AVB's success at Porto.

[Bing]

the bottom line is AVB was a completely unproven manager and should not have been appoiinted.

The double bottom line is that he was appointed manager, he is Spurs manager and we should get behind him 100% because more change, even if it is for a more qualified (at present) manager, is no good for anybody.

CLARIFICATION: Not saying AVB is not a good manager or immensely talented or wont come good...just saying he was unproven and should not have been appointed.

 

[Donki]

Ramos at Sevilla was....

Playing great footballl and winning the Europa league in style

So what are u saying to me biglad..... 2 points in 8.... Noooooooo!!!

 

[SteveH]

Ramos at Sevilla was....

Playing great footballl and winning the Europa league in style

Please dont - I was so happy we signed Ramos. Oh how I was wrong! There are parallels though sadly.

 

[RichieS]

I want to see what AVB does in our next game at home. Twice we have switched formations, got a goal, then switched back and conceded. The switch to 4-4-2 hasn't been the reason for us scoring, but the switch back to a more defensive setup after taking the lead has been the reason for us succumbing to pressure.

Against weaker teams, especially at home, we should look to be more attacking, have more men committed forward, and use the wings. My worry is that AVB is wedded to a system regardless of the personnel at his disposal, and he will want players to do things they are not good at. Sometimes you have to tell players to do what they would rather not do (Bale stick to the left, for example) to serve the team's interests, sometimes you have to adjust tactics to suit your players. I'll be interested to see which way AVB goes.

Not true. Re-watch the West Brom game and notice how as soon as we switched to 4-4-2 the game opened up and West Brom became prominent where they'd hardly had a sniff before. We'd totally controlled the game without scoring with the original tactics, so switching back to those once we had a precarious lead was sensible.

Against Norwich, the switch to 4-4-2 more obviously swung the game in our favour (probably due to the fact that Norwich were also playing a 4-4-2 so there was no midfield mis-match) but it's not that hard to understand AVB's thinking in bringing off Defoe (who'd been shit anyway) and replacing him with Huddlestone (extra man in midfield, someone good with the ball = greater possession and control). Clearly we need to work on defending set-pieces though...

 

[thinktank]

Please dont - I was so happy we signed Ramos. Oh how I was wrong! There are parallels though sadly.

Main failing of Ramos was that he couldn't speak a bloody word of English and just didn't get what makes prem. teams tick.

 

[Bing]

Main failing of Ramos was that he couldn't speak a bloody word of English and just didn't get what makes prem. teams tick.

I always thought there was an element of him not getting the players he needed to play the system he wanted effectively.....def echoe's here...although you are right the English was a big thing....surely you sign a non english speaking manager you expect to have to give him more time to adapt...guess not.

 

[SteveH]

the bottom line is AVB was a completely unproven manager and should not have been appoiinted.

The double bottom line is that he was appointed manager, he is Spurs manager and we should get behind him 100% because more change, even if it is for a more qualified (at present) manager, is no good for anybody.

CLARIFICATION: Not saying AVB is not a good manager or immensely talented or wont come good...just saying he was unproven and should not have been appointed.

Trouble is even though I agree with much of the above and yes we have to get behind him 100%. But too many performances like in the first half on Saturday and he wont last - no matter how loyal we are or try to be.

 

[AngerManagement]

Please dont - I was so happy we signed Ramos. Oh how I was wrong! There are parallels though sadly.

Yea but Ramos' failure is no real reason to assume AVB will also fail, I was just saying Ramos achieved similar feats before arriving at the Lane so AVB's success at Porto is also no guarantee of success

 

[SteveH]

Main failing of Ramos was that he couldn't speak a bloody word of English and just didn't get what makes prem. teams tick.

Was that meant to make us feel better?

 

[Cavehillspur]

Want AVB to succeed so badly and prove the booing numpties wrong.

Man hasnt even been able to field his strongest team yet. He's lost 3 key players in the summer, not to mention Parker and Kaboul to long term injury.

The clubs last minute dealings in the market havent fken helped either.

3 games in and the knives are out and the media are loving it, utterly pathetic.

 

[thinktank]

Was that meant to make us feel better?

Que?

 

[thinktank]

Want AVB to succeed so badly and prove the booing numpties wrong.

More than that it would shut the xxxxting media up who are still in bitter mourning over big gob 'arry.

 

[RichieS]

I always thought there was an element of him not getting the players he needed to play the system he wanted effectively.....def echoe's here...although you are right the English was a big thing....surely you sign a non english speaking manager you expect to have to give him more time to adapt...guess not.

I think that because of the whole 2 from 8 debacle, we forget that Ramos took over on 27th October the previous season, and thus had pretty much a full calendar year to 'adapt'. AVB will be given at least the same amount of time I expect.

 

[Cavehillspur]

More than that it would shut the xxxxting media up who are still in bitter mourning over big gob 'arry.

It ridiculous mate, we've lost the same amount of games as United ffs, some people need to grow the f*ck up and get some perspective, even moreso given we're going through transition.

 

[thinktank]

I always thought there was an element of him not getting the players he needed to play the system he wanted effectively.....def echoe's here...although you are right the English was a big thing....surely you sign a non english speaking manager you expect to have to give him more time to adapt...guess not.

He definitely didn't get the players he needed/wanted and there are striking similarities here. Like I said, DL has pulled this one before

 

[SteveH]

Que?

I was just being sarcastic

"Main failing of Ramos was that he couldn't speak a bloody word of English and just didn't get what makes prem. teams tick."

Speaking English he is better but not great IMHO.
prem teams tick. Chelsea!

 

[thinktank]

It ridiculous mate, we've lost the same amount of games as United ffs, some people need to grow the f*ck up and get some perspective, even moreso given we're going through transition.

They've lost their mutual cock-sucking sessions with droopy; they won't be done with AVB for a while....

 

[thinktank]

I was just being sarcastic

"Main failing of Ramos was that he couldn't speak a bloody word of English and just didn't get what makes prem. teams tick."

Speaking English he is better but not great IMHO.
prem teams tick. Chelsea!

Yes! Ok, I'll try again...que?

 

[dooey123]

There was not much difference in the Porto team from before AVB took over to after other than Moutinho coming in, he must have done something right. We are just continuing the form from last season but with a new manager.

 

[StartingPrice]

I am really trying to back AVB s much as I can, he is here now and I want him to be successful so badly. I was a fan of Harry and had great respect for what he done for us, but at the end of the day I support Tottenham Hotspur football club not an individual. Having said that, the thing that bothers me about AVB, and again I dont want to be too critical YET, is I don't think he has a plan B, a plan C or any other plan than plan FC Porto. He is too focused on "his project" and how he wants us to play instead of maybe changing his tactics to suit the players at his disposal. IMO a truely great manager is a dynamic one, he knows what he has and he knows how to get the best out of them. So far I am not seeing this, yes its only 3 games in but who can honestly say they didnt have the games against Norwich and WBA down as wins? I am hoping for our first win of the season in our next 2 league games as we will be needing some confidence for Man U and the Chavs.

How do you mean Donki? Summit like: I would prefer to play a 4-3-3, but the players aren't ready for that so we will continue with what they know for now? Jus' sayin'

IMO Moutinho was de facto Porto manager, like 'JT' for Chelsea. This is proved by the fact that AVB and him are apparently great friends. No Moutinho, no tictacs

Now, I kow you have said that this is your opinion and therefore not a quantifiable fact, but do you have even one shred of evidence to base that on?

It's rapidly heading the same way as the Ramos situation. He inherited a team on the way up built by his predecessor, Joaquin Capparos.
Our board fell for that one too!

It is...because the fans are letting it.
In every other way, it is nothing like ramos, other than that he is a Johhny Foreigner.
I mean, apart from anything else, he has five games (like FIVE) in which to get one more point so as to avoid 2 points from 8 games.
Get real people, someone has put up a list of our recent EPL starts, and there are been plenty hovering around 2 or 3 points after 3 games (including last season, I may add).

Listening to Durham and that fat prick Micky Quinn on the way home and they literally made out that a monkey could have replicated what AVB achieved at Porto with the players at his disposal.

Of course that's a load of cods wallop and to go unbeaten in that season for Poro deserves a huge amount of credit so let's not belittle that achievement in trying to find reasons to knock him now.

Exactly.

Porto wasn't the only Portugese side he had success with, he did an excellent job with Academica also

And this.

Porto finished 3rd the season prior to AVB joining them. He obviously improved them a fair bit to then completely dominate and stroll to the title.

In an ideal world he should probably have stayed there and quite possibly should still be there and have a few more trophies to his name as well as having an even bigger reputation than he enjoyed before he went to the plastics.
I think he will come good. I'm just praying it's with us!

And another myth would seem to have bitten the dust.
Which players did AVB buy in that Porto team? How vital were they? How did the team fare after he left?
Even regular success does not justify the argument presented here. He didn't jsut win the Portugese league - his team went unbeaten, and with the consistency to win the domestic trophy as well. And jsut to top that off, he beat some of Europe's best in winning the Europa league...all in ONE season.
Even if Porto had a successful team at the time, that is pretty unprecedented.
And the fella was how old when he did this? Most managers don't achieve anything remotely like this, even when given the opportunity to manage a big fish in a small pond in a whole career.

So, enough of this he didn't really achieve that much at Porto. Please