Team for Arsenal...

[sloth]

you do realise we've been playing 4-2-3-1 recently? and, are you aware that Arsenal play though the middle generally speaking? - going 4-4-2 against them in particular is fucking suicide.

Arsenal have better CMs than we do. We haven't got the creativity to play well through the middle. Nor do our CMs have the off the ball quality to provide a decent barrier to their creativly superior CM. Matching them up in the centre when you're weaker there is to invite a defeat.

We are strong on our flanks where they are all the more exploitable, because as you say they play narrow. Adebayor is also adept at getting involved in build up play, he regularly over-loads defenders by making the extra man. Defoe is at his best playing off another striker. I don't think he's a brilliant goal-scorer, but given our paucity of options he is the most likely to score for us.

On the other hand we will be weaker in the centre, and to make the most of our wingers we need a progressive CM like Carroll, who will make us even weaker defensively, compared to playing two defence minded CMs such as Vertonghen and Sandro. We will need some luck to prevent them scoring.

442/4411 is not an ideal formation to play away at Arsenal, and if we had some guile, and dynamism in CM then I would not be advocating it. Unfortunately we are where we are and a punchers chance is better than no chance at all. We have to provide the platform for our big guns to get their shots away. Covering up and staying on the ropes is not a strategy to win, it's not even a strategy to not lose, it is a strategy which will see us knocked out.

 

[Spursidol]

Anyway, now hoping for:

Lloris

Walker/Naughton
Gallas
Caulker
Vertonghen

Sandro
Carroll

Lennon
Sigurdsson
Bale

Adebayor

If Dempsey starts this there is something fundamentally wrong with AVB's thinking. He needs to stop fucking about with some of these perplexing (euphemistically speaking here) decisions - they're getting old now. Play the better keeper ffs (my last moan!)

Not a big fan of Dempsey or Sigursson on the their current form - although surely one or both must come good and reproduce the form they had at Fulham and Swansea respectively at some stage.

Huddlestone on his current form is not great either, but maybe a better option than Sigurdsson ? Then we have 3 CM's in Sandro, Carroll and Huddlestone, playing 433.

Reduces our attacking options in theory without Sigurdsson, but gives us solidity in the middle where Arsenal are strong. Would mean that Adebayor, Balle and Lennon need to do a lot of work - maybe need to bring on a Falque/Townsend and/or Defoe as subs in the second half, but think I prefer that to an underperforming Sigurdsson.

 

[JUSTINSIGNAL]

Arsenal have better CMs than we do. We haven't got the creativity to play well through the middle. Nor do our CMs have the off the ball quality to provide a decent barrier to their creativly superior CM. Matching them up in the centre when you're weaker there is to invite a defeat.

We are strong on our flanks where they are all the more exploitable, because as you say they play narrow. Adebayor is also adept at getting involved in build up play, he regularly over-loads defenders by making the extra man. Defoe is at his best playing off another striker. I don't think he's a brilliant goal-scorer, but given our paucity of options he is the most likely to score for us.

On the other hand we will be weaker in the centre, and to make the most of our wingers we need a progressive CM like Carroll, who will make us even weaker defensively, compared to playing two defence minded CMs such as Vertonghen and Sandro. We will need some luck to prevent them scoring.

442/4411 is not an ideal formation to play away at Arsenal, and if we had some guile, and dynamism in CM then I would not be advocating it. Unfortunately we are where we are and a punchers chance is better than no chance at all. We have to provide the platform for our big guns to get their shots away. Covering up and staying on the ropes is not a strategy to win, it's not even a strategy to not lose, it is a strategy which will see us knocked out.

I understand the points you make but after seeing how Arsenal walked through our midfield at will at the Emirates last season I would be reluctant to play 442.

No matter what tactical instructions Ade is given to drop in and make the extra man in midfield his instinct are those of a striker. He will naturally move into attacking positions and dropping back and defending will be an after thought.

I know Siggy hasn't had the greatest of starts to his spurs career but I think he is a better option of the no.10 role. He is a natural attacking midfielder and is more likely to drop deep and help counteract Arsenals midfield.

Whatever the formation is I think we all know it's going to be backs to the wall for much of the match. We simply do not have enough players in our decimated first 11 who are ball carriers or who are adept at keeping possession. Where as the Arsenal team are full of them.

 

[$hoguN]

All I can say is Lloris better start this game

 

[Mr Pink]

Arsenal have better CMs than we do. We haven't got the creativity to play well through the middle. Nor do our CMs have the off the ball quality to provide a decent barrier to their creativly superior CM. Matching them up in the centre when you're weaker there is to invite a defeat.

We are strong on our flanks where they are all the more exploitable, because as you say they play narrow. Adebayor is also adept at getting involved in build up play, he regularly over-loads defenders by making the extra man. Defoe is at his best playing off another striker. I don't think he's a brilliant goal-scorer, but given our paucity of options he is the most likely to score for us.

On the other hand we will be weaker in the centre, and to make the most of our wingers we need a progressive CM like Carroll, who will make us even weaker defensively, compared to playing two defence minded CMs such as Vertonghen and Sandro. We will need some luck to prevent them scoring.

442/4411 is not an ideal formation to play away at Arsenal, and if we had some guile, and dynamism in CM then I would not be advocating it. Unfortunately we are where we are and a punchers chance is better than no chance at all. We have to provide the platform for our big guns to get their shots away. Covering up and staying on the ropes is not a strategy to win, it's not even a strategy to not lose, it is a strategy which will see us knocked out.

Don't agree with this premise, I understand it but don't agree with it. Possession is key, and if we can get 45% to say 35% I'm happy because its giving us a chance by limiting their possession and suffocating more space in the middle of the park - where they're strongest. If anything the suggestion of going 4-4-2/4-4-1-1 would make a bit more sense to me if Dembele was fit - alongside Sandro that would definitely compensate through a lot of defensive capability/strength.

Again though, AVB has to pick the right players to ensure we have the best possible chance. I think its about possession in terms of giving us more of the ball and them less even though they'll control more of it, you think we should play to our strengths and get it wide with two further forward. For me we'll definitely get out scored that way - give them too much space and they'll rip us a new one.

Yes we'll have more chance of getting at their full backs (Santos should be targeted in particular, Lennon had better make it) but again this is relinquishing more space centrally for them, where they're strongest.

I would go my way and try and stay in the game for as long as possible, and have the option of going 4-4-2 if needs be later on. It wouldn't surprise me, if we went your way, that we took a lead and then got pummeled for sitting back in an open formation/set up.

Confidence will be key, as both sides arn't high at the moment, and the last thing we need to do is give them free licence to go a couple of goals up early doors - what's the strategy then, 4-2-4? We are away from home with fragile confidence after all.

 

[stevenurse]

no way huddlestone will be dropped for carroll, rightly or wrongly as hes been awful recently but it just wont happen. Would be good to see carroll against the golden boy wilshire though. Would make an interesting motivational tool from AVB too. "go out there and prove youre better than this hyped up dickhead"

Dempsey surely has to be dropped, surely, for the love of god surely. Sigurdsson may not have set the world on fire but he at least brings set piece threat (which arsenal still struggle with) and the possibility of a moment of class from nothing.

id play ade in the hole with defoe up top. Ade was brilliant against city and it seems to be his natural game to drop deeper anyway. Dempsey or Sigurdsson, coupled with huddlestone on current form against wilshire, cazorla and arteta would be a disaster.

personally i couldnt be any less confident about this game which is sad as ive not been pessimistic about a NLD for about 4 years now

 

[Mr Pink]

Not a big fan of Dempsey or Sigursson on the their current form - although surely one or both must come good and reproduce the form they had at Fulham and Swansea respectively at some stage.

Huddlestone on his current form is not great either, but maybe a better option than Sigurdsson ? Then we have 3 CM's in Sandro, Carroll and Huddlestone, playing 433.

Reduces our attacking options in theory without Sigurdsson, but gives us solidity in the middle where Arsenal are strong. Would mean that Adebayor, Balle and Lennon need to do a lot of work - maybe need to bring on a Falque/Townsend and/or Defoe as subs in the second half, but think I prefer that to an underperforming Sigurdsson.

Thought about that mate, just don't think Hudd is anywhere near agile enough for this sort of game. It does beef us up a bit more in theory - but that's just the problem, its in theory.

I would put my confidence in Carroll and Sig for this game - pass and move all the way.

 

[mpickard2087]

Changed my mind again, this might be taking a bit of a risk but:

Lloris​

Naughton Gallas Caulker Vertonghen​

Parrett Sandro Carroll​

Lennon Adebayor Bale​

​

Subs: Keeper, Dawson, Walker, Livermore, Falque, Townsend, Defoe​

​

We need to try and win the central midfield. That means for a start we need to go with three in there. I havent seen much of Parrett but from what I have seen he does work his socks off and can bring energy and determination. Alongside Sandro it could be a pretty good shield.​

​

Carroll will be the extra body, hopefully get on the ball and be nice and composed in possession.​

​

What is needed are big performances from Bale and Lennon. Defensively they really need to track back to help the fullbacks, but also with a three man central midfield they need to make sure they get up in support of Adebayor. Basically, they need to run themselves into the ground and put in a real shift for the team.​

 

[Mackay6]

All I can say is Lloris better start this game

Couldn't agree more, following on his fantastic display in Spain, he's now helped France beat Italy in Italy. I didn't see the latter game so can't comment on Hugo's performance, but to let in only two goals in trips to Spain and Italy that is a tremendous performance, and well done to Hugo.

 

[sloth]

I understand the points you make but after seeing how Arsenal walked through our midfield at will at the Emirates last season I would be reluctant to play 442.

No matter what tactical instructions Ade is given to drop in and make the extra man in midfield his instinct are those of a striker. He will naturally move into attacking positions and dropping back and defending will be an after thought.

I know Siggy hasn't had the greatest of starts to his spurs career but I think he is a better option of the no.10 role. He is a natural attacking midfielder and is more likely to drop deep and help counteract Arsenals midfield.

Whatever the formation is I think we all know it's going to be backs to the wall for much of the match. We simply do not have enough players in our decimated first 11 who are ball carriers or who are adept at keeping possession. Where as the Arsenal team are full of them.

The thing about last year was that 4231 was the formation we should have begun with in most matches as it would have been the perfect platform to get the most out of our strengths which were in a strong CM base of Parker and Sandro, ahead of which we could boast VdV, Modric, Bale, and Adebayor; that combination of steel, craft, guile, and power would have seen us do excellently. As it is we didn't do badly, but we failed to get the most out of our squad, imo.

Currently we are largely devoid of guile, and only Sandro offers steel, while Ade, Sandro, and Bale, are our only dynamic powerful players. You can't play 4231 if you haven't the players to make the most of the additional CM and to compensate for the lack of an extra striker. We do have speed on our flanks, we can guarantee crosses into the box if we play 442, and if crossing the ball from the byline, or quick counter-attacks are your best chance of scoring, then you need to get the ball to your wide-men quickly and often, you don't need everything to slow down as it plods from one limited CM to the next and back again.

I do think this will leave us vulnerable to Arsenal, in the area where they're strong though.

In essence I'm suggesting that rather than offer weak resistance in the centre at the expense of any real attacking strength ourselves, we should look to exploit their weaknesses with our only strengths, and hope for the rub of the green on the day.

 

[sloth]

Don't agree with this premise, I understand it but don't agree with it. Possession is key, and if we can get 45% to say 35% I'm happy because its giving us a chance by limiting their possession and suffocating more space in the middle of the park - where they're strongest. If anything the suggestion of going 4-4-2/4-4-1-1 would make a bit more sense to me if Dembele was fit - alongside Sandro that would definitely compensate through a lot of defensive capability/strength.

Again though, AVB has to pick the right players to ensure we have the best possible chance. I think its about possession in terms of giving us more of the ball and them less even though they'll control more of it, you think we should play to our strengths and get it wide with two further forward. For me we'll definitely get out scored that way - give them too much space and they'll rip us a new one.

Yes we'll have more chance of getting at their full backs (Santos should be targeted in particular, Lennon had better make it) but again this is relinquishing more space centrally for them, where they're strongest.

I would go my way and try and stay in the game for as long as possible, and have the option of going 4-4-2 if needs be later on. It wouldn't surprise me, if we went your way, that we took a lead and then got pummeled for sitting back in an open formation/set up.

Confidence will be key, as both sides arn't high at the moment, and the last thing we need to do is give them free licence to go a couple of goals up early doors - what's the strategy then, 4-2-4? We are away from home with fragile confidence after all.

I respect your opinion, but don't agree. I'd refer you to Hannibal's victory at Cannae for the reasons why (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cannae)

 

[Mackay6]

Lloris
Naughton Dawson Caulker Vertonghen
Hudd Sandro Caroll
Lennon Adebayor Bale
Subs: Friedel, Gallas, Walker, Livermore, Falque, Townsend, Defoe

I must admit whatever team I come up with, I can only see it losing.​

I did want JD to start. However, given Sandro is likely to be knackered but still has to play, I guess. Then reluctantly I think Defoe needs to be dropped.​

 

[Mr Pink]

I respect your opinion, but don't agree. I'd refer you to Hannibal's victory of Cannae for the reasons why (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cannae)

Sloth - get a life

 

[kernowspur]

Thought about that mate, just don't think Hudd is anywhere near agile enough for this sort of game. It does beef us up a bit more in theory - but that's just the problem, its in theory.

I would put my confidence in Carroll and Sig for this game - pass and move all the way.

Quite right Mr P. Arsenal are just the sort of team that show up all Huddlestone's shortcomings. I still have nightmares about Fabregas running past him with no hint of a challenge, straight from the kick-off against Arsenal a few seasons ago.

 

[sloth]

I understand the points you make but after seeing how Arsenal walked through our midfield at will at the Emirates last season I would be reluctant to play 442.

No matter what tactical instructions Ade is given to drop in and make the extra man in midfield his instinct are those of a striker. He will naturally move into attacking positions and dropping back and defending will be an after thought.

I know Siggy hasn't had the greatest of starts to his spurs career but I think he is a better option of the no.10 role. He is a natural attacking midfielder and is more likely to drop deep and help counteract Arsenals midfield.

Whatever the formation is I think we all know it's going to be backs to the wall for much of the match. We simply do not have enough players in our decimated first 11 who are ball carriers or who are adept at keeping possession. Where as the Arsenal team are full of them.

I think you're focussing too much on stopping Arsenal through defensive measures. I think by attacking you also stop them, and the better we attack them the easier it will be for us in a defensive sense.

 

[sloth]

Sloth - get a life

What did you think of that Wiki article Mr P., did you get what I'm getting at?

 

[BringBack_leGin]

I respect your opinion, but don't agree. I'd refer you to Hannibal's victory at Cannae for the reasons why (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cannae)

Love this post!

 

[JUSTINSIGNAL]

I think you're focussing too much on stopping Arsenal through defensive measures. I think by attacking you also stop them, and the better we attack them the easier it will be for us in a defensive sense.

Harry is that you? LOL

Seriously though we won't be able to attack if we can't get the ball. The easier way to try and wrestle some kind of possession would be to match them up in midfield.

 

[RJ1882]

Lloris
Naughton Dawson Caulker Vertonghen
Hudd Sandro Caroll
Lennon Adebayor Bale
Subs: Friedel, Gallas, Walker, Livermore, Falque, Townsend, Defoe

I must admit whatever team I come up with, I can only see it losing.​

I did want JD to start. However, given Sandro is likely to be knackered but still has to play, I guess. Then reluctantly I think Defoe needs to be dropped.​

FFS wise up. We arent facing the invincibles here.
Its the team that have shipped 15 goals in 7 games. The team Fulham put 3 past. And while we arent brilliant, whatever team we put out will be stronger than the team Fulham had out last weekend.
Adebayor will torture them, and with Gallas, Caulker, Vertonghen, Bale, Adebayor we have serious threat from set pieces.

They'll dominate possession, but with our counter attacking threat and aerial threat we are more than capable of scoring 2 or 3 goals. We'll score at least 1, so its about keeping them out.

 

[BringBack_leGin]

FFS wise up. We arent facing the invincibles here.
Its the team that have shipped 15 goals in 7 games. The team Fulham put 3 past. And while we arent brilliant, whatever team we put out will be stronger than the team Fulham had out last weekend.
Adebayor will torture them, and with Gallas, Caulker, Vertonghen, Bale, Adebayor we have serious threat from set pieces.

They'll dominate possession, but with our counter attacking threat and aerial threat we are more than capable of scoring 2 or 3 goals. We'll score at least 1, so its about keeping them out.

One big difference between us and Fulham.

They have a centre forward who would waltz into our team.

They signed him for less than we gave them for Dempsey :-(