England manager Sam Allardyce for sale

[slartibartfast]

What a total embarrassing fk up.
Allardyce, what a twat.
His agent, what a twat.
The prick that gave the go ahead to try and fk up Englands manager a few weeks in, what a ####.
Well done Telegraph. You've entrapped Allardyce and sold an extra few papers for a day or two. Hope it was worth it.
Imo everyone involved should be ashamed.

 

[spursfan77]

What a total embarrassing fk up.
Allardyce, what a twat.
His agent, what a twat.
The prick that gave the go ahead to try and fk up Englands manager a few weeks in, what a ####.
Well done Telegraph. You've entrapped Allardyce and sold an extra few papers for a day or two. Hope it was worth it.
Imo everyone involved should be ashamed.

You missed out the FA for employing the prick in the first place!

 

[onthetwo]

Why do all the managers support him by saying he hasn't done anything wrong?
Are these things that endemic that they think giving advice on gaming the transfer system and earning a bit on the side are ok?
Lets see how many others the DT have stitched up.....

 

[Danners9]

Why do all the managers support him by saying he hasn't done anything wrong?
Are these things that endemic that they think giving advice on gaming the transfer system and earning a bit on the side are ok?
Lets see how many others the DT have stitched up.....

That's exactly it. They come from an era where envelopes of cash from agents was normal, part of the game, perks of the job. Now it's cuts of transfers, %s of wages as a kickback for signing a player or even putting a player in the XI.

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2003/mar/02/sportandleisure.sport - good book. Familiar names feature prominently.

Jason Puncheon on Warnock. He was fined 15k for this: http://www.101greatgoals.com/blog/j...tter-to-accuse-neil-warnock-of-being-crooked/

Here's the video of Steve Kean talking about Allardyce:
Sam sued, and won I think... https://www.theguardian.com/football/2012/jul/19/sam-allardyce-legal-action-steve-kean

 

[TaoistMonkey]

ooo more stuff coming out. Looks like Harry (portsmouth) and Chelski are in the shit

 

[Gb160]

ooo more stuff coming out. Looks like Harry (portsmouth) and Chelski are in the shit

Where ? Where?
Linky?

 

[TaoistMonkey]

Where ? Where?
Linky?

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...nd-the-fa-failed-to-investigate-a7335916.html

Four of the 17 deals were Bolton signings at the time Allardyce managed the club: Ali Al-Habsi, Tal Ben Haim, Blessing Kaku and Julio Correa. Three were Chelsea buys (Didier Drogba’s move from Marseille, Petr Cech's from Rennes and Michael Essien’s move from Lyon the following year). A further three arrived at Harry Redknapp’s Portsmouth (Collins Mbesuma, Benjani Mwaruwari and Aliou Cisse). Four were Newcastle signings (Emre Belozoglu, Jean-Alain Boumsong, Amdy Faye and Albert Luque), and two went to Middlesbrough (Aiyegbeni Yakubu and Fabio Rochemback) while one transfer has not been disclosed.

 

[SteveH]

If the Sam stuff is the 'big' leader on this expose?
Im thinking this is new 'Duck House' "seleb charges lots £$€ for lecture"............so what, its much ado about nothing.

 

[E.L.Strict]

This whole story is opening a pretty large can of worms in terms of the fans getting to grips with just how many interests are at stake beyond just winning a football match.

Agents are a huge problem. The money they have the potential to earn is so large and the influence they can have over individual players is too great. Not to mention the possibility of agents/agencies having influence over large groups of players, either at the same club or at opposing ones, and investment funds owning multiple teams in the same competition (as suggested in this: 2011 Dispatches that for some reason you can't remember.) How many names from that similar story are still using English football as their play thing today?

With Allardyce, the huge problem is that as England manager you can make 10s of millions of pounds for people just by handing out a simple England cap. How long have we complained about the England team not being picked on merit? Without suggesting that there is money changing hands behind the scenes, it simply makes sense that friendships between Managers, Agents and Players, combined with the amount of money that is at stake, could easily lead to something like a "boys club," where everyone acts in a way that preserves or inflates the value of the other parties. Allardyce has always been able to help people "own" players, but becoming England manager has given him a key position where he is easily able to affect the value of a player, and to a massive extent.

Would it be immoral for him to advise one of these funds to "buy" a player that he knew he was about to pick for England? Would it be immoral of him to delay picking the player until the deal had gone through? Would it be immoral of him to pick a player for England just as a favour to these people, even if the player is not deserving? Would it be immoral for him to agree with the fund that they could use an England call up as a bargaining chip to secure deals on players? Where would Allardyce draw the line? What would stop these people from speaking to Allardyce, then negotiating new contracts for "their" players which include huge bonuses for international appearances, then giving Big Sam a cut of that to give them a cap? How much would this all be worth to him per year? Enough to dwarf his England salary I bet. And after a couple of pints of wine do you really think he'll be in the mood to say no to millions? If him throwing away his dream job over £400k doesn't make sense then maybe there's a better explanation, which is that what he's chasing is worth far more to him than is being reported. The pie is huge and he knows it.

Somehow agents need to be got rid of. I don't think their interests align with a fair and honest game at all.

A player that kind of fits into this discussion is Grealish. What was more unbelievable, how overhyped he was for a few months, or how frequently he is now criticised? I'm not interested in him at all personally, but I do think there is something going on behind the scenes that has caused him to be targetted so obviously. Maybe it is a Ravel Morrison situation and he refused to change agents, or changed to the wrong agent and so the same hype that was used to lure him into signing was turned against him? Perhaps there are behind the scenes gentlemen's agreements between agents in terms of the supply of English players to the national team, and his electing to play for England over Ireland was seen as stepping on some toes? It would be interesting to see if the negative stories about him seem to come from a small group of papers or journalists. Grealish, Agbonlahor, Berahino and Sterling have all been given the "laughing gas" treatment, and I think it would be interesting to look for any agent disputes involving them also.

 

[luRRka]

What a total embarrassing fk up.
Allardyce, what a twat.
His agent, what a twat.
The prick that gave the go ahead to try and fk up Englands manager a few weeks in, what a ####.
Well done Telegraph. You've entrapped Allardyce and sold an extra few papers for a day or two. Hope it was worth it.
Imo everyone involved should be ashamed.

Sorry, but this is not entrapment.

'induces a person to commit a criminal offense that the person would have otherwise been unlikely to commit.'

You can't really think that's the first dodgy bit of business Sam has ever done.

EDIT that's not to say the press aren't sneaky fuckers, just this isn't entrapment

 

[Danners9]

Tommy Wright has now been fired by Barnsley. Oops.

 

[whitesocks]

This whole story is opening a pretty large can of worms in terms of the fans getting to grips with just how many interests are at stake beyond just winning a football match.

Agents are a huge problem. The money they have the potential to earn is so large and the influence they can have over individual players is too great. Not to mention the possibility of agents/agencies having influence over large groups of players, either at the same club or at opposing ones, and investment funds owning multiple teams in the same competition (as suggested in this: 2011 Dispatches that for some reason you can't remember.) How many names from that similar story are still using English football as their play thing today?

With Allardyce, the huge problem is that as England manager you can make 10s of millions of pounds for people just by handing out a simple England cap. How long have we complained about the England team not being picked on merit? Without suggesting that there is money changing hands behind the scenes, it simply makes sense that friendships between Managers, Agents and Players, combined with the amount of money that is at stake, could easily lead to something like a "boys club," where everyone acts in a way that preserves or inflates the value of the other parties. Allardyce has always been able to help people "own" players, but becoming England manager has given him a key position where he is easily able to affect the value of a player, and to a massive extent.

Would it be immoral for him to advise one of these funds to "buy" a player that he knew he was about to pick for England? Would it be immoral of him to delay picking the player until the deal had gone through? Would it be immoral of him to pick a player for England just as a favour to these people, even if the player is not deserving? Would it be immoral for him to agree with the fund that they could use an England call up as a bargaining chip to secure deals on players? Where would Allardyce draw the line? What would stop these people from speaking to Allardyce, then negotiating new contracts for "their" players which include huge bonuses for international appearances, then giving Big Sam a cut of that to give them a cap? How much would this all be worth to him per year? Enough to dwarf his England salary I bet. And after a couple of pints of wine do you really think he'll be in the mood to say no to millions? If him throwing away his dream job over £400k doesn't make sense then maybe there's a better explanation, which is that what he's chasing is worth far more to him than is being reported. The pie is huge and he knows it...
.

Some good ideas here but something doesn't add up. Sam was the England manager, managing English players who just do not go abroad. He can't cap south americans. So why would someone want to pay him to advise on 3rd party ownership?

 

[Danners9]

Some good ideas here but something doesn't add up. Sam was the England manager, managing English players who just do not go abroad. He can't cap south americans. So why would someone want to pay him to advise on 3rd party ownership?

He was West Ham manager when they signed Enner Valencia and the accusation - denied by Wham - was that Valencia had ownership issues at his Mexican club which they managed to get around.

This bit is from the Daily Mail

How do businesspeople circumvent the rules?

In the past, a business would simply purchase the 'economic rights' of a player, or a segment of them. When it came to the player moving on, the business would decide which transfer the player would make depending on which was most beneficial to them.

Following the rule changes the system has changed. A business now pays for an agent's salary, with the agent representing a player.

When the player moves to a new club, the business receives a cut of the transfer fee, as an agent usually would.

Hardly earth shattering, but maybe they were hoping Sam would admit to breaking the rules over Valencia.

 

[WorcesterTHFC]

Sorry, but this is not entrapment.

'induces a person to commit a criminal offense that the person would have otherwise been unlikely to commit.'

You can't really think that's the first dodgy bit of business Sam has ever done.

EDIT that's not to say the press aren't sneaky fuckers, just this isn't entrapment

Another way to put it is that the press didn't cause Allardyce's corruption. They simply exposed it.

 

[slartibartfast]

Sorry, but this is not entrapment.

'induces a person to commit a criminal offense that the person would have otherwise been unlikely to commit.'

You can't really think that's the first dodgy bit of business Sam has ever done.

EDIT that's not to say the press aren't sneaky fuckers, just this isn't entrapment

Ok by the dictionary definition of the word its not entrapment but they set a trap for him and he fell for it.
The only reason this isnt technically entrapment is because he hasn't broken the law not because he wasn't set up which I think is just as shitty as anything he's done.
Not saying I think he's straight and whiter than white but fk me are we so naive we think football isnt full of corruption with all this money sloshing about?
If we're going to sack every bugger whose taken money when offered it to do a job (which he said he'd have to ok with the fa) or after being plied with booze said things which would be viewed badly in the public eye then there'd probably be no fker left in work tomorrow including you I suspect. Obviously in his position he should know better and be more cautious before opening his cake hole. Thats why I said he was a twat.
Not sure why you felt the need to point out that this technically isn't entrapment. Do you work for the media by any chance.
It fkin stinks mate whatever you call it.

 

[luRRka]

Ok by the dictionary definition of the word its not entrapment but they set a trap for him and he fell for it.
The only reason this isnt technically entrapment is because he hasn't broken the law not because he wasn't set up which I think is just as shitty as anything he's done.
Not saying I think he's straight and whiter than white but fk me are we so naive we think football isnt full of corruption with all this money sloshing about?
If we're going to sack every bugger whose taken money when offered it to do a job (which he said he'd have to ok with the fa) or after being plied with booze said things which would be viewed badly in the public eye then there'd probably be no fker left in work tomorrow including you I suspect. Obviously in his position he should know better and be more cautious before opening his cake hole. Thats why I said he was a twat.
Not sure why you felt the need to point out that this technically isn't entrapment. Do you work for the media by any chance.
It fkin stinks mate whatever you call it.

No, I don't work for the media, I'm just pointing out that they aren't forcing him to do something which he wouldn't have done with a real 'businessman'

 

[Johnny J]

Amazing that people are criticising the Telegraph/media.

Let's get this straight: one of the key roles of a free press is to expose corruption and wrongdoing. Shit like this. It's called investigative journalism.

Would you genuinely rather that we were none the wiser about Sam, and that he was free to go about making tidy cash on the side by advising on how to circumvent his employer's rules? And UEFAs rules, for that matter?

I have no doubt that this shit goes on all the time, and that those involved think they can get away with it. Sam obviously thought this was real, and that he could get away with it. I'm glad he got caught, just like I'm glad that Tommy Wright got sacked.

And this is nowhere near entrapment.

 

[whitesocks]

This bit is from the Daily Mail

How do businesspeople circumvent the rules?

In the past, a business would simply purchase the 'economic rights' of a player, or a segment of them. When it came to the player moving on, the business would decide which transfer the player would make depending on which was most beneficial to them.

Following the rule changes the system has changed. A business now pays for an agent's salary, with the agent representing a player.

When the player moves to a new club, the business receives a cut of the transfer fee, as an agent usually would.

This makes sense to me now and it is surprising more hasn't been made of it.

As I understand, just like before, the agent both directs where a player goes and takes a cut of the transfer fee from the buying club, but he now has already sold all/some of the rights to this income to a 4th party - the far eastern investors.
After any transfer, these investors will still own a share of the player, via the agent, and the more transfers/contract renewals a player gets, the bigger the return on their investment.

So this is all here in the premiership today - not far away in south America or somewhere, and as already pointed out, Sam capping one of their investments and raising their profile is quite a big deal and well worth a bung of a £0.5m or so.
No wonder it was his dream job.

 

[mark87]

Apologies if already posted.

Apparently the England players go this the other day, i really hope it's true.

 

[teok]

That signature.