Tottenham Vs Liverpool: Match Thread

[Misfit]

Thank you mate. He has been released without charge on the most amazing trumped up charge I have ever witnessed. I am sorely tempted to write a thread on what happened. I am ashamed at what our police force did to an American on a visit over from the states to the lane.

Apologies as this is off topic.

Shit, sorry to hear about that mate. Still, being a septic he no doubt thought our police were stupidly polite. No batons shoved up his arse or pepper spray shoved down his jap's eye as is the usual response to asking for directions from some of our donut-eating friends over the pond.

Hope it hasn't put him off going to games in the future.

 

[torbaytottenham]

Rogers is desperate!

He should have stuck to "played well, should have got something out of the game". The penalty calls were sad at best.

Agreed, driving back to Devon after the game, I heard Rogers on the radio, going on about 2 stonewall penalties ? And saying Gerrard was assaulted, I could not even remember the challenge and had to watch it on MOTD this morning to see what he was going on about, it actually happened at the end of the ground I was at, no way a penalty let alone an assault, don't think the Suarez one was either by the way

 

[Hitch]

Arent 99 percent of people on here crying out for 442 though? This season we have to play Ade and Defoe up top. I think Carroll is a good player, but i dont think he should play instead center mid for us if we want to finish in the top 4 this season. Play him in Europe, bring him on in games, and start him when we have injuries. His time will come

Are they? Sounds like a terrible idea to me. OK for games against weaker opposition perhaps, but we need to better assert ourselves in the midfield area. We are not dictating games this season. That's our problem. The vast majority of top teams do not play 442. It only really works well when you have two forwards up top with high workrate and intelligent movement (as with United when they play it). Unfortunately Defoe fulfills neither of these criteria. He limits us in so many respects and were our full squad regularly available I would never start him unless perhaps it were against particularly weak opposition at home. Against better teams a flat 442 (especially with Defoe) would leave us way too open and would result in us ceding the midfield battle (even more so).

What we need is to bolster the midfield via inserting a metronome type player alongside Sandro and Dembele in a 433. Would provide better protection for the full backs, provide the wingers with greater attacking freedom, provide the centre halves with a a greater variety of options when playing out from the back and would allow us to press the opposition better in the final third. Most of all it would allow us to fight for a stronger share of possession. We need to start controlling games.

 

[Mustard]

I used to feel that Hitch and I will again I'm sure but I actually think his tail is up at the moment and whilst he cant hold the ball up very well, if at all he worked his socks yesterday. He did well and I wouldn't drop him.

 

[Mustard]

I used to feel that Hitch and I will again I'm sure but I actually think his tail is up at the moment and whilst he cant hold the ball up very well, if at all he worked his socks yesterday. He did well and I wouldn't drop him.

 

[Hitch]

I used to feel that Hitch and I will again I'm sure but I actually think his tail is up at the moment and whilst he cant hold the ball up very well, if at all he worked his socks yesterday. He did well and I wouldn't drop him.

The main problem for me is that he's just so damned stupid. His movement is terrible and he doesn't press opposition defences well at all. If he had some intelligence about him then he'd really be something. For now we've little choice but to use him, but I want to see him swapped for an upgrade at the earliest possible opportunity. Been waiting for that to happen for years by now though so my expectations are low.

 

[Mustard]

Always wanted an upgrade for Defoe. He is 30 now and still doesn't understand the offside rule but I do feel he is in a purple patch and I have never seen him work so hard. He covered the last third as well as he could last night. He even won a header!

He is on course for 30 plus goals this season and I prefer him to Ade. He is seriously working hard and you have to see that. I respect his attitude and that is not something I ever thoight I would say.

I would prefer a traditional 2 up front but I also think that Clint is building a partnership with him.

I am happy to wait and see. That said I do want Lloriente.

 

[only1waddle]

Are they? Sounds like a terrible idea to me. OK for games against weaker opposition perhaps, but we need to better assert ourselves in the midfield area. We are not dictating games this season. That's our problem. The vast majority of top teams do not play 442. It only really works well when you have two forwards up top with high workrate and intelligent movement (as with United when they play it). Unfortunately Defoe fulfills neither of these criteria. He limits us in so many respects and were our full squad regularly available I would never start him unless perhaps it were against particularly weak opposition at home. Against better teams a flat 442 (especially with Defoe) would leave us way too open and would result in us ceding the midfield battle (even more so).

What we need is to bolster the midfield via inserting a metronome type player alongside Sandro and Dembele in a 433. Would provide better protection for the full backs, provide the wingers with greater attacking freedom, provide the centre halves with a a greater variety of options when playing out from the back and would allow us to press the opposition better in the final third. Most of all it would allow us to fight for a stronger share of possession. We need to start controlling games.

Agree with the 433, something like Honda Sandro Dembele, if we can't get a real quality number 10 then i see no point in continuing with it..

 

[Shadydan]

Falcao didn't have one of his best games last night did he...

 

[Toela65]

65% possession and created 5 chances, we had 35% and created 7. Liverpool just do a lot of pointless passing for no reason, they didn't really create many clear cut chances that I can think of. They just create a myth that they look threatening when they don't actually do anything. No wonder we just let them play

We had one cleared off, we missed an open goal, Suarez missed a sitter soon after you scored side footing the ball straight to Lloris, Suarez skyed a relatively simple volley from about 10 yards out, off the top of my head.

All of them were easily score-able but poor finishing meant they weren't.

We were at least a match for Spurs for 60 odd minutes, played very good in the second half creating, but missing, chances throughout which is the new Liverpool way.

Tottenham won fair and deserve credit and congrats for this which I have given, but I think we we deserve some credit too as we created enough chances to get at least something from the game as AVB said, so lets not make out that we were never in the game, created no decent chances and didn't look threatening as that only applies for the first 20 mins and not the rest.

 

[Toela65]

It was a foul simple as that, they were doing it all over the park and arguing every one.
Liverpool put us under a lot of pressure but on all honesTly I can't remember lloris having to pull off a save. They did well but we did what we did better. I think I heard they had nine shots on target which must include shots from outside the box that we blocked before they reached the box. Even their goal was more like a headed pass back to lennon they just got lucky.

I am not sure I agree with this. I think he has too high thoughts of himself and his own 'progressive' ideas to get it right. A case in point is letting Downing play left back against a team like ours. Of course if you give him the Barca squad he will be a good manager, but cannot see him convincing Henry to part with another 100-120 million pounds - which imo what would be needed to improve this side into something special.
Our inability to control a game when leading, Dawson/Gallas comedy show of passing and Bale's nugget made Liverpool look better than they are yesterday. Their defensice shape and organisation is quite evidently a shambles and they seem to lack a game plan for cutting through defenses. Granted there were some really nervy moments yesterday but they were a question of overcrowding in our area and defensive lapses from our back line than astute play from them.

That said, I would love to hear what it is that you see that I don't that makes you think that Rodgers will achieve a lot.

Do you not think its too early what Rodger's will achieve with Liverpool? Or AVB for Spurs?

Next Xmas will be better when they've had more transfer windows to bring in their own players and and developed their syle building a team.

I'm 50/50 at the mo about him. He's done a lot of good stuff and has a sound philosophy and has been excellent developing the kids. not being afraid to play them like previous Managers.

However, he has made mistakes too, to by gambling with Downing and Henderson as full backs which has cost us a goal in two different matches now, which contributed to a loss. TBF though, some of that was because of injuries to full backs but there were still better options than using those 2 muppets there.

Our style of footy though is much improved and a lot more enjoyable to watch and I like the system and philosophy he is trying to implement. We've played so excellent one touch passing at times leading to us slicing through midfields and defences, but it doesn't happen frequently enough.

We'll just keep on getting behind him and the team and see what happens. Hopefully this poor start is down to the transition to a new way of playing and given time Rodger's will get us improving over the season and beyond, and once he has brought in more players of his own to fit his philosophy, we'll see Liverpool becoming more and more of a threat in upcoming seasons.

Rodger's with us for at least the 2.5 seasons so the fans have got to get behind him and support him now because so far, at Anfield, were not doing a good enough job so far and this is only making things worse for the team and Manager.

Its just to hard and early yet for me to give any form of useful or credible prediction of how well Rodger's may or may not though.

 

[only1waddle]

Do you not think its too early what Rodger's will achieve with Liverpool? Or AVB for Spurs?

Next Xmas will be better when they've had more transfer windows to bring in their own players and and developed their style building a team.

I'm 50/50 at the mo about him. He's done a lot of good stuff and has a sound philosophy and has been excellent developing the kids. not being afraid to play them like previous Managers.

However, he has made mistakes too, to by gambling with Downing and Henderson as full backs which has cost us a goal in two different matches now, which contributed to a loss. TBF though, some of that was because of injuries to full backs but there were still better options than using those 2 muppets there.

Our style of footy though is much improved and a lot more enjoyable to watch and I like the system and philosophy he is trying to implement. We've played so excellent one touch passing at times leading to us slicing through midfields and defences, but it doesn't happen frequently enough.

We'll just keep on getting behind him and the team and see what happens. Hopefully this poor start is down to the transition to a new way of playing and given time Rodger's will get us improving over the season and beyond, and once he has brought in more players of his own to fit his philosophy, we'll see Liverpool becoming more and more of a threat in upcoming seasons.

Rodger's with us for at least the 2.5 seasons so the fans have got to get behind him and support him now because so far, at Anfield, were not doing a good enough job so far and this is only making things worse for the team and Manager.

Its just to hard and early yet for me to give any form of useful or credible prediction of how well Rodger's may or may not though.

Coach choosing own players, Levy................ not. going. to. happen.............

 

[SteveH]

Coach choosing own players, Levy................ not. going. to. happen.............

No manager or coach ever chooses his players in isolation. Except for that infamous coach/manager/owner Roman Abramovich!

 

[only1waddle]

No manager or coach ever chooses his players in isolation. Except for that infamous coach/manager/owner Roman Abramovich!

Fergie, Wenger, Moyes? would be nice if AVB got at least 1 of his choices..

 

[davidmatzdorf]

Do you not think its too early what Rodgers will achieve with Liverpool? Or AVB for Spurs?

What really impressed me yesterday about Liverpool was how quickly Rodgers has refocused their style. We're a third of the way into the season and Liverpool already look like last season's Swansea. It isn't working yet, mainly because he hasn't got the players he needs to score plentiful goals, but the squad has bought into his tactics and methods.

By contrast, AVB's style seems to be indistinct. It certainly isn't working out as the experts predicted: a consistent high defensive line, a pressing game (that's what you lot did last night, not us) and good ball retention. However, unlike Liverpool, we have several genuine star players and that is why we are in the upper part of the table: we have won several games, despite being largely outplayed (including yesterday's match), on the strength of the quality of our wingers to set up and score counter-attacking goals and one striker who can score on his own every couple of games.

I'd propose that Spurs have a highly talented squad including some seriously threatening players, but have also been subjected to a very debilitating series of injuries and have issues with midfield creativity and lack of defensive fortitude, whereas Liverpool have a weaker squad and only one-and-a-half seriously exciting players (Gerrard is visibly on the decline), but are playing a more coherent style of football.

In addition, you have just poached the brains behind our excellent youth scheme, Alex Inglethorpe. Seven years ago, Spurs' youth programme was a joke: it had produced one player in the previous decade, albeit a superb one, Ledley King. Now our whole first team squad is littered with players who joined the club at 12-16 years of age.

So it depends on how your owners are willing to treat the Rodgers 'era'. If they let him buy 2-3 key creative and attacking players and then wait until Inglethorpe starts to get a production line going, you could build another dynasty. But modern football doesn't generally work like that. It certainly doesn't work like that at Tottenham: we sack managers after they finish 4th.

 

[Mr Pink]

We had one cleared off, we missed an open goal, Suarez missed a sitter soon after you scored side footing the ball straight to Lloris, Suarez skyed a relatively simple volley from about 10 yards out, off the top of my head.

All of them were easily score-able but poor finishing meant they weren't.

We were at least a match for Spurs for 60 odd minutes, played very good in the second half creating, but missing, chances throughout which is the new Liverpool way.

Tottenham won fair and deserve credit and congrats for this which I have given, but I think we we deserve some credit too as we created enough chances to get at least something from the game as AVB said, so lets not make out that we were never in the game, created no decent chances and didn't look threatening as that only applies for the first 20 mins and not the rest.

I wouldn't describe that as a sitter, he was just inside the box, maybe not even - a good chance though. The one he blazed over, the ball was out of play before Agger whips it in - even if Dowd missed it. The one Henderson misses only results because of a poor decision by Lloris, completely avoidable as opposed to a real chance Liverpool cultivated.

I thought Liverpool played well though, and you closed down our space very well and of course saw huge amount of ball, particularly second half.

On balance you deserved something from the game, but there is no doubt we were feeling the affects of the three games in six days, one out in Rome and its also relevant to note that Rodgers rotated more than AVB for the European games.

Bottom line, I would be encouraged by Liverpooi's future - the blueprint is forming well, just need to get that attacking potency by getting in a player or two.

 

[dk-yid]

Do you not think its too early what Rodger's will achieve with Liverpool? Or AVB for Spurs?

Next Xmas will be better when they've had more transfer windows to bring in their own players and and developed their syle building a team.

I'm 50/50 at the mo about him. He's done a lot of good stuff and has a sound philosophy and has been excellent developing the kids. not being afraid to play them like previous Managers.

However, he has made mistakes too, ....

Of course it is too early, but it would be no fun waiting till the results are in before discussing it.

My point though is that I have my doubts because I feel that Rodgers is too set in his ways and I am struggling to see him being agile enough to adapt. Even at Swansea games were there for the taking if he had switched the style of play, but his insistence on tika-taka possession and attacking left them with 1 point where they could otherwise have got three, or 0 point where they could have got 1. At Swansea he was praised for this gung-ho charming approach, but he is now at a club that expects and wants more, and where cynicism and ugly football (step up andy carroll) is required to get results once in a while. That french twat down the road has the same kind of insistence and he hasn't won anything for years - because unless you are Barcelona and can pick and choose from the best players in the world this fancy, nice, fleet-footed football won't take you all the way.

I have refrained from commenting on AVB because my initial comment a was in regards to Rodgers and this prompted your response. Though trust me my I also have (similarish) issues with AVB so this is not purely rose-tinted bashing on others....

 

[worcestersauce]

Just seen the second half on football first (I recorded it) and Agger caught Bale's foot in the "dive" and Gallas played the ball not Suarez for the rat face's penalty shout.
I had to watch it again because I couldn't remember a penalty shout at the game now I know why, it was right in front of me so I knew Gallas never fouled him, I just didn't realise that was what rogers was claiming as a pen, seems like their manager is carrying on the fine tradition of that club, I thought he had more class than that but I was wrong.