Everton v Spurs ratings

Son_Of · Dec 7, 2009

fair ratings Nick. i'd prob give JD a 7. as well as the pen i thought his lob attempt was from too close, should've drilled it.

bale was not up to scratch in defence where he allowed himself to be rounded for the goal without any real resistance. did take a good free kick, but that's a bonus for a LB, the prevention of wingers dribbling into the box should be his bread and butter.

benny i think needed to come off not just for poor play, but to avoid getting sent off

Bus-Conductor · Dec 7, 2009

It's interesting what you guys are saying about the atmosphere. I watched it on the box and it seemed like although not singing much the locals were getting very wound up and doing a lot of angst ridden venomous shouting and baying for every perceived free kick and decision.

Second half they definitely went quieter. Was that not how it actually was ?

ShelfSide18 · Dec 7, 2009

On the telly the crowd sounded fantastic, but I won't argue with those who were there. When Everton got one back it sounded like they really cranked it up and we caved in under the pressure. I've been there dozens of times and have always been impressed with their support so it's weird hearing people's reports.

Son_Of · Dec 7, 2009

my second time there. first time backs up your experience. honestly they were appaling today. i could believe that it was mostly tourists just coming along to see what a football match is like.

didn't manage to get a song going until they scored. no swell of noise during or following their attacks and shots. even the whistling and booing for fouls etc was nothing out of the ordinary. although it was the first sign that these people were supporting everton and not just neutral football appreciaters!

Bus-Conductor · Dec 7, 2009

By the way BBLG I've just painfully sat through the goals we conceded again. Bale was the only real culprit for the first - Bassong had no choice but to come towards the player with the ball as he'd gone past Bale. Dawson should then also move across and mark Saha as he was marking no-one, but he didn't read it and just stood marking no-one, it happened pretty quickly so I wouldn't be too harsh on Dawson on that one.

The second goal is even worse. Bale once again fails to make a realistic effort to block the cross, Dawson then seems to have a chance to head the initial cross but strangely decides not to then runs straight past Cahill (the scorer) and marks Gomes for some inexplicable reason.

This is my problem with Dawson. Honest endeavour yes, brains to read and react to danger quickly and efficiently ? No.

brett.spurs · Dec 7, 2009

He didn't go and 'mark Gomes' he went back towards the goal line incase the shot went past Gomes, unluckily for him Baines scuffed the shot allowing Cahill to nod it in.

Chinaspur · Dec 7, 2009

Having seen a lot of JJ v Thud debates and not being sure of my own opinion I tried to watch Thud for as much of last night's game as possible. Going forward he was good, making himself available for the ball and a few very sweet balls forward. However defensively he was useless. I understand that it was a five man midfield, but even after both Yak and Saha were on he just didn't have an impact when they had the ball. Nearly every time they crossed the halfway line he seemed to move into a position which neither put pressure on the ball player, or marked a free man/zone. He just hovered.

I'm sure Harry is drilling our players into putting pressure on the ball player, but if you watch the Hudd you wouldn't know it. Occasionally when I play I have exactly the same problem, caught between being close enough to the man to pressure or cut down his options and marking a man/zone. However, I'm rubbish so it can be excused. Unless Harry's coaching team can sort this out I don't see Hudd as a long term solution.

(Braces himself for stats about how many times Hudd and Wilson have started together and we're in 4th place...)

dimiSpur · Dec 7, 2009

thought wilson played well,he aint pretty but gets job done,,,i think we forget how far we have come under harry...lets GET REAL.we r 4th.totally dominating teams like villa everton ,who last year were tearing us apart...we need to get pav out and get someone else in...and we need a leader.....then the skys the limit COYS

Coyboy · Dec 7, 2009

Bus-Conductor said:
It's interesting what you guys are saying about the atmosphere. I watched it on the box and it seemed like although not singing much the locals were getting very wound up and doing a lot of angst ridden venomous shouting and baying for every perceived free kick and decision.

Second half they definitely went quieter. Was that not how it actually was ?

Perhaps. They were pretty hostile to BAE and Palacios. But I wouldn't describe it as that loud or much like a cauldron.

mattstev2000 · Dec 7, 2009

Gomes 6 - Ok, nothing spectacular.

Corluka 6 - Pretty good, solid defending - caught short once or twice

Dawson 7 - Good defending, good goal. Seemed to be losing control a bit in the first half.

Bassong 6 - Average.

Ekotto 5 - Ok defensively but seemed to be losing his cool.

Lennon 8 - Good stuff.

Palacious 7 - Better than the past few games, closed things down well and less sloppy in possesion.

Hudd 6 - Very average.

Kranjcar 7 - Good attacking play, closed things down. Seems to be one of the few of our players that has genuine skill on the ball. Strange decision by Harry to take him off for JJ.

Defoe 6 - Seems to have gone back to being 'Mr. Shift and Shoot'. Umpteen chances to do something a bit clever but seemed to just hammer the ball towards goal. Good position for his goal but a dreadful penalty.

Crouch 5 - Mediocre. Decidedly mediocre.

Bale 5 - Good going forward. Bad in defence. Pretty much what everyone knows so a strange decision by Harry to bring him on.

Harry 4 - Brought Bale on, who everyone knows isn't up to scratch defensively in the PL. Left Defoe and Crouch on for the full 90 despite them both being fairly average for three games in a row. Took Kranjcar off again despite him being a constant threat and having genuine quality. Left Hudd on despite him being nothing more than average. A strange day for Harry all round...

Coyboy · Dec 7, 2009

Bus-Conductor said:
By the way BBLG I've just painfully sat through the goals we conceded again. Bale was the only real culprit for the first - Bassong had no choice but to come towards the player with the ball as he'd gone past Bale. Dawson should then also move across and mark Saha as he was marking no-one, but he didn't read it and just stood marking no-one, it happened pretty quickly so I wouldn't be too harsh on Dawson on that one.

The second goal is even worse. Bale once again fails to make a realistic effort to block the cross, Dawson then seems to have a chance to head the initial cross but strangely decides not to then runs straight past Cahill (the scorer) and marks Gomes for some inexplicable reason.

This is my problem with Dawson. Honest endeavour yes, brains to read and react to danger quickly and efficiently ? No.

That observation of Dawson was included in my post which got lost. He then appeals for nothing. I didn't think he played well generally but to be fair it is not something he is always guilty of or even has been consistently over the last year when he has come in. Sometimes he just looks lost and gormless. He is still young and learning, has been excellent in more games than he has been poor and is often in and out of team with injuries and King and Woodgate coming back and getting inured etc.

Gilzeanking · Dec 7, 2009

What I would say about their crowd (watching on tv) and I noticed it last time we played there ,is that they are instinctive appealers . They are like the modern cheating footballer (most) who claims for every throw in etc no matter how obvious it is he's wrong .

Often their crowd seem like dickheads making absurd claims en masse..

...BUT I reckon they may sometimes influence the ref when he makes instant decisions ....

Bulletspur · Dec 7, 2009

Bingy said:
Defoe LOST us this game....END of. He was his usual 'selfish' twat. I'm afraid that Harry needs to let him warm the bench, again. The 5 goal haul (V Wigan) has gone straight to his head, again, and he has cost us (along with others, I might add) apart from the Penalty mess.... He wasted a fair amount of chances to play his 'teammates' in to score....(there is no Defoe in Teamwork? haha). We can FORGET CL with this TWAT in the team. :bang:COYS (Defoe-less)

You are either having an attempt at sarcastic humour which is misplaced or you need to give up the booze or wacky backy!!

Legend10 · Dec 7, 2009

Bulletspur said:
You are either having an attempt of a sarcastic humour which is misplaced or you need to give up the booze or wacky backy!!

There are definitely some issues there, I wish I was a psychiatrist as occasionally something he writes might come somewhere near making sense.

mattstev2000 · Dec 7, 2009

Legend10 said:
There are definitely some issues there, I wish I was a psychiatrist as occasionally something he writes might come somewhere near making sense.

Despite the post being a bit extreme and loopy, the point he's making has a grounding in truth.

I counted at least 4/5 oportunities where Defoe just hammered the ball towards goal rather than do something a bit more clever with it.

Defoe was so good early in the season because he was using his brain more. He was more of a team player and giving more in general. The past few games he's looked more like the Defoe of old to me (i.e. a bit of a 1 trick pony).

I know Defoe is the golden boy and no one is allowed to criticise him but if the point is valid then it is worth posting.

Legend10 · Dec 7, 2009

mattstev2000 said:
Despite the post being a bit extreme and loopy, the point he's making has a grounding in truth.

I counted at least 4/5 oportunities where Defoe just hammered the ball towards goal rather than do something a bit more clever with it.

Defoe was so good early in the season because he was using his brain more. He was more of a team player and giving more in general. The past few games he's looked more like the Defoe of old to me (i.e. a bit of a 1 trick pony).

I know Defoe is the golden boy and no one is allowed to criticise him but if the point is valid then it is worth posting.

Defoe's overall performance yesterday was top class!

12 Premiership goals in 12 starts says a lot, he has scored in half of the games he has played in and scored vital away goals at Hull, West ham, Pompey and now Everton.

If he stays fit the lad is very likely to get somewhere between 20-25 league goals and I for one would be very happy with that.

12 goals from 12 starts isn't bad for a 1 trick pony.

mattstev2000 · Dec 7, 2009

Legend10 said:
Defoe's overall performance yesterday was top class!

12 Premiership goals in 12 starts says a lot, he has scored in half of the games he has played in and scored vital away goals at Hull, West ham, Pompey and now Everton.

If he stays fit the lad is very likely to get somewhere between 20-25 league goals and I for one would be very happy with that.

12 goals from 12 starts isn't bad for a 1 trick pony.

We can go round and round with the stats in the same way that these striker debates always go (I could for instance point out that 8 out of his 12 goals came against 2 of the worst defences I have ever seen and that 2 of the other 4 have been goals that haven't won us games). But let's not, because that's boring. I think the main thing is your ignored my point.

Defoe hasn't looked as good in the past few games because he hasn't been playing as intelligently as he was early in the season. I didn't comment on his overall form for the season.

Harry isn't going to drop him no matter how he plays because he is Harry's favourite (exactly the problem that so many people where whining about with Keane) so I don't see what incentive he has to return to the top class player that we had for the first few games.

Also, if you think his performance yesterday was top class then we'll probably just have to agree to disagree.

Legend10 · Dec 7, 2009

Are you saying you would drop Defoe?

And so my position is clear I think he is in great form and wouldn't even mention him in the same breath as Keane, there is such a massive gulf in quality between the two its ridiculous.

Since the 70th minute against Sunderland at home we have looked like a really top class side, I wonder if that's just a coincidence.

yusrisafri · Dec 7, 2009

Anyone who says Dawson was awful must be crazy. He was brilliant today. Every attack that came was nullified by him. He has also learned to pass the ball calmly instead of just hoofing and hoping.

Huddlestone, on the other hand, was crap. And I mean really, really crap. Sometimes I wonder if he had any idea what to do with the ball. He was hesitant, undecided and well off the pace. He shouldve been subbed 15 minutes into the 2nd half.

Bale was crap, but Harry had no choice. BAE was committing suicide.

Damn that last 20 minutes. Bloody big damn.

mattstev2000 · Dec 7, 2009

Legend10 said:
Are you saying you would drop Defoe?

And so my position is clear I think he is in great form and wouldn't even mention him in the same breath as Keane, there is such a massive gulf in quality between the two its ridiculous.

Since the 70th minute against Sunderland at home we have looked like a really top class side, I wonder if that's just a coincidence.

You don't think that's anything to do with the balance? You know, playing a left winger on the left and a right winger on the right? Also, if we are a top class side why have we had one good result against very poor opposition and 2 draws against teams we should have beaten? We have looked the best this season early on when Defoe and Keane were together and Defoe seemed to have matured past the player he was when he was with us last time.

Also for the record, I wouldn't drop Defoe. Yet. But if he continues to just grab the ball, make a beeline for goal and then hit it with little thought or insight into better options then I would like the option of him being dropped.

Finaly, you're right, generally there is a massive gulf in quality between Keane and Defoe but not in the way you think. At the moment all you're seeing is a small gap in their relative form.

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