The Daily ITK Discussion Thread - 19th July 2013

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Paolo10

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It's only July 19th. We'd love to have our squad settled before Hong Kong, but, I think we all know that while we'd love for it to happen, it just wasn't going to be the case. There's still a hefty crop of wide forward types, and despite the doom and gloom, there's a few striker options remaining.

Lewis Holtby came to our side at the worst possible time. He came here right as Bale came into his own playing in the hole, Holtby's best position, and as a result Lewis really never found his place in the squad. He can play in front of Sandro with a player like Dembele/Paulinho and function as the creative passer. See: Any match he played in for Schalke before his move to us or in the U21 Euros. We need Paulinho because both Dembele and Sandro have big injury red flags and if one goes down, we're officially not dicked over and can still use the favored 4-3-3.

I also can't recall a time we were ever settled before the season started. You'd wish Levy would realize that a strong start can make all the difference (2 points in the first 3 matches last year against mediocre competition). Unfortunately, he's almost too concerned with saving some money right now. Focusing on saving a mil right now can end up costing the clubs tens of millions by the end of the year.
Do you think he's still burned by the Comolli spending spree a bit? Overall with Bale's value that whole business could have paid off as an earner overall, despite the relatively poor performances we got from of most of them at the time.

Did you get a look at that player I posted in the scouting thread btw?
 

scat1620

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I agree with the parts of your post I haven't quoted below, Andy, but I think you're being unduly optimistic with the two arguments below:

we have a while left of the window and the club are trying to address the striker issue,
Pausing only briefly at the "long while left in the window" argument (how many times has that been rolled out only for us to be signing the likes of Dempsey, Pav [who was a panic buy, according to the ITK reports at the time and since] and Fraizer Campbell on August 31st?), I agree that the Club probably are trying to address the striker issue. Given that the last striker that we signed on a permanent basis who went on to be an undisputed 'hit' for us was Berbatov in 2006, us "trying" to address the issue is a wholly different matter from us actually solving this problem - we haven't adequately resolved this problem position for half a decade now, reminiscent of the period after Ginola left where we couldn't sort the left-hand side of midfield out for years to come. We don't need "trying", we need success... by hook or by crook!

Adebayor can't be anywhere near as bad as last season,
Don't get me wrong, I like Adebayor - I was very pleased when we signed him last summer and I would still prefer him to be kept at Spurs in preference to Defoe, but after last season's shocking overall showing from him there are at least as many reasons to think we might get a repeat of 12/13 out of him rather than a repeat of 11/12. In fact, I'd argue that a repeat of last season is the more likely outcome than a repeat of his loan season with us (for a variety of reasons that have been well-discussed in the past and don't need repeating).
 
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Thanks for the praise and I'm just lucky the internet is a vast place with plenty of *completely legal* streams available. I actually work with individuals with intellectual disabilities. Setting them up with services/supports in the home/community and all that jazz.

The truth is, while I love to watch all levels of football across the world, I'm sure just about every scout in this sport is well aware of any player that I talk about on here. It really does have to be one of the best jobs, however. Traveling the world, looking for talents in the most obscure places and hoping that you do find that one talent that symbolizes your career/success.
I just find it intriguing a regular Joe (not in an insulting way) has the knowledge that some scouts would possess and use as their USP to secure job roles for professional clubs. Why don't you go for it? I don't know how hard it would be to get into but you should follow your vocational dreams.
 
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When do we ever really pay over the odds?

It was win win for Benteke though, it was always going to be. If we didn't meet their valuation he new he would get offered more money, of course he did.

Still think its a gamble to not do anything about a striker though. Great if Adebayor is performing like he did in his first season, not so great if its like last. And what happens if Bale picks up a serious injury in this scenario. Where we getting our goals from if Adebayor is inconsistent? Doesn't bear thinking about Defoe running the show and going through a baron spell to boot.

As far as I'm concerned MrP the most important thing is AVB is here next year. Then our 21 goal forward.
Are people seriously considering the question of whether it'd be acceptable for us not to buy another striker this window? What Champions League aspiring club only has two recognized strikers, both of which are coming off exceptionally poor seasons where they were injured, too?

Jermain Defoe, who has always wanted a regular first team position, came out last week and said we needed to bring in another striker! Think about that statement for a minute, please, before you try to defend the indefensible idea that we don't need to add anyone to our front-line.

The idea of spending 17 million pounds on midfielder, and then not bringing in a striker, boggles the mind. I simply refuse to believe Andres wouldn't kick up a huge fuss over such a bone-headed strategic decision, nor do I believe that Levy, with the aid of Baldini, would leave us that short in such a critical juncture again.

This season is absolutely critical to our success going forward as a club. You absolutely do not risk going with just Adebayor and Defoe as our sole options up-front. Even if it's someone like Cisse, who can push for a first team spot; a striker must be added.
How many recognised top quality strikers did Arsenal or Chelsea have last year. Or Dortmund ?

We need to upgrade Defoe, but we have two other top quality forwards already.
 

Andy

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fair enough mate, i'm trying to get people to calm down a bit if anything tbh, i'm hoping we get a better season out of Adebayor seeing as he is getting a pre season in and not off to the ACN this year.

the striker issue is starting to panic a few fans though but hopefully we can pick up a decent one in the next two to three weeks.
 

Snarfalicious

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Do you think he's still burned by the Comolli spending spree a bit? Overall with Bale's value that whole business could have paid off as an earner overall, despite the relatively poor performances we for our of most of them.

Did you get a look at that player I posted in the scouting thread btw?

I would hope that Levy would truly back AVB after the job he put in last year. He had to go through so much shit, did so much for the club and he never bitched and moaned about any of it.

- He took Bale to a whole new level and probably doubled his value for Levy. AVB had the balls to put Bale in a position, mid-season, to get him on the ball as much as possible. If he didn't do that, there's no telling where our point total might have finished and if Bale would have actually bagged his three major accolades.

- Sandro, Kaboul, BAE and Parker all missed substantial time with injury but it never really seemed to effect/cripple us. If you would have told me before the season started that we would be without Sandro for about half the year and without Kaboul for basically the whole year, I would have been surprised if we would have been in 6th place. To land 5th, with 72 points and the only thing keeping us from 4th was a measly 1 point and a won't-be-repeated run by Arsenal.

- The departures we went through and never really bought the players to account for the loss yet we still managed to put a side on the pitch, despite at times looking pretty shitty, still were some of the biggest creators of chances in the EPL.

- Our striker player basically came down to this: Defoe was good for about 3 months, Adebayor was good for about 200 minutes over the whole season.

These are all worn-out reasons why AVB did such a fantastic job to get us where we were by the end of the season. You'd hope these would all be big reasons why Levy would show some faith in him and really back him with a generous budget. I'm just really concerned with the lack of movement out of the club. In my opinion, we've got a shit-ton of deadweight and all we do is hurt ourselves by holding out for more money as their wages continue to pile up over the weeks wasted haggling.

And I'm not sure I remember the player you're talking about in the scouting thread but I'll check it out.
 

Snarfalicious

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Do you think Rondon is gettable? Surely he'd prefer Spurs over Rubin.

He was pretty bad this year, actually. Just really inconsistent. I love his teammate Bibras Natkho, though. One of my favorite players after watching him a ton hoping we might be in for him.

That being said, he is young and is a strong fella who can easily handle the physicality of the EPL.
 

arunspurs

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serious?
lol
we just finished with record points ever, we just broke our transfer record and signed an international midfielder, we have strengthened and have around seven weeks left of the window to address the striker problem,
united and Arsenal are struggling to buy players, liverpool are buying average players, City and Chelsea can throw money around which they are doing on good to average players.

yes we didn't get Benteke, his agent must have got him a nice juicy payrise but guys ffs chill out a bit, go watch some porn and cheer yourselves up.
we have a while left of the window and the club are trying to address the striker issue, Adebayor can't be anywhere near as bad as last season,

oh and for the record pre season means fuck all, it's a training game (y)

Training game ? when was the last time we won a game more than 3-0 with opposition having all 11 men on field? 2 years ago...

When was the last time we won away from home in Europe mainland ? AC Milan 0-1

When was the last time we won a penalty in league ? You guessed it right ...2011/12

Everyone who follows the league knows we need a Striker. Every fan of Tottenham knows we need a striker. Every one knows that AVB went into his his first pre-season with no fit striker.
Every radio, every TV if they talk about Spurs - 'They need a striker'....

Yes the window is long and will go till sep 1. But what's the point if we can't get a fwd for our coach to work with.

Why is it that we just don't prioritize a forward signing over a midfielder ?

From all the feedback I see from yesterday game, Ade didnt try hard enough ? Are you happy ?

I like Ade, but if he cant give 100% even if its a preseason game want him gone. But the sad reality is 50% Ade looks better than 100% Defoe

Every hawk & vulture is circling lane after AVB & Bale - I hope we do something quicker.

I am sure (or I hope) we will sign a striker - I am not faulting ITKs here - they reveal what they hear. But if we are serious about top4 or serious about having an ounce of ambition towards title, Levy & board - better act fast to atleast give a chance to AVB & his staff.
 

CanberraSpur

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I see so many of us in here taking bragging rights for not being the "plaything" of a billionaire like our rivals. But we are are privately owned nonetheless, subject to the inner workings of a private organisation. When you examine things closely what agency do we have as fans? What input do we get for the overpriced tickets and merchandise, what agency do I get as someone who tries to make the trip to London from Oz for at least one game a year at vast expense? Ultimately we are the "plaything" of a billionaire, a completely closed shop. It' just that our billionaires don't bring as much to the table as the billionaires at other clubs!
 

scat1620

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We need to upgrade Defoe, but we have two other top quality forwards already.
One-and-a-half top quality forwards, I'd say. I agree that Adebayor at his best is at least as good (and probably better) than anyone we'd be likely to sign under any circumstances, but for me he's not someone that we can rely on to be at his best for significant periods of the season. (I know at this point you will doubtless retrieve your Opta stats to assert that Ade had a decent season in 12/13, but IMO he stunk up the joint just as badly as Defoe did last term - and looking back at his chequered history with other clubs we've just as much reason to suspect that he'll have another 12/13 than he will have another 11/12.)

One-and-a-half top quality forwards is not enough (when the people beyond those forwards are Defoe and Dempsey) for us to sufficiently compete for a Champions League place or a major trophy. Again, all IMO (probably didn't need saying but I am somewhat phrasing my opinions as statements).
 

arunspurs

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A 15m Euro bid for him, should that be accepted, would be fantastic business. He's worth every penny.
a year loan + option to buy at 15m euros would be perfect - good but just played 400 min in 1st division. I remember him playing at LW for Madrid. Since we are already looking for a wing forward, would not be bad option.
 

Spurger King

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I see so many of us in here taking bragging rights for not being the "plaything" of a billionaire like our rivals. But we are are privately owned nonetheless, subject to the inner workings of a private organisation. When you examine things closely what agency do we have as fans? What input do we get for the overpriced tickets and merchandise, what agency do I get as someone who tries to make the trip to London from Oz for at least one game a year at vast expense? Ultimately we are the "plaything" of a billionaire, a completely closed shop. It' just that our billionaires don't bring as much to the table as the billionaires at other clubs!
I can't wait for the time when I'm in my eighties telling my grand kids about our years of doing things the right way.

”What about the trophies grandpa Spurger?”

”Eh?? I don't know about no trophies but we sure had a fine training facility and a steady profit margin”
 

spud

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I see so many of us in here taking bragging rights for not being the "plaything" of a billionaire like our rivals. But we are are privately owned nonetheless, subject to the inner workings of a private organisation. When you examine things closely what agency do we have as fans? What input do we get for the overpriced tickets and merchandise, what agency do I get as someone who tries to make the trip to London from Oz for at least one game a year at vast expense? Ultimately we are the "plaything" of a billionaire, a completely closed shop. It' just that our billionaires don't bring as much to the table as the billionaires at other clubs!
All football clubs are privately owned. What differentiates them are a vast number of variables, one of which is the level of owner investment. I'm one of those who are pleased that we aren't owned by somebody who throws billions at us; I consider it to be cheating - and winning in that way would, for me, be a phyrric victory. I'm proud of where we are compared to the mega-rich Chelsea and City, and want to beat them by continuing to grow organically. It will make the victory all the sweeter.

As for the 'agency' that we have as fans, we can ultimately vote with our feet. If we stopped going to games and stopped buying merchandise, then ENIC would probably sell the club so quickly that it would make your head spin. If we don't do that then we do our job, what every supporter should: support the team. By all means piss and moan on a web forum, but get behind the team at the ground. Congratulations on your dedication in commuting half-way around the world to watch the team: it's dedication like yours that makes the club what it is. You seem to think that it should enfranchise you in some way; I don't see why. It's your choice to live so far from the club that you support.

If you want success at all costs and would be happy to support a club that buys it with a rich owner's money, then you have plenty to choose from.
 
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