Yid

[wills]

Sorry spurslenny, but when you're called a paki and spat at, had it sprayed on your house, had shaven headed white englishmen chase you down the road shouting paki, the word becomes more than just an insult that you can laugh off. These are more than words. I'll leave you with this thought, if a West Indian or Pakistani billionaire took over our club, would you become part of the nigger or paki army?

 

[lukespurs7]

Obviously our club has jewish links which explains the term and when used towards our players you are basically calling them a tottenham player rather than a 'Jew'.
However I am not Jewish and have nothing against them but the amount of time I have to explain the whole notion of the term 'Yid' to opposing fans does get frustrating and it must perhaps offend some Jewish people and also those who are not because they are being labelled something they are not,however its a traditional Spurs chant so can't really knock it.

 

[spurslenny]

Sorry spurslenny, but when you're called a paki and spat at, had it sprayed on your house, had shaven headed white englishmen chase you down the road shouting paki, the word becomes more than just an insult that you can laugh off. These are more than words. I'll leave you with this thought, if a West Indian or Pakistani billionaire took over our club, would you become part of the nigger or paki army?

Obviously that is a horrendous sitation to have to endure, but that which you explained is more than just name calling. Spiteful, violent or intimidating behavior such as that is totally unacceptable. My point pertains to banter, positive football chant (such as the ones used by us) and general good humoured mickiy taking, not agressive, inciteful behavior.
As regards to your question, no, obviously not, because that has nothing to do with the cultural history of this club. And as others have said, the use of the word 'yid' in some ways has been reclaimed as a positive collective unity symbol for the fans of our club, and is not used in a hateful, derogatory way.

You, I, and others may argue wether it's offensive, and that's down to each individuals take on the word, in the same way that someone being called 'a big nosed twat' will take exception, and others will not.
Sorry, buts that's my own feelings on name calling, be it cultural nam calling or physical name calling.

 

[The Apprentice]

Doesn't bother me in the slightest. It's our identity.

I'll always sing it even if they banned it.

 

[whitelightwhiteheat]

I have a question on this one. When did we adopt it (Yid Army) as our name, anyone know? Is it a recent-ish thing (the last 20 years) or before that?

 

[guate]

When did we adopt the "Lillywhites" term, was it from our all white kit during the 60's ?

 

[Raxscallion]

When did we adopt the "Lillywhites" term, was it from our all white kit during the 60's ?

That's a common misconception but no. It's derived from Lily White, a famous "hostess" (high class hooker) who worked in the area during the 20's. She was a favourite amongst the players of time and was reputed to have serviced the entire team, hence the nickname.

 

[worcestersauce]

I have a question on this one. When did we adopt it (Yid Army) as our name, anyone know? Is it a recent-ish thing (the last 20 years) or before that?

Never ever used the term in the 60's and 70's and spent the whole time in the Park Lane so it is later than that.

 

[Raxscallion]

As for 'Yid', I've always seen it as a 'reclaiming' thing. It's a word that's been used in a derogatory way, which we've reclaimed and turned back round on them. Much in the same way as 'nigga' is used by some members of the black community.

 

[Raxscallion]

Never ever used the term in the 60's and 70's and spent the whole time in the Park Lane so it is later than that.

No it originally comes from much earlier (see above) - it was revived later.

 

[Dan Ashcroft]

That's a common misconception but no. It's derived from Lily White, a famous "hostess" (high class hooker) who worked in the area during the 20's. She was a favourite amongst the players of time and was reputed to have serviced the entire team, hence the nickname.

You just made that up didn't you? :grin:

 

[Raxscallion]

You just made that up didn't you? :grin:

No, my mate's got the Opus (2nd hand, he's not that stupid) and it's in there.

 

[RickyVilla]

Last Tuesday WLWH!! ;-)

 

[PLTuck]

what i find funny is that peopel are writing 'The N Word' rather than nigger when they will freely write words like Yid.

I personally am of the opinion that words are JUST THAT. it has to be said in spite than to mean spite. if i'm conversing with my friends, and the subjects come up, i will freely use words like nigger, queer, poof, yid, any of these style of words if it assists in any kind of explanation i am giving. i DO NOT do is call someone a nigger or a poof in a derogatory manner, because THAT'S what discrimination, prejudice and all sorts of ugly little things come from.

Bang on.

I personally don't find it offensive when WE use it, as its used as a term of endearment. When other fans use it it offends me as its used in an offensive context.
If a majority of Jewish Spurs fans said it offended them when WE use it, I'd try very hard to stop using the word.

 

[THFC6061]

When did we adopt the "Lillywhites" term, was it from our all white kit during the 60's ?

The original "Lillywhites" were Preston North End, who won the very first Football League Championship in season 1888-89 (and repeated the feat the next season too).

Spurs adopted their kit in homage of their achievements.

As a colour, Lillywhite is a shade a tad creamier than pure white and in the ethical sense, it means beyond reproach: blameless or exemplary - much like the standard of football we strive to play (but don't always succeed!).

 

[dooey123]

I voted no but some of the comments have made me think differently.

I guess its down to whether you care about what other people think. Perhaps we shouldn't but for me I wan't our club and fans to be respected.

As has been said when other teams use it it is done so in a negative way as in "Jew scum" particularly when done so by West Ham and Chelsea supporters. In their eyes they are calling us shits and we are therefore saying yes we are shits and proud of it.

If any one of us were insulted one on one in a pub, called a prick for example I doubt we would turn to the person and say "so what?".

The term Yid is here now and will probably stay for a long time to come but I think I'd prefer it to go away altogether. Whether there is or has been a large Jewish community around the Tottenham area should not be part of our club or any club and the issue of race or religion should not be involved in football.

 

[Jaispurs]

Just adding to the debate. I voted no and am Jewish. I am not particularly religious though but have had been called a Yid all my life. I went to a CofE school and whenever anything went wrong with friends etc I was called Yid, Jew, Red Sea Pedestrian, Tight, Judas you name it i've had it thrown at me. But through adversity you grow stronger. My grandparents grew up with Mosley and the Black shirts throughout the 30's and the fear of Hitler during the war years. Growing up in the 70's I had the NF racist crap from everyone and was even handed literature that blamed the Jews for all the ills of the world. So although i'm not religious I am always conscious that I am Jewish and am bringing up my kids to know about their heritage and that they are Jewish whether they practice the religion or not.
Back to the subject in hand. I find it difficult to understand how a Leeds and Chelsea fan can be offended by Spurs fans calling themselves Yids. Now as I have said I am not religious and maybe they are further into the religion than I am, which beggars the believe that they actually support the teams they do.
One of my worst ever footballing experiences was at Leeds. We were playing them in the FA Cup when George Graham had just become our manager. My sister was studying at Leeds and got us tickets in the 'safe' home end. I was surrounded by Hitler salutes, hissing noises and shouts of 'f*ck off back to jew land you thieving *****s' etc etc. I felt humiliated, sad and very frightened. I couldn't even go to the loo in case someone noticed I was circumcised.
The most gratifying site that day was the Israel flag flying proudly in the Spurs end with the chants of Yid army crying out. I thought, those are my people, thats where I am safe and thats where no body cares if i'm Jewish or not. Thats why I love the term Yid Army. It shows that everyone has embraced the Jewish religion and you won't hear anything anti semetic at WHL or following Spurs by our fellow supporters.
Chelsea fans are horrific. Their firm are Combat 18. 18 being the first and 8th letters of the alphabet - AH or Adolf Hitler. How any Jew can support them is beyond me.
If Jews were offended by the chants then the songs would be banned in the ground or the crowd would not be full of Jewish faces, all singing along.
Don't worry about what followers of other teams say, they don't understand. Daniel Levy has conducted a survey across the Jewish community about the chant and the response was an emphatic Yes to it staying.
I'm proud to be Jewish and proud to take my seat every season in block 39. Yid Army

 

[Raxscallion]

The original "Lillywhites" were Preston North End, who won the very first Football League Championship in season 1888-89 (and repeated the feat the next season too).

Spurs adopted their kit in homage of their achievements.

As a colour, Lillywhite is a shade a tad creamier than pure white and in the ethical sense, it means beyond reproach: blameless or exemplary - much like the standard of football we strive to play (but don't always succeed!).

This is tosh. What you've just stated is merely a rephrasing of a statement that the club released in the late 60's/early 70's as a whitewash of the true derivation - they were keen to hide the less salubrious nature of the nickname's origins. It's pure spin and PR, nothing more.

 

[Son_Of]

no. i use it literally every day. and literally a hundred times every match day. and i never use the word literally when i mean figuratively

 

[SpurSince57]

Just adding to the debate. I voted no and am Jewish. I am not particularly religious though but have had been called a Yid all my life. I went to a CofE school and whenever anything went wrong with friends etc I was called Yid, Jew, Red Sea Pedestrian, Tight, Judas you name it i've had it thrown at me. But through adversity you grow stronger. My grandparents grew up with Mosley and the Black shirts throughout the 30's and the fear of Hitler during the war years. Growing up in the 70's I had the NF racist crap from everyone and was even handed literature that blamed the Jews for all the ills of the world. So although i'm not religious I am always conscious that I am Jewish and am bringing up my kids to know about their heritage and that they are Jewish whether they practice the religion or not.
Back to the subject in hand. I find it difficult to understand how a Leeds and Chelsea fan can be offended by Spurs fans calling themselves Yids. Now as I have said I am not religious and maybe they are further into the religion than I am, which beggars the believe that they actually support the teams they do.
One of my worst ever footballing experiences was at Leeds. We were playing them in the FA Cup when George Graham had just become our manager. My sister was studying at Leeds and got us tickets in the 'safe' home end. I was surrounded by Hitler salutes, hissing noises and shouts of 'f*ck off back to jew land you thieving *****s' etc etc. I felt humiliated, sad and very frightened. I couldn't even go to the loo in case someone noticed I was circumcised.
The most gratifying site that day was the Israel flag flying proudly in the Spurs end with the chants of Yid army crying out. I thought, those are my people, thats where I am safe and thats where no body cares if i'm Jewish or not. Thats why I love the term Yid Army. It shows that everyone has embraced the Jewish religion and you won't hear anything anti semetic at WHL or following Spurs by our fellow supporters.
Chelsea fans are horrific. Their firm are Combat 18. 18 being the first and 8th letters of the alphabet - AH or Adolf Hitler. How any Jew can support them is beyond me.
If Jews were offended by the chants then the songs would be banned in the ground or the crowd would not be full of Jewish faces, all singing along.
Don't worry about what followers of other teams say, they don't understand. Daniel Levy has conducted a survey across the Jewish community about the chant and the response was an emphatic Yes to it staying.
I'm proud to be Jewish and proud to take my seat every season in block 39. Yid Army

I was a student at Leeds back in 69-72 and can fully testify to their fans' Neanderthal nature. Their stewards were too thick to notice that my friends and I had London accents, so we invariably had to stand in their 'Kop' (they had no tradition of their own, so nicked everyone else's). At that time, though, there was no anti-Jewish chanting.

This is such a tricky question, and I fully understand why some Jews and the terminally Politically Correct find 'Yid', as we employ it, offensive. Perhaps it hasn't been adequately explained to them.