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The Daily ITK Discussion Thread - 5 August 2011

McFlash

McFlash

In the corner, eating crayons.
Oct 19, 2005
12,990
46,617
If I'm perfectly honest, I'd rather not lnow what our incomings may or may not be being paid.
It's just going to pile pressure on them from a certain section of fans that will start with the abuse as soon as the said player has a slightly iffy game or fails to score a hat-trick against some relegation fodder team!
Knowing what they earn is just a depressing millstone around their necks.

I'll put my faith in Danny boy to see us right - for the time being.
 
L

Ledders Army

Well-Known Member
Jul 26, 2008
738
783
stemark44 said:
He did indeed have 1 very good year for Arsenal but before and after he has been a 1 goal in 3 games striker..................who can't get into the Man City squad and is a substitute at Madrid.
The only team he has really consistently performed against is Spurs!
Click to expand...

If only he'd been a sub in the 1st leg when we'd played them. Who out of Keane, Defoe, Crouch and Pav do you think would make the Madrid bench?

just because they wouldn't make the Madrid starting line up, doesn't mean they couldn't have a massive impact on us.
 
McFlash

McFlash

In the corner, eating crayons.
Oct 19, 2005
12,990
46,617
kcmei said:
i would attribute to most of the goals he scored to their excellent midfield
Click to expand...

Bingo!
We have a midfield of similar, if not better, quality and creativity than theirs back then. Arguably a pacier, more attack minded set of players as well.
We just need a decent striker that's able to play at the same level as the rest of the team - and also, one willing to come to us!!
 
RJ1882

RJ1882

SC Supporter
Aug 28, 2010
2,122
1,843
Spurger King said:
Probably more opinion than itk, but Archibald posted later in reference to City not selling to a rival..

"we arent seen as a rival anymore! Arrogant maybe but lets swallow our pride and finish above em"

Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but if someone as well connected as Archie reckons City no longer consider us rivals, maybe this really is the case.
Click to expand...

Do we all not honestly agree with this?
Looking at Man Citys squad you cant help but think that’s a title winning team in the making. If they have one possible weakness, for me, its Mancini.
If he wants to win the leage he is going to have to go out and play against Man U, Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool and Spurs hoem and away and aim to take maximum point, rather than sit back and be willing to throw away 2 points every game.
Man U, Chelsea and Man City will be 1,2 & 3 this season. Of that I have no doubt. So technically, we wont rival City. We can, however, use Adebayor, one of theirs, to take take points from their title rivals and help their own title push.
IMHO city will deal with us no problem.
 
K

kitchen

Well-Known Member
Nov 24, 2006
2,320
3,688
stemark44 said:
He did indeed have 1 very good year for Arsenal but before and after he has been a 1 goal in 3 games striker..................who can't get into the Man City squad and is a substitute at Madrid.
The only team he has really consistently performed against is Spurs!
Click to expand...

Not really. You're making the maths up.

2007/08 48 appearances, 30 goals, 5 assists (incredible stats - 1 goal per 1.6 games)
2008/09 38 appearances 16 goals 8 assists (1 goal per 2.4 games)
2009/10 31 appearances 14 goals 3 assists (1 goal per 2.2 games)
This season for Man City 12 games 5 goals (1 goal per 2.4 games with shit service)
For Real Madrid (mostly as a sub) 22 appearances 8 goals (1 per 2.75)

And he does more than just score goals. Holds the ball up, links play, runs the channels. He might not be as good as Aguero or Tevez, but he isn't far off and can easily be a 20 goal a season striker.
 
S

StanSpur

Ronny Rosenthal
Jul 15, 2004
2,439
2,046
Arazi440 said:
Not at all, there hasnt been a hint of the player going anywhere all summer, thats the part what concerns me.
Click to expand...

You may not have noticed but there have been almost zero large transfers this summer across the whole of Europe. Liverpool and City and Utd have spent a little bit but none on any real superstar talent with the exception of Kun. The market is dry and clubs are looking closely at their finances. Even Real have yet to spend big on anyone so it isn't of great suprise that nobody has come in as yet.

As for the whole wages debate about wanting superstars for £100k. We are in a strange time regarding wage budgets, there will be a change in the operating of clubs over the next few years owing to the fair play rulings. Clubs will have to start managing their wage budgets better to fit with income. This means clubs will need to reduce the amount spent on individuals and the increases to £250k+ that we have seen of late will be a thing of the past. With that in mind we must look at how we operate now. We have a number of top players on relatively low wages in comparison and on long term contracts. This puts us in a strong position as we go into the next 4-5 years as players at other clubs will be renegotiating at lower rates and we can continue to keep our stars on their packages. Thus is we can sign the likes of Ady for £100k then that will sit with the longer term plan and should be easier to sell to a player who could run down his contract at City but then be only able to pick up £50 or 60k at his next club.
 
K

kitchen

Well-Known Member
Nov 24, 2006
2,320
3,688
kcmei said:
i would attribute to most of the goals he scored to their excellent midfield
Click to expand...

Really? I thought football wasn't a team game at all. Normally strikers do it all on their own....

(Sorry about the sarcasm) :wink:
 
stemark44

stemark44

Well-Known Member
Mar 17, 2005
6,598
1,829
Good point,if City think that they are way better than us maybe they will be happy to loan players to help us take points of their rivals and leaving these players unable to play for us against them.
 
M

Maske2g

SC Supporter
Feb 1, 2005
4,257
1,726
kitchen said:
Not really. You're making the maths up.

2007/08 48 appearances, 30 goals, 5 assists (incredible stats - 1 goal per 1.6 games)
2008/09 38 appearances 16 goals 8 assists (1 goal per 2.4 games)
2009/10 31 appearances 14 goals 3 assists (1 goal per 2.2 games)
This season for Man City 12 games 5 goals (1 goal per 2.4 games with shit service)
For Real Madrid (mostly as a sub) 22 appearances 8 (1 per 2.75)

And he does more than just score goals. Holds the ball up, links play, runs the channels. He might not be as good as Aguero or Tevez, but he isn't far off and can easily be a 20 goal a season striker.
Click to expand...


you not backing yourself up enough. Use starts like me!! Much more effective than 8 minute sub appearances!!!

64 league goals in last 105 starts
 
K

kitchen

Well-Known Member
Nov 24, 2006
2,320
3,688
Maske2g said:
you not backing yourself up enough. Use starts like me!! Much more effective than 8 minute sub appearances!!!

64 league goals in last 105 starts
Click to expand...

I don't need to back myself up when there are nice folk like you that do it for me. Cheers :beer:
 
A

Arazi440

Member
May 4, 2010
174
0
StanSpur said:
You may not have noticed but there have been almost zero large transfers this summer across the whole of Europe. Liverpool and City and Utd have spent a little bit but none on any real superstar talent with the exception of Kun. The market is dry and clubs are looking closely at their finances. Even Real have yet to spend big on anyone so it isn't of great suprise that nobody has come in as yet.

As for the whole wages debate about wanting superstars for £100k. We are in a strange time regarding wage budgets, there will be a change in the operating of clubs over the next few years owing to the fair play rulings. Clubs will have to start managing their wage budgets better to fit with income. This means clubs will need to reduce the amount spent on individuals and the increases to £250k+ that we have seen of late will be a thing of the past. With that in mind we must look at how we operate now. We have a number of top players on relatively low wages in comparison and on long term contracts. This puts us in a strong position as we go into the next 4-5 years as players at other clubs will be renegotiating at lower rates and we can continue to keep our stars on their packages. Thus is we can sign the likes of Ady for £100k then that will sit with the longer term plan and should be easier to sell to a player who could run down his contract at City but then be only able to pick up £50 or 60k at his next club.
Click to expand...

So Adebayor is on a reported 170 - 180k a week on a five year deal with 3 years to run - 28 million in wages, now City paid a reported 25 million for the guy, what everyone is suggesting (yourself included) is he will be paid 100k a week here, 5.2 million a year, so he will be short in wages of 4.2 million a year, thats if his loaned and City make up the difference, thats an awful lot of money to lose each and every year, playing in the Europa league, the figures get worse if we are looking to sign the bloke, as I cant see City selling him for less than 15 million and thats a huge loss, I was under the impression than deals made before a certain date wouldn't be affected by the new regulations introduced, and im sure Adebayor was purchased prior to this date, so in effect, City could let him rot in the reserves.

So I cant possibly see Adebayor signing for us, unless City give him away, and I cant see that, a years loan, yes, with perhaps City picking up half the tab or we pay Adebayor some sort of retainer for his services to make up the 4 million short fall in wages for the season.
 
G

Grapo2001

Well-Known Member
Jul 26, 2011
3,700
5,957
Do clubs ever actually pay out transfer fees in one lump... doubt it. Therefore losses etc. that clubs make on players are probably grossly exagerated
 
talkshowhost86

talkshowhost86

Mod-Moose
Staff
Oct 2, 2004
48,331
47,584
Arazi440 said:
So Adebayor is on a reported 170 - 180k a week on a five year deal with 3 years to run - 28 million in wages, now City paid a reported 25 million for the guy, what everyone is suggesting (yourself included) is he will be paid 100k a week here, 5.2 million a year, so he will be short in wages of 4.2 million a year, thats if his loaned and City make up the difference, thats an awful lot of money to lose each and every year, playing in the Europa league, the figures get worse if we are looking to sign the bloke, as I cant see City selling him for less than 15 million and thats a huge loss, I was under the impression than deals made before a certain date wouldn't be affected by the new regulations introduced, and im sure Adebayor was purchased prior to this date, so in effect, City could let him rot in the reserves.

So I cant possibly see Adebayor signing for us, unless City give him away, and I cant see that, a years loan, yes, with perhaps City picking up half the tab or we pay Adebayor some sort of retainer for his services to make up the 4 million short fall in wages for the season.
Click to expand...

If they let him rot in the reserves they lose 28m for nothing over the next three years. If they sell him now they gain 15m and free up 28m of wages. If they loan him now with a potential sell on fee they free up some wages, get a loan fee and have him potentially off the books next year.

There are reasons why City would want rid of Adebayor. The big stumbling block, as you say, is how low is he prepared to go to join Spurs.
 
m*****73

m*****73

Well-Known Member
Dec 15, 2005
462
732
StanSpur said:
You may not have noticed but there have been almost zero large transfers this summer across the whole of Europe. Liverpool and City and Utd have spent a little bit
Click to expand...

Are your serious?!?! So Utd spending a combined £50m on 3 players is "a little bit" in your book? City spent £38m on a single player. Arsenal have bought Gervinho, supposedly a player we'd targeted...

That's 3 of the 4 clubs who finished above us last season who have strengthened their squads.

Then there's our main competitors for 5th spot, Liverpool... they've only gone and spent £40m so far (that's in addition to their moves in the last transfer window).

We can all argue as to the quality of some of those players, but the point is that those clubs have actively embarked on a process of strengthening their playing squads for the forthcoming season. We, on the other hand, have not. What does it matter whether other European clubs have spent big money or not? Our competitors play in the Premier League - and they have certainly spent money this off-season....

StanSpur said:
We have a number of top players on relatively low wages in comparison and on long term contracts. This puts us in a strong position as we go into the next 4-5 years as players at other clubs will be renegotiating at lower rates and we can continue to keep our stars on their packages.
Click to expand...

That's a big IF, mate.... just look at the Modric situation. It's inevitable that some players will seek to renegotiate their contracts regardless of whether they are on long-term deals or not. And as regards the whole UEFA financial regulations, I wouldn't exactly hold my breath that it's gonna happen in the manner that alot of people are saying/hoping...

Do UEFA really have the appetite to pick a fight with the likes of Barca, Madrid, Man. Utd, Man. City & Chelsea? All of those clubs have tremendous levels of debt, but they are (or in the case of City, will soon be) marquee names in Europe's biggest football competition...

I can just imagine Platini phoning Florentino Pérez to tell him that Real won't be allowed to compete in the Champions League in 2013.... I'm sure all the TV stations and sponsors will really like that... instead of the two big Spanish clubs, we can have a competition with a few Swiss and Belgian clubs instead...
 
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