Let's All Laugh At... Let's all laugh at Chelsea thread

[worcestersauce]

I wrote somewhere, possibly in here, when Boley bought Chelsea that their fans have a shock coming as he's not going to be anything like Abramovitch.
They need to come to terms with the fact that they are now a normal football club, they may still be successful, (unlikely) but if they are they'll have to do it the standard way.
I believe Potter is the right manager for this Chelsea, it's the fans that are the wrong ones as they still think it's the Russian version.
It's going to be a shock to their system.

 

[Bluto Blutarsky]

I believe Potter is the right manager for this Chelsea,

I am not sure that is true - though time will tell.

I think this may be a bad fit for both parties. Potter does well when he has younger players eager to learn and impress. Managing older, more established, players is more about managing egos than it is about tactics. Its much harder to get them to buy into high energy new systems.

I think Potter will be back managing mid-table squads soon.


(Maybe even at Chelsea....?)

 

[allatsea]

I am not sure that is true - though time will tell.

I think this may be a bad fit for both parties. Potter does well when he has younger players eager to learn and impress. Managing older, more established, players is more about managing egos than it is about tactics. Its much harder to get them to buy into high energy new systems.

I think Potter will be back managing mid-table squads soon.


(Maybe even at Chelsea....?)

Similar to Poch.

 

[Bluto Blutarsky]

Similar to Poch.

A little - and that is why he struggled at PSG.

The one difference with Poch - and why he got a chance at PSG - he did take Spurs to a CL Final, and did have Spurs competing in the top-4, when most would not have rated Spurs that highly.

But, clearly his best years were when he had young players pushing their hardest.

I do think that if we move on from Conte at the end of the season, Poch is likely to be the next manager - and we will again, embark on a new "Project". Kane and Son would probably both be sold, and we would start the re-build with a younger core - Deki, Richi, Romero, Bentancur, Sess, Udogie, Sarr, maybe even Gil.

 

[worcestersauce]

I am not sure that is true - though time will tell.

I think this may be a bad fit for both parties. Potter does well when he has younger players eager to learn and impress. Managing older, more established, players is more about managing egos than it is about tactics. Its much harder to get them to buy into high energy new systems.

I think Potter will be back managing mid-table squads soon.


(Maybe even at Chelsea....?)

That's sort of my point, I think you may also be buying into the Abramovitch Chelsea view of who they are whereas I believe his way of building a side may be more in tune with the new hierarchy. I will be very surprised if the new ownership is going to keep stumping up hundreds of millions going forward.

 

[C0YS]

I wonder if they will allow him to bring in the players he wants or the Chairman will continue to do the buying ?

I mean he didn't get much a choice at Brighton either. Potter is a good coach, all about movement and also good game prep. So when I say he needs a preseason it's more about training than player purchases.

There are lots of issues though. What made him a success in other jobs is players believed in his project. He comes in at Chelsea and already most of the players are thinking, we got rid of tuchel and got this guy in? Like hard to win players over. If players don't buy in its a big problem.

The second issue is that I think he isn't adjusting to big team mentality. Take the Newcastle game, he developed a plan to deal with Bruno, rather than working on how Chelsea are going to beat the opposition. That's unlikely to win many players over.

Similarly, he seems to be suffering under the pressure a bit. He is rotating his squad heavily after almost every game. It's like he is just waiting to find the magic formula. But instability tends to bring, well instability. A much better approach is to slowly adjust the way the team looks and not just change players after one bad performance.

Similarly, while some don't like Sterling, he started pretty well for Tuchel, but under Potter every game he is being given a different position. That hurts confidence and doesn't give an impression of having a plan.

Basically, Potter looks right now like a manager who hasn't adjusted to what managing a top 6 team looks like. But he's also in an impossible position. He's following an incredibly successful manager who managed to come in mid season and quickly instil an identity to that team. Tuchel was sacked because of political purposes not performances.

Normally managers are given a bit of leeway when coming in because generally they come into a team with existing problems which can't be immediately fixed. Chelsea had a shaky start, but were not at a point of crisis. This meant he had to hit the ground running to justify his appointment. He hasn't, but that happens.

Potter could be a success in a top 6 team. But the setup needs to be right, the Chelsea job feels like a poor move from him. Because normally you get only one shot at the top jobs, unfair as that may be.

 

[Frozen_Waffles]

I mean he didn't get much a choice at Brighton either. Potter is a good coach, all about movement and also good game prep. So when I say he needs a preseason it's more about training than player purchases.

There are lots of issues though. What made him a success in other jobs is players believed in his project. He comes in at Chelsea and already most of the players are thinking, we got rid of tuchel and got this guy in? Like hard to win players over. If players don't buy in its a big problem.

The second issue is that I think he isn't adjusting to big team mentality. Take the Newcastle game, he developed a plan to deal with Bruno, rather than working on how Chelsea are going to beat the opposition. That's unlikely to win many players over.

Similarly, he seems to be suffering under the pressure a bit. He is rotating his squad heavily after almost every game. It's like he is just waiting to find the magic formula. But instability tends to bring, well instability. A much better approach is to slowly adjust the way the team looks and not just change players after one bad performance.

Similarly, while some don't like Sterling, he started pretty well for Tuchel, but under Potter every game he is being given a different position. That hurts confidence and doesn't give an impression of having a plan.

Basically, Potter looks right now like a manager who hasn't adjusted to what managing a top 6 team looks like. But he's also in an impossible position. He's following an incredibly successful manager who managed to come in mid season and quickly instil an identity to that team. Tuchel was sacked because of political purposes not performances.

Normally managers are given a bit of leeway when coming in because generally they come into a team with existing problems which can't be immediately fixed. Chelsea had a shaky start, but were not at a point of crisis. This meant he had to hit the ground running to justify his appointment. He hasn't, but that happens.

Potter could be a success in a top 6 team. But the setup needs to be right, the Chelsea job feels like a poor move from him. Because normally you get only one shot at the top jobs, unfair as that may be.

It does seem like a poor job for him and Chelsea (in hindsight), but he had to take it. What gets overlooked sometimes is experience. The right experience.

He has not become a bad manager overnight, and I would take him at Spurs if Conte went. The problem is coming in mid season to a club in transition is difficult and if you are going to do this, you need top class managers who can manage this sort of pressure (see Conte and Jose at us).

Not a project manager. He is going to change the ethos and playing style of the club, this takes time, but surely Boehly must have known that it was going to get worse before it gets better. This is where the question lies... does Boehly know what he is doing?

Because the players he has signed are for immediate success and in imo terrible purchases or decent purchases at terrible prices, bringing Potter in is another strange one. Imo he was the best manager on the market, but he was in no way a fit if you want immediate success (or for Chelsea).

It still might work out, he just needs time.... but will he get it? Everything points to Boehly being out of his depth.... but he will probably throw more money at the problem and they will get better with or without Potter.

Weirdly the best appointment they could make now (if they get rid of Potter) is probably Thomas Tuchel.

Just a recap on Boehly, he has come in to Chelsea, sacked all the staff, bought random players at silly prices, sacked a successful manager and brought an inexperienced manager in. He is certainly not afraid to make decisions, I will give him that.

 

[easley91]

He's getting found out. The superlative 'chef's kiss' manager that he is should be doing better with this group of players.

None of them he brought in though. He needs time and windows. He got given a squad that was weirdly put together by the owners in the summer. They didn't get a proper goal scorer that was sorely needed and also have big injuries defensively. Just like any manager who comes in mid season, you can't judge them until at least after the next one (if they're given that time).

Potter needs time to put his fingerprint on the club. Hard to say whether he is a fit or not just yet. Though I think he would have been better off succeeding Southgate as England boss.

 

[A Bit Much]

None of them he brought in though. He needs time and windows. He got given a squad that was weirdly put together by the owners in the summer. They didn't get a proper goal scorer that was sorely needed and also have big injuries defensively. Just like any manager who comes in mid season, you can't judge them until at least after the next one (if they're given that time).

Potter needs time to put his fingerprint on the club. Hard to say whether he is a fit or not just yet. Though I think he would have been better off succeeding Southgate as England boss.

Imagine if we were on a Chelsea forum saying potter is being 'found out' after what 10 games? Barmy stuff.

 

[Tonio]

Oh yes we’ll definitely know for sure if he’s the real deal after Boehly and co pump 200 mill or more into the team for him. If he lasts that long.

 

[McFlash]

Still think the bloke needs a bit of time.
If the experienced, "top" managers like Klopp, Conte and even ETH are struggling so far, I think it's down to the fucking state of this season, more than their ability.
Potter, like the rest of us is struggling with a lack of training time and frequency of games.

Chelsea fans wanting rid just reminds me of the few on here that want Conte out. Little understanding of the unusual challenges that this season has thrown up.

 

[dontcallme]

For me, there's definitely a question of whether Potter is the right fit for Chelsea. He's clearly a very intelligent and quality coach but a big part of the challenge of managing Chelsea is dealing with the board, big ego players and fans.

He needs more time but it's hard to work out if he is able to manage such a strange club.

 

[Timberwolf]

Still think the bloke needs a bit of time.
If the experienced, "top" managers like Klopp, Conte and even ETH are struggling so far, I think it's down to the fucking state of this season, more than their ability.
Potter, like the rest of us is struggling with a lack of training time and frequency of games.

Chelsea fans wanting rid just reminds me of the few on here that want Conte out. Little understanding of the unusual challenges that this season has thrown up.

Yeah absolutely. If they want Potter to succeed, he needs to be given time as the squad is still a weird mess and they have all sorts of injuries. I think Boehly will have to really hold his nerve, though. The Chelsea fans will get very restless very quickly if the result don't improve soon.

Chelsea are unlike all of the other clubs you mentioned in that they've had sustained success, in some form or other, for 20 years now. Every time they've had bad season or a dodgy spell - and they've had a fair few under Scolari, AVB, Jose mk II, Lampard etc - they've always bounced straight back. In the face of failure they've acted fast: fired the manager, spent a shit-ton, got a big name replacement and won trophies. Even their bloody stop-gap coaches like Benitez, Hiddink and Di Matteo won them stuff. It's a fine line to walk, but between sustained big investment, good recruitment and luck, they've pulled it off.

As a result they have perhaps the most consistently spoilt fan base in the country. United, Liverpool and Arsenal fans have all had a period of relative failure in the past decade or two and were all forced into being patient and backing project managers. Chelsea fans have never been through that since Roman took over, and if Boehly has decided Potter is his man for the long term they could be in for a serious shock over the next year or so.

In hiring a manager like Potter, Boehly has gone completely against the modern culture of Chelsea, and while it might pay off long term a la Arteta, he's going to need nerves of steel if Chelsea finish 8th and the fans are kicking off. In sacking Tuchel and giving Potter a 5 year deal, Boehly has put a huge amount of stock in his success, and if Potter fails it means admitting he fucked up his choice of manager.

It's going to be interesting to see how this one pans out but I think it could get messy.

 

[BorjeSpurs]

Yeah absolutely. If they want Potter to succeed, he needs to be given time as the squad is still a weird mess and they have all sorts of injuries. I think Boehly will have to really hold his nerve, though. The Chelsea fans will get very restless very quickly if the result don't improve soon.

Chelsea are unlike all of the other clubs you mentioned in that they've had sustained success, in some form or other, for 20 years now. Every time they've had bad season or a dodgy spell - and they've had a fair few under Scolari, AVB, Jose mk II, Lampard etc - they've always bounced straight back. In the face of failure they've acted fast: fired the manager, spent a shit-ton, got a big name replacement and won trophies. Even their bloody stop-gap coaches like Benitez, Hiddink and Di Matteo won them stuff. It's a fine line to walk, but between sustained big investment, good recruitment and luck, they've pulled it off.

As a result they have perhaps the most consistently spoilt fan base in the country. United, Liverpool and Arsenal fans have all had a period of relative failure in the past decade or two and were all forced into being patient and backing project managers. Chelsea fans have never been through that since Roman took over, and if Boehly has decided Potter is his man for the long term they could be in for a serious shock over the next year or so.

In hiring a manager like Potter, Boehly has gone completely against the modern culture of Chelsea, and while it might pay off long term a la Arteta, he's going to need nerves of steel if Chelsea finish 8th and the fans are kicking off. In sacking Tuchel and giving Potter a 5 year deal, Boehly has put a huge amount of stock in his success, and if Potter fails it means admitting he fucked up his choice of manager.

It's going to be interesting to see how this one pans out but I think it could get messy.

They’ve missed out on Champions League football twice in the last 20 years. In this time, they’ve only been in the Europa League once from the groupstage, which of course meant they won the EL title that year.

The only time they’ve been out of Europe in the last 20 years was 16/17, which helped them win their last league title, beating us in the process. FML.

 

[Japhet]

In fairness I think Tuchel is a top tier manager Potter is a promising one. I think you can't really judge potter without him having had time to set out his vision. The issue is that Chelsea players may not have bought into him and if that's the case it's almost impossible to turn it around.

Reality is more than bad management it's a case of clueless running of the club.

They don't need to worry since they have Super Todd Boehly at the helm. He ignored Marina Gravatskiya and took control of Summer transfers, and what a fine job he made of that paying 63m for Cucurella and also nabbing the perma crocked Fofana for a monster fee. He doubtless fancies himself to be manager too since Potter seemingly doesn't fit the bill, and if they lose their strikers he'll be waiting in the wings with his kit on under his suit so he can sprint onto the pitch and score the winner. Bloke seems like an absolute penis to me.

 

[IamSpurtacus]

The lack of pre-season for Potter is damaging, given he has a certain style of play, and he's not helped by injuries.

But it shows how much quality Conte has as a manager, that he was able to come in mid-season and straight away get a tune out of a squad that is clearly deficient in so many areas.

That's the difference between an established world-class manager and someone with potential

 

[ikky]

Potter will probably buy some Brighton players ( Trossard, Caceido ), hopefully at extortionate prices, which their fans won’t like even though they’re good players.

 

[Timberwolf]

The lack of pre-season for Potter is damaging, given he has a certain style of play, and he's not helped by injuries.

But it shows how much quality Conte has as a manager, that he was able to come in mid-season and straight away get a tune out of a squad that is clearly deficient in so many areas.

That's the difference between an established world-class manager and someone with potential

Yeah I think it's slightly taken for granted what Conte did last season. We were absolutely god-awful under Nuno and he immediately made big changes to the squad, bombing out Lo Celso, Ndombele and Alli who many fans thought would be reborn under him, myself included, before bringing in his own guys.

Potter might be able to do the same at Chelsea, but as he's quite a laid back character and doesn't have a ton of trophies to point at to assure the players he's taking them down the right path. Can Potter get away with, or take the risk of, kicking out a bunch of players in Jan? I think if he's to succeed at Chelsea it will be much more of a gradual, patient building process like Arteta at Arsenal (or Potter at Brighton) rather than an instant turn around like Conte.

 

[Trix]

Oh yes we’ll definitely know for sure if he’s the real deal after Boehly and co pump 200 mill or more into the team for him. If he lasts that long.

They aren't just going to keep spending year on year. Boehly has said this they will have to find a way by being on the whole sustainable just like we are.

 

[djhotspur]

Their fan forum is an incredible read currently. They are truly in the shit, the have signed a bunch of expensive flops, have a bunch of crocked talents and ageing talents, a manager they all hate and nothing in place to make sure they sign the players they need to improve. They all think they need 1 striker, 2 wingers, a CB, a RWB, a LWB, 2 CMs and a GK.