The beginning of the end...

[dimiSpur]

I couldn’t really give a shit what a lot of our fans want. A lot of our fans are nobheads. Which they prove time and again when a result doesn’t go our way.

I think it's more to do with the style. We've seen what this side is capable of week in week out, and this does seem to be a pale shadow of that team. Poch also seems to be quite frustrated and that can and does lead to him making some unfortunate comments.

What we must always remember is that prior to Poch, our ambition as a Club was not to win the CL or the PL (realistically speaking). Our ambition was to establish ourselves as CL regulars. We are doing that, quite comfortably. So we ought to be careful what we wish for and accept the fact that being CL regulars is success for a club like Spurs. A club that always has one or two pieces of a silverware winning side missing, and before we can fill those places in, lose another piece in a different area (Bale, Walker, Eriksen now). That is, perhaps, where the frustration emanates from. But we must never lose sight of the fact that a 3rd place position this season would be another succesful season IMO.

 

[Everlasting Seconds]

I think it's not all Pochettino's fault, probably Levy/Enic, players and Pochettino all could improve their performance. But owners and chairmen almost never leave. 8, 11 or 15 players can't leave at once. It not possible. The one part of the equation that actually can be swapped out is always the manager and his team. So they might have 1/3 of the blame when things go sour, but they always get 3/3 of the consequences.

 

[Metalhead]

So. what tricks has the 'disruptive' Vertonghen been up to exactly?

Didn't Herc suggest that it's a fitness issue?

 

[Thewobbler]

The longer we go without a major trophy we will always have players who get fed up of waiting and want to move on. How long can you keep asking them to buy in to the 'project' without it becoming boring.

We need to give poch a few games this season. Back him with his new players, and see where we end up at the end of the season.

 

[shelfboy68]

I think it's not all Pochettino's fault, probably Levy/Enic, players and Pochettino all could improve their performance. But owners and chairmen almost never leave. 8, 11 or 15 players can't leave at once. It not possible. The one part of the equation that actually can be swapped out is always the manager and his team. So they might have 1/3 of the blame when things go sour, but they always get 3/3 of the consequences.

It's vitally important that poch gets this right soon otherwise there is a risk he could get swapped out.

 

[Metalhead]

Lack of incisive play along with weird formations and predictable substitutions are at the managers door no excuses about contract situations, all this was happening last year again no excuses I just don't get how faster attacking play can't be coached instead of the AVB shit that continues to be served up.

Poch has to be working towards something - I hope so anyway. Maybe a settled first XI with (touch wood) no injuries will give us a better idea of what identity Poch is looking to stamp on the team.

 

[CowInAComa]

I have no problem with a lot of what the OP had to say and actually agree with some of it. But come out with it after the Villa game or even the City game after all, as he says, the concerns were there. The concerns have been there for quit a while and he says himself, he's had 18 months of 'concern' so plenty of opportunity to say it, SC isn't usually so slow to have a dig or want a manager out and now SC has sunk it's teeth in, this won't go away until the manager does.

If you wait until after a defeat then people are going to say it's knee-jerk. And that's exactly what it was, despite the OP's claims to the contrary. It's all in the timing

No big deal in itself really, but pretty much 100% of the time people claim it's not knee-jerk it actually is. Don't piss on my back and tell me it's raining

Surely that is true of any criticism of everything ever? They dont occur until the event, or a culmination of events has occured.

In all honesty, wasnt this being talked about after the Villa or City games(or any number of games in the backend of last season)? I think it was simmering along for sure.

Personally I think it may well be a kick up the backside that everyone needs for this season at least, remind them all they really arent half as good as they think they are.
After this season I think we are going to be embarking on new phase without Poch and the players associated with his tenure.

 

[Metalhead]

The longer we go without a major trophy we will always have players who get fed up of waiting and want to move on. How long can you keep asking them to buy in to the 'project' without it becoming boring.

We need to give poch a few games this season. Back him with his new players, and see where we end up at the end of the season.

Agree with that. People are right when they say that players will go where the money is but one day, when a player retires, do they want to talk about their medals or how much they earned per week?

 

[Deleted member 29446]

Poch goes and we lose 80% of what's good about our current playing squad it's that simple. The idea that people would be okay with poch leaving and us becoming a top 8 team again battling Europa league is actually hilarious. grow the fuck up people and this is coming from someone who is pessimistic as fuck

We won't loose 80% of our games ffs. We have some REALLY good players, and an overall really good squad that should end in top4 and possible even more.

Problem is atm that Poch is not getting the maximum out of the squad he has available.

We used to run teams over and was the most exciting teams in the league, now we look fucking shit and has looked like that for the past 18 months.

 

[shelfboy68]

Poch has to be working towards something - I hope so anyway. Maybe a settled first XI with (touch wood) no injuries will give us a better idea of what identity Poch is looking to stamp on the team.

We can hope he is but it looks like his best years with us are gone.

 

[Archibald&Crooks]

Surely that is true of any criticism of everything ever? They dont occur until the event, or a culmination of events has occured..

It's not raining. I know it's not, I just looked out the window.

 

[mike_l]

Poch has to be working towards something - I hope so anyway. Maybe a settled first XI with (touch wood) no injuries will give us a better idea of what identity Poch is looking to stamp on the team.

Healthy severance package?

 

[Monkey boy]

I've calmed down since the result a lot, the performances of last season were poor however I wonder if we are carrying around a mental fatigue from losing that final. I get that impression from Poch but also the players, I get the feeling it's going to take a fucking long time to recover.

Not really we’ve been shite for a long time before the final. Cast your mind back to the 1st leg of the semi final, that was as bad as we’ve played in a long time.

 

[Gilzeanking]

This probably wont go down well but in some games we can drop kane, and i rate kane very highly, and play son up top. We've seen before that we can win games without him no problem. Having an attack of eriksen, son, alli, lucas and lamela and they can interchange.

This stat here says we do fine without him:

"Overall, in the three seasons since the start of the 2016-17 campaign combined,Tottenham have a win percentage of 64.5% without Kane "

Before and mebbe after CL Final Poch , 'Kane fit..Kane play' . What you suggest is simply unthinkable to Poch . A glaring case of managerial rigidity .

 

[scat1620]

When Pochettino said that our 5 year project is finished and now we're beginning a new one, I don't really think it was really our best move to turn back time and start the new 5 year project from that 2013/14 baseline again.

 

[SargeantMeatCurtains]

I understand people calling this thread kneejerk due to the timing, but if the OP had posted this after we’d won a game, you’d get people calling him out for putting a dampener on a win, or something to that effect. It can’t work both ways.

I don’t think it’s kneejerk at all. I think the problems at Spurs have been there for a while now and, after three game where I’ve personally given Spurs and Poch the benefit of the doubt, it’s pretty clear that the problems are still there and are much bigger than they were before.

As others have said, watching Spurs is a chore now and it’s not something I enjoy doing anymore. In fact, I really enjoyed the summer off season and dreaded the season starting again. I’ve never felt that way before.

 

[HildoSpur]

Before and mebbe after CL Final Poch , 'Kane fit..Kane play' . What you suggest is simply unthinkable to Poch . A glaring case of managerial rigidity .

He is also 100% right. Dropping Kane would be insane.

 

[Norwayspurs]

Hopefully Poch has an Argentinian BBQ party at his place this week. Maybe they can walk on hot coals and have "trust fall". If Vert-Bert is the one to catch Poch then that's game over.
Seriously tho...i miss the high press and urgency.

 

[John48]

I couldn't & watched the game on TV & I have to say that was the worst performance I've seen since Poch took over. Lethargic, a lack of creativity & players like Kane & Lucas were at their poorest.

There certainly seems to be something not quite right there & the manager seems more concerned about what's going on off the pitch than on it.

Time will tell whether it's the beginning off the end, but if we continue to play like yesterday then it could well be.

 

[NickHSpurs]

It doesn't matter if this thread is a knee jerk reaction or not, the facts speak for themselves.

4 wins in the last 15 games and in 2019 we've played 22 games, lost 11, drawn 3 and only won 8. That's alarming.

We're just very lucky that United, Chelsea and Arsenal are all in transition otherwise we'd easily be the 6th best team in the country. We have got to stop the rot before the others hit their stride otherwise we'll be left behind next season and struggling to replace Toby, Jan, Eriksen and Rose (at a minimum) when we're in the Europa League.