Jermain Jenas

[jamesc0le]

Personally I'd jetison Huddlestone, Ohara and even Zokora before Jenas.

into space? bit harsh.
the truth is redknapp doesnt know what he is doing if he is prepared to release jenas before the likes of ekotto, hutton, gilberto, bent. you may wonder why i mention fullbacks and a striker.

this is because i dont see jenas as good enough for the middle. he isnt strong enough, neither in strength nor character, needs to more dogged, more of a bastard and then he would be an amazing CM. but his all round qualities means he is crucial to us as firefighter, can easily marshall the fullback positions because he is that good, can easily do a decent job anywhere across the midfield if he's up for it and also would do a very good stint as ''second striker'' if he had to.

mourinho's no fool , he'll quickly get into jj's mindset and sort him tyhe fuck out, i just hope redknapp comes to his senses or levy blocks teh transfer at least until the summer when we could possibly see a new manager coming in. maybe mourinho? who knows.

 

[Ossie85]

Personally I'd jetison Huddlestone, Ohara and even Zokora before Jenas.

agree
JJ is our best CM imo

 

[DFF]

Jenas would just spend another 3/4 years here attempting to make the step up into the midfielder he should be, while being dictated to by opposing CMs, if we didn't sell him. The skillset he has combined with his unimposing nature, he just isn't suited to the Premiership - not as a CM, anyway. I think he would benefit immensely from playing in one of the two big continental leagues (like many other English players). He wouldn't be dominated, physically or otherwise, as much and would be allowed to come out of his shell more often. His athleticism and running would be a welcome addition to most Serie A teams.

As it is, he wasting his career away in the Prem.

 

[walworthyid]

For what it's worth here are the stats:

I looked up some stats on Palacios because I haven't seen much of him. Here they are:

-----------------------------------Palacios------------Jenas

Goals-------------------------------0-------------------2
Assists------------------------------0-------------------3
Min per tackles won------------------32.3---------------38.5
Min per Attempts created-------------79------------------60
min per pass--------------------------2.3----------------1.6
Total passes-------------------------735-----------------868
Accurate----------------------------605-----------------764
success %---------------------------82%----------------88%
Minutes played----------------------1747----------------1463


Jenas has an incredibly healthy 88% pass success ratio. Also offers much more going forwards it would seem.

I haven't looked, but I reckon those stats for Jenas would compare favourably with most in the EPL including some so called uber players.. The stats aren't everything but I think they prove he's more valuable than most give him credit for.

For starters a large number of Jenas' passes are sideways!

If he compares favourably with the "uber" players and what not, why oh why, does he look so crap in many, MANY games and the "uber" players don't?

I think the lad has talent and I also think that part of his problem is the players playing around him, but, his inability to control the ball, to look for a creative pass, to get himself out of trouble with a deft touch, all means that he is very often unable to do anything with the ball and thus makes him ineffective in many games.

Stats are great, but I prefer actually watching football!

 

[piedpiper]

I'm happy for Jenas if the move does come off. I have no doubt that he will be missed once he leaves. He has received so much flak on here that i would rather he leave and go to a team where his contribution will be valued. Now Mourinho is a coach and knows players, he will get the best out of Jenas. I had the pleasure of meeting most of the spurs squad when they were here in SA 2 years ago, of all the players he was the friendliest most down to earth player who was more than accomodating in meeting the fans. A genuine warm guy, hope he gets the move to a bigger and better club.

 

[BringBack_leGin]

into space? bit harsh.
the truth is redknapp doesnt know what he is doing if he is prepared to release jenas before the likes of ekotto, hutton, gilberto, bent. you may wonder why i mention fullbacks and a striker.

this is because i dont see jenas as good enough for the middle. he isnt strong enough, neither in strength nor character, needs to more dogged, more of a bastard and then he would be an amazing CM. but his all round qualities means he is crucial to us as firefighter, can easily marshall the fullback positions because he is that good, can easily do a decent job anywhere across the midfield if he's up for it and also would do a very good stint as ''second striker'' if he had to.

mourinho's no fool , he'll quickly get into jj's mindset and sort him tyhe fuck out, i just hope redknapp comes to his senses or levy blocks teh transfer at least until the summer when we could possibly see a new manager coming in. maybe mourinho? who knows.

You'd let go of Ekotto? You do realise that he's been amongst our best players... nay, amongst our only good players

 

[Mullers]

There is no point in selling JJ unless someone better is going to come in.
Buying Palacios and selling JJ makes the squad weaker, looking at those stats, not stronger.

 

[Dr Know]

Well HR just squashed that on SSN, he said no ones going out!! he also said Jenas is the best CM in the league!! and on that note I'm getting worried about HR

 

[Chiedozies_Afro]

Zokora to Real Madrid.... Jenas to Inter Milan..... Whatever next?

Gary Doherty to Barcelona!!??!!

 

[Bus-Conductor]

For starters a large number of Jenas' passes are sideways!

If he compares favourably with the "uber" players and what not, why oh why, does he look so crap in many, MANY games and the "uber" players don't?

I think the lad has talent and I also think that part of his problem is the players playing around him, but, his inability to control the ball, to look for a creative pass, to get himself out of trouble with a deft touch, all means that he is very often unable to do anything with the ball and thus makes him ineffective in many games.

Stats are great, but I prefer actually watching football!

If I said to you:
"I've watched Jenas for the last 3 years and I can tell you he's a decent footballer" would that convince you ?

That's why I chucked in the stats as well.


If you search my posts - possibly even in this thread - you will find my statless opinion of Jenas.

Do you think Everton and Villa are packed full of creative, long distance forward passers ?

I guarantee you both of those clubs would buy Jenas, and both would probably appreciate him for what he brings to the team.

Hard work, energy, box-to-box, rarely gives the ball away, tackles, scores and creates.

What a shitter.

 

[stemark44]

If I said to you:
"I've watched Jenas for the last 3 years and I can tell you he's a decent footballer" would that convince you ?

That's why I chucked in the stats as well.


If you search my posts - possibly even in this thread - you will find my statless opinion of Jenas.

Do you think Everton and Villa are packed full of creative, long distance forward passers ?

I guarantee you both of those clubs would buy Jenas, and both would probably appreciate him for what he brings to the team.

Hard work, energy, box-to-box, rarely gives the ball away, tackles, scores and creates.

What a shitter.

You really are wasting your time trying to convince the Jenas bashers,nothing you or anyone says will change their minds - they simply defy logic!

 

[jamesc0le]

You'd let go of Ekotto? You do realise that he's been amongst our best players... nay, amongst our only good players

of course i realise that. but that's not the whole ekotto story is it.. he could be a monster of a player..but he isn't. go figure

 

[yanno]

As the stats I posted in the Palacios thread show, Palacios would probably be a better Zokora replacement that Jenas.

I've always defended Zokora, and remain a fan of what he brings but Jenas IMO is the more valuable player. Jenas has similar passing stats to Zokora (both around 85%) Both pass more per minute than Palacios but where Jenas had a Minutes per tackle (ie the lower figure the better) of 38, Palacios was 32 I think and Zokora was worse than both with 50 I think. Jenas had two goals and 3 assists. Zokora & Palacios had 0 of either despite playing at least 200 min more football than both Zokora and Jenas.

Not sure why Redknapp (or many of the muppets on here) has got it in for Jenas. I know he isn't quite Viera but for me he's actually one of the best CM's in the country interms of his actual work rate and and all round ability.

His biggest weakness seems to be that he doesn't score like Gerrard or Lampard and doesn't dive around like Edgar Davids.

But what he does do is a bit of everything to a very high standard. My eyes have always told me Jenas is a very decent central midfielder, the stats say he's better than that.

Agreed.

If Mourinho really does want JJ, then I'd expect him to go. Why would JJ want to stay with a manager who allegedly talked publicly on the radio (has that been confirmed yet?) about trying to sell or swap him with an Everton player?

However, as B-C sez, Palacios is a more logical replacement for Zokora than JJ, and I think the way 'Arry has played his cards is fundamentally not in the best interests of our club.

If JJ goes to Inter, I really hope we insist on real money, similar to or better than the money we've shelled out for Palacios. Unfortunately, 'Arry is more likely to want to wheel and deal for a fat Brazilian alcoholic playboy.

Simple question: if man manager extraordinaire, Mr 'Arry Redknapp, can't motivate the likes of JJ and Bale, who at least understand his cockney stream of consciousness, does anyone seriously believe 'Arry can turn perennial underachiever Adriano into a striker who does the goods week in, week out, away on cold winter nights in places like Stoke?

We'll see how it all turns out, but Levy seems to have given up attempting to control 'Arry's wheeling and dealing, and his constant public airings of our famous club's transfer business.

Donna Cullen should be sacked, because her job has clearly been reduced to begging every media outlet in the country for a copy of 'Arry's latest public utterance given without her knowledge or agreeement....

 

[Capocrimini]

Jenas is god.

 

[walworthyid]

If I said to you:
"I've watched Jenas for the last 3 years and I can tell you he's a decent footballer" would that convince you ?

That's why I chucked in the stats as well.


If you search my posts - possibly even in this thread - you will find my statless opinion of Jenas.

Do you think Everton and Villa are packed full of creative, long distance forward passers ?

I guarantee you both of those clubs would buy Jenas, and both would probably appreciate him for what he brings to the team.

Hard work, energy, box-to-box, rarely gives the ball away, tackles, scores and creates.

What a shitter.

I don't deny that he brings all of those attributes, because it would defy logic to do so. My argument is somewhat more subtle than that. In my opinion, Jenas has one fundamental flaw, he lacks composure on the ball.

Because he is an attacking mid, it means that the burden of responsibility for creating, and scoring, from central midfield is on him. The trouble is that when he gets the ball in advanced areas his natural game is to pass wide or run rather than use skill to create space for a forward pass. That doesn't make him a bad player, it just means that either;

a) we slow the play down by going wide, allowing the other team to get into a defensive position and forcing either a cross from deep or the winger to beat his man. Neither or which are high percentage plays

b) Jenas, who is a sprinting dribbler rather than a jinking one, runs with the ball. Again, this is not a high percentage play.

Now, you could argue that if we got the ball up the pitch quicker or compressed play into the opponents half, that Jenas could either go wide stretching the opponents with the pace of the attack or he could use his main strength and play into a striker and look for one-two's around the penalty area similar to a Lampard or Gerrard or Cahill. But what allows these players to do this is good retention of the ball, either up front or from the back, we don't have that. Lampard's retention of the ball is vastly better than Jenas', as is Gerrards, as is Cahill's. The attack can move through these players, Jenas struggles to do this.

If you watch Modric, if he receives the ball in a tight position he has the awareness and the skill to apply a little touch to the ball to buy him a yard or enough time to look up and get a pass away, again, Jenas cannot do this on a regular basis. Modric takes responsibility of the play, if he loses it he has enough belief in his ability to try again, and again. Jenas seems to lack that fundamental belief, perhaps because he knows that it is not a strength in his game.

We have struggled very often over the past few seasons when under pressure simply because we cannot retain the ball. There is not enough movement, skill or beleif among the players in midfield areas to do this. While you could argue that Palacios is not that much of an improvement over Jenas, he is a slightly different player, watch the video in the thread and you will see that he just has that little bit of strength, composure and vision to turn a tight situation into an offensive one.

All of this player love/hate business is really neither here nor there because I really, really want every player that plays for spurs to be a world beater. If Jenas woke up tomorrow and started playing like Messi, you wouldn't find anybody more happy than me, except maybe him and his agent, but the fact is that it is not likely to happen.

It is for these reasons, and these reasons alone, that I beleive that we need a different type of player to improve our team.

 

[yanno]

Now, you could argue that if we got the ball up the pitch quicker or compressed play into the opponents half, that Jenas could either go wide stretching the opponents with the pace of the attack or he could use his main strength and play into a striker and look for one-two's around the penalty area similar to a Lampard or Gerrard or Cahill. But what allows these players to do this is good retention of the ball, either up front or from the back, we don't have that. Lampard's retention of the ball is vastly better than Jenas', as is Gerrards, as is Cahill's. The attack can move through these players, Jenas struggles to do this.

I partly agree with this. I think both Gerrard & Lampard have a better first touch and ball retention skills than JJ. I don't think Cahill does.

Strangely though, I suspect Mourinho would intend to play JJ in a Lampard role at Inter, as the midfield player with the licence to make runs into the box in the space created by the big striker (Ibrahimovic at Inter, Drogba at Chavski) drawing the opposition CBs out of position. JJ does obviously have the engine to play that role, and he is a decent finisher.

If he goes, it will be fascinating to see if Mourinho's judgement of a player and coaching skills are good enough to turn JJ into Fat Frank Mk II. Or whether JJ remains a generally frustrating enigma.

If you watch Modric, if he receives the ball in a tight position he has the awareness and the skill to apply a little touch to the ball to buy him a yard or enough time to look up and get a pass away, again, Jenas cannot do this on a regular basis. Modric takes responsibility of the play, if he loses it he has enough belief in his ability to try again, and again. Jenas seems to lack that fundamental belief, perhaps because he knows that it is not a strength in his game.

I 100% agree with this. I hope 'Arry will play Luka alongside Palacios. Indeed, Palacios looks to have a very good first touch and moves the ball quickly in possession, which Modric will love.

However, my fear is that 'Arry will play Palacios alongside Zokora, with Modric at LM at home, and probably as an ACM (Number 10) away from home in a 4-5-1, once he realizes - as BMJ did - that Defoe is a waste of space in away matches. In that scenario, I would rather have JJ (than Zokora) alongside Palacios every single time.

 

[Khilari]

Hard work, energy, box-to-box, rarely gives the ball away, tackles, scores and creates.

What a shitter.

i'd agree with most of what you say and we'd be stupid to dump JJ unless we replaced him with someone better

but having watched him lots this season, he's not been on his game - gives the ball away a lot (as much as zokora) and hasn't been involved enough in goal scoring.

if he could raise his game to sort those two out, he'd be back to his best

 

[SpurSince57]

I agree with WY's analysis.

Part of the problem, maybe, is that no-one's been quite able to decide what role Jenas should play. Is it also possible that being one of the first names on the team sheet as long as he's fit, with no real competition, he's got a wee bit complacent? If Palacios comes in, that could be the necessary cracker under his backside.

He is a good player—a whole succession of managers, Barcodes, Spurs and England, not to mention his old boss at Forest, have rated him highly, and he is only 25. The frustrating thing is that he appears to have all the physical attributes to be absolutely first-class. Is it a head thing, as I've suggested before?

And I wonder, if you still happen to have some recordings of games from 2005-2006 knocking about, would you see any real improvement in his play if you compared JJ then to JJ now? Maybe I'm being harsh, but I'll swear I've seen more improvement in O'Hara in one season than I have in JJ in three-and-a-half.

 

[AngerManagement]

Well HR just squashed that on SSN, he said no ones going out!! he also said Jenas is the best CM in the league!! and on that note I'm getting worried about HR

I thought Redknapp said he is onr of the best midfielders in the country rather then the best in the league

 

[yanno]

'Arry's latest utterance:

"Every player I have spoken about is in the newspapers and that means someone at this club is passing information on."
http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11675_4803869,00.html

mg::rofl::shake:

OMFG - we must have a mole!

Who could it be?