Cain Hoy say 'No'.

[CAIN]

God I wish I was the Cain, in Cain Hoy... I'd be the ITK Daddy Champion of the World.
SC members would be unblocking me on an hourly basis, JJ would be just a distant memory and A&C wouldn't fucking dare give me the evil eye again, or dish me out another 24hour ban for calling Luka Modric a ****

You'd love the stench of my billions....But sorry, all I've got is onions

 

[Graysonti]

These guys could give us the investment for the stadium - debt free.

That happens - this club is a potential monster.

It don't need an oil Barron, it's revenue will allow it to compete.

Biggest turnover in football in 80s and up to 91. And us Spurs supporters growing up in 80s - remember the glamour ?

It can return.

Oh, and the company Cain Hoy was formed yesterday. Why ? IMO, solely to purchase Spurs.

Im thinking ENIC with more money - Im seriously excited.

 

[THFCSPURS19]

I wonder if Levy has been Levy'd

I can see a scenario where Levy meets with Cain Hoy to discuss financing options for the new stadium and development - in the course of those discussions, Cain Hoy gets a better understanding of the costs and benefits of the new stadium and surrounding development. That allows them to factor in those financial commitments/benefits into their decision to purchase Spurs, including the stadium development.

So now Cain Hoy comes back and offers £X, knowing a little more about the entire operation than the typical purchaser could coming in a little blind.

If it happened (still looks unlikely) it would be like Liverpool buying Southampton's players. Southampton set prices they thought no one would pay and suddenly Liverpool coughed up.

Maybe we do want £1billion and Cain Hoy/Guggenheim/some super-rich consortium of investment companies are willing to pay that, or near that amount.

 

[LexingtonSpurs]

If it happened (still looks unlikely) it would be like Liverpool buying Southampton's players. Southampton set prices they thought no one would pay and suddenly Liverpool coughed up.

Maybe we do want £1billion and Cain Hoy/Guggenheim/some super-rich consortium of investment companies are willing to pay that, or near that amount.

I am assuming it will be close to that valuation with the caveat that the stadium construction costs would be backed out of any purchase price - new buyer still would have to pay ENIC for the existing property, and would presumably overpay Archway to make them go away quickly.

 

[dirtyh]

Fuck me. This is really happening isn't it? So much smoke, has to be a little fire.

 

[cornelius knob]

These guys could give us the investment for the stadium - debt free.

Im thinking ENIC with more money - Im seriously excited.

I`m also getting a bit moist by it all. But I`ve been excited by so many false dawns with this club I`m refusing to believe anything just yet.
It turns out most of these guys are regulars at the annual Bohemian Grove bash.
Thats the yearly get to-gether of the rich and powerful where the destiny of the planet is shaped. They also sacrifice goats and babies, then drink their blood in special goblets.
The Spursy thing to happen would be for them to somehow fail the fit and proper owners test.

 

[SpursDave88]

So many posts, so little knowledge.

I can't count the number of one or two line posts confidently [arrogantly] asserting what people 'feel' or 'know', based on a total absence of information, a surfeit of cynicism and a wrong-headed application of football principles to finance and investment.

It's the most ignorant collective contribution I've ever seen on SC - and that's a major achievement.

I'm emphatically not going to tell everyone what I 'know' or 'feel' is going to happen, because it's as uncertain to me as it ought to be to everyone else. I am going to continue to try to read the runes and indications and use some logic to work out what the motivations of the players might be, as opposed to the ludicrously simplistic versions of ENIC's intentions that litter this thread.

The initial story was incompetent nonsense. It implied a hostile takeover, which is an impossibility, and repeatedly confused THFC with a listed company, which it isn't. It took a scrap of tittle-tattle and built a whole edifice of mythical imminent dealings around it.

Back in the real world, if someone is daft enough to offer ENIC a multiple of the current value of the club, then they would be foolish not to sell, because buying, adding value and then selling at the opportune moment is what they do. But no one is likely to make such an offer, certainly not canny financiers of the kind whom ENIC has been approaching to fund the NDP (which includes Cain Hoy).

If no one offers them idiot-money, then it would be against ENIC's business model to sell, because they have a pending project that would add a huge amount of value to the asset. There's no profit in abandoning a project before it adds value to your asset. You have to add the value first and then sell promptly.

That's what I meant by 'use some logic to work out what the motivations of the players might be'. Use your fucking heads, people! Preferably before you post.

This is, of course, rubbish. Enic are clearly struggling to fund the new stadium build, to get the CPO through or to attract the right sponsors, despite all of Levy's canny dealings. The club is of course worth more to Cain than to Enic since they have the firepower to fund the development of the stadium and hence grow the business. If Cain offer a sensible premium Enic will accept and walk away. Think about it in a VC framework, Enic has taken a mid-sized company and grown it, but they are unable to take it to a dominant position where it can list for a massive premium. Cain are the guys who can make it happen. In your terms, you speak about the value-add project that Enic are undertaking...clearly ENIC don't have the finance to pursue said project hence seeking outside monies. Cain have been approached and have thought "Hey, why should we provide the stadium money and let ENIC reap a the equity benefit in terms of value add to the business whilst we get loan-like returns on our money, why don't we just buy the equity, finance the the build and take all the equity upside". I'm not speaking from direct knowledge of the parties intentions, just thinking through the situation logically. The fact that a Bidco, Cain Hoy has been set up, means that this will be very far down the line by now.

 

[LexingtonSpurs]

These guys could give us the investment for the stadium - debt free.

These guys did not make billions by giving away anything. And, they won't start here - they could loan the club money, on favorable terms, but they are not giving the club a stadium - even if they own the club. Somebody will get a return on the £400M cost to develop the stadium and surrounding area.

 

[parklane1]

This is, of course, rubbish. Enic are clearly struggling to fund the new stadium build, to get the CPO through or to attract the right sponsors, despite all of Levy's canny dealings. The club is of course worth more to Cain than to Enic since they have the firepower to fund the development of the stadium and hence grow the business. If Cain offer a sensible premium Enic will accept and walk away. Think about it in a VC framework, Enic has taken a mid-sized company and grown it, but they are unable to take it to a dominant position where it can list for a massive premium. Cain are the guys who can make it happen. In your terms, you speak about the value-add project that Enic are undertaking...clearly ENIC don't have the finance to pursue said project hence seeking outside monies. Cain have been approached and have thought "Hey, why should we provide the stadium money and let ENIC reap a the equity benefit in terms of value add to the business whilst we get loan-like returns on our money, why don't we just buy the equity, finance the the build and take all the equity upside". I'm not speaking from direct knowledge of the parties intentions, just thinking through the situation logically. The fact that a Bidco, Cain Hoy has been set up, means that this will be very far down the line by now.

And you know what they say about assumptions, which all that is.

 

[dricha1]

This is, of course, rubbish. Enic are clearly struggling to fund the new stadium build, to get the CPO through or to attract the right sponsors, despite all of Levy's canny dealings. The club is of course worth more to Cain than to Enic since they have the firepower to fund the development of the stadium and hence grow the business. If Cain offer a sensible premium Enic will accept and walk away. Think about it in a VC framework, Enic has taken a mid-sized company and grown it, but they are unable to take it to a dominant position where it can list for a massive premium. Cain are the guys who can make it happen. In your terms, you speak about the value-add project that Enic are undertaking...clearly ENIC don't have the finance to pursue said project hence seeking outside monies. Cain have been approached and have thought "Hey, why should we provide the stadium money and let ENIC reap a the equity benefit in terms of value add to the business whilst we get loan-like returns on our money, why don't we just buy the equity, finance the the build and take all the equity upside". I'm not speaking from direct knowledge of the parties intentions, just thinking through the situation logically. The fact that a Bidco, Cain Hoy has been set up, means that this will be very far down the line by now.

I understand nothing about finance, but this seems more logical to me. Any investors to the stadium build would want a return if Enic decided to sell, Enic can't/won't pay for the build themselves, so any sale post build would involve payment to several parties?

 

[neilp]

These guys could give us the investment for the stadium - debt free.

That happens - this club is a potential monster.

I think that this is one of the most important factors.

I have just told my girlfriend that I may soon start taking her up the Guggenheim but she slapped me and now won't cook my pizza

 

[Graysonti]

These guys did not make billions by giving away anything. And, they won't start here - they could loan the club money, on favorable terms, but they are not giving the club a stadium - even if they own the club. Somebody will get a return on the £400M cost to develop the stadium and surrounding area.

I know that - they will get an increased value asset with a much bigger turnover and can return dividends greater than loan interest returns. It might also balance their investment portfolio

 

[HW61]

I'd be more fearful of being a play thing for a rich oil tycoon than being owned by very serious investors. It's not just about having the investment funds. Cain Hoy seem to have access to specialists in the field of real estate, entertainment, retail and media which make their investments work. These sectors are the core of what Spurs and the premiership are about. For Spurs to possibly have access to such know-how is attractive.

Let's be under no illusion. Our beloved team have been under the ownership of entrepreneurs trying to make a buck since 1980s and the Scholar days. The notion that "you don't go into football to make money" may apply to the lower leagues, but it no longer applies to the premiership with the ever increasing money floating about and the world wide brands that can be exploited.

The Americans are so ahead of us in nurturing and realising brand value. The attraction of England is that we are the fastest growing economy in Europe in 2013 hence a further reason for the timing of this.

Gets a thumbs up from me if this moves forward.

 

[worcestersauce]

Is it not possible that they could buy the club with their money then take out a bastard big loan as THFC pay that loan to themselves and have the club pay back the loan. Hey presto, they own the club and get their money back and the club has a huge debt, it's not as though it hasn't been done before and these people are an investment company so all they want is the money, thats their business.

 

[weststandvoice]

The Guggenheim group are eye-wateringly, astoundingly flush with money...

Cain Hoy looks a bit like it is going to be a separate entity set up specifically to purchase and run Spurs.


Even the name Cain Hoy plays into the namesake of the Guggenheim Group as the "Cain Hoy Stables" were Harry Guggenheim's thoroughbred horse racing stables that ended up earning the family a boat load of cash in it's hay day.

These guys have literally more money than any of us could probably accurately conceive of......

Chris Rock once put it as this:



These guys are WEALTHY and they are smart, they know how to invest and get returns and they absolutely have the capital to really make things interesting.

Yup.

 

[C0YS]

give me a break a beer or two does that!

 

[Lo Amo Speroni]

Do we already know if this Jonathan Goldstein chap is a member of BSoDL?

Well I haven't seen him at any of the meetings, so if he is, he is doing it in secret.

 

[sidford]

An investment company commences trading on the same day that they are linked to buying a high profile football club which is gaining them significant headlines throughout numerous countries..... I'm sure it's just a coincidence

 

[bat-chain]

Were anything to come of this I just hope any new regime will fully understand the quality in our current group of young players and youth system, I love having this at the heart of the club.

It would be horrible if this group and future ones suddenly found their paths blocked by any statement signings or anything silly.

 

[joelstinton14]

I really do not know what to make of all this.

I really hope that, if this is true, Joe, and Daniel trust these guys to do a good job.

Money wise, the game is probably different for us. FFP is now in, so we can't really buy our way anywhere (which i'm actually really happy about). I'm really proud of our club, for how we worked to achieved a Champions League place, the players we have brought in and the investment they have returned (although i rather we still have luka and bale). Enic and Levy in particular have been really good for us. I want that mentality still at the club. I think it is important, and distinguish's our selves from everyone else.

I guess it may be easy to panic, i hope that joe and daniel properly assess Cain Hoy, and they our right for club, financially but also the club philosophy.

I know john henry has been great for liverpool, but he is a one off.

Sigh football and money. Just a rich mans playground.