No, I´m not blind, we really are 14th in the league.

Gaz_Gammon

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16,047
#41
5 LEAGUE goals. You know, because the post is talking about our LEAGUE performance. Pav can't score consistently in the LEAGUE because he is not good enough. Sure he can score against poor opposition in the cup but who cares about that when we are talking about the LEAGUE.
And Wigan are World beaters, in a match where Defoe scored for fun?

Poor teams? How many did Keano, Defoe and Crouch score against Stoke, Wolves, and Hull? Or are those teams also title contenders or perhaps they are not on you argument list of "poor opposition"?

Explain your statement in words that make any sense whatsoever.

You can't have it both ways, and ineed your argument is just full of holes regarding Pav. He's a far more fluent striker, with more skills than Crouch.

I remarked on here when the signing of Crouch was about to go thriugh that the ball wouldn't be rolling along the green stuff much when Crouch was being selected and that's how it's turned out.

Torres, Rooney, Drogba, Fabregas are all "World Class" whereas Defoe, Keane and Crouch should not be mentioned in the same sentance. Why do you think Harry is after Nistleroy? It's bugger all to do with whether a side we play is good, poor, or average. Great goalscorers will score against any opposition but we have not had a single great goalscorer at Spurs since the Premier League was formed. Berbatov was perhaps the closest we had to very good all round goalscorer, but not a great one.
 
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#42
In recent years the difference between us and Liverpool has been that they've beaten us twice. We ahd a great chance to reverse the well established order of things and go 7 points clear but to many players failed to show last night....... preserving themselves for the 3 games next week...who knows....

Yes the goal should have counted and would have changes the game and perhaps condemned Liverpool to financial ruin.... but it was disappointing that there was no killer attitude.

Liverpool were up for it ...Spurs weren't. Very disappointing.
 

sebo_sek

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#43
And Wigan are World beaters, in a match where Defoe scored for fun?

Poor teams? How many did Keano, Defoe and Crouch score against Stoke, Wolves, and Hull? Or are those teams also title contenders or perhaps they are not on you argument list of "poor opposition"?

Explain your statement in words that make any sense whatsoever.

You can't have it both ways, and ineed your argument is just full of holes regarding Pav. He's a far more fluent striker, with more skills than Crouch.

I remarked on here when the signing of Crouch was about to go thriugh that the ball wouldn't be rolling along the green stuff much when Crouch was being selected and that's how it's turned out.

Torres, Rooney, Drogba, Fabregas are all "World Class" whereas Defoe, Keane and Crouch should not be mentioned in the same sentance. Why do you think Harry is after Nistleroy? It's bugger all to do with whether a side we play is good, poor, or average. Great goalscorers will score against any opposition but we have not had a single great goalscorer at Spurs since the Premier League was formed. Berbatov was perhaps the closest we had to very good all round goalscorer, but not a great one.
Well, we did have Klinsmann and... Sheringham - a truly brilliant striker

But I agree with everything you say here.
 
Joined
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#45
The difference between us and the sides who will actually finish in the top four is that we are aiming for fourth; they are aiming to win the league.
Agree with that. Instead of worrying about the pack that surrounds us we
should be trying to bridge the gap between us and the scum down the road.
 

mattstev2000

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Aug 15, 2007
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1,647
#46
And Wigan are World beaters, in a match where Defoe scored for fun?

Poor teams? How many did Keano, Defoe and Crouch score against Stoke, Wolves, and Hull? Or are those teams also title contenders or perhaps they are not on you argument list of "poor opposition"?
Well lets turn it around... you think Pav is so fantastic, why couldn't he muster more the 5 league goals all last season and don't give me the 'he was tired' or 'he needed to adapt' crap.

Everytime he has played this season he has look bored, weak and lacking in talent. His shooting has been wayward and his control poor. Coupled with that has been the fact that both Redknapp and Hiddink have commented on the fact that he has motivational problems.

Explain your statement in words that make any sense whatsoever.
Just because you can't understand them doesn't mean they don't make sense.
 

JoeT

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Jun 7, 2005
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#47
I have recently posted (on more then one occasion actually), that one of the team's priorities should be bringing in an out-and-out left winger to either start when/if Lennon is injured, or to compliment him on the right....why? Because EVERY TIME he doesn't start we instantly experience trouble, either not being able to break teams down, but scoring goals as well. (Just look at the number of goals we have scored that Lennon had a supporting part in.) And again recently with him missing, we are having the same problems. So, maybe our goalscorers will start to score when they have some service. (A cliche really, but in our case all too true.)
Also in the event that other teams try to stop Lennon by double-teaming him, another winger would again give us a different outlet.
I must admit to a lack of knowledge when discussing whom we should try to bring in, but I think that Martin Petrov might be a good candidate, plus I think he might be surplus to requirements in Manchester these days....wasn't it him I saw playing right-wing against Everton just the other day?
 

PT

North Stand behind Pat's goal.
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#48
Fact is we've only lost three times away from home - to Chelsea, Liverpool and the scum - all three losses to teams immediately threatening our own status at the top of the table.

Home form is paramount to mount a serious challenge and it's at home that we appear to be stumbling right now. The away form is already good enough for top four if we continue the trend of 1.45 points per game.

I stress that home form is where we need to be a fortress and find a way to getting past two banks of four and a bus.
 

spurs_viola

Rui Costa,dreamspurs no10
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#49
Well lets turn it around... you think Pav is so fantastic, why couldn't he muster more the 5 league goals all last season and don't give me the 'he was tired' or 'he needed to adapt' crap.

....
Yes, let's look properly, shall we. Pav started 19 league games last season without any pre-season with the team and having joined the team in poor form in the totally new, very hard league, having not played for any foreign club before, and having to adapt to a new manager just over a month after he arrived; his 9 substitute appearances under Harry were usually after 70-75 min. And he did score 5 league goals, 3 of which were winners (L'pool 2-1, West Ham 1-0, Blackburn 1-0) and the other one very crucial opening goal in the first win of the season (Bolton 2-0).
By the way, the games against West Ham and Blackburn were very similar to how this season's games v Stoke, Wolves, Hull went.

Now, Crouchy - has had 13 league starts plus 9 sub appearances at least from 60th min, experienced EPL forward, playing under a manager who has every trust in him and had players in much better form around him.
Yet he has scored just 4 (Four) goals in total of 22 games.

To me this does not immediately point to the conclusion that Pav is crap and Crouchy is a much better striker.
 

Chedozie

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#50
Yes, let's look properly, shall we. Pav started 19 league games last season without any pre-season with the team and having joined the team in poor form in the totally new, very hard league, having not played for any foreign club before, and having to adapt to a new manager just over a month after he arrived; his 9 substitute appearances under Harry were usually after 70-75 min. And he did score 5 league goals, 3 of which were winners (L'pool 2-1, West Ham 1-0, Blackburn 1-0) and the other one very crucial opening goal in the first win of the season (Bolton 2-0).
By the way, the games against West Ham and Blackburn were very similar to how this season's games v Stoke, Wolves, Hull went.

Now, Crouchy - has had 13 league starts plus 9 sub appearances at least from 60th min, experienced EPL forward, playing under a manager who has every trust in him and had players in much better form around him.
Yet he has scored just 4 (Four) goals in total of 22 games.

To me this does not immediately point to the conclusion that Pav is crap and Crouchy is a much better striker.
The truth is, a fully fit and in form Batistuta shits all over both of them, that is who we should be signing the new batigol.

If we could genetically modify our current players, we would have the solution, mix defoes pace and finishing with Crouchs height and Keanes game awareness, we would have the striker we need.

We could do the same with Hudd, give him Jenas's engine and pace. We spent £15 million on Bentley 13 on Pav and 8 on Hutton if we hadn't done that, we would have £36 million to spend on this (not including their wages).
 

spurs_viola

Rui Costa,dreamspurs no10
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#51
The truth is, a fully fit and in form Batistuta shits all over both of them, that is who we should be signing the new batigol.

If we could genetically modify our current players, we would have the solution, mix defoes pace and finishing with Crouchs height and Keanes game awareness, we would have the striker we need.

We could do the same with Hudd, give him Jenas's engine and pace. We spent £15 million on Bentley 13 on Pav and 8 on Hutton if we hadn't done that, we would have £36 million to spend on this (not including their wages).
:) Eh? Have you had any sleep since last night?...:wink:

Batigol is of course several times better than either Pav or Crouch, but what is the point in daydreaming about a SuperPlayer clone? Agree on £ 36-37 million we could have used much better. Add £9 mil for Crouch and it becomes about £ 46 mil...
 
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#52
Nine goals against Wigan - 10 goals in 9 Premiership matches since then. May only have conceded 6 in those 9 games, but haven't scored enough.
 

Jonesey

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Apr 20, 2004
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#53
It sounds crazy but that's spot on.

The games against Stoke and Wolves and missed goals that you mention would mean we were title contenders but, unfortunately, we're likely to finish around 5th or 6th if our defence can keep up the good form they'd showed before the Liverpool game.

Unless we can be more prolific in front of goal ...

Wish Ruud really was coming.
 

JoeT

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#54
I guess my post re: a left-winger didn't make a lot of sense eh?
It's obviously a more practical suggestion that the team can be made more effective by cloning.
 

spurs mental

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#55
The thing is, with the creative players we have in our team every game, we should be scoring goals for fun. We've got Modric, Kranjcar, Lennon, Huddlestone, Crouch, Defoe, not forgetting Keane on the bench, Gio, Rose, Bentley, Jenas. 6 of those 11 usually play every week. There's no reason why we shouldn't be scoring.

The 9-1 game has really hurt us though. Teams come to sit and defend all game. But those players I mentioned should have enough about them to be able to create something even with two banks of four in front of them, but instead, we usually just send it long to Crouch, which is very frustrating, and something I was afraid would happen when we signed him.

Another problem we have with our first choice strike partnership of Crouch and JD, is that the latter is offside far too often. I'm not sure on the stats, he's certainly not the most, I know Darren Bent is the player most offside, he's been flagged 34 times. I imagine Defoe is pretty close though. He was offside about 5 times last night. Unlucky to have a goal ruled out. But he needs to improve on his movement and positioning when we're attacking. He doesn't need to go as early as he is, because he has pace to beat defenders. Good moves can be ruined because of it.
 

spurs_viola

Rui Costa,dreamspurs no10
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#56
I guess my post re: a left-winger didn't make a lot of sense eh?
It's obviously a more practical suggestion that the team can be made more effective by cloning.
Not many sensible posts get commented on here, don't worry :)

Modric and Kranjcar seem to have got the left midfield slot to themselves with Harry and it's difficult to see a new LW coming in unless both of them get injured at the same time.
 

sebo_sek

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#57
The thing is, with the creative players we have in our team every game, we should be scoring goals for fun. We've got Modric, Kranjcar, Lennon, Huddlestone, Crouch, Defoe, not forgetting Keane on the bench, Gio, Rose, Bentley, Jenas. 6 of those 11 usually play every week. There's no reason why we shouldn't be scoring.

The 9-1 game has really hurt us though. Teams come to sit and defend all game. But those players I mentioned should have enough about them to be able to create something even with two banks of four in front of them, but instead, we usually just send it long to Crouch, which is very frustrating, and something I was afraid would happen when we signed him.

Another problem we have with our first choice strike partnership of Crouch and JD, is that the latter is offside far too often. I'm not sure on the stats, he's certainly not the most, I know Darren Bent is the player most offside, he's been flagged 34 times. I imagine Defoe is pretty close though. He was offside about 5 times last night. Unlucky to have a goal ruled out. But he needs to improve on his movement and positioning when we're attacking. He doesn't need to go as early as he is, because he has pace to beat defenders. Good moves can be ruined because of it.
And last night he got caught WALKING back from an offside position with the ball at the edge of the D. :eek:mg:
 

jenko

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Mar 18, 2004
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#58
i agree our strikeforce is well overrated. i agree we need to break teams down better. But this mail ignores our goal difference. I doubt we'll make 4th but 14th is way off the mark whichever way you dress it up. we've always been climbing uphill to get to 4th and its starting to show now. we'll be 6th in my opinion but its still and improvement on last year and next year it'll be the same. liverpool might come up short but man city are here to stay with they're finances and we can't escape that. champions league was and is a dream i'm afraid. its not negativity, its realism.
 

Stoof

Stoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooof
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#59
Can we please move away from the idea that Pavlyuchenko deserves "a chance".

He's not played a tiny amount of football for us; and the times that he has played this season he's looked disinterested, lacklustre and mostly awful. Possibly one of the worst striker contributions (vs. Peterborough) that I have ever seen. And I include Andy Booth in that. Andy. Booth.

Everyone loves a knee-jerk reaction and all strikers go on poor runs. ALL of them. In whatever League. It's just usually they are considerate enough to not go on a poor run at the same time. They're not suddenly bad players. So you don't need to spend 45 hours on Championship Manager churning over what strikers we do and don't need - we need to keep our squad settled, play the good football we have been playing and know and trust that we will put chances away when we get them, because we've seen all of them do it time and time again.

As a side issue, hands up those that thought we would be anywhere near the top 4 this January? (My hand is certainly not going up).
 

Chedozie

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#60
I guess my post re: a left-winger didn't make a lot of sense eh?
It's obviously a more practical suggestion that the team can be made more effective by cloning.

Its not cloning, we need genetic modification.
 
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