Kaboul

[Spursidol]

Kaboul's contract runs to 30 June 2015, and I suspect we were not keen to extend it whilst he was injured.

Its still unclear whether he's totally recovered, so can guess that an offer from us might not look too 'much like a 'bumper contract' to Kaboul, plus the very strong rumours that we are bringing in another very good CB suggesting that Kaboul would sink to 3rd choice.

Unless Kaboul accepts whatever contract extension we are prepared to offer, IMO we have no option other than to sell him as at the end of the season he's off on a free.

But I'f hate to find him looking as if he had recovered his fitness and form at a new club if we sell him for a lowish fee due to his injury uncertainty. .

 

[Ledleys Knee]

Anyone slagging off Dawson, remind me to come and twist the dagger in your heart when Lloris, Eriksen etc screw us over to get their moves to Madrid. Loyalty works two ways.

 

[John chedozie]

Dawson has been our most loyal and despite his limitations hardest working player since mabbutt ,unlike kaboul every defeat seems to hurt him and I think he's earnt the right to sit tight n see his contract out. IMHO he should be kept on in a coaching capacity as can u honestly think of anyone u would rather have teaching up n coming kids about attitude , also kaboul is a shadow of his former brilliant self

 

[SpurSince57]

This is Kaboul's first full pre-season in a while, played 90 at the weekend and seems to have no ill effects from his injury. A fully fit Kaboul is a HUGE asset.

Unfortunately, it was against Celtic D-.

It's funny how perceptions change. When we re-signed Kabs from Pompey a lot of SC members—possible the majority—thought Harry had lost it. The reality is we've had one good season from him (and that may be due in part to the Ledley effect, just as Dawson looked far better than he was back in 05-06); in 2011-12 Friedel was actually marginally busier than Hugo was last season, which suggests that he wasn't especially well protected.

I can see the advantages of Kaboul over Dawson, but these mostly devolve upon his pace. He doesn't read the game any better, IMO, but is—or was—quick enough to be able to compensate for his errors most of the time. When it comes to interceptions, winning headers or just getting your body in the way of a shot, Dawson's at least as good.

Most of our opponents are going to park the bus, particularly at the Lane. If Dawson has a quicker partner and we have alert DMs, his lack of pace shouldn't really matter.

 

[Reclamation Project]

Anyone slagging off Dawson, remind me to come and twist the dagger in your heart when Lloris, Eriksen etc screw us over to get their moves to Madrid. Loyalty works two ways.

Dawson should be respected for his time at Spurs, his efforts and how he has conducted himself. If he wants to see out his contract that is his right, and I'm sure he'd be a decent enough back-up.

I also think he has been well-paid by the club in line with his value to the club.

But how has his loyalty been tested? Has he had the opportunity to move onto something better? Has Real Madrid come in for him?!

If they had done, perhaps Dawson wouldn't have agitated for a move, or maybe he would have...... but it's all academic really because although he's been a good player for us, he's never been good enough to invite interest from a top top club.

(Sorry I know this is supposed to be a 'Kaboul' thread)

 

[Sweech]

Anyone slagging off Dawson, remind me to come and twist the dagger in your heart when Lloris, Eriksen etc screw us over to get their moves to Madrid. Loyalty works two ways.

Dawson has only turned down moves to lesser clubs, I don't find that quite analogous to turning down a move to the most successful Champions League team in history.

 

[Ledleys Knee]

Dawson has only turned down moves to lesser clubs, I don't find that quite analogous to turning down a move to the most successful Champions League team in history.

I was just talking about kicking our club captain, who has given everything for the cause for the last 9.5 years.

People who do that have no right to complain when the next mercenary gives us the old dos dedos.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Unfortunately, it was against Celtic D-.

It's funny how perceptions change. When we re-signed Kabs from Pompey a lot of SC members—possible the majority—thought Harry had lost it. The reality is we've had one good season from him (and that may be due in part to the Ledley effect, just as Dawson looked far better than he was back in 05-06); in 2011-12 Friedel was actually marginally busier than Hugo was last season, which suggests that he wasn't especially well protected.

I can see the advantages of Kaboul over Dawson, but these mostly devolve upon his pace. He doesn't read the game any better, IMO, but is—or was—quick enough to be able to compensate for his errors most of the time. When it comes to interceptions, winning headers or just getting your body in the way of a shot, Dawson's at least as good.

Most of our opponents are going to park the bus, particularly at the Lane. If Dawson has a quicker partner and we have alert DMs, his lack of pace shouldn't really matter.

It isn't just about pace, but Kaboul is still much quicker and quicker on the spin, he does read the game better than Dawson, can get closer to an opponent without over committing, and is also more comfortable on the ball than Dawson.

You keep highlighting the fact that Kaboul didn't look great at times last season, but he was coming back from a very long injury duration, and Dawson hasn't looked great ever. Not to anyone capable of seeing past the cheesy grin.

Getting rid of Kaboul ahead of Dawson is a very dangerous policy IMO.

 

[Cravenspurs]

Anyone slagging off Dawson, remind me to come and twist the dagger in your heart when Lloris, Eriksen etc screw us over to get their moves to Madrid. Loyalty works two ways.

I liked that, but the door is open for Dawson to move on. He is a loyal SOB and we all love him for it. Eriksen and Lloris will move on if this talented team can't make something happen in a year or two. Everyone moves on. Dawson's is now, but we will always welcome him back with open arms.

 

[ebzrascal]

I was just talking about kicking our club captain, who has given everything for the cause for the last 9.5 years.

People who do that have no right to complain when the next mercenary gives us the old dos dedos.

If he loved the club and he knew he was no longer good enough at the highest level he would move on so we get some cash and can free up his wages.That would be true selfless loyalty in my view...

He is a good guy but easy to be loyal when you earn a couple of million of pounds a year. I doubt he would have turned down Man Utd or Real Madrid..

 

[Spursking]

Sometimes I wonder if we also have a lot of these people at the Club who are not seeing what a raw talent is.
Kabould is 28 years old now, but selling him for only £7mill doesn't make any sense in my mind. I know he is injury prone, but still. Let's sell Dawson instead. Bring in Mateo, and Dier is already there. We will see what happens to Vlad.

With Jan, Kaboul and Mateo. we have leaders at the back. I am not saying Dawson isn't, but I think he is not up there with the best, even though he is working very hard and is committed.

 

[SpurSince57]

Sometimes I wonder if we also have a lot of these people at the Club who are not seeing what a raw talent is.
Kabould is 28 years old now, but selling him for only £7mill doesn't make any sense in my mind. I know he is injury prone, but still. Let's sell Dawson instead. Bring in Mateo, and Dier is already there. We will see what happens to Vlad.

With Jan, Kaboul and Mateo. we have leaders at the back. I am not saying Dawson isn't, but I think he is not up there with the best, even though he is working very hard and is committed.

A 28-year-old raw talent? Really?

Does not compute.

 

[Spursking]

A 28-year-old raw talent? Really?

Does not compute.

I am talking about a pure talent for football here. Not age. Kaboul has a special talent for football, and I rate him as one of our key defenders. That's what I'm talking about here.

 

[Matrix]

Yes Dawson has been a loyal servant, but centimentality does not make you progress. Do we have him on the bench as club captain wasting away precious playing time in his twilight yes or do we let him go when he would be a regular?
We need to progress as a club and move on, if theres someone better then why not upgrade? Or do we keep him and slag him off all season for leaving us open at the back and giving away soft goals?
I for one want to remember Dawson the captain who played with his heart on his sleeve, not Dawson who cost us cheap goals.

 

[Jospur]

I'll be sorry to see Kaboul leave. He's a powerhouse defender. A leader. The prices quoted for this talent are ridiculously low. What's wrong with him? Do the physios think he's an injury liability? If so, it'll be interesting to monitor how many games Kaboul plays this season.

 

[Sweech]

I'll be sorry to see Kaboul leave. He's a powerhouse defender. A leader. The prices quoted for this talent are ridiculously low. What's wrong with him? Do the physios think he's an injury liability? If so, it'll be interesting to monitor how many games Kaboul plays this season.

He hasn't played much recently and he's on the last year of his deal. That's why his price is low.

 

[chinaman]

We'll regret if we sell Kaboul for only 6 million pounds.

 

[SandroClegane]

We'll regret if we sell Kaboul for only 6 million pounds.

Why will we regret it? If he has injury problems and is in the last year of his contract that's an excellent deal.

 

[Jospur]

He hasn't played much recently and he's on the last year of his deal. That's why his price is low.

Yes, I agree. It still doesn't take away from the fact (as far as I'm concerned) that he's a top drawer player. Musacchio looks to be a decent player - but is he better than Kaboul? I'm not so sure. He might be better at some things - but equally Kaboul would be better at other aspects of defending. Heading, for example.

Is there really a 15 million gulf between Musacchio and Kaboul?

 

[Sweech]

Yes, I agree. It still doesn't take away from the fact (as far as I'm concerned) that he's a top drawer player. Musacchio looks to be a decent player - but is he better than Kaboul? I'm not so sure. He might be better at some things - but equally Kaboul would be better at other aspects of defending. Heading, for example.

Is there really a 15 million gulf between Musacchio and Kaboul?

Well...yes it actually does take away from the fact. That's precisely the point of it. Those two things lower his value in a very substantial way.

What Kaboul is better at is somewhat of an unknown right now. With his fitness concerns we really don't know which side of the coin we're going to get with him. Are we going to see more of the same from what he was last year, or will he return to form?

Right now we're looking for top class players and their value raises exponentially when their even just that little bit better than the next guy. Is he worth 15 more than Kaboul? Possibly. Especially when you look at all the factors involved.