was backing in and trying to get a freekick or pen, that's entirely allowed. The question was how much has he backed into it, is Kane also being careless? Debatable, I think it was a pen though, but fully understand why a brighton fan would be hard done by it. Again was it a collision or a foul? Is Kane stopping Lallana from playing the ball by backing into him? Ultimatly it was careless by Lallana who needed to keep his knee down.

The brighton penalty, you see them given you see them not, but I think there was a clear tug, and enough to constitute 'impeding the progress of an opponent.

If I was the ref I would have given both pens and disallowed the goal, but like I say it's not that clear cut, and the rules do not make any more so. You think Brighton benefited more, I suspect Brighton fans think the opposite, and we are not neutral observers! Nor us nor Brighton fans!

 

[C0YS]

The issue yesterday wasn't necessarily Sissoko's strengths or weaknesses or whether or not he is "good" (he isn't). The main issue is that to propel the team forward, we need a CM upgrade on one of Winks or Sissoko, so that we will play with somebody who just plainly is better. It's about what would strengthen the team in the long run.

Sissoko had a very good first half yesterday. Like ideally we will play Lo Celso and Ndombele, and I suspect we will it is what Jose is suggesting. But yesterday was very important in the first 20 minutes or so where he was imperious then sort of was okay. But he had a better game than Ndombele and we need players like this in our squad.

Upgrades as a word to use on players is such a silly idea, I don't know if it comes from fifa where players are given a number. Every player is unique and what makes someone good for a team is a mixture between style, having particular strengths that suit the team and personality. You actually want a diversity of skill sets, Sissoko has a place in this team, we might want to get new CMs in but it's not about an upgrade or not. Sissoko will need replacing soon enough anyway, he'll be 32 come the end of the season.

 

[Mr Pink]

Yep for me Kane was fouled, penalty correct decision.

Their goal should of been ruled out as PEH was definitely fouled, and March booked.

They should of had a penalty though.

 

[midoNdefoe]

Is only 15 mil thereabouts and we are not even ¼ of the season. If you would like to bash a player, at least chose one who had been doing the same shit thing for the past 3 seasons at the minimum.

He wasn't the only one culpable of lapses today when Son and Sissoko were far worse. In fact Doherty improved later in the game when Bale came on, closing down the spaces better. Some of you may just have forgotten how Aurier could give away any stupid fouls or penalties or whatsoever under intense pressure. Doherty offers us a different RB/RWB which Aurier couldn't and that can only be a good thing.

How was sissoko far worse? Nonsense bashing of him again. Tiresome.