Tom Carroll

[RichieS]

Out for the season ACL

Bugger. Second time he's done it, no?

My concern now then would be that Carroll will be asked to play a defensive role in Thorne's absence.

 

[St José Dominguez]

This is Tom Carroll's responsibility. In my opinion all he has to his game is good passing technique, I hope I'm wrong but I just can't see him making it in PL. Physically I just can't get my head around how in 4 years he seemingly hasn't strengthened. Bentaleb despite being 3 years younger, is miles ahead in terms of mentality, physicality and even technique I don't see much between them.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Yep I do wonder if the minimum number of domestic players is actually going to harm some of these guys rather than help them.

I suppose the point is though, that for the top teams, any 21-22 year old players they have, particularly in midfield/attack, should already be at the required standard to push for a first team place.

It's harsh, and not good for the game as a whole, but that does seem to be the reality these days.

I would argue that Carroll is at the required standard to be pushing for a place. Maybe not guaranteed one but is Dembele, Paulinho, Sandro, Capoue ?

I genuinely don't believe that Dembele offers a team a whole lot more than Carroll.

 

[talkshowhost86]

I would argue that Carroll is at the required standard to be pushing for a place. Maybe not guaranteed one but is Dembele, Paulinho, Sandro, Capoue ?

I genuinely don't believe that Dembele offers a team a whole lot more than Carroll.

My concern with Carroll is defensively where I haven't really seen much to suggest he can hold his own.

It seems as if we'll be operating a sort of 4-2-3-1 (or a 4-3-3 where one of the midfield is the more attacking player). Assuming Carroll isn't going to be an attacking midfielder (and I don't think he has the skills/pace to do that) then he'll have to play more of a holding role and I'm just not sure he's ready for that.

It's the same issue I have with Bentaleb. Whilst they are both tidy users of the ball, they need to offer something else, whether that be defensively or in attack, and at the moment I'm not sure whether they do offer that.

As for Dembele, I think he would be best utilised in a more attacking role, possibly in one of the wide positions. I agree that he isn't what he was as a central midfielder, which is presumably why we're looking at Schneiderlin.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

My concern with Carroll is defensively where I haven't really seen much to suggest he can hold his own.

It seems as if we'll be operating a sort of 4-2-3-1 (or a 4-3-3 where one of the midfield is the more attacking player). Assuming Carroll isn't going to be an attacking midfielder (and I don't think he has the skills/pace to do that) then he'll have to play more of a holding role and I'm just not sure he's ready for that.

It's the same issue I have with Bentaleb. Whilst they are both tidy users of the ball, they need to offer something else, whether that be defensively or in attack, and at the moment I'm not sure whether they do offer that.

As for Dembele, I think he would be best utilised in a more attacking role, possibly in one of the wide positions. I agree that he isn't what he was as a central midfielder, which is presumably why we're looking at Schneiderlin.

Agree, Carroll does not really suit a CM2. But a 433 he could be very useful. Same could be said for other midfielders we have though.

 

[FinnYid]

Seems like a really good place for loan move and sort of season where he has to deliver.

 

[talkshowhost86]

Agree, Carroll does not really suit a CM2. But a 433 he could be very useful. Same could be said for other midfielders we have though.

Would you use him as the most attacking player in the midfield in a 4-3-3?

Or do you think that in that formation he'd get away with holding a bit more because there would be two players around him?

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Would you use him as the most attacking player in the midfield in a 4-3-3?

Or do you think that in that formation he'd get away with holding a bit more because there would be two players around him?

I'd have Capoue centre and providing the most defensive protection, paulinho right side and Carroll (or Bentaleb) left. In a high line high tempo style it's not like any of them would be "deep" sitting, but Capoue would be the central pivot and most disciplined, with the other two having more license to travel forward with Paulinho getting himself into the box as often as possible and Carroll providing the link play between midfield and attack.

There's a good balance of skills in a midfield 3 like that. A protector who can also pass, a water carrier and bomber. All can do varying degrees of everything, all have their own special forte, which hopefully cover for the weaknesses in the other's game.

 

[kendoddsdadsdogsdead]

I would argue that Carroll is at the required standard to be pushing for a place. Maybe not guaranteed one but is Dembele, Paulinho, Sandro, Capoue ?

I genuinely don't believe that Dembele offers a team a whole lot more than Carroll.

If you watch Carroll nine times out of ten he plays the way he's facing. Just passing the ball back first time to where it's came from for me is not pass and move, or incisive. I've never or very rarely seen him take the ball when pressed and be able to turn and face the opposition to give more options for himself and relieve any pressure. He plays alot of hospital balls because of it. At least Dembele can beat the press and get the opposition turning, he can relieve pressure that way which seems to get overlooked. granted he doesn't always make the right choice but I do think he's a better passer than given credit. It's just the timing of the pass on occasions that is hit and miss. I think by being able to protect the ball when a teams pressing you either with a ball around the side which scholes used to be great at or by menouvering it with ability strength/pace is essential in a fast paced, high pressing league. Dembele Is defensively underrated too.

 

[murichej]

I see no sense in loaning Carrol again. Play him or sell him. We could get ~3mio for him I think.

 

[FreddieYid]

I don't know what it is, but I really want this kid to succeed...

He needs a loan move to a Burnley or another lower premier league team and hopefully it will be the making of him like Wilshire did with Bolton.

 

[danielneeds]

If you watch Carroll nine times out of ten he plays the way he's facing. Just passing the ball back first time to where it's came from for me is not pass and move, or incisive. I've never or very rarely seen him take the ball when pressed and be able to turn and face the opposition to give more options for himself and relieve any pressure. He plays alot of hospital balls because of it. At least Dembele can beat the press and get the opposition turning, he can relieve pressure that way which seems to get overlooked. granted he doesn't always make the right choice but I do think he's a better passer than given credit. It's just the timing of the pass on occasions that is hit and miss. I think by being able to protect the ball when a teams pressing you either with a ball around the side which scholes used to be great at or by menouvering it with ability strength/pace is essential in a fast paced, high pressing league. Dembele Is defensively underrated too.

Agree with all this. And defensively Dembele's stats for interceptions and tackles have always been very good, even up there with more specialist DMs like Sandro.

 

[Snarfalicious]

Will they be going for a 3-man midfield of Hendrick, Hughes and Carroll? Seems pretty lightweight to me. George Thorne would have been the more defensive option but recently tore his ACL.

 

[St José Dominguez]

http://www.london24.com/sport/footb...head_of_pre_season_visit_to_daggers_1_3710133

Probably already said elsewhere but Carroll and Cebellos didn't travel to Helsinki.

 

[steve]

I'd have Capoue centre and providing the most defensive protection, paulinho right side and Carroll (or Bentaleb) left. In a high line high tempo style it's not like any of them would be "deep" sitting, but Capoue would be the central pivot and most disciplined, with the other two having more license to travel forward with Paulinho getting himself into the box as often as possible and Carroll providing the link play between midfield and attack.

There's a good balance of skills in a midfield 3 like that. A protector who can also pass, a water carrier and bomber. All can do varying degrees of everything, all have their own special forte, which hopefully cover for the weaknesses in the other's game.

I think Carroll makes himself available for the ball more than Nabil, not by loads but just seems that bit more eager to get into the right positions. My only criticism would be his movement was constant and thus a bit easier to predict - I'd like to see him slow his movement down a bit and then sharpen it quickly to buy himself space. Physically and mentally I'm just not sure and can't be without knowing him or seeing a lot more of him on the pitch.

Would like to see him pushed a bit though as intelligence and willingness are at a premium in our squad.

 

[HildoSpur]

I'd like to see him do well but I fear he just doesn't have the quality to do it at the top level.

 

[prawnsandwich]

I think youngsters/their parents who are undecided which academy to join will look at the way Spurs don't give up on players like Carroll, Dawkins and Obika.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

I think Carroll makes himself available for the ball more than Nabil, not by loads but just seems that bit more eager to get into the right positions. My only criticism would be his movement was constant and thus a bit easier to predict - I'd like to see him slow his movement down a bit and then sharpen it quickly to buy himself space. Physically and mentally I'm just not sure and can't be without knowing him or seeing a lot more of him on the pitch.

Would like to see him pushed a bit though as intelligence and willingness are at a premium in our squad.

Agree. It's why I'd like to have have seen him in and around our squad this season. Some genuine sink or swim time.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

If you watch Carroll nine times out of ten he plays the way he's facing. Just passing the ball back first time to where it's came from for me is not pass and move, or incisive. I've never or very rarely seen him take the ball when pressed and be able to turn and face the opposition to give more options for himself and relieve any pressure. He plays alot of hospital balls because of it. At least Dembele can beat the press and get the opposition turning, he can relieve pressure that way which seems to get overlooked. granted he doesn't always make the right choice but I do think he's a better passer than given credit. It's just the timing of the pass on occasions that is hit and miss. I think by being able to protect the ball when a teams pressing you either with a ball around the side which scholes used to be great at or by menouvering it with ability strength/pace is essential in a fast paced, high pressing league. Dembele Is defensively underrated too.

I think that's more true of all our midfielders except Capoue. Most midfielders will spend most of the time making simple passes, often sideways. At least Carroll keeps moving, giving going, and he does get his head up and try to play more incisive passes when he can get forward.

Dembele sometimes invited pressure on our back four by ambling in possession and getting pressed out of it. It's fine to do that in the final third, and I like a CM that can drop a shoulder and move forward, but Dembele would spend too much time just dawdling around the centre of the pitch with the ball when it needed moving.

I'd have more confidence in Carroll playing a through ball than Dembele.

 

[kendoddsdadsdogsdead]

I think that's more true of all our midfielders except Capoue. Most midfielders will spend most of the time making simple passes, often sideways. At least Carroll keeps moving, giving going, and he does get his head up and try to play more incisive passes when he can get forward.

Dembele sometimes invited pressure on our back four by ambling in possession and getting pressed out of it. It's fine to do that in the final third, and I like a CM that can drop a shoulder and move forward, but Dembele would spend too much time just dawdling around the centre of the pitch with the ball when it needed moving.

I'd have more confidence in Carroll playing a through ball than Dembele.

I personally think Dembele getting pressed out of it happened very rarely. Probably the best at keeping and manipulating the ball when under pressure in our whole squad and probably the one that can releive pressure the most from the back four by taking it and being comfortable with people right up your arse. If you're under pressure and I was a ch or fb would feel more comfortable knocking it into Dembele and not getting a hospital ball back than i would be with Carroll and actually pretty much anyone else in our squad.

I think people just seem to remember the Newcastle game when he lost the ball like that and in the next phase we conceded. He does play at his own pace but that's not always a bad thing in that area of the pitch I have a real issue with people thinking releasing the ball first time is always the right ball.

I obviously hope you're right that Carroll's a real talent and it'll be great if the kid makes it here. Personally I'm dubious and it will be interesting to see what the new manager makes of him. I dont think its fair to keep on blaming managers, the players got to take responsibily too. it'll also be interesting in regards to Dembele and the new manager.