Player Watch Player Watch: Micky van de Ven

[felmani26]

No short term thinking. Just considering squad harmony and the fact as many years that I’ve heard the argument that we need X amount of quality cover for certain positions, ‘just in case’, it never works out that way. Players get frustrated (see Richarlison last season) as a manager under pressure to win every match will likely play a settled 11 most weeks, especially in the centre of defence.

VDV isn’t gonna accept leaving a team where he is a guaranteed starter for a decent bundesliga side, to come and be a bench option for us, potentially stunting his development. He could stay where he is, develop further and get a move to an elite club next summer instead.

Yes we need a quality cover in the long term but Tosin has by all accounts been throughly scouted to potentially provide a back up option this season and we can upgrade further next summer when Dier leaves. Meaning we have Romero, Tapsoba or VDV, Tosin, and a high quality up and coming defender.

But you're comparing apples with oranges when it comes to a Conte system of little rotation to Ange whereby he will actively utilise his squad around the hour mark due to the demands he puts on his players to press.

Top teams have succession planning on all facets, looking progressively at situations arising and not merely waiting and subsequently being not only in a negotiation position of weakness, but then having to integrate players right from the get-go as opposed to bedding them in getting accustomed to the system.

 

[fishhhandaricecake]

They are in the champions league mate. You arguably need two first elevens to compete in that and the prem effectively. And you have high level matches to offer around and keep the squad happy and harmonious.

Yes but we’re not saying go and sign Bastoni and Graviadol for £70-80mil each it’s just VDV and Tabsoba for say combined £70mil to address our by far weakest area.

So it wouldn’t be 4 quality CB’s just 3 and a young homegrown back-up or one of the deadwood we can’t shift.

Also the season before last we finished above Arsenal let’s not let them get further ahead ey.

 

[fishhhandaricecake]

No short term thinking. Just considering squad harmony and the fact as many years that I’ve heard the argument that we need X amount of quality cover for certain positions, ‘just in case’, it never works out that way. Players get frustrated (see Richarlison last season) as a manager under pressure to win every match will likely play a settled 11 most weeks, especially in the centre of defence.

VDV isn’t gonna accept leaving a team where he is a guaranteed starter for a decent bundesliga side, to come and be a bench option for us, potentially stunting his development. He could stay where he is, develop further and get a move to an elite club next summer instead.

Yes we need a quality cover in the long term but Tosin has by all accounts been throughly scouted to potentially provide a back up option this season and we can upgrade further next summer when Dier leaves. Meaning we have Romero, Tapsoba or VDV, Tosin, and a high quality up and coming defender.

I do see where you’re coming from with this but in your scenario we’d miss out on a very promising young defender who likely won’t be available next summer so why not just get them in now, there is no way Romero would play anywhere near 38 games and VDV can cover LB too, it’s a no brainer to get both you’re overthinking it for sure.

 

[Hercules]

No movement for now

 

[RickyVilla]

No movement for now

Prunes ftw

 

[jimmy-jojo]

No short term thinking. Just considering squad harmony and the fact as many years that I’ve heard the argument that we need X amount of quality cover for certain positions, ‘just in case’, it never works out that way. Players get frustrated (see Richarlison last season) as a manager under pressure to win every match will likely play a settled 11 most weeks, especially in the centre of defence.

VDV isn’t gonna accept leaving a team where he is a guaranteed starter for a decent bundesliga side, to come and be a bench option for us, potentially stunting his development. He could stay where he is, develop further and get a move to an elite club next summer instead.

Yes we need a quality cover in the long term but Tosin has by all accounts been throughly scouted to potentially provide a back up option this season and we can upgrade further next summer when Dier leaves. Meaning we have Romero, Tapsoba or VDV, Tosin, and a high quality up and coming defender.

Real long term thinking would be to buy him now and then loan him back, if game time is a worry.

Everyone’s a winner!

 

[King of the Lane]

No movement for now

im hoping this means we may have a breakthrough with Tapsoba

 

[Led Revolver]

No movement for now

Perhaps this means we’ve made a breakthrough regarding Tapsoba…

 

[Led Revolver]

im hoping this means we may have a breakthrough with Tapsoba

Great minds mate!

 

[DenverSpur]

Looooool

I agree. But then when do you rotate players? because every prem match is just as important as any cup match. Playing your ‘strongest 11’ even for early round cup matches just leads to rustiness and disillusionment among the squad players which ultimately causes problems with squad harmony. A manager wants everyone to feel included and pulling in the same direction, if players aren’t being given chances, even in early cup matches that’s just gonna cause him problems.

I agree. My solution is that you continually rotate the squad. The same 11 shouldn’t be starting every game. Ideally you make 2 or 3 changes every game. That way, as best as possible, you spread the game fairly evenly among at 16-18 of the squad. That way everyone is fresh and everyone is match fit/sharp when you call them up. It’s what Pep does at ManC and is one of the reasons they have a strong run-in at the end of the season. Now you can argue that they have the money to assemble a squad of top level players but still everyone we sign should be good enough to start every game if need be. If not we are wasting money buying them.

 

[DiVaio]

Wholeheartedly agree.

Some short term thinking by some with tunnel vision to this sole campaign and not the bigger picture in which we seek a swift return to European football and to nurture talent which we think long term will propel us to being competitive for silverware again.

Tapsoba looks a prime candidate that if we don't pull the trigger this summer he will be out of our reach (financially and quite possibly coveted by bigger fish) much like Gvardiol and with van de Ven as a rotation option and able understudy, it would provide solid foundations for years to come.

This is the summer to not do things by halves and to retain the core of that defence erring on the side of fiscal caution will once again be our downfall.

Or long term thinking is that we aren't in Europe so will have less games, less rotations and we will be fine with Romero/Vdv or Tapsoba/Tosin/Dier. Ange doesn't rotate centerbacks and I don't see how VdV fits that inverted LB role, so reality is that he won't have a lot of game time to develop.
Next season has good chances of a big mess in terms of our homegrown numbers in Europe - not buying both now but only one and next season replace Dier with someone better(and monitoring what happens with Guehi, Colwill or another good HG) is exactly long term thinking I would say

With less games not disrupted by mid break at Spurs, different playstyle, full pre season, less international games before or during season I don't think argument with Romero being injured makes a lot of sense tbh. And he was suspended for only one league game in his Spurs career.

I'm not sure what makes him prime candidate for it apart that we are now linked with him. Tapsoba is good/really good, but he definitely isn't Gvardiol level of potential that he won't be possible next season. He's been at Bundesliga for 3,5 years and clubs aren't crazy about him. Next season there will also be a lot of good cb options.

 

[the yid]

No movement for now

Uh oh

 

[ukdy]

Uh oh

Potentially no movement.... because another target is coming in first?

 

[martinm2k1]

im hoping this means we may have a breakthrough with Tapsoba

I presume this means we’ve got to the point where we’ve agreed all terms but as Tapsoba is our top target we’re trying to negotiate that first before we pull the trigger on VDV. If Tapsoba can’t be done before we go off on tour VDV will be quickly pushed through

 

[CantSmileWithoutYou]

Potentially no movement.... because another target is coming in first?

Absolutely!!!




Lenglet.

 

[matthew.absurdum]

No movement for now

I think VDV is a really fast player, so he could catch up later (I will get my coat)

 

[archiewasking]

Royal could also be a pretty good option at centre back. In that scenario, we'd only need one of the two.

 

[VoteMe4Prez]

Royal could also be a pretty good option at centre back. In that scenario, we'd only need one of the two.

I was going to raise this point but glad you did. He has been pretty good in that position but I guess he will be at RB

 

[fishhhandaricecake]

Royal could also be a pretty good option at centre back. In that scenario, we'd only need one of the two.

Don’t think Royal would be good as a CB in a back 4 mate. Back 3 as a RCB is very different. In the tucked in, inverted RB role for Ange however he’ll be class.

 

[Timberwolf]

Not saying I think the Royal thing is a great idea, but this time last year most would've laughed at the idea of playing Shaw as a CB and he covered really well there for United.

That said, I absolutely don't think we should be planning to use him there. Him and Davies could be last-resort CB options if we have a massive injury crisis but nothing more than that.