A theory as to why Pochettino was hired...

[mpickard2087]

Don't you think the difference in stats has a lot to do with the team pattern of play in which each played their games ? Soldado played in AVB's mega defensive, slow build up which meant he was snatching at half chances most of the time. Adebayor played under Sherwood's gung-ho style of almost all out attack.

He snatched at chances no matter who was manager, lets be honest.

I admire the faith people have in him but I'm not convinced I'm afraid. One of the main arguments is that we need to get in behind the defence and put in better balls for him, though I count near enough 10 occasions in the season where a ball went across goal for a golden chance and he shinned it horribly over the bar usually. Confidence may be a factor, but every part of his game looks average in my opinion.

 

[mpickard2087]

Oh and I think Kane and Adebayor are ahead of him in the queue if Pochettino sticks to the same system we have seen at Southampton.

 

[SpurSince57]

Don't you think the difference in stats has a lot to do with the team pattern of play in which each played their games ? Soldado played in AVB's mega defensive, slow build up which meant he was snatching at half chances most of the time. Adebayor played under Sherwood's gung-ho style of almost all out attack.

Not really. That analysis I posted pretty much dispels the notion that there was a huge difference in the quality and quantity of service he got at Spurs and Valencia. And in any case, aren't expensive strikers supposed to put away those half-chances run-of-the-mill ones can't?

 

[am_yisrael_chai]

He snatched at chances no matter who was manager, lets be honest.

I admire the faith people have in him but I'm not convinced I'm afraid. One of the main arguments is that we need to get in behind the defence and put in better balls for him, though I count near enough 10 occasions in the season where a ball went across goal for a golden chance and he shinned it horribly over the bar usually. Confidence may be a factor, but every part of his game looks average in my opinion.

He hasn't been great at Spurs but I watched enough of him at Valencia to know he definitely isn't an average player. I'm not saying he will work out in England but he is a quality player the only real glimpse we got of that was Villa away.

 

[SpurSince57]

He hasn't been great at Spurs but I watched enough of him at Valencia to know he definitely isn't an average player. I'm not saying he will work out in England but he is a quality player the only real glimpse we got of that was Villa away.

A highly euphemistic assessment, and his Valencia form is irrelevant if he can't reproduce it at Spurs. Sheva was a far better quality player, and there have been quite a few others who for one reason or another and sometimes no obvious reason at all couldn't adapt to the EPL. I really can't think of anyone brought in as a main man who failed and then went on to retrieve his reputation—tottering into double figures as Stupor Pav did in his second season really doesn't cut it.

Frankly, if Pochettino can't get the best out of Ade I'd really question his man-management skills.

 

[LukeBB]

Not really. That analysis I posted pretty much dispels the notion that there was a huge difference in the quality and quantity of service he got at Spurs and Valencia. And in any case, aren't expensive strikers supposed to put away those half-chances run-of-the-mill ones can't?

Regarding the expense, no one apart from Valencia believed Soldado was worth £26 million, however due to us coming into a lot of money which we could burn and because he was a regular 20+ goal a season striker, Levy could hardly be bothered to negotiate and prolong the deal any longer. He isn't putting away chances this season because he's snatching at them, he's nervous due to the expectation and he's adjusting to a new country when his wife just suffered a miscarriage when their family is desperate for a 3rd child (another one is on the way happily) as much as you play football with your feet, you play with your head and your heart and for one reason or another, his head and heart haven't been there, hell, look at what Arsenal have done to Ozil, even great players can have off seasons. Had Soldado had a little extra luck and been more relaxed he would've finished this season with at least 16 or so goals IMO which to me shows he's ready for a better season next year under Poch.

 

[Norwegian Spurs fan]

And these would be?

Ade did not come back after African nation after his sudden decision to play for Togo after first saying he would not take part in the tournament. To make matters worse he was our only fit striker at the time. When he finally arrived on the 8 of February it was less than 24 hours before our match against Newcastle. Togo was knocked out on the 3 of February. He didn't prepare himself good enough during pre season before he finally signed on the dotted line for Spurs. Last season he was out of the team after falling out with AVB. his intensity drops when he is in the early months of a long contract, or when he would rather be elsewhere. That sums up the man for me- too much unprofessional behavior of the biggest earner at Spurs.

 

[LukeBB]

A highly euphemistic assessment, and his Valencia form is irrelevant if he can't reproduce it at Spurs. Sheva was a far better quality player, and there have been quite a few others who for one reason or another and sometimes no obvious reason at all couldn't adapt to the EPL. I really can't think of anyone brought in as a main man who failed and then went on to retrieve his reputation—tottering into double figures as Stupor Pav did in his second season really doesn't cut it.

Frankly, if Pochettino can't get the best out of Ade I'd really question his man-management skills.

As Ade has grown older and more confident, especially after Angola, he's become very difficult to manage unless he's had a Harry or Tim in charge, someone who only expects him to be Ade and not play to a certain style or system. TBH I expect Ade to go, he's a lot of money for too much inconsistency and I would be extremely surprised if Poch could be arsed to "manage" him, IMO at 30, he should be mature and get on and not have to be "managed" but he's a problem child when he wants to be and I'd rather take the money and run on Ade. If Poch has faith in him I'd be extremely surprised and nervous at the same time.

 

[LukeBB]

AVB is always respectful to his players and he always tries to get along with them, he gives them time off whenever they suffer personal tragedy and he treated Ade no differently and Ade threw it back in his face with poor performances and a lack of respect at a time when every Neil Ashton had something against AVB. Iirc, there was a lot of ITK last August, when we were trying to sell Ade, that he wasn't very liked within the Spurs camp and he was very disrespectful and a lot of players didn't get on with him, he could've changed a little since then but Ade is too much of a loose cannon for the money we throw at him. What kind of player digs his heels in at a club, who've already been paying him 200k a week and when he's got a new club sorted, just so they will pay him the rest of his contract?

Usually I'm more patient with players but at 30, I've got little sympathy or patience for him anymore, especially after last season.

 

[LukeBB]

Oh, and here's another, much shorter theory as to why Pochettino wasn't hired. Van Gaal was no longer available.

Aren't you clever

I think most of us figured that out when Levy flew to his house mid-season and he rejected us.

 

[SpurSince57]

Aren't you clever

I think most of us figured that out when Levy flew to his house mid-season and he rejected us.

Comparatively.

 

[LukeBB]

Comparatively.

Banter.

 

[SpurSince57]

AVB is always respectful to his players and he always tries to get along with them, he gives them time off whenever they suffer personal tragedy and he treated Ade no differently and Ade threw it back in his face with poor performances and a lack of respect at a time when every Neil Ashton had something against AVB. Iirc, there was a lot of ITK last August, when we were trying to sell Ade, that he wasn't very liked within the Spurs camp and he was very disrespectful and a lot of players didn't get on with him, he could've changed a little since then but Ade is too much of a loose cannon for the money we throw at him. What kind of player digs his heels in at a club, who've already been paying him 200k a week and when he's got a new club sorted, just so they will pay him the rest of his contract?

Usually I'm more patient with players but at 30, I've got little sympathy or patience for him anymore, especially after last season.

Speculative bullshit, for which there isn't a shred of actual evidence; in particular, that sentence I've emboldened makes very little sense, grammatically or otherwise.

After last season? As far as anyone actually knows, Villas-Boas froze him out because of an incredibly trivial incident in training, or possibly because Ade had the temerity to suggest that the Bearded Wonder's ideas wouldn't work—in which case he was dead right. If Villas-Boas was too stubborn, too stupid or too insecure to try and build bridges, he deserved to lose his job. Where do you suppose we'd have ended up without Ade's goals and assists?

Suggesting we should give a flop like Soldado preference is not merely perverse, it borders on a mental health issue.

 

[Reprobate]

AVB is always respectful to his players and he always tries to get along with them, he gives them time off whenever they suffer personal tragedy and he treated Ade no differently and Ade threw it back in his face with poor performances and a lack of respect at a time when every Neil Ashton had something against AVB. Iirc, there was a lot of ITK last August, when we were trying to sell Ade, that he wasn't very liked within the Spurs camp and he was very disrespectful and a lot of players didn't get on with him, he could've changed a little since then but Ade is too much of a loose cannon for the money we throw at him. What kind of player digs his heels in at a club, who've already been paying him 200k a week and when he's got a new club sorted, just so they will pay him the rest of his contract?

Usually I'm more patient with players but at 30, I've got little sympathy or patience for him anymore, especially after last season.

AVB has been pretty unlucky, if his fall outs with players are never any fault of his!

 

[LukeBB]

Speculative bullshit, for which there isn't a shred of actual evidence; in particular, that sentence I've emboldened makes very little sense, grammatically or otherwise.

After last season? As far as anyone actually knows, Villas-Boas froze him out because of an incredibly trivial incident in training, or possibly because Ade had the temerity to suggest that the Bearded Wonder's ideas wouldn't work—in which case he was dead right. If Villas-Boas was too stubborn, too stupid or too insecure to try and build bridges, he deserved to lose his job. Where do you suppose we'd have ended up without Ade's goals and assists?

Suggesting we should give a flop like Soldado preference is not merely perverse, it borders on a mental health issue.

f*k gramur

I will not call Soldado a flop 'till his stint with Spurs is over, basing him on one season under questionable conditions is just as bad as judging someone on 3 WC games. I prefer to give someone who is desperate for success a chance rather than someone who's never been liked no matter where he goes. I was grateful for Ade's contribution to last season but Sherwood is gone, Poch is nothing like Harry or Tim so I think it's best for both parties if we separate now while he's worth something to the likes of Monaco.

I don't really want to get into this but AVB's ideas did work it's just there was too much resistance towards them with too little time.

Edit: do you mind if we drop this? Cause I can go forever and I just cba

 

[fecka]

The reason why I love Poch and this appointment is because of the similarities to the way Heynckes had his Bayern Munich side play when they thrashed everyone in the CL a year ago, compared to the patient build up-style á la Barcelona that FdB has Ajax playing.

I'm not saying it's as good as last year Bayerns of course but the direct, pacy, aggressive but still patient possession-style of football Poch had Southampton playing last season is so incredibly beautiful that I just can't help being extremely excited for next season.

 

[ItsBoris]

Because out of the two I see Ade being sold this year and considering Poch can also speak Spanish I reckon he'll fancy Soldado considering he'll more likely suit his system because he'll stick to the width of the box whereas Ade tends to drift wide and sometimes go missing from games.

This system will also likely allow Soladado to produce better numbers due to the high tempo style which he was more suited to at Valencia.

If he can regain his confidence. That's the problem I have with the AVB/FDB approach at a club like our's. I know you said you prefer this style of football but it requires players that have been raised in that style imo. Making it work at Ajax or Barca where you have an academy producing players for this style is fine, but buying players like Lamela and Soldado and expecting them to adapt to it, especially in a new, more physical league, is madness imo.

Soldado's confidence as a goalscorer was shot within a few months. I agree that Poch's system will work better for him but he'll also need to rebuild himself psychologically.

 

[ItsBoris]

A highly euphemistic assessment, and his Valencia form is irrelevant if he can't reproduce it at Spurs. Sheva was a far better quality player, and there have been quite a few others who for one reason or another and sometimes no obvious reason at all couldn't adapt to the EPL. I really can't think of anyone brought in as a main man who failed and then went on to retrieve his reputation—tottering into double figures as Stupor Pav did in his second season really doesn't cut it.

Frankly, if Pochettino can't get the best out of Ade I'd really question his man-management skills.

On the other hand, I can think of many players who improved significantly with either a new coach in place or a season in the league under their belt, and Soldado has both. So there is reason to suspect that he might be much better next season.

 

[SpurSince57]

On the other hand, I can think of many players who improved significantly with either a new coach in place or a season in the league under their belt, and Soldado has both. So there is reason to suspect that he might be much better next season.

In both Soldado threads I asked for examples of strikers brought in as the main man (not as youngsters like RvP or Ade at Arsenal) who have under-achieved spectacularly and gone on completely to retrieve their reputation. No-one was able to supply a name. It's easier to think of one-season wonders.

I don't say it's impossible that Soldado will improve (he could hardly get much worse, could he?). History says it's unlikely, though. What I do say is that it is absolutely barking to suggest he should start ahead of Ade.

 

[JUSTINSIGNAL]

So to all those that used the argument that Vertonghen would want to leave if we appointed Poch because he wasn't De Boer and not a big enough name...

http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2014...ttino-phoned-me-personally-im-very-impressed/