Match Threads Spurs Vs Brighton

[Bobby TwoShots]

I was polite, if a bit tart. No personal insults, as always. But I do get sharp-tongued when I encounter the assertion "I have a right to my opinion". There are times in life when being condescending is just an accurate response to the circumstances. But I confess that I get a bit ratty whenever that statement appears. There are reasons why:

"I have a right to my opinion" is a phrase that is so self-evident that it doesn't need saying - no one is ever trying to deny someone a right to their opinion. They are usually just explaining why the person's opinion is not correct. So why do people say it?

The reason it appears so frequently in these hallowed pages is that many people use it as a proxy for something very different. What they are really implying is this: "my opinion is just as good as everyone else's opinion'". That's false. Opinions are not created equal. Some opinions are factual and some are wrong.

Back in the day, before the internet fucked up everyone's brain, an "opinion" was something like "my favourite colour is blue" or "I don't like avocados". An opinion was an expression of personal preference. Not an attempt to assert personal facts. We don't get to have personal facts. Even on the internet.

[/politerant]

He said the player looked slow. To be fair, most players new to the PL look “slow” at first since the game is played at a much quicker pace than other leagues. I think he was wrong and that it’s unfair to judge someone on 20 mins. But it was a valid opinion/observation, even though it didn’t align with yours. It sounds like you have far deeper issues with people having opinions, so I’ll leave it there.

 

[fecka]

I fairness to southlondonyiddo said it cannot be denied that a supporter who goes to ALL the games is more invested in the team. Depending where the game is it can mean giving up a whole day just to watch 90 minutes of football. It can mean taking days of work( or giving up work if self employed) to get to mid week away games. It’s a huge investment in time and money. Also because you spend so much time with other supporters who also go to all the games the bond and camaraderie between those fans, and the team, is a huge emotional investment. The players recognize and appreciate the regular away supporters.
It also cannot be denied that supporters who watch the team live game after game have a better insight into how the team is playing both in individual games or over extended periods of time than someone watching on TV or who go to the odd game.
That’s not to say the non ”hard core” supporters are not entitled to opinions or that those opinions are any less valid but they are different perspectives.

I say all this as someone who from 1989 through to 2002 probably only missed half a dozen games live including pre season friendlies(previous to that I’d lived abroad for 15 years). Now I live 1000’s of miles away from Spur’s and am an armchair fan. Here in the States I can(and do) watch everyone of our games but believe me no matter how much it can take over my life at times it is NOTHING at all like the same emotional involvement I felt back there in the 90’s going up and down those motorways week after week. How I miss those days.

To a certain point, I see the point you're both trying to make. I just feel it's a very narrow-minded one.

I live in the northern parts of Sweden, born and raised. I've been a Spurs supporter for the last twelve years, which is the better part of my life. I wasn't born into Spurs or had a mate who got me into Spurs. I chose Spurs, and Spurs chose me.
When I lived in Australia I stayed up to 3 or 4 AM every week on shitty streams despite working in the mornings just to be able to watch games.
If I'm going to a Spurs game, it's an absolute minimum of 3 days of travel from Umeå where I live to watch the game. A one-way trip easily takes about 10-15 hours, sometimes more, and will easily put me back at least £600-1000 for a home game and about £600-1500 for an away game in the UK. That's without including any potential merch in the shop, or other souvenirs.
As you might understand, it's not viable for me to visit the UK every week to be there in person. Still, at this time I've gone to more away games than home games and I try to watch Spurs in person least two times a year.

Does that make me less invested?
Does that make me a lesser supporter?
Or would I have to quit my job, move to London, and leave family and friends behind to be given the same value as those born there?

Calling someone an armchair fan and saying their opinions are worth less because they can't attend games every week feels very derogatory, and I honestly thought Spurs fans were better than this.

 

[Aphex]

There’s no difference between being an armchair fan or going to the stadium. For many they are totally interchangeable roles that people alternate between all the time.

I’ve been both, you don’t understand the game any better being at the stadium really. You see a bit more of the positioning and runs of players off camera but it doesn’t make that much difference in the grand scheme of things and is highly unlikely to change your opinion of a player or a teams performance.

There are plenty of morons that go to the football unfortunately, Spurs fans included. I’ve heard some disgusting / ridiculous things from fans at WHL, and I certainly wouldn’t trust their opinion on anything about football. It definitely doesn’t make them better fans just because they spent money on a ticket.

If it is slightly more emotionally investing it is just due to the travel there and back. When you lose it’s a horrible slog home but I wouldn’t say there is any more invested emotionally in the game itself. In fact, I get more nervous watching at home than I do in the stadium.

 

[fingersinc]

To I certain point I see the point you're both trying to make. I just feel it's a very narrow-minded one.
I live in the northern parts of Sweden, born and raised. I've been a Spurs supporter for the last twelve years, which is the better part of my life. I wasn't born into Spurs or had a mate who got me into Spurs. I chose Spurs, and Spurs chose me.
When I lived in Australia I stayed up to 3 or 4 AM every week on shitty streams despite working in the mornings just to be able to watch games.
If I'm going to a Spurs game, it's an absolute minimum of 3 days of travel from Umeå where I live to watch the game. A one-way trip easily takes about 10-15 hours, sometimes more, and will easily put me back at least £600-1000 for a home game and about £600-1500 for an away game in the UK. That's without including any potential merch in the shop, or other souvenirs.
As you might understand, it's not viable for me to visit the UK every week to be there in person. Still, at this time I've gone to more away games than home games and I try to go at least two times a year.

Does that make me less invested?
Does that make me a lesser supporter?
Or would I have to quit my job, move to London, and leave family and friends behind to be given the same value as those born there?

Calling someone an armchair fan and saying their opinions are worth less because they can't attend games every week feels very derogatory, and I honestly thought Spurs fans were better than this.

This is exactly the point. I’ve only missed two games this season. Newcastle away and the game in Slovenia or wherever it was. But after reading your post I’d say you’re way more emotionally invested than I am. I don’t consider myself emotionally invested. I just see it as an addiction. The rare games that I do miss I don’t even watch them on television. Just can’t watch it on television. That seems like a waste of time. But I’ll happily go to Burnley next week and get back at 5am. I still get amazed when I meet fans from abroad at games. Massive respect to to everyone of our fans abroad and especially those that are able to come over for games.

 

[gazzeh]

My post was poorly worded

Those that go week in, week out are more emotionally, financially, socially invested in the club. That makes a big difference imo

Of course all & any supporters are entitled to an opinion

Seems I really offended all the armchair supporters for which I humbly apologise. Now settle back in your sofas, pop your slippers on, stick the heating up and settle down to more footy on the box while some poor sods freeze their bollox off trying to create an atmosphere for you

Absolute douchy comment.

 

[mark87]

That’s probably the most dickish apology I’ve ever read here

Agreed, and I've read some tripe.

 

[Trix]

You probably haven’t been to more away grounds or spent more money than me. I was definitely more emotionally invested when I was a ST holder

I gave up my ST last summer after going every season since 1975

Good, from what I've just read the place will be all the better for it.

 

[Push & Run]

Hi Guys, hope you are all well, if not somewhat bruised. Just to say I was sat in my armchair sipping a beer and eating a bacon sarnie watching the game and I got very emotionally involved, even shouting at the missus, 'why the fuck are we giving the ball away so easily, so called quality players unable to do the basics of control and pass.' This rant got louder as the game progressed and turned to that old cherry. 'What the fuck is the point of giving the ball to a team mate who has absolutely no options, and to make matters worse standing watching as the poor sod tries to hoof his way out of trouble.'
Sorry maybe my emotions got the better of me and I was blinded by frustration but I had to vent my feelings by kicking the cat (its a stuffed one) and then got a bollocking from she who must be obeyed for being childish. It is much easier watching at the stadium.
Happy days with slow progress being made.

 

[southlondonyiddo]

Good, from what I've just read the place will be all the better for it.

You’re probably right. Legacy fans are a bit of a pain these days

Customers are easier to deal with

 

[Timberwolf]

"I'm a bigger fan than you" is "My dad is bigger than your dad" level debate.

Grow the fuck up.

 

[FloridaSpur]

I was thinking. I hadn't followed the thread up until I posted. So if it was something mentioned over and over again I apologize.

It's just my initial opinion, he looked heavy legged, slow and not very agile. Am I not permitted to express an opinion? I didn't think it was inflammatory? Since I got a lot of hate, can I assume everyone else thought he was Aaron Lennon reincarnated?

Kulusevski had thirty minutes of football, with a new club, in a new Country playing in a different league (Cup game or not).

For any fan make an assessment of a player given those facts beggars belief. But do go on making a fool of yourself.

 

[Wearegoingtowintheleague]

You’re probably right. Legacy fans are a bit of a pain these days

Customers are easier to deal with

Lots of fans who go home and away to every game are knowledgeable, have a decent insight and always good to a pint or two with. Always appreciate their informed views.

But there are also those who go to home and away games who think their opinion is all that matters and ensure everyone hears what they think, sadly they can be so unpleasant that they ruin it for those around them.

I'm sure you belong in the top group, but it's just a shame that for whatever reason you're acting like the latter.

 

[Dillspur]

Kulusevski had thirty minutes of football, with a new club, in a new Country playing in a different league (Cup game or not).

For any fan make an assessment of a player given those facts beggars belief. But do go on making a fool of yourself.

Settle down. All I said, was he LOOKED heavy and slow, much like Kane has looked the last 18 months before Conte. You're trying to turn an off hand comment into something it wasn't meant to be.

 

[ralphs bald spot]

I will say one thing the crowd at the ground tends to be a lot less critical than the persons watching from afar - which is probably a little bit unfair as you only see a loud minority but generally I would say its true -

I will also say that there are a few people that I know or have met that go all over the place and I would say that they have a very limited football knowledge - and instead there views are bordering fanatical stupidity they won't have word spoken about the club and have ridiculous views imo

 

[topper]

There’s no difference between being an armchair fan or going to the stadium. For many they are totally interchangeable roles that people alternate between all the time.

I’ve been both, you don’t understand the game any better being at the stadium really. You see a bit more of the positioning and runs of players off camera but it doesn’t make that much difference in the grand scheme of things and is highly unlikely to change your opinion of a player or a teams performance.

There are plenty of morons that go to the football unfortunately, Spurs fans included. I’ve heard some disgusting / ridiculous things from fans at WHL, and I certainly wouldn’t trust their opinion on anything about football. It definitely doesn’t make them better fans just because they spent money on a ticket.

If it is slightly more emotionally investing it is just due to the travel there and back. When you lose it’s a horrible slog home but I wouldn’t say there is any more invested emotionally in the game itself. In fact, I get more nervous watching at home than I do in the stadium.

Oh yes there is - in my case about £1200 each year!!

 

[chrissivad]

Oh yes there is - in my case about £1200 each year!!

That would get you a decent sofa

 

[Aphex]

Oh yes there is - in my case about £1200 each year!!

Haha. Mine used to be 1600 quid a season.

 

[southlondonyiddo]

Oh yes there is - in my case about £1200 each year!!

and the rest!! Travel, bovril, sausage roll, dry roasted peanuts, programme….

 

[IfiHadTheWings]

I was wondering why this thread was still going strong...lovely little omnibus that.

I must admit @southlondonyiddo faux apology did tickle me.

COYS

 

[dudu]

You’re probably right. Legacy fans are a bit of a pain these days

Customers are easier to deal with

I used to sit by plenty of fans who went week in week out, every game home, away and honestly most just complained are shouted abuse at our own players and chatted so much shit about what was happening on the pitch I would be pressed to say they understood football in general, let alone had some incredible savant type insight from going to watch every game live.

You are completely generalising and I think you know it.