The Race for 4th

[slartibartfast]

I would rather actually win something than 4th, not that we ever will under Levy.

All day long mate. I remember clearly Keane and King lifting the league cup. Not sure I can reel off what seasons we got top 4.
Top 4 is a trophy! What a load of horseshit.

 

[Saoirse]

When the new sponsorship/broadcast cycle begins 2024-25 season.

Yep, so 5th next season will probably get UCL. It does depend on the English teams collectively being in the Top 2 performing nations in European competition next season, but they usually are. Which does also mean that our chances improve if our rivals do well in Europe

 

[Cochise]

I think 4th was a massive thing when the financial benefits could lift us above our rivals. Feels like now fourth place is required just so we can keep pace.

 

[HodisGawd]

I think 4th was a massive thing when the financial benefits could lift us above our rivals. Feels like now fourth place is required just so we can keep pace.

4th absolutely is essential. It's the first thing we need to achieve every season. It's not a trophy, no, no one is saying that, but a trophy without 4th is just short-term fun but a step back in the long term.

5th and a league/FA cup is a failure of a season because it hurts our chances of getting more trophies after that.

4th is treading water.

What we want is 4th or above and a trophy. That is a good season and what we should be aiming for in the short term so we can build for bigger, better things.

That is surely what the club is aiming for, and what we should.

Have it all, not just the crappy League Cup.

 

[Bluto Blutarsky]

4th absolutely is essential. It's the first thing we need to achieve every season. It's not a trophy, no, no one is saying that, but a trophy without 4th is just short-term fun but a step back in the long term.

5th and a league/FA cup is a failure of a season because it hurts our chances of getting more trophies after that.

4th is treading water.

What we want is 4th or above and a trophy. That is a good season and what we should be aiming for in the short term so we can build for bigger, better things.

That is surely what the club is aiming for, and what we should.

Have it all, not just the crappy League Cup.

I'll be honest - normally, I am very much in the "we need top-4 more than we need a trophy" crowd, given the financial rewards of Champions League.

But, I do wish we had prioritized FA Cup this season, even if it meant finishing 5th (or lower). There is something to be said to building a winning mentality by winning a Cup, and then being able to use a "lighter" European competition next season to better rotate players, and bed in younger players - while being competitive in the league. See what Arsenal are doing this year, and what I expect Chelsea and Liverpool to do next year.

 

[HodisGawd]

I'll be honest - normally, I am very much in the "we need top-4 more than we need a trophy" crowd, given the financial rewards of Champions League.

But, I do wish we had prioritized FA Cup this season, even if it meant finishing 5th (or lower). There is something to be said to building a winning mentality by winning a Cup, and then being able to use a "lighter" European competition next season to better rotate players, and bed in younger players - while being competitive in the league. See what Arsenal are doing this year, and what I expect Chelsea and Liverpool to do next year.

I don't get your logic at all there. "Prioritising" the FA Cup just means you end up with neither. Teams that finish 4th and above do so because they are better than teams that 5th and below, which means they are more likely to win a cup. Just look at which teams have been winning the cups over the last 5 years. They are mostly the teams in the top 4. Building a winning mentality includes winning league matches in the season you are trying to win a cup. I can't see how "building a winning mentality" can mean accepting a poor result in the league. What we should be doing is going for both, but 4th is the first step to a successful season. It's the new avoiding relegation.

 

[mil1lion]

I'll be honest - normally, I am very much in the "we need top-4 more than we need a trophy" crowd, given the financial rewards of Champions League.

But, I do wish we had prioritized FA Cup this season, even if it meant finishing 5th (or lower). There is something to be said to building a winning mentality by winning a Cup, and then being able to use a "lighter" European competition next season to better rotate players, and bed in younger players - while being competitive in the league. See what Arsenal are doing this year, and what I expect Chelsea and Liverpool to do next year.

Utd too. All the CL teams this season have underperformed.

 

[Bluto Blutarsky]

"Prioritising" the FA Cup just means you end up with neither.

It does not "mean" anything.

Nothing is a given. Had we sent out our best XI against Sheffield we were not guaranteed a win, nor would beating Sheffield have guaranteed that we would even make it to the FA Cup Final. But, the mentality of going with our best is important - it tells the players, and the supporters, what is important here.

And, it's equally true that crashing out of FA Cup and CL does not mean we will finish in the top-4.

What is done, is done. I just wish we had approached it differently.

 

[alfie103]

4th absolutely is essential. It's the first thing we need to achieve every season. It's not a trophy, no, no one is saying that, but a trophy without 4th is just short-term fun but a step back in the long term.

5th and a league/FA cup is a failure of a season because it hurts our chances of getting more trophies after that.

4th is treading water.

What we want is 4th or above and a trophy. That is a good season and what we should be aiming for in the short term so we can build for bigger, better things.

That is surely what the club is aiming for, and what we should.

Have it all, not just the crappy League Cup.

Why is finishing in the top 4 essential?

 

[chas vs dave]

Why is finishing in the top 4 essential?

80m - 100m a season.

It in thoery, puts us way ahead financially of arsenal and Chelsea.

It may well swing the advantage, depending on if ffp works.

Sadly, I probably know the answer to ffp

 

[ajspurs]

Had no idea Southampton play today as well. Every little bit helps I guess but we still need to show a certain level of intensity and intent to our play or I fear it won't really matter.

 

[Bluto Blutarsky]

Why is finishing in the top 4 essential?

Financial. The value of CL is immense.

 

[alfie103]

Financial. The value of CL is immense.

But if the extra money we gain by qualifying for the champions league isn't enough to compete with the biggest teams to win the PL or CL, in my opinion we might as well as put the focus on winning the domestic trophies and winning the Europa League and Europa Conference League.

For me, there is far too much focus on the business side.

 

[rabbikeane]

But if the extra money we gain by qualifying for the champions league isn't enough to compete with the biggest teams to win the PL or CL, in my opinion we might as well as put the focus on winning the domestic trophies and winning the Europa League and Europa Conference League.

For me, there is far too much focus on the business side.

Then we drop in quality. Likely average around 10th in the table. As soon as we hit jackpot with a player he will move on to one of the top clubs after a couple of seasons. From time to time having to fight off relegation again.
Most of the fan base will be upset when they see the reality of going that direction.

 

[Cochise]

I guess one argument regarding Cups vs Top 4 is to look at Leicester. I know there are other factors at play, but if they had UCL money then would they be in a relegation battle, looking at losing their best players for next to nothing/free?

 

[fishhhandaricecake]

Best we can hope for now is get top four and City win the league which would mean for all the scums noise , their best season in years won't be any better than ours.

I'm confident too. It won't be pretty at all but we can grind results out with only one game a week.

This would be a perfectly acceptable end to what so far has been a horrible season

Seems like 4th place hot potato like a few seasons back, no one wants it.

Our next 3 games are all very winnable, if we win them and newc / liv drop a few points we could start to pull away which would be nice

 

[HodisGawd]

Why is finishing in the top 4 essential?

Obviously, the money which allows us to build and maintain a successful team.

But, perhaps more importantly, also the allowance that revenue buys you with FFP. Without UCL, we could have the richest and most generous owner in the world, but we wouldn't necessarily be able to spend it. 4th is a must if you want to consistently with silverware going forward.

 

[Dov67]

The goons haven’t been in the champions league for years but they have managed to build a squad that is likely to win the league this year.

Even when sitting comfortably at the top of the league in January they were still willing to go out and buy Mudryk for circa £70m to push them over he line before Chelsea stepped in. Would we have done that? Would ENIC have sanctioned that kind of spending in January or would they more likely have thought, top4 is is in the bag why risk spending money on a player(s) who could flop.

So yes, the money from the CL is huge, but additional revenue for additional revenue sake doesn’t excite me to anything like the level i would have been with winning even a lousy carabao cup.

It now seems like the only reason we prioritise the Top4 is to give us a better chance of again making the top 4 In the following season.

 

[Dillspur]

Why is finishing in the top 4 essential?

So we can attract and afford the very best players.....

 

[g_harry]

I think 4th was a massive thing when the financial benefits could lift us above our rivals. Feels like now fourth place is required just so we can keep pace.

Particularly when Liverpool are depending on UCL money to spend.