Zokora

[xtrac]

Glad to see him back, cant wait to see JR and GP work there magic on this guy, and to find out wether they see him as a DM or AM player, its clear he has pace, and likes to get forward, be interesting to see what plans they have, and were they see his best position. Whatever that may be, im really looking forward to seeing the player who we had high hopes for when we bought him, produce on a consistent level under JR and GP. Its clear he was playing well in defence before going of to the ACN.

 

[yanno]

Glad to see him back, cant wait to see JR and GP work there magic on this guy, and to find out wether they see him as a DM or AM player.

CB or bust - for me.

 

[Capocrimini]

^ Elaborate, surely his speed and stamina are better suited to a midfield position. His reading of the game and lack of height wouldnt be suited to CB, and considering we now have, Daws, Woodgate, King, Kaboul and Gardner would he even get a game there?

 

[yanno]

I elaborated in this thread:
http://www.spurscommunity.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=27074&page=7

Here's the core of it, comparing Tainio, O'Hara and Zokora as potential partners for JJ in CM:

It would be great if Ramos could turn Zokora into a top quality DM. But I have my doubts and examining the key skills of Tainio, O'Hara and Zokora, here's why:

i) passing ability - both Tainio and O'Hara are far superior short, quick passers of the ball to Zokora;

ii) reading of the game - both Tainio & O'Hara read the game much better than Zokora in a CM/DM position. After Ramos switched him, Zokora played very well as a spare or main CB, but it's easier to read the game and step out to break up play when you're playing in the back four. Tainio's display against Fabregas in the 2nd semi final was a masterclass in reading the game as a disciplined C/DM. I've never seen Zokora show anything like this ability when he's played in CM;

iii) speed and athleticism. Here Zokora is absolutely the winner. But as outstanding C/DMs like Carrick and Makelele have proven, speed of foot is far less important than speed of thought in the position. If you can read the game, you can be in the correct position to nick the ball or close down the opposition. Whereas I think Zokora's speed is far more useful when he plays in defence: it means we can play a high line, because he's not going to get beaten by the ball over the top, and it's the reason why he was so effective stepping up to break up play.

So, in short, the reason I believe Tainio and O'Hara are better bets for the C/DM position alongside JJ is because they're better short passers of the ball and superior readers of the game. And whilst I hold Juande in very high regard, I don't think passing and reading of the game can be coached on the training ground in a few weeks.

 

[Bowser]

^ Elaborate, surely his speed and stamina are better suited to a midfield position. His reading of the game and lack of height wouldnt be suited to CB, and considering we now have, Daws, Woodgate, King, Kaboul and Gardner would he even get a game there?

Gardner on loan to Everton for the rest of the season, King not likely to play too many consecutive matches, Kaboul not consistent enough at the moment - I think Zokora at CB is a really useful option as we have more options at CM. To me Zokora is more suited to CB so than the Hudd who I think offers more in midfield

 

[rulocal]

Good Topic.

I too am curious and excited to see what influence the "staff" can have on Zokora. I feel many of the players in the squad have come on leaps and bounds over the last month, a period when Zokora has not been around much. For me, he has had his best moments in a SPurs shirt when driving forward with the ball from our half. His final ball has often been lacking but I think Ramos will encourage him to make those driving runs and this will give him more confidence.

Having said that I think he will do well to displace the imcumbents.

 

[hodspurs]

holding player for me.think he could do avery good job in there with jj.

 

[tottenham4life]

I think zoko is a box to box player like jj, so i cant see the both of them starting to be honest

 

[yanno]

I think zoko is a box to box player like jj, so i cant see the both of them starting to be honest

Zoko makes the occasional eye-catching forward run - usually with the ball, whereas JJ will make box-to-box off the ball runs. The problem with Zoko's forward adventures is that he has no clue what to do when he ends up in the opposition penalty area, so he either gives the ball away or falls over. Also, Zoko probably has the worst shot of any player I've ever seen at Spurs...

All of which rules him out as a box-to-box player for me.

 

[nidge]

holding player for me.think he could do avery good job in there with jj.

Sorry but, there have been a lot of times when the two have played together and it just hasn't worked.

I think zoko is a box to box player like jj, so i cant see the both of them starting to be honest

If this is the case (not that I agree with it) then Jenas wins hands down for me. Last year he covered the ground in the prem, had more tackles, goals, and assists than Zokora. So if what you say is correct then Jenas has to start ahead of Zokora.

 

[C0YS]

I think Zoko wont start but in the CC cup final he will be on the bench in case we go 3-5-2 which is what formation Zokora plays well in. and he will be used among the 3 CB in that situation!!

 

[sloth]

All I'm going to say is let's wait and see what Ramos does, lol. But I want the usual culprits eating full helpings of humble pie, none of this "Awww, who could have seen the improvement..." half-humble damp pasty bollocks.

 

[nidge]

All I'm going to say is let's wait and see what Ramos does, lol. But I want the usual culprits eating full helpings of humble pie, none of this "Awww, who could have seen the improvement..." half-humble damp pasty bollocks.

The same could be said of some of the comments you have made about Zokora in the past. I will need to dig them out just in case humble pie is needed for you :wink:

 

[sloth]

The same could be said of some of the comments you have made about Zokora in the past. I will need to dig them out just in case humble pie is needed for you :wink:

It's a deal :wink:

 

[SpurSince57]

Good Topic.

I too am curious and excited to see what influence the "staff" can have on Zokora. I feel many of the players in the squad have come on leaps and bounds over the last month, a period when Zokora has not been around much. For me, he has had his best moments in a SPurs shirt when driving forward with the ball from our half. His final ball has often been lacking but I think Ramos will encourage him to make those driving runs and this will give him more confidence.

Having said that I think he will do well to displace the imcumbents.

I'd say very much the opposite, on the evidence so far. He's done best in a 4-5-1 (league win against Chelsea last season) or as back peg in a diamond (cup against Chelsea at the Bridge), or in an out-and-out defensive role. Too right his final ball has been lacking; and the frustrating thing is that he has, on occasion, delivered a really good one. Either I was hallucinating, or he put in a first-class cross from the left in one of the IC's recent ANC games. People keep raving on about his runs forward, but whilst they certainly catch the eye, they more often than not come to very little. Frequently the best you can say is that they relieve pressure.

I'm not ruling anything out with Ramos, nor anything in, and neither should anyone else, but it strikes me that as a CM Zoko would be most effective in a 4-5-1, and Juande is no more likely to play a 4-5-1 as a starting formation than Martin was. I think, now that the side is settling down again and certain conclusions have been drawn, it will need a lot of thought and a degree of experimentation to figure out how his strengths can contribute to the team.

But why this conviction that he can't play CB because of his height, or lack of? He's 6' 0", according to the club website and every other stat site. There seems to be a widespread notion that he's a midget.

 

[southlondonyiddo]

As Yanno and SS57 say he certainly is no box to box central midfield player.

He's a stroller and in midfield cannot read the game. As for those eye catching runs, generally they look all lovely and fluffy on MOTD highlights but in reality sometimes that's all he'll do and they achieve nothing.

His best performances for us were recently at the back and looks a different player. Reads the game very well when everything is infront of him and when playing at CB actually gets up high to win headers very well.

For me he's very average in midfield but looks like he could be quality further back.

 

[guy]

He cant shoot or pass. I like the guy, he clearly loves spurs and is a great athlete but he cant be more than a squad player from now on. Unless he can really work on his passing he's behind Hudd and Tainio in CM for me (alongside jenas).

I like him much more at CB than MF, and would prefer him over daws. Rocha I thought was decent too but he hasnt got a look in?

 

[hughy]

^ Elaborate, surely his speed and stamina are better suited to a midfield position. His reading of the game and lack of height wouldnt be suited to CB, and considering we now have, Daws, Woodgate, King, Kaboul and Gardner would he even get a game there?

I think this season's injury problems have answered that question for you.

 

[Teemu]

Slighty (entirely) off topic but I just noticed you liked Enter Shikari. They're great. Good man.

 

[General Levy]

Good squad player, but like some have already emphasised, his passing, shooting, and lack of a left foot means that IMO we have better alternatives to play in CM using a 4-4-2 formation. He would do well alongside Huddlestone/Taino with JJ playing a 4-5-1 with Berbs upfront, but the likelihood of Keane being dropped to accommodate the midfield is extremely unlikely.