After yesterdays game...is Morgan Schneiderlin someone we need

[DaSpurs]

I would say that's a massive reason why we're conceding goals.
The midfield 2 are weak in that area.
A DM would help enormously in that area.

A DM would help, but it wouldn't be enough.

Due to the nature of the high line and high press, we open up considerably more angles to play in behind and get around our CM's, regardless of how good they are. The problem is we're simply not pressing well enough at all and not cutting out those passing lanes, so even if we had Mascherano in there it wouldn't mean a rat's ass difference if we continue to fail at pressing the ball adequately higher up the pitch.

If you look at interviews from players at Saints while under Poch, they keep referring to a "trigger man." The whole point is that everyone must press -and quickly- if the whole system is to work. The less parts there are doing their job higher up the pitch, the more angles are opened, and the more exposed the double pivot and CB's are.

The logic that a DM would entirely solve our defensive issues would apply if we were playing a traditional format with a deeper-lying back line, but in this unique system you shouldn't be fooled by the fact we have no genuine DM in our setup. That is an illusion over the genuine problem which is further upfield.

 

[Strikeb4ck]

And Schneiderlin, they play in a double pivot.

I know, but Schneiderlin plays farther forward more consistently than Wanyama. It's the same as Mason/Bentaleb with us.

 

[Blake Griffin]

a cm pool of

veljkovic
bentaleb
carroll
mason
alli
onomah

has everything we need.

 

[Blackcanary]

a cm pool of

veljkovic
bentaleb
carroll
mason
alli
onomah

has everything we need.

It has promise, but it's too inexperienced.

 

[Syn_13]

a cm pool of

veljkovic
bentaleb
carroll
mason
alli
onomah

has everything we need.

Except experience.

Don't get me wrong, I love the youth prospects we have at hand, but I do believe we need an experienced head out there in the middle. I don't just mean experience in terms of amount of games played either. I'm talking about someone who can help lead a team by example, and preferrably has a winner's mentality and history to boot.

 

[Chris12]

a cm pool of

veljkovic
bentaleb
carroll
mason
alli
onomah

has everything we need.

Where's Winks!

 

[MattPhilpott]

As much as I would like Schneiderlin at Spurs, I just don't think we will pay the £20-£25m that they want and rightly so, because as good as he is, he is realistically worth £15m TOPS.

I really think we need a brute-ish defensive midfielder such as a Makalele, Viera, or Keane, someone dedicated to covering the back 4 and allowing the other midfielders to join in the attack..

For me, the man we need is Geoffry Kongdogbia from Monaco. The man is an animal at 6ft2 and I've been very impressed with him for his age at only 22 YO. Hope Hugo could maybe talk him over. Realistically I can't see him costing more than £10-£12m think we could use Capoue as part-exchange, think he would be open to a move back to France and would fill the gap left by Kongdogbia adequately...

Thoughts? Just my view of a realistic midfield target instead of MS

 

[SpursDave88]

Actually if it's a mix of experience and ability we want two gettable players for reasonable fees who offer something different to what we have are Sissoko at Newcastle and Alex Song. I would actually like to keep Dembele also as I think he offers something different. Paulinho, Stamnouli and Capoue meanwhile are very replaceable.

 

[THOWIG]

As much as I would like Schneiderlin at Spurs, I just don't think we will pay the £20-£25m that they want and rightly so, because as good as he is, he is realistically worth £15m TOPS.

I really think we need a brute-ish defensive midfielder such as a Makalele, Viera, or Keane, someone dedicated to covering the back 4 and allowing the other midfielders to join in the attack..

For me, the man we need is Geoffry Kongdogbia from Monaco. The man is an animal at 6ft2 and I've been very impressed with him for his age at only 22 YO. Hope Hugo could maybe talk him over. Realistically I can't see him costing more than £10-£12m think we could use Capoue as part-exchange, think he would be open to a move back to France and would fill the gap left by Kongdogbia adequately...

Thoughts? Just my view of a realistic midfield target instead of MS

He would be phenomenal.

 

[Shadydan]

I know, but Schneiderlin plays farther forward more consistently than Wanyama. It's the same as Mason/Bentaleb with us.

When Southampton have the ball it is true that he gets forward to support the attack but ultimately him and Wanyama are both their to protect the defence, if you're talking about a player who would help screen the defence and cover the full backs when they roam he is more than competent at it.

 

[MattPhilpott]

My

He would be phenomenal.

My thoughts exactly friend...

 

[Blake Griffin]

Where's Winks!

mk maybe? i just don't rate experience, i think it's something you gain along the way, rather than buy. the members of this squad aged 25 and under consistently outperform those who are older/more experienced but apparently we need more of them and less of the former. i don't know why fans are so down on this team, we're 6th, which is basically our mean position over the last 10 years but it's been done with the youngest squad in the league and one that will more than likely get better if given a chance. fans should show more patience rather than trying to find a short cut that doesn't exist.

 

[Chris12]

mk maybe? i just don't rate experience, i think it's something you gain along the way, rather than buy. the members of this squad aged 25 and under consistently outperform those who are older/more experienced but apparently we need more of them and less of the former. i don't know why fans are so down on this team, we're 6th, which is basically our mean position over the last 10 years but it's been done with the youngest squad in the league and one that will more than likely get better if given a chance. fans should show more patience rather than trying to find a short cut that doesn't exist.

I'd just like to see Winks in there.

 

[Blake Griffin]

I'd just like to see Winks in there.

if carroll goes then maybe, we have a lot of options either way. our cm pool this year has been

capoue
stambouli
paulinho
dembele
bentaleb
mason

capoue's not played since october. stambouli's barely played at all. paulinho hadn't played until a month ago and dembele for some reason hasn't played for the last couple of months. so it's not like we'd be any worse off with the six i posted up the page. they all know what is required of them though and they all know eachother's game(except alli).

 

[Everlasting Seconds]

mk maybe? i just don't rate experience, i think it's something you gain along the way, rather than buy. the members of this squad aged 25 and under consistently outperform those who are older/more experienced but apparently we need more of them and less of the former. i don't know why fans are so down on this team, we're 6th, which is basically our mean position over the last 10 years but it's been done with the youngest squad in the league and one that will more than likely get better if given a chance. fans should show more patience rather than trying to find a short cut that doesn't exist.

You live in a world in which we don't lose our best players and in which our competition doesn't strengthen. I don't live in that world. To a certain degree, a possible future can't make up for an underwhelming now. The only thing we know we have certainty in is right know, and right now, we are falling further behind those in front of us, and getting closer to those behind us.

 

[JohannTHFC]

Clearly not in our plans? This is ITK? There have been a few mentions that he is doing some sort of fitness regime involving long runs at an even pace - that would suggest to me that he isn't considered fit enough or is perhaps returning from an injury. It could of course be some sort of punishment and he is on his way out the door. I'm not ITK.

I think we as a fanbase are way to short term in our thinking. If a player doesn't arrive and make an instant impact then he must be shit and we need to get rid. As I say, perhaps we are looking slightly longer term and believe that he is the answer to our prayers - I guess the Summer window will show either way.

Yes clearly not in our plans. If he was then he would have featured more regardless of fitness. Of course these is a chance that your theory is correct but I struggle to see why Poch would let a player miss almost an entire season of football just because he isn't fit enough. Surely he would be playing him to get him fit enough? Many players like Adebayor, Capoue, Kaboul, Lennon have been frozen out by Poch this season already so I think it's more likely that he has been too.

Who said that he's shit because he didn't make an instant impact? He's missed almost an entire season of football so of course people are going to sceptical of his future with the club.

 

[only1waddle]

mk maybe? i just don't rate experience, i think it's something you gain along the way, rather than buy. the members of this squad aged 25 and under consistently outperform those who are older/more experienced but apparently we need more of them and less of the former. i don't know why fans are so down on this team, we're 6th, which is basically our mean position over the last 10 years but it's been done with the youngest squad in the league and one that will more than likely get better if given a chance. fans should show more patience rather than trying to find a short cut that doesn't exist.

Personally I would prefer a blend of both, if we could have a core of 2 good quality CB's and a Scott Parkeresque guy next to Bentaleb then I could get on board with your suggestion.

 

[samsonlevi]

Schneiderlin adds something the others (who are already at the club) cant next season at least....

the know how as to how to organise a midfield that protects the back 4 while still distributing the ball forward quickly enough to remain an attack minded team. That's what we are missing!

If not him then someone who can do the same thing is needed. But schneiderlin has the added bonus of already proving he can do it in this league and under this manager!!

 

[Everlasting Seconds]

Yes clearly not in our plans. If he was then he would have featured more regardless of fitness. Of course these is a chance that your theory is correct but I struggle to see why Poch would let a player miss almost an entire season of football just because he isn't fit enough. Surely he would be playing him to get him fit enough? Many players like Adebayor, Capoue, Kaboul, Lennon have been frozen out by Poch this season already so I think it's more likely that he has been too.

Who said that he's shit because he didn't make an instant impact? He's missed almost an entire season of football so of course people are going to sceptical of his future with the club.

Well, if your body is fatigued enough playing PL football is not advisable. For all we know, he might even have caught a long term virus and what not. I don't think he is frozen out just like the other players you are referring to, because he has travelled with the squad to away matches.

 

[Hoddle&Waddle]

A DM would help, but it wouldn't be enough.

Due to the nature of the high line and high press, we open up considerably more angles to play in behind and get around our CM's, regardless of how good they are. The problem is we're simply not pressing well enough at all and not cutting out those passing lanes, so even if we had Mascherano in there it wouldn't mean a rat's ass difference if we continue to fail at pressing the ball adequately higher up the pitch.

If you look at interviews from players at Saints while under Poch, they keep referring to a "trigger man." The whole point is that everyone must press -and quickly- if the whole system is to work. The less parts there are doing their job higher up the pitch, the more angles are opened, and the more exposed the double pivot and CB's are.

The logic that a DM would entirely solve our defensive issues would apply if we were playing a traditional format with a deeper-lying back line, but in this unique system you shouldn't be fooled by the fact we have no genuine DM in our setup. That is an illusion over the genuine problem which is further upfield.

No, you press in 2's and 3's, it's when we over commit too many at the wrong times that leaves us open to the counter. There isnt one 'trigger man', the trigger man is the first guy that identifies an opportunity to press which triggers 2 maybe 3 players in that zone to press with him. Obviously if we then win possesion you want players breaking quickly to join up with that group, which I think is the problem as we are lacking pace in certain area's, in particular the wings.