Taarabt to be sold!

SpurSince57 said:

Before anyone dismisses Tomspurs' info out of hand, I suggest you check his posting record. His first post here said we'd be signing Taarabt. This appeared several hours ahead of the news in l'Equipe. I'm not sure when the ITKs on COYS and FTL posted their info.

One certain fact is that Taarabt hasn't figured for us in any role since a ressies game on 3rd September, in which his performance left BOF, Eddie and SpursOdyssey's match reporter seriously unimpressed. He may have been involved in a youth tournament in France, but I've yet to hear of a youth tournament lasting two-and-a-half months. Draw your own conclusions.

I wouldn't assert that Taarabt would not fit into a Ramos side, but from what I've seen of Sevilla JR's checklist for players that float his boat probably doesn't include boxes for fannying about and wanting your own personal ball. I don't imagine that Jol's did, either.

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alves :shrug:

I think adel when he gets older might offer alot more than he does now. Everytime I see him he is more interested in pleasing the camera's and the crowd with silly tricks and flicks. Other aspects of his game are nowhere near as good as other midfielders in our squad which will ultimately keep him out of the first team. Lets face it I would rather have a player who gets stuck in, plays good intelligent simple football and provide for our strikers whilst also getting back and helping out the defence. Adel doesnt do any of the above for me and if he wants to go we shouldn't stop him. At 17,18 You cant demand to be involved in the first team if your not up to scratch. KPB hasn't whinged about not getting his chance but now it's come under ramos I think he will turn into a quality player. Adel should take a leaf out of his book and get his head down and work hard.

sell our best prospect. good move.

dynamoSpurs said:

sell our best prospect. good move.

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On what, exactly, are you basing this opinion?

dynamoSpurs said:

sell our best prospect. good move.

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we are selling bale? mg:

SpurSince57 said:

On what, exactly, are you basing this opinion?

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being 18 and being one of the most skillfull players in the squad

SpurSince57 said:

On what, exactly, are you basing this opinion?

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the fact that he helped us beat Ham away on his debut. Maybe people forget tat, bt I never weill. I was there and never felt so happy in all my Spurs days.

but hey, he's also avery good footballer - but we won't know unless he's played... And we certainly won't know if he's sold..

but ou're right, he could actually be pretty useless... Just I always had a keen eye on him and thought he looked a good player to be.

Well, he did, insofar as he won us a free kick. Berba put it away, though, brilliantly.

No doubt that he's very gifted, I don't think anyone disputes that. The problem is, is he going to put those gifts at the team's service? Taarabt or Bale? Which is the Ramos player?

fucking spurs fans!!

Criticizing a player like Taarabt now is so ridiculous.

The issue here is that Taarbt is undoubtedly a young talent and the best young talent only matures under proper coaching - he is may not be ready for first team football yet but is certainly a prospect - much as I hate to admit it Winger (who wanted to sign him) is a good judge of talent. The question is can we bring that talent through to fruition? Our track record is not great in that department under our management so far (excluding JR or course, not been there long enough)

I think with the right coaching he could be a mini ronaldo - note with the right training.

The fact that he's disappeared for over ten weeks says a good deal, VOR. Less his being criticised, far more his being decreed Spurs' Great White Hope on very little evidence.

sloth said:

I don't agree with much there I'm afraid, although its well thought out. Unfortunately the central premise feels shaky and without that the rest comes tumbling down.

I think all sides are more adaptable than you make out.

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Well give some examples. What is this thought based on? Surely if it was that simple as a team adapting then someone would have done something about the way the English national side play, as during every International tournament it is pointed out how much more comfortable the continental and South American sides are on the ball. If the best players this country has to offer struggle to play the intricate, quick passing game we see the likes of Spain and Argentina playing, then what makes you think a coach can come along and do so at Spurs?

It seems that football history is littered with cases of good coaches going to new clubs and failing. Why do you think this is? They can't have just become bad coaches. Why did such a good coach as Wenger fail at Nancy? What happened at Monaco? He didn't go from being a Championship winning coach to an idiot in the space of a few seasons. The reason he gave was that they bought the wrong players. What happend to Hector Cuper. Took Valencia to 2 CL final twice in a row, but at inter and Mallorca he couldn't make the same impact. And most significantly what about Caparos. Took Sevilla from division 2, to 6th in La Liga, but when he got a "bigger" opportunity with Depor, things didn't work out.

The point is, good coaches can and very often do, fail to succeed with good groups of players. The key reason for this, is that it isn't just about having good players, but the right players, the players that suite the way a particular coach wants to play. Therefore the most important part of the Coach and Director of Football relationship surely has to be a shared appreciation of the same kind of players. Now when I look at the player we have in our squad and compare them to those in the Sevilla squad i see two very different groups. Hence, given the 3 years of team building we've undergone since 2004 and the fact we have been 5th twice, i see him as an odd appointment. I think for Ramos to succeed he has to be given the opportuinty to bring in a number of new players, which is against the whole point of our structure.

Traabt has quick feet but isn't strong enough on the ball to take on players.

He is no Nani, no C.Ronaldo. Gotta pump more iron and do more squats.

ultimateloner said:

Traabt has quick feet but isn't strong enough on the ball to take on players.

He is no Nani, no C.Ronaldo. Gotta pump more iron and do more squats.

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I have no idea how you can make that statement.

ultimateloner said:

Traabt has quick feet but isn't strong enough on the ball to take on players.

He is no Nani, no C.Ronaldo. Gotta pump more iron and do more squats.

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So that his quads get even bigger?! Eek

I love Adol Traaabata. He is probably Spurs best player. Adlo Trabatar has all the tricks. I love it when Tabbatra does a run with the ball then shoots 30 yards wide. I also love it when Abdul Tarrarrababbabatata goes like he's going to pass it but beats 3 players before running into another one and giving possession away. Abede Torro-Battyboy reminds me of Paul Gasscoyne. I love A Dull Taaaaabrt so much I'm going to get his name, Adolf Treebeard, on the back of my jersey.

Joey: Thought-provoking as ever... though how confident can we be, that the Seville (forgive the crude description) 'quick-wings, strong centre' style is the JR way? ie. Did he shape the players/squad to his chosen style, or (as any good coach should be able to) shape the style to the players available? Players like Alves, Navarro, Renato, Adriano etc (afaik) were already there.

Or has he shaped all his teams this way?

Or are we being naive to JR's abilities as a coach?

:bs:

thejames said:

Joey: Thought-provoking as ever... though how confident can we be, that the Seville (forgive the crude description) 'quick-wings, strong centre' style is the JR way? ie. Did he shape the players/squad to his chosen style, or (as any good coach should be able to) shape the style to the players available? Players like Alves, Navarro, Renato, Adriano etc (afaik) were already there.

Or has he shaped all his teams this way?

Or are we being naive to JR's abilities as a coach?

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I don't think team shape is the issue. 'Quick-wings, strong centre' can be made up from players from any continent in the world. I'm talking about the inheretn differences in how Latin style players play football compared to those British or African players. I think there is a bit of naivety about coaching abilites in general. I don't see a great many examples (at the top of the table) of when coaches come in and are able to use their coaching abilites alone to get the results they need. It has to be a combination of good coaching and players that compliment that coaching. The examples of success we've seen in the Prem in recent years such as Wenger, Mourinho and Ferguson all came with big personel changes. Wenger won the title in his first full season, but he inherited arguably the best back 5 in the country. But of the other 6 players, 4 were those he brought in (Overmars, Vieira, Petite and Anelka). Mourinho won the title, but he too had 6 big players that weren't there the previous season (Drogba, Robben, Tiago, Ferrer, Cech and Carvalho). Even with all the money Chelsea had, Mourinho still wanted to bring in 3 of his own countrymen and he'd tried to buy Drogba when he was at Porto. Ferguson must have bought in 20 players before he got it right. Benitez has brought in 31 players and they really don't seem any closer to winning the Prem than we he took over. All 4 of these guys had won league titles before and yet it's unlikley any of them could have had success from coaching or adapting their squads to how they want to play. That had to bring in their own players and not 1 or 2. For Ramos to have success (in our case finish top 4), I think he'll have to make changes in the same way those other coaches did, only I think he's going to have to make even more changes than them.

Don't panic. Ramos clearly feels that Spurs have been too casual in their approach play. Last night every pass was made noticeably quicker. Quick passing and the ability to actually go past someone rate highly with Ramos as evidenced by the way Seville play. Someone with the footwork os Tabaart will get a run at Spurs. Ramos just owes it to the more senior players to show what they can and can't do. The way Kaboul was 're-focused' recently is an indication of the way he operates. What were you all like at 17 / 18 when told to wait. Tabaart will be ok at Spurs because by Xmas will be clearing some of the deadwood and he will get his chance.