Aston Villa

[nailsy]

O'Neill has to should a lot of the blame for me. Their wages bill was astronomical by the time he left. They got by by selling a star each year but ran out of players with any value.

Surely that's the owners fault though? The manager will just spend the money that they are given. And to be fair to him he did lead them to three consequence sixth place finishes in the league and the league cup final.

Looking at his spending here it looks like he spent a fortone, but some of those players like Young, Downing, Milner and Delph were sold for huge sums after he left the club.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...Neill-spent-120million-years-Aston-Villa.html

 

[talkshowhost86]

Whilst Villa had their problems long before Timmy arrived, it was their recruitment policy last Summer under Sherwood that seems to have really done for them.

Now to give Tim the benefit of the doubt I suspect he wasn't the only one involved in those transfer decisions, but whoever was is to blame for their current terrible predicament. They were bad under Houllier and Lambert...but not this bad.

 

[SteveH]

Randy Lerner and his 'advisors' was/is the problem, he is yet another american owner without clue about the EPL and european football. They have chosen poor managers and poor players.
Other than Stan Kroenke who does not get involved with the football side AND they sadly have a very strong/knowledgeable manager, US owners are troublesome to these clubs, up next Everton and they must be mad. Man U and Liverpool are still all over the place and it's not helped by the owners not knowing 'the game'.

 

[double0]

What a shambles a great club like Villa have descended too. The recruitment department all need to be sacked... They thought they were being clever buying all foreign hoping to find the next Benteke, a bad gamble that hasn't paid off, not only will they get relegated I can see them doing a Leeds.

 

[dontcallme]

Surely that's the owners fault though? The manager will just spend the money that they are given. And to be fair to him he did lead them to three consequence sixth place finishes in the league and the league cup final.

Looking at his spending here it looks like he spent a fortone, but some of those players like Young, Downing, Milner and Delph were sold for huge sums after he left the club.

The owners certainly have to take a lot of responsibility.

But if a manager is given a lot of money then they are also responsible for spending it wisely.

If you look at O'Neills signings he was very wasteful.

Sutton, Harewood, Zat Knight, Reo-Coker, Curtis Davies and Steve Sidwell all ate up a fair amount of wages and in Reo-Coker's case cost £8.5m and eventually left for free.

Any money made from his good signings was eaten up by his bad ones.

 

[eddiebailey]

Whilst Villa had their problems long before Timmy arrived, it was their recruitment policy last Summer under Sherwood that seems to have really done for them.

Now to give Tim the benefit of the doubt I suspect he wasn't the only one involved in those transfer decisions, but whoever was is to blame for their current terrible predicament. They were bad under Houllier and Lambert...but not this bad.

The signings were surprising at the time because they did not fit with Tim's self-proclaimed MO. Other hands were presumably at work. But that does not absolve Tim. I suspect he was so desperate for the chance to make a go of it at a big club like Villa that he bottled fighting his corner, which given how large he gives it is a bit shameful. But then I also suspect that he was so arrogant that he thought he could succeed regardless of the players he was given.

Then struggling to impose a coherent style of play on bunch of odds and sods, rather than stick to his guns and painstakingly build a solid platform, he panicked and reverted to his old failing of being too clever by half, treating each game as tactical chess, sometimes successfully but too often catastrophically.

If he learns his lessons, and I suspect he will, he will come back stronger for the experience. As for Villa their decline began long before his tenure, and will continue until Lerner finds a buyer.

 

[SlickMongoose]

If he learns his lessons, and I suspect he will, he will come back stronger for the experience.

If there's one thing I doubt Sherwood is capable of it's "learning". He's anti-intellectualism personified.

 

[eddiebailey]

If there's one thing I doubt Sherwood is capable of it's "learning". He's anti-intellectualism personified.

I agree that Sherwood is not an intellectual, but one definition of an intellectual is someone who learns other than by experience. In that respect at least I would categorise AVB as an intellectual: one locked into his own analytical thought processes and therefore incapable of benefiting from his mistakes. I suspect Tim might be more savvy than that. But time will tell.

 

[Spursidol]

Staggeringly badly run club, certainly since Lerner took over.

The Wages to turnover ratio to illustrate it :

2011 - 91%
2013 - 86%

Only in 2014 did the ratio get to 56%, still high, but at least vaguely sensible as getting to a break even scenario.

Cumulative losses under Lerner is £222m to end of 2014 (almost a quarter of a billion) - and that's AFTER profits on player sales. Since then Villa have pretty much run out of decent players to sell.....
http://swissramble.blogspot.co.uk/2015/03/aston-villa-lost-in-supermarket.html

Just corporate suicide.

Awful player buying over many years and after selling the better ones, they've lost a fortune, and the remaining squad was poor before Sherwood arrived and needed a number of new faces, The 2015 TW was poor - and probably seen even at that stage as the last throw of the dice.

Going to be a tough time to rebuild and get out of Championship - think its going to take 3 or 4 seasons if they have enough youngsters they can promote out of their youth system to complement/supplement players brought in, as IMO most of the current squad will leave (almost certainly too used to high wages, and I wouldn't bet on their contracts having wage reduction clauses for playing in Championship).

 

[Insomnia]

Staggeringly badly run club, certainly since Lerner took over.

The Wages to turnover ratio to illustrate it :

2011 - 91%
2013 - 86%

Only in 2014 did the ratio get to 56%, still high, but at least vaguely sensible as getting to a break even scenario.

Cumulative losses under Lerner is £222m to end of 2014 (almost a quarter of a billion) - and that's AFTER profits on player sales. Since then Villa have pretty much run out of decent players to sell.....
http://swissramble.blogspot.co.uk/2015/03/aston-villa-lost-in-supermarket.html

Just corporate suicide.

Awful player buying over many years and after selling the better ones, they've lost a fortune, and the remaining squad was poor before Sherwood arrived and needed a number of new faces, The 2015 TW was poor - and probably seen even at that stage as the last throw of the dice.

Going to be a tough time to rebuild and get out of Championship - think its going to take 3 or 4 seasons if they have enough youngsters they can promote out of their youth system to complement/supplement players brought in, as IMO most of the current squad will leave (almost certainly too used to high wages, and I wouldn't bet on their contracts having wage reduction clauses for playing in Championship).

Or those who are on big fat wages stay until their contracts end regardless of wether they are part of the managers plans or not, there's been many examples of those types in the past

 

[Spursidol]

Or those who are on big fat wages stay until their contracts end regardless of wether they are part of the managers plans or not, there's been many examples of those types in the past

Agreed, and with the number of managers in and out of Villa recently there will be quite a few who will not be in the current manager's plans, whoever the current manager is at the time !

 

[talkshowhost86]

Agreed, and with the number of managers in and out of Villa recently there will be quite a few who will not be in the current manager's plans, whoever the current manager is at the time !

I imagine there's quite a few that the manager at the time doesn't even know is at the club.

I can just imagine Remi Garde walking around and finding someone huddling by a bin and saying "Hey who ze 'ell are vous?"

And the reply will come:

"It's me boss. Libor Kozak. You know me?"

Followed by a bemused Garde turning and saying to the kit-boy, "Never heard of him", not realising that the kit-boy is actually Jores Okore.

 

[Drink!Drink!]

The signings were surprising at the time because they did not fit with Tim's self-proclaimed MO. Other hands were presumably at work. But that does not absolve Tim. I suspect he was so desperate for the chance to make a go of it at a big club like Villa that he bottled fighting his corner, which given how large he gives it is a bit shameful. But then I also suspect that he was so arrogant that he thought he could succeed regardless of the players he was given.

Then struggling to impose a coherent style of play on bunch of odds and sods, rather than stick to his guns and painstakingly build a solid platform, he panicked and reverted to his old failing of being too clever by half, treating each game as tactical chess, sometimes successfully but too often catastrophically.

If he learns his lessons, and I suspect he will, he will come back stronger for the experience. As for Villa their decline began long before his tenure, and will continue until Lerner finds a buyer.

You are in danger of labouring under the illusion that anything Sherwood says is related to an actual insight into football management or a principled belief. Even by criticising him you are giving him too much credit

he attacked foreigners when he was causing trouble at our club because this was a proxy attack on foreign managers i.e. AVB, whereas "proper" football men (translation bantertastic English blokes who wipe their arses with coaching manuals) were being left on the slag heap of life.

When he got the Villa gig none of this mattered any more, all forgotten. Watch a few youtube videos...yeah, he will do....

Sherwood doesn't believe in youth, he only bigged that up cos that was all he had on his cv, he doesn't believe in not buying foreign players either, that was just a way of attacking AVB and getting Harry's media mates to put pressure on Levy to give the job to a "proper" football man.

How anyone can think he is anything other than egotistical chancer is beyond me

 

[eddiebailey]

You are in danger of labouring under the illusion that anything Sherwood says is related to an actual insight into football management or a principled belief. Even by criticising him you are giving him too much credit

he attacked foreigners when he was causing trouble at our club because this was a proxy attack on foreign managers i.e. AVB, whereas "proper" football men (translation bantertastic English blokes who wipe their arses with coaching manuals) were being left on the slag heap of life.

When he got the Villa gig none of this mattered any more, all forgotten. Watch a few youtube videos...yeah, he will do....

Sherwood doesn't believe in youth, he only bigged that up cos that was all he had on his cv, he doesn't believe in not buying foreign players either, that was just a way of attacking AVB and getting Harry's media mates to put pressure on Levy to give the job to a "proper" football man.

How anyone can think he is anything other than egotistical chancer is beyond me

Of course he is egotistical. He is a football manager. What has that got to do with anything?

 

[Spursidol]

You are in danger of labouring under the illusion that anything Sherwood says is related to an actual insight into football management or a principled belief. Even by criticising him you are giving him too much credit

he attacked foreigners when he was causing trouble at our club because this was a proxy attack on foreign managers i.e. AVB, whereas "proper" football men (translation bantertastic English blokes who wipe their arses with coaching manuals) were being left on the slag heap of life.

When he got the Villa gig none of this mattered any more, all forgotten. Watch a few youtube videos...yeah, he will do....

Sherwood doesn't believe in youth, he only bigged that up cos that was all he had on his cv, he doesn't believe in not buying foreign players either, that was just a way of attacking AVB and getting Harry's media mates to put pressure on Levy to give the job to a "proper" football man.

How anyone can think he is anything other than egotistical chancer is beyond me

Not of course mostly the same foreign players who Poch sidelined and were sold last TW - Capoue, Kaboul, Paulhino, Soldado et al ?

Think you are allowing your view of Sherwood to read too much into some of his comments.

Don't understand Villa's buying of players over quite a few years - the post I made above shows that financially the players on average cost a fortune - and delivered very little on the pitch as we've seen.

Think that Lerner has been incredibly naïve - he seems to have ploughed in a lot of money, but been let down by a succession of managers from O'Neill onwards

 

[yankspurs]

Randy Lerner and his 'advisors' was/is the problem, he is yet another american owner without clue about the EPL and european football. They have chosen poor managers and poor players.
Other than Stan Kroenke who does not get involved with the football side AND they sadly have a very strong/knowledgeable manager, US owners are troublesome to these clubs, up next Everton and they must be mad. Man U and Liverpool are still all over the place and it's not helped by the owners not knowing 'the game'.

Not only is this comment off base, it is also a bit xenophobic, dont ya think?

On the American owners you listed, trust me when I say you are wayyyy off base when you say they are failing because they have no clue about the PL and European football. Why? Because that would imply they are actually good owners of their American teams. The fact is, they arent. At all. The Bucs(Glazer's team) are a shitshow. The Red Sox(FSG's team), outside of a few great years under a great GM, have largely been a shitshow, especially recently. Lerner owned the Browns until 2012, and that franchise was a complete and utter shitshow under him as well(to be fair though, it still is). With Moores? Good luck, Everton. The Padres were largely a shit show under him. Kroenke's teams have been very meh.

Wrt the investment coming into Palace and Bournemouth...LOL @ Palace. Taking investment from the owner of the most incompetent franchise in the NBA(the 76ers), which is a very hard feat to accomplish considering James Dolan(the Knicks owner) is one of the most incompetent and meddlesome owners in sports history, and the most incompetent franchise in the NHL, does not seem like the brightest of ideas Steve Parish has ever had

Bournemouth's new investors are completely new to the sports scene I believe. I know nothing about them.

Also, some English owners have been remarkably shit also. So nationality doesnt really have much to do with it.

 

[Monkey boy]

Not only is this comment off base, it is also a bit xenophobic, dont ya think?

On the American owners you listed, trust me when I say you are wayyyy off base when you say they are failing because they have no clue about the PL and European football. Why? Because that would imply they are actually good owners of their American teams. The fact is, they arent. At all. The Bucs(Glazer's team) are a shitshow. The Red Sox(FSG's team), outside of a few great years under a great GM, have largely been a shitshow, especially recently. Lerner owned the Browns until 2012, and that franchise was a complete and utter shitshow under him as well(to be fair though, it still is). With Moores? Good luck, Everton. The Padres were largely a shit show under him. Kroenke's teams have been very meh.

Wrt the investment coming into Palace and Bournemouth...LOL @ Palace. Taking investment from the owner of the most incompetent franchise in the NBA(the 76ers), which is a very hard feat to accomplish considering James Dolan(the Knicks owner) is one of the most incompetent and meddlesome owners in sports history, and the most incompetent franchise in the NHL, does not seem like the brightest of ideas Steve Parish has ever had

Bournemouth's new investors are completely new to the sports scene I believe. I know nothing about them.

Also, some English owners have been remarkably shit also. So nationality doesnt really have much to do with it.

Hate Everton with a passion so that's good to know!

 

[slartibartfast]

My bro sent me this.

Kind of backs up what I said after watching their last performance, if I was the Manager I'd drop the lot of the lazy overpaid pricks and play the youth. At least show some fight if your gonna get thumped.
Wankers lol.

 

[Marty]

This was sent to my work e-mail today. Villa fans planning a walkout against Lerner on 74 minutes. Let's see how many are in on it.

Didn't know that Villa v Everton is the most played fixture in English football...

Aston Villa v Everton – The End of an Era?

138 years ago, in 1888, following their first ever victory over Everton, little did the Aston Villa players know, as they walked off the pitch that the fixture would become the most played ever in the history of English Football. Sadly we now may soon be witnessing the end of an era and the record could soon be more.

In the last 1800s and up until the First World War, Aston Villa was the most famous club in the world. Having since won 7 division one titles, 7 FA Cups, 5 league Cups, The European Super Cup and European Cup.

It was a Villa director, William MacGregor that conceived the idea of forming the English Football League. Together with Everton, Aston Villa were two of the twelve founding members. The first game between the two clubs was 22nd September 1888 with over 5000 fans attending. The match was played only one week after the first ever set of games in the Football League.

On 1st March 2016, Aston Villa will play their 202 game against Everton. However the record may soon be lost forever with Villa facing relegation to the Championship.

Aston Villa fans see their next game v Everton as possibly the end of an era. If relegated and Villa do not return to the Premier League within a few seasons, one of their most cherished records will be lost to the fixture between Everton v Liverpool.

In frustration and anger with what they see as the boards mismanagement of the club over the last five seasons, a protest group is planning a walkout in the 74th minute in honour of the club being founded in 1874. The fans are demanding that the owner Randy Lerner and the club’s director, change direction and tell the supporters how they are going to undo the mess that we have become.

Website: www.OutTheDoorOn74.co.uk

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/OutTheDoorOn74

Twitter: @OTDO74 #OutTheDoorOn74

 

[Spurger King]

You just know that somewhere out there is a lifelong Aston Villa fan who has a passionate hatred for Leicester (maybe a Leicester fan slept with his wife, or bullied him at school), and who is having the worst season of his life.