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Archibald&Crooks

Aegina Expat
Admin
Feb 1, 2005
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To be honest though I think the way some fans talk down others for not having the patience for a project is a bit much sometimes (not directed at you specifically).

The way I see it: everybody first gets a grace period of about a season, maybe longer if it's a previously successful manager
My post was mostly aimed at those (and there are more than a few) for whom the idea of having given enough 'time' was a third to half a season. And i'm sorry, but that deserves what it gets. I did say a season and a half isn't being given time though and I stand by that but that's onions for you.

But thank you for response which was pretty fair.
 
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dontcallme

SC Supporter
Mar 18, 2005
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The playing philosophy of the coach and his ability to work with what he's given and our youth talent is more important than needing to be Premier League experienced IMO.
Under ENIC our 3 best managers have been Jol, Redknapp and Poch. Everytime we've gone for a big name or "next level manager" it has been a failure.

The qualities they all shared:
  • played good football
  • good with the media
  • positive people
  • had Prem experience
  • we were a step up for them
I agree that the playing philosophy is more important than Prem experience. No manager really stands out as having the above qualities right now. If Potter hadn't gone to Chelsea, he'd have been an option. I don't know enough about Thomas Frank to comment on him.
 
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Johnny J

Not the Kiwi you need but the one you deserve
Aug 18, 2012
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I don't want Poch back but there is a lot of truth in what you say.
I think for this reason it's riskier for Levy to bring Poch back. If it goes wrong, the fans won't quickly turn on Poch, they'll go for Levy first.
 

Japhet

Well-Known Member
Aug 30, 2010
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I've just got a nasty feeling that we'll spend ages getting our hopes up for Nagelsmann and Kane staying only for it to all blow up in our faces. It's just how we roll.
 

dontcallme

SC Supporter
Mar 18, 2005
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I keep seeing variations on the idea that the next manager needs to be given time. And quite right too, the trouble is, we don't do that as a club or on here do we. Not really. The idea of being given 'time' is roughly a third to a half a season before the footballing intelligentsia on here start bitching that he's had enough time and we should be doing this or that. We need to change that. Half a season, one season, a season and a half, that's not being given time, a genuine process and philosophy that's also backed up with action by the owners will take longer than that and if it comes sooner, that's great. We need to understand this and it needs to be reflected in how we react when things go sour from time to time.

Whoever the next patsy is will, as usual, divide SC to the point where each match thread and the manager watch thread, will yo-yo with toxicity and support, a constant stream of "see I was right" posts from each side depending on every result and people so entrenched and invested in having been right to begin with that the place will be a festering pit of dissatisfaction, vitriol and spite toward each other, the players and the manager. We need to change that too.

Meh, the disciples of the knee will read this and think fuck you you silly old twat

What a fucking grand waste of time this post has been :woot:
Very good post.

Managers do need time but time alone isn't a defining factor. If time was so important Arsenal should have kept Rioch and not bothered with Wenger.

I wanted Jose but it became pretty clear it wasn't working and more time would have been more detrimental to the club. If Conte was committing to the club then we could justify giving him time but time has to come with commitment.
 

eViL

Oliver Skipp's Dad
May 15, 2004
5,841
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I've just got a nasty feeling that we'll spend ages getting our hopes up for Nagelsmann and Kane staying only for it to all blow up in our faces. It's just how we roll.

It's not like you to be a Negative Nelly..
 

mil1lion

This is the place to be
May 7, 2004
42,707
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You speak a lot of sense. In reality, to sack Conte is a bit bonkers, given the season he has had personally. But I guess, if he has decided he has had enough then there really is no choice.
This season hasn’t been great, but could very well still yield a better finish than Klopp or Arteta’s worst finishes.
I would have been happy to keep Conte and give him another window with a less interrupted season. Unfortunately he self imploded and now there's no way back for him. I think that's more his own doing as I do feel he wants to return to Italy. Its been a crazy 12 months for him. If another manager turned on his players the same way then sacking makes complete sense. When a manager does a good job in a difficult season it's hard to understand why they would be sacked. Especially at this point in the season.
 

dude573

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
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Weren't we fighting tooth and nail to get Nagelsmann after Poch, before he went to Bayern?
 

GMI

G.
Dec 13, 2006
3,126
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By the same token, will you bastard sons of DL's cuckolds show the same compassion and patience and gentle caresses to your bete noire?

When the football and results went unexpectedly badly this season people turned on Levy almost immediately, even though he'd appointed a top manager and had provided significant backing - with the promise of more to come; as Conte repeatedly said, this was a long process requiring many transfer windows.

The hatred towards Levy was a massive contributer to so many people turning againt Conte, because it created an atmosphere of crisis when there shouldn't have been one; and naturally people would start to think that Conte was part of the problem. Given the mad febrile atmosphere an underperforming Conte had no chance.

I'm not saying you have to love Levy, just live your best Levy life.
I need a ‘live your best Levy life’ t-shirt.
 

YB123

YB123
Aug 27, 2006
6,077
21,850
We should explore German market more for players, we were already getting linked to Hincapie,Ndicka and Thuram. Maybe we would focus there more with Nagelsmann in charge. Everyone falls out with Salihamidzic but I'm more concerned about Neuer situation. I would still be happy with him though.

Spoke to a pal in Germany, no pun intended but Neuer hasnt got a leg to stand on.

He went off skiing, had an accident and is out for season. He let the team down.

Out there it appears to be "the absolute cheek of Neuer to be kicking off". But then he was close to the goalkeeping coach and is club captain

It seems Nagelsmann is not being painted in a bad light at all, the negativity is on Neuer and surprise surprise Salihamadzic
 

dontcallme

SC Supporter
Mar 18, 2005
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German journo currently on TS saying JN has pissed off most/all the senior players. He seems high risk high reward
I don't know anything about him so my post is in ignorance of him, but I don't want another big name manager.

I want our next hire to be a step up for the manager who will be positive about the quality of our players.
 

Tucker

Shitehawk
Jul 15, 2013
31,565
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Very good post.

Managers do need time but time alone isn't a defining factor. If time was so important Arsenal should have kept Rioch and not bothered with Wenger.

I wanted Jose but it became pretty clear it wasn't working and more time would have been more detrimental to the club. If Conte was committing to the club then we could justify giving him time but time has to come with commitment.
Him not being such a toxic **** would probably help garner a little patience from the fans too.

It’s clear he doesn’t want to be here and thinks he’s above us. No manager is going to get time when they’ve been acting like he has.
 

YB123

YB123
Aug 27, 2006
6,077
21,850
Weren't we fighting tooth and nail to get Nagelsmann after Poch, before he went to Bayern?

When Poch left it was Mourinho or Nagelsmann.

We then went for him again after Mourinho but Bayern came in last minute and thats his boyhood club. We went for Flick after which was a waste of time as every man and his dog knew he was off to national team.
 

YB123

YB123
Aug 27, 2006
6,077
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German journo currently on TS saying JN has pissed off most/all the senior players. He seems high risk high reward

He got rid of the goalkeeping coach who was a populae figure of over 10 years. That upset Neuer and Muller. Basically a no go.
 

Tucker

Shitehawk
Jul 15, 2013
31,565
147,691
I don't know anything about him so my post is in ignorance of him, but I don't want another big name manager.

I want our next hire to be a step up for the manager who will be positive about the quality of our players.
I don’t think he’s necessarily a big name. He was the next big thing a couple of years ago but it hasn’t worked out at Bayern for him (though it hasn’t for anyone there for a few years.)

I don’t know enough about the guy to know if he’s the right fit.
 

HoltbiusMac

ScroobiusMac
Jun 25, 2013
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I think he was the main idea of summer 2021 before Conte and before Paratici got involved. Then Flick took the Germany job and Bayern came calling.
 
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