Can we compete?

[jabbathehut]

if we sort out the defence and concede 15-20 fewer goals and learn how to unlock teams that come to WHL to park the bus then we can definitely compete.Beat wba,stoke,newcastle and villa at home and we finish 4th this year. Making WHL a fortress is key.We took points from 3 of the top 4.It certainly hasn't always been like that.

 

[StartingPrice]

Improvement isn't just a factor of how many great players are bought, though, or even how quickly/how well they settle. Young players can naturally be expected to improve with a year's experience and mental/physical maturity - and we have the youngest squad in the country. The quality of the young players coming through the youth set-up can be more important than players bought - and for the supporters of a club who has just produced Harry Kane to even need told this is somewhat odd. No-one, least of all myself, is going to guarantee that a lot, or even any, young players will, with certainty, make an impact next season, let alone an impact like Harry Kane. But we do have one of the most highly rated, if not the highly rated, youth set-ups in the country (and Europe), and some of the most highly rated youth players in our ranks. It seems almost certain that Poch will have more players he trusts next season, too.

Without going into a big discussion of who our rivals have signed and who we have signed, what it is really going to come down to is this: We obviously struggle to sign very top level managers/Head Coaches and players at their peak - either we can't attract them, or we can't afford them, or they can be on to a more sure thing elsewhere, or a combination. We have taken a gamble on acquiring them earlier in their careers in the hope that they will develop to be top level. The more players and Head Coach that reach that level, and the higher they push their individual ceilings play a huge part in how well we can compete going into the future.

 

[lukespurs7]

if we sort out the defence and concede 15-20 fewer goals and learn how to unlock teams that come to WHL to park the bus then we can definitely compete.Beat wba,stoke,newcastle and villa at home and we finish 4th this year. Making WHL a fortress is key.We took points from 3 of the top 4.It certainly hasn't always been like that.

Good points. Do you think Wimmer and Tripper will really make a difference?

I know, I know the window is only just open so lets see who we bring in but I think we are lacking a top top class CB a CM a winger with pace and a capeable back-up striker.

Hopefully we can get these.

 

[lukespurs7]

Improvement isn't just a factor of how many great players are bought, though, or even how quickly/how well they settle. Young players can naturally be expected to improve with a year's experience and mental/physical maturity - and we have the youngest squad in the country. The quality of the young players coming through the youth set-up can be more important than players bought - and for the supporters of a club who has just produced Harry Kane to even need told this is somewhat odd. No-one, least of all myself, is going to guarantee that a lot, or even any, young players will, with certainty, make an impact next season, let alone an impact like Harry Kane. But we do have one of the most highly rated, if not the highly rated, youth set-ups in the country (and Europe), and some of the most highly rated youth players in our ranks. It seems almost certain that Poch will have more players he trusts next season, too.

Without going into a big discussion of who our rivals have signed and who we have signed, what it is really going to come down to is this: We obviously struggle to sign very top level managers/Head Coaches and players at their peak - either we can't attract them, or we can't afford them, or they can be on to a more sure thing elsewhere, or a combination. We have taken a gamble on acquiring them earlier in their careers in the hope that they will develop to be top level. The more players and Head Coach that reach that level, and the higher they push their individual ceilings play a huge part in how well we can compete going into the future.

brilliant post!

 

[lukespurs7]

The transfer window isn't closed. It opened yesterday.

United also haven't signed Ramos.

Get over yourself FFS. We're likely to make at least 4 new signings.

I know it isn't long into the window but we have made 2 signings 1 of which for me is probably our biggest weakness in CB and as good as Wimmer may become I think that is the one position we lack quality and a leader.

We need a CM, Pacey winger and capeable back-up striker and to sell the deadwood.

If we can do that and we keep all our best players AND our youth players continue to develop then we have a chance of competing I suppose but it is a lot of IF's, I suppose it is a slower more long-term approach but perhaps all of these young players peaks may co-inside with our new stadium who knows...

Good feedback from others so far, your response was a waste of time fella.

 

[lukespurs7]

Urgh, Depay, Proven world class?!? Give me a break. He had some great cameo performances for Holland followed by one great season.

We can compete, but instead of going out signing ready made, £30M players for every position, we must develop our own/scout potential. The best teams in modern football are ones that have grown together.

This gives me hope as Barca & Ajax have proven this can work very effectively I just hope we get it right and keep the likes of Lloris etc a bit longer while our younger players develop.

 

[beats1]

With the recent news of Manchester United liked with Sergio Ramos and having just signed Depay who by the way is a class act as well as Liverpool signing that new Brazillian striker and some astute buys in Milner, Clyne and Ings I'm starting to lose a bit of optimism about Spurs and football that I had at the end of the season.

I know it has been covered on numerous occasions about how financially we are behind the bigger sides and can't pay the bigger wages and transfer fees etc but I just can't help but be a little depressed that while little old Tottenham have a fairly exciting crop of young mostly homegrown talent and are perusing an exciting and sensible strategy of purchasing young hungry players the competition is just getting stronger and stronger.

Chelsea: Have the best manager in the world and strength in every position + just added Cuadrado and Falcao.
Man.City: Falling away from their standards of a few seasons ago but will be guaranteed to strengthen.
Arsenal: 2x FA cup winners in last 2 years and are looking stronger and stronger + just made a brilliant signing in Cech!
Liverpool: As stated above some very astute purchases especially Milner and Clyne will lift them forward.
Man.U: Depay is a great new signing, and will be sure to add much more class to get back to where they were.

Tottenham: Wimmer & Trippier... (While I don't think there is anything wrong with these purchases and I like our new strategy as clearly splashing the cash doesn't work for us there is a difference between buying say Pauliniho, Chiriches and Capoue and signing Depay and Ramos the latter 2 are proven world class players who we could never dream of attracting or affording).

I thought Potch did a great job this year and we brought through some great young players like: Kane, Mason, Bentaleb, Rose, Dier etc and I'm excited to see him and his team weed out the deadwood and built a young talented squad but even if we get this really right will it come close to the 5 teams mentioned above, I just can't see it happening.

Its almost as if as hard as we might try we just won't come close, sorry but when did we last actually look like we could seriously challenge for the title or the FA cup or a European cup if not the league... Perhaps under Harry for a while otherwise not for 30+ years I'd say and I'm just a bit bored of the Sky 4/5 getting stronger and stronger while the rest just struggle to compete.

Always optimistic for the season ahead but realistically not hoping or expecting anything better or different to last season except we may end up with a squad and group of players who all care and hopefully are enjoyable to watch more often than not.

COYS!

Yes because it went wrong once it shall always go wrong. Clearly part of the issue with the bale transfer window was that we did seem to sign players without much scouting and who just came off the back off a good season/tournament.

Worth noting that a lot of our signings that were a great success weren't exactly cheap, like Modric, Bale(was £10m initially before being reduced), Berbatov and etc.

Some people act like all expensive signings mean that we will sign a dud lol

 

[TH1239]

The simple fact of the matter is that the EPL television deal from 2013-2016 was a game changer for many clubs. The fact that the next television deal from 2016-2019 now guarantees a near 40% increase on top of the already rich 2013 deal is a massive boon to teams throughout the league. The top 5 can now comfortably spend anywhere between 75-150 million pounds net each summer from now until the end of the decade. The bigger concern are the likes of West Ham and Stoke can currently spend 30 million pounds net a summer with the current television deal, but with 6th place in 2016-2017 earning a projected 135-140 million pounds, you can expect these teams to aggressively make signings like Payet and Shaqiri from here on out without having to sell their best players to finance moves.

I've made my opinion clear: the club has a tried and true formula that panned out with Berbatov, Modric, Lloris, Vertonghen, Van der Vaart, Eriksen, and Chadli. All players who broke through at the international level and had major success at their clubs and almost all had EL/CL experience and success, too. Virtually all cost in the 10-16 million pound range. Players of this ilk seemingly available this summer are Cabaye, Clasie, Payet, Shaqiri, Song, Llorente, Suarez, Imbula, Alderweireld, Mirallas, Ayew and Konoplyanka just to name a few. I, and many others, aren't asking we sign far better players than this lot, as it's clear we can't afford them, or at the least, won't pay the transfer fees for them. Nevertheless, signings less experienced, less talented players with weaker histories of work product should be criticized as not good enough for us as a club (if it comes to that). We can afford a 12 million pound player with a 70K a week salary. We supposedly refused to loan out Adebayor to West Ham, which would've saved 50K a week last year, so I don't want to hear about how our wage bill is bursting at the seams (even in a season where we added numerous high wage earners in 2014, our wage bill only went up 4 million pounds).

Here's another interesting fact regarding the new EPL television deal: there is a good chance that after the 2016-2017 deal takes effect, we will be nearly on par with Juventus in total revenue and in the top 10 of world football. If that fresh money is not going to be spent on transfers to bolster the squad, it is an absolute must that we be told where this money is going. If it's ALL going to build a stadium, then they need to explain that to supporters (that would be a fairly unprecedented step in professional sports as far as I'm aware, as I've never seen owners take television money most teams use to bolster playing rosters to finance a stadium that said owner will solely own). You can't on the one hand say we have no money to spend because we are building a stadium and on the second hand say we will have to spend years after the stadium is built paying off the stadium (both things I've seen said on here).

 

[DaleMurphy]

Compete? absolutely
Break into the top 4? unlikely

We took points off 3 of the top 4 last season. Remember our record and goal differential against those sides the two prior seasons?

 

[absolute bobbins]

Like accusing someone of knowing less because they are American?

Isn't that a fair point?

 

[Nebby]

For the title? No.
For the top four? For a while.
For 5th? Absolutely.

 

[luptic]

For me its all about competing with those in and around us, and whether we can attract or pay the monies needed for our top targets. Granted i can understand the need to shift the players that are deemed surplus to the needs of the squad, but somethings its annoying that we try to recoup as much money as possible.
As much of out recent success ie Modric and Bale showed sometimes we need to gamble to get in players, while the likes of Paulinho etc show, it sometimes doesnt work out that well, ( i think our recent failings has burnt the figures of those bringing the players in, as there isnt as much confidence).
Its still very early in the merry go round, but there has been some players that have moved whom most of us would have liked in squad, but there is an awful amount of time left to see how everything pans out.

 

[Timberwolf]

We're always going to be at a disadvantage compared to all the richer clubs but we live in a world where Atletico Madrid won La Liga and Dortmund repeatedly topped Bayern. If we buy smart, invest in youth and get a fair slice of luck, who knows what we can do.

I think as Spurs fans we always have that faint glimmer of hope. And it's that hope that makes supporting Spurs both so rewarding and so horrendously soul crushing.

 

[dontcallme]

I'm not too concerned at the moment. Importantly we appear to be holding onto our best players which for me is always more important in the short term than any signing.

Liverpool have bought well but a lot of signings in a short period isn't anything to worry about as we've seen from ourselves and Liverpool in the last 2 seasons.

With their spending power and need to remain in the CL Arsenal and Utd were always going to spend big and they are attractive enough clubs to get top talent.

Our improvement isn't simply going to happen through the transfer market. We have a very young squad that are growing together and Poch seems to know how to get them to play. Trippier and Wimmer fit our squad needs.

Poch did say a few months ago something about being smarter than the opposition. I thought he meant buying early but if we bide our time and get the right signings then I'll be happy.

At this stage I'd say we still edge Liverpool but are unlikely to compete too competitively with the teams who finished in the top 4 last season.

 

[mpickard2087]

I started a thread a few weeks ago with a few ideas about how we compete despite the financial gap. Basically we (fans and club) have to think long term and stop basing everything on transfers and do something different. There are many areas where we can gain a competitive advantage.

In the short term, we could do with being much smarter, and more polished, tactically. Whoever we sign for instance, if Poch plays with a cm2 every single week and hasn't got individuals putting in more than a halfhearted press then we'll still get x amount of games where we get bossed in the centre of the park and made to look silly.

 

[dudu]

Good points. Do you think Wimmer and Tripper will really make a difference?

I know, I know the window is only just open so lets see who we bring in but I think we are lacking a top top class CB a CM a winger with pace and a capeable back-up striker.

Hopefully we can get these.

I think almost anything will be an improvement on what we had to deal with at RB last year. Just havin Dier play there at the end of the season who was competently crossing the ball made a difference, so however mild I'm expecting Tripper to give us an improvement over Walker (on last years form) Dier, Chiriches etc.

 

[Darth Vega]

Until we can compete on the same financial level as City, Chelsea, United and so on, I can't see us establishing ourselves as a consistent top 4 side and beyond. When those around us are spending tens of millions on players and putting them on well over 100k p/w contracts, we'll always struggle. Money is too big of a catalyst in the modern game.

 

[dudu]

I'm not too concerned at the moment. Importantly we appear to be holding onto our best players which for me is always more important in the short term than any signing.

Liverpool have bought well but a lot of signings in a short period isn't anything to worry about as we've seen from ourselves and Liverpool in the last 2 seasons.

With their spending power and need to remain in the CL Arsenal and Utd were always going to spend big and they are attractive enough clubs to get top talent.

Our improvement isn't simply going to happen through the transfer market. We have a very young squad that are growing together and Poch seems to know how to get them to play. Trippier and Wimmer fit our squad needs.

Poch did say a few months ago something about being smarter than the opposition. I thought he meant buying early but if we bide our time and get the right signings then I'll be happy.

At this stage I'd say we still edge Liverpool but are unlikely to compete too competitively with the teams who finished in the top 4 last season.

Great Post.

 

[Hoops]

The simple fact of the matter is that the EPL television deal from 2013-2016 was a game changer for many clubs. The fact that the next television deal from 2016-2019 now guarantees a near 40% increase on top of the already rich 2013 deal is a massive boon to teams throughout the league. The top 5 can now comfortably spend anywhere between 75-150 million pounds net each summer from now until the end of the decade. The bigger concern are the likes of West Ham and Stoke can currently spend 30 million pounds net a summer with the current television deal, but with 6th place in 2016-2017 earning a projected 135-140 million pounds, you can expect these teams to aggressively make signings like Payet and Shaqiri from here on out without having to sell their best players to finance moves.

I've made my opinion clear: the club has a tried and true formula that panned out with Berbatov, Modric, Lloris, Vertonghen, Van der Vaart, Eriksen, and Chadli. All players who broke through at the international level and had major success at their clubs and almost all had EL/CL experience and success, too. Virtually all cost in the 10-16 million pound range. Players of this ilk seemingly available this summer are Cabaye, Clasie, Payet, Shaqiri, Song, Llorente, Suarez, Imbula, Alderweireld, Mirallas, Ayew and Konoplyanka just to name a few. I, and many others, aren't asking we sign far better players than this lot, as it's clear we can't afford them, or at the least, won't pay the transfer fees for them. Nevertheless, signings less experienced, less talented players with weaker histories of work product should be criticized as not good enough for us as a club (if it comes to that). We can afford a 12 million pound player with a 70K a week salary. We supposedly refused to loan out Adebayor to West Ham, which would've saved 50K a week last year, so I don't want to hear about how our wage bill is bursting at the seams (even in a season where we added numerous high wage earners in 2014, our wage bill only went up 4 million pounds).

Here's another interesting fact regarding the new EPL television deal: there is a good chance that after the 2016-2017 deal takes effect, we will be nearly on par with Juventus in total revenue and in the top 10 of world football. If that fresh money is not going to be spent on transfers to bolster the squad, it is an absolute must that we be told where this money is going. If it's ALL going to build a stadium, then they need to explain that to supporters (that would be a fairly unprecedented step in professional sports as far as I'm aware, as I've never seen owners take television money most teams use to bolster playing rosters to finance a stadium that said owner will solely own). You can't on the one hand say we have no money to spend because we are building a stadium and on the second hand say we will have to spend years after the stadium is built paying off the stadium (both things I've seen said on here).

Absolutely right. The do a Leeds brigade need to get a grip.

Fact is, Levy has no ambition to invest.

 

[Donki]

Every year!! Every year thsi come up, I think we can.

I will be honest and will probably get disagrees all over the place but I dont think Ramos will do that well in the England, he gets away with an awful lot of shit due to who he is in Spain. I hate him so maybe I am biased.