Defoe Vs Man City

[brasil_spur]

Honestly i thought he had a fairly poor game.

His running in behind players wasn't as good as usual, he didn't manage to get enough possesion on the edge of the box, where he is probably most dangerous from.

His goal was a good finish, but the chance was handed to him.

He missed an obvious chance.

I like Defoe, and it really wasn't his fault as he was always going to struggle playing the lone front man role against a team like City, but i think he could've done more in the game.

 

[lol]

bale should have squared off to defoe way earlier instead of making the run. defoe was anticipating the pass..if he moved any further would have been a offside. i would say bale at that point was too selfish, trying to win the game by himself. the only thing that i felt defoe could have done better was stretch out his feet and point his toes toward, instead of bringing in from the side, foot flexed. that. that 5 inch extension would have own us the game.

 

[adamthfc]

bale should have squared off to defoe way earlier instead of making the run. defoe was anticipating the pass..if he moved any further would have been a offside. i would say bale at that point was too selfish, trying to win the game by himself. the only thing that i felt defoe could have done better was stretch out his feet and point his toes toward, instead of bringing in from the side, foot flexed. that. that 5 inch extension would have own us the game.

Spot on

 

[cozzo]

I think that Defoe had crashing into the post in the back of his mind, thus not attacking the space with as much gusto and hesitated. I think that he knew he would not score and just made a token effort.

 

[AngerManagement]

The Bale Defoe incident was one of two players not being on the same wavelength

Defoe failed to read Bale's intention and didn't bust a gut to get in the right position for the tap in

It could be argued too that Bale didn't read Defoe's run and had he played him in before rounding Lescott, Defoe would have had a one on one with the keeper (although also had pressure from LEscott)

For me Bale did the right thing, his extra run and the nature of his delivery took both Lescott and Hart out of the equation so that Defoe would only have had a tap in (where as had Bale chose the other option he would still have to beat Hart and had LEscott pressurising him)

But then because of Defoe's some what staggered run as he waited for the pull back or simply to react to BAle instead of anticipating him Bale's ball ultimately took Defoe out of the equation too.

It was a key moment in the game, and potentially the title race.

I really just wanted Bale to smash it in the bottom corner Inter style as I had little faith in Defoe scoring from his cross, I actually think Pav would have scored that goal because he is better at reading situations than Defoe and would have been more likely to be in the right place at the right time.

I don't want to seem like I am berating Defoe, he had a good game and took his goal really well. Its not really his fault that he was unable to get involved that much, we were asking him to play a role that simply isn't his game and he did it about as well as we could have expected him to.

The Bale cross too, frankly Bale asked him to be a player he is not, Defoe has never been a fox in the box intelligent player who always is in the right place at the right time, I think a more cunning striker would have already made his burst to get to where the ball was about to be but Defoe was waiting for the cut back and waiting a split second before his final burst of pace to get to the cross and that split second was the difference between tap in and desperate and futile lunge.

[yt]mRDbkVYu5sY[/yt]

Two quotes from commentary...

"ohhhhh WHAT A MISS"

"he simply can't keep up with Gareth Bale"

There was a time where Bale had to choose between playing Defoe in Early or rounding LEscott, I think Bale had half a mind on taking teh shot and winning the game himself and it was only when Lescott kept up with him quite well he played in Defoe, but the cut back was not really on at that stage and his ball was perfect....Defoe's stride just seemed to get messed up and he couldn't sort his feet out in time.

At that speed, it takes split second reading and reactions and real calmness it was asking a bit much of Defoe perhaps, a world class striker would have read the play and been there in time but Defoe has never been world class.

 

[striebs]

Meh.. Defoe's game has gone backwards.

When we signed him first time he was full of ideas, unpredictable, good with the ball at his feet, could play off the shoulder of the last defender or take the ball past last man.

He now seems to lost all of these abilities. It's no good having a great shot when you can't make space for yourself or get beyond your defender.

Lets not even talk about his link up play..

He'll always get 15 goals a season and run his little legs off. But so will Kevin Davies.

I think Defoe went backwards for a number of years and got distracted by life off the pitch .

However , this season he's been playing better than at any time in the last 5 years .

Much as I prefer watching cultured players like Mark Viduka who create a goal out of nothing with their backs to goal if you want to win something you are probably better with a Linneker/Klinsman type player who does nothing except put the ball in the net from close range .

 

[kendoddsdadsdogsdead]

I've been having another look at the game and I didn't realize how bad his off the ball movement was this afternoon. He rarely found himself a pocket of space/made himself available for a pass.

He didn't touch the ball too many times today and nobody's control is perfect all of the time, sure, but I am of the opinion that, in general, his touch is not that of a top class player.

His first touch was terrible 47 seconds into the first half. At 37:58, his second touch was actually a tackle and at 77:30, after getting in behind Lescott, his lack of balance/close control saw him take a fresh air kick with Bale free in an excellent position.

I think he held the ball up well on 3 occasions and I didn't fancy him to round Hart because I think he lacks composure when he has too much time to think. So credit to him there. He just rolled it into the net.

I agree about his movement and don't particularly rate many aspects of his game, his pace his overrated and he gets brushed off the ball easily, but you're not going to convince me his got a poor touch. When you play the game you can tell who looks comfortable on the ball and receiving it and Defoe does as far as I'm concerned. Going through the whole game and picking out one or two moments he lost the ball, well we could do that with every player.

 

[double0]

It does surprise me how Defoe is scrutinized in moments like this...we get the accusations that he fails to score in big games, we hear the moans about his lack of touches on the ball him being a one trip pony with only his left foot for standing Defoe's criticised about his height ffs.

Against City he came in for Adebayor and played well IMO. Defoe scored a crucial goal at an important time in the game, anticipated a mistake from City CB then had the composure to round the keeper (now probably the best in EPL) and score. The Bale Defoe passage of play can be argued either way he just missed out...that's football.

As a Squad player or starting 11 Defoe's worth it his goal scoring record is testament to that.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Maybe we've been spoilt with berbs and keane but the amount of stick Defoe gets is fairly ridiculous... He's never going to be world class but he's better than a hell of a lot of other premiership strikers and he'd get game time for everyone in the league except Man City... He'd be used at manure, certainly play for Chelsea and Arsenal and start for everybody else in the league...

And BC, for someone who loves stats so much,

http://www.imscouting.com/reports-generator3/?id=40&l=5304&p1=0&p2=500&p3=0&p4=20#rep

He's currently 7th best goal return in the league... He'd be higher if Man City hadn't scored quite so many goals this year.

He doesn't fit our style of play very well and today he was isolated, but why on earth he's being hammered and no ones shouting about how poor VDV was today is beyond me.

...Certainly, I don't envy Harrys job trying to get someone better in than him for a minimal outlay on transfer fees and wages.

To put that stat into context Pav would be 8th or 9th, virtually level with Rooney.

And I would counter that with a stat showing EPL strikers contribution with the ball, which would almost certainly show Defoe as being in the bottom 7.

VDV wasn't poor. VDV was very good. You aren't thinking about the game as a whole and why we managed to compete and hold our own against the side at the top of the league and prevent them from dominating by having 51% of the ball first half, and 47% over all.

This was because we have players like VDV who cover more ground than everyone else, make themselves available to receive the ball more than anyone else and rarely give it away when under pressure. See the ball 60 times instead of 13.

Why was Defoe isolated ? Because his movement is unintelligent and he doesn't make himself available enough. I would be surprised if there is a player in the league who contributes less in terms of seeing the ball than Defoe in this league.

From around 18-22 yards I don't think there is a better finisher in this league, but he isn't that great from 6 yards and he also lacks finesse, his game is possibly more one dimensional than most perceived top strikers I can think of which is why even the man that bought him for 16m isn't starting him regularly. He wasn't good enough for our first team when he was sold 4 years ago, and certainly isn't now. I don't mind him being in our squad, but I don't want him to ever be first choice because it would mean our football has regressed.

I didn't start a thread saying he was entirely responsible for losing yesterday but I'm not starting a thread saying how fantastic he was either. Because neither are true. He did fuck all of consequence until late on when he scored and fluffed two great opportunities to influence the outcome.

 

[eViL]

Klinsman type player who does nothing except put the ball in the net from close range .

I hope you've got some proof that this is all Klinsmann did.

You must have been watching a different player to me - he scored with his head, his left, his right, from close range, on the line, outside the box, bicycle kicks, volleys. His link up and hold up play was superb, never wasted a pass, had an extra gear of pace when needed.

Better than Shearer.

 

[ethanedwards]

I hope you've got some proof that this is all Klinsmann did.

You must have been watching a different player to me - he scored with his head, his left, his right, from close range, on the line, outside the box, bicycle kicks, volleys. His link up and hold up play was superb, never wasted a pass, had an extra gear of pace when needed.

Better than Shearer.

Fair summation of Jurgen, your version is the one I recall.

 

[jonathanhotspur]

I agree about his movement and don't particularly rate many aspects of his game, his pace his overrated and he gets brushed off the ball easily, but you're not going to convince me his got a poor touch. When you play the game you can tell who looks comfortable on the ball and receiving it and Defoe does as far as I'm concerned. Going through the whole game and picking out one or two moments he lost the ball, well we could do that with every player.

I had said the ball bounced off him and you asked me when it happened. I just wanted to prove that I wasn't making it up. My point is that, in general, I think his first touch is lacking. It's not a conclusion I've come to on the basis of one game.

 

[midoNdefoe]

considering redknapp's tactical infllexibility yes, the need is great.

but we have versatile players that could be used as stop-gap solutions. as prev. suggested kaboul could have been used today as a target today to support defoe. bale could have been used as the central target . even just asking bale to stay close to defoe would have helped. as would have playing lennon and bale as narrower attacking mids, nominally in front of a midfield 3.

so many options, we chose none.

:rofl:
did you watch the game???

What happened when Livermore came on?
We changed our shape 2 or 3 times noticably yesterday....:duh:

Thanks for your fantastic input though, maybe you should write a letter to Harry explaining your brilliant tactical background, and why you should be given the role of master tactician..in fact, apply for the england job, i'm sure that with how obviously terrible Harry is, you'll be a sure fire winner!

Kaboul as a targetman???:bs:

 

[kungfugrip]

Thought Defoe did fairly well. Not much service. Took the goal very well, unlucky not to score the winner. Much more disappointed with VDV yesterday. He's either awesome or poor.

 

[jonathanhotspur]

Thought Defoe did fairly well. Not much service. Took the goal very well, unlucky not to score the winner. Much more disappointed with VDV yesterday. He's either awesome or poor.

Not much service? How often did he show for the ball?

And I think that is absolute rubbish about VDV. He's the only player we have who routinely looks to play a killer pass. Modric has been getting a free ride for weeks now.

 

[Mr Pink]

Not much service? How often did he show for the ball?

And I think that is absolute rubbish about VDV. He's the only player we have who routinely looks to play a killer pass. Modric has been getting a free ride for weeks now.

I agree but it annoyed me when he chose to shoot 35 yards out when Lennon was standing free in acres of space on the right hand side....an easy pass was putting Lennon in a very dangerous position.

 

[jonathanhotspur]

I agree but it annoyed me when he chose to shoot 35 yards out when Lennon was standing free in acres of space on the right hand side....an easy pass was putting Lennon in a very dangerous position.

I agree that it was a waste of time shooting from there but I don't think Lennon was on his game yesterday. His first contribution was to back heel the ball to a Man City player. That kind of thing drives me cuckoo.

 

[SpurSince57]

To put that stat into context Pav would be 8th or 9th, virtually level with Rooney.

And I would counter that with a stat showing EPL strikers contribution with the ball, which would almost certainly show Defoe as being in the bottom 7.

VDV wasn't poor. VDV was very good. You aren't thinking about the game as a whole and why we managed to compete and hold our own against the side at the top of the league and prevent them from dominating by having 51% of the ball first half, and 47% over all.

This was because we have players like VDV who cover more ground than everyone else, make themselves available to receive the ball more than anyone else and rarely give it away when under pressure. See the ball 60 times instead of 13.

Why was Defoe isolated ? Because his movement is unintelligent and he doesn't make himself available enough. I would be surprised if there is a player in the league who contributes less in terms of seeing the ball than Defoe in this league.

From around 18-22 yards I don't think there is a better finisher in this league, but he isn't that great from 6 yards and he also lacks finesse, his game is possibly more one dimensional than most perceived top strikers I can think of which is why even the man that bought him for 16m isn't starting him regularly. He wasn't good enough for our first team when he was sold 4 years ago, and certainly isn't now. I don't mind him being in our squad, but I don't want him to ever be first choice because it would mean our football has regressed.

I didn't start a thread saying he was entirely responsible for losing yesterday but I'm not starting a thread saying how fantastic he was either. Because neither are true. He did fuck all of consequence until late on when he scored and fluffed two great opportunities to influence the outcome.

I agree with much of this, but it's odd that you correctly highlight his weakness from close in and yet used to slate Bent, who has few peers in the league at short range (and has superior placement and is a sight better from the spot).

He had an OK game. Aren't some of us over-analysing the missed chance from Bale? We're talking split-second errors of judgement, after all. Bale had a fractional window to square the ball sooner, Defoe might have accelerated a fraction earlier. Shit happens.

 

[Legend10]

There's no way Defoe can be blamed for not finishing that chance, there was nothing wrong with his movement in there at all. had he gone earlier he would have run the risk of Bale pulling it back behind him, as it turned out that ball arrived at just about the only place he couldn't score.

 

[ThorntonSpur]

i would like to see defoe partnered with ade for at least ten games - he needs a partner to be his most effective.

i thought he played well yesterday considering no support at all from vdv in first half