Huddlestone the new Carrick??

[mikeygold]

Does hudd need to emulate carrick yes they are both great passers of the ball but just because of that they dont have to end up being the same end product. The hudd is a force in midfield we dont always have witout him due to his height and weight and that could make up for his lack of movement, which i feel alot of people havent given him enough credit for how much he has improved this.

 

[walworthyid]

And the fact that Huddlestone has been ever present this season shows that it is more down to him, than anything else. There have been options to play instead of him, but Harry knows he offers something others don't. He, alongside Modric, Palacios and Lennon are our best midfield.

What about the 90% of games where he is average at best?

I just don't get it:shrug:

I see him and think he is poor in almost every single match!

 

[ShelfSide18]

And the fact that Huddlestone has been ever present this season shows that it is more down to him, than anything else. There have been options to play instead of him, but Harry knows he offers something others don't.

Nic, replace the word Huddlestone with Keane and it all seems different. :shrug:

 

[BringBack_leGin]

Huddlestone, like Carrick, possesses a lovely long pass, the ability to (when his head is screwed on) keep possession, and wonderful control of the ball.

That is where the similarities end. Carrick, from a younger age than Huddlestone is, was far better positionally and a far better reader of the game. Huddlestone, however, is far more likely to put his foot in and make a tackle. Carrick is second to none at switching play to the flanks, while Huddlestones passes are far more direct and seem to often be aimed either over the top or at least through the middle.

I'd say Huddlestone is better than Carrick was when he joined us, a year older than Hudd is now, but I have my doubts as to whether Hudd can become as good a player as Carrick was by the time he left us.

 

[ShelfSide18]

Carrick never needed to tackle because he was always in the right place, but Hudd has too because positionally he is nowhere near Carrick. The thing is, Hudd can tackle, but rarely does often sticking a half hearted leg out.

Hudd does have a beautiful pass on him, but I think Carrick used his passes better and knew when to make the killer pass, and when to lay it simple, whether to go wide or a central ball to the strikers.

I still have hopes for him, but I'm unsure whether we can keep fitting him in trying to accomodate his limitations without it affecting the team as a whole.

 

[Dillspur]

great passer and has a wicked shot, that's about it, he does not have the footballing brain to make up for his lack of pace and mobility and as someone said that isn't something you can learn.

 

[ShelfSide18]

great passer and has a wicked shot, that's about it, he does not have the footballing brain to make up for his lack of pace and mobility and as someone said that isn't something you can learn.

Is it a lack of brains, or is it lack of judgement at crucial times?

 

[Dillspur]

Both

Look at Teddy, slow as mud but his footballing brain was always 3 steps ahead sadly the hudd doesn't have this which is why he is ALWAYS found wanting against top teams

 

[ShelfSide18]

Both

Look at Teddy, slow as mud but his footballing brain was always 3 steps ahead sadly the hudd doesn't have this which is why he is ALWAYS found wanting against top teams

Hmmm, Teddy was a master you're right. No pace in his legs but his footballing brain created pace in the game.

I do actually think Hudd has vision but does lack judgement on when to play the killer ball and when to move the ball on quickly with a short pass. Vision is only as good as your judgement to use it well. Judgement is something that can be learnt, and Tommy is young so I hope he does hone this part of his game. I don't think it has helped that he has always been labelled a great passer of the ball in the Hoddle mould - because you tend to believe in your own hype, especially when you're young, and you think every time you get the ball you have to make something happen.

He has also put in good performances against the big teams, Liverpool this season, Man Utd last although these do tend to be the exception not the rule, sadly.

 

[michaelden]

Hudd is getting a lot better. I think its down to mental maturity rather than anything else. He appears a lot more focussed now.

As an aside: Aqualani is looking even more impressive than he did in Serie A. I see him replacing Pirlo in the Azzurri

 

[stevenqoz]

What a great feeling it is to have Huddlestone not only being our only ever-present this season but also our most likely 'outsider' to break into the England squad. He will get time against Brazil and if the media like what he does could be lifted all the way to SA as one of the 'new generation' doing it for Engerland......its a funny old game aint it:clap:

 

[kernowspur]

Nic, replace the word Huddlestone with Keane and it all seems different. :shrug:

:clap::clap:

Nic, despite all the evidence still believes that Hudd is a better bet than JJ in CM. He is in the minority as the results of the poll in another thread show.

 

[SpurSince57]

Where does this quaint notion that Carrick can't/doesn't tackle come from?

 

[BringBack_leGin]

Carrick never needed to tackle because he was always in the right place, but Hudd has too because positionally he is nowhere near Carrick. The thing is, Hudd can tackle, but rarely does often sticking a half hearted leg out.

Where does this quaint notion that Carrick can't/doesn't tackle come from?

That is where the similarities end. Carrick, from a younger age than Huddlestone is, was far better positionally and a far better reader of the game. Huddlestone, however, is far more likely to put his foot in and make a tackle.

Never said Carrick can't tackle, just that Huddlestone is more likely to tackle. I believe the fact that the comment immediately followed a sentence praising Carrick as being far better positionally means that the intended context (in line with both of your views) is more than implied, and that no swipe at the frequency/ quality of Carricks tackles should be inferred.

:grin:

 

[Krafty]

I dont think Huddlestone is quite as consistent as Carrick, but I think he is developing into the type of player I had hoped Carrick would.

Neither player is exceptional as a DM - they need a tough tackling ball chaser next to them to get the most out of them. When Carrick was at Spurs Jenas would often sit right alongside him, and Davids would be tuckin in from the left and we would be very hard to break down. However, at the top teams when you are expected to win the majority of games you cannot afford to have two central midfielders sitting so deep. Carrick has been exposed against strong opposition as a DM, and has yet to show that he can really offer a game winning performanace going forward. In Utd's system he is almost caught adrift in the middle - not a Hargreaves defensively, not a Scholes going forward.

Tommy has shown a lot more going forward, which is what I want to see from him. I dont want him as a DM because he is not mobile enough and is not good enough at reading the game. However he does manage to time his runs forward extremely well - his goal against Everton, for example, is not one you will see Carrick scoring, and his strike against Sunderland was something Carrick had in his locker but didnt use. Of course, Hudd has Wilson behind him which gives confidence to get forward, whereas Carrick's remit was to sit back.

In that respect a comparison is a bit unfair, but I think Huddlestone is developing into a different player that makes better use of his skills than Carrick. In a season or two, if Harry keeps picking him, I think Huddlestone will be ahead of Carrick in the queue to play in Englands midfield because his offensive play will be better than Carrick's defensive play.

His passing is often more effective than I felt Carricks was - he switches the play much quicker, he will play it forward for the strikers, whereas I felt Carrick just helped more the ball. He did this exceptionally well, and there is nothing wrong with it. If Jenas had Carricks Passing then I think he would be a far greater player, but Tommy has better ability. Tommy was utter rubbish against the scum, but Carrick always had a habit of getting caught in possession when pressed successfully.

Carrick had a better platform mentally, whereas Tommy has a slight skill advantage. I dont think Carrick has really progressed that much at Utd, but I think Tommy can if pushed forward a little more.

 

[worcestersauce]

Just on the point of Tom Huddlestone in the England team as I see it all of our senior England team midfielders are the wrong side of 28 except Lennon, Milner & Walcott who are wide players.
Gerrard, Lampard, Carrick, Barry, Wright-Phillips & Joe Cole will be well into their thirties by the next world cup and I'm not sure where the 24 -25 year olds are that will replace them are, nobody springs immediately to mind which does leave the field open for the likes of Tommy in that central area, come to think of it Jenas would also be a candidate.

 

[ShelfSide18]

:clap::clap:

Nic, despite all the evidence still believes that Hudd is a better bet than JJ in CM. He is in the minority as the results of the poll in another thread show.

It wasn't really a dig at Nic if i'm honest mate, but when people have made the same argument, except using Keane rather than Hudd, they have been derided.

 

[ShelfSide18]

Where does this quaint notion that Carrick can't/doesn't tackle come from?

As BBLG said, it's not that Carrick can't or won't tackle, it just his positioning, anticipation and judgement means he is less likely to tackle - simply because he doesn't need to. Tackling is the last resort to defending and Carrick did his defending by intercepting the ball and being in the right position more often than not.

 

[SpurSince57]

True, but he's put in more successful tackles than Essien, Lampard and Ballack (individually, not put together) over the past few seasons. I suspect that the reason he's got this non-tackling reputation is that he tends to win the ball without sending opposition players flying into the air.

Back to Hudd (because Carrick ain't coming back, and I'm not sure labelling a player as the 'new' whoever is any help at all) we need to persist. There are weaknesses in his game which have been gone over ad infinitum, but we seem to forget he's not quite 23 yet. I think we need to give him what's left of this season and next before we start to pass judgement, and take a leaf out of Wenger and Ferguson's book. A lot of people (not least Gooners) were writing off Song a couple of years ago—now he's turning into a very capable DM. A couple of seasons ago, when he was Hudd's age, Fletcher looked a bit of a donkey. You wouldn't say that now.

 

[ethanedwards]

Carrick never needed to tackle because he was always in the right place, but Hudd has too because positionally he is nowhere near Carrick. The thing is, Hudd can tackle, but rarely does often sticking a half hearted leg out.

Hudd does have a beautiful pass on him, but I think Carrick used his passes better and knew when to make the killer pass, and when to lay it simple, whether to go wide or a central ball to the strikers.

I still have hopes for him, but I'm unsure whether we can keep fitting him in trying to accomodate his limitations without it affecting the team as a whole.

Pretty much agree with your post, Carrick's quick passing gave us a great tempo, the Hudd does not possess the agility of body and mind to make us a fast and fluid footballing side.