Pre Season Non Transfer ITK
- Thread starter nicdic
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- Oct 17, 2006
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If his post was excelent, why nit pick? :shrug:
- May 21, 2004
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- #83
Excellent post, although I disagree!! :razz:
worcestersauce
"I'm no optimist I'm just a prisoner of hope
- Jan 23, 2006
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I think some people have a limited idea of what training is.
There seems to be an idea that it should make the players suffer beacause that's what they deserve, pretty much "stick it up'em"
Ok pre season is about building up fitness but if that was all then our players would be perfectly able to shoot wide tackle badly and misplace passes for hours on end; fat lot of good that would do us.
Training is also about tecnique, tactics and familiarisation I have no doubt that Ramos does this too but maybe Martin Jol just placed more emphasis on these than fitness.
I would assume one of the three sessions would address these.
There seems to be an idea that it should make the players suffer beacause that's what they deserve, pretty much "stick it up'em"
Ok pre season is about building up fitness but if that was all then our players would be perfectly able to shoot wide tackle badly and misplace passes for hours on end; fat lot of good that would do us.
Training is also about tecnique, tactics and familiarisation I have no doubt that Ramos does this too but maybe Martin Jol just placed more emphasis on these than fitness.
I would assume one of the three sessions would address these.
Bobishism
*****istrator
- Aug 23, 2004
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You fool.
Stop getting all gay and defensive for Martin Jol.
As far as I'm concerned, Comolli shouldn't be at the training grounds. He should be scouting for players. Glorified talent scout/coach appointer.
I agree that the diet wasn't all hamburgers and chips. But I didn't go on a PR bash. What would be the point?
Also, I still want to see these examples of spin. You still haven't posted any.
And it's not about pro jol or anti jol. I couldn't give a shit about Jol. Ramos is the superior coach.
Kendall
Well-Known Member
- Feb 8, 2007
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I'm not sure what you're asking for. surely you can just hit 'tottenham, ramos, diet' into google and find a thousand articles on how the players are going to be fitter, were eating shit and now ramos has cracked the whip. Those are the articles both myself and SS57 perceive to be PR leaked from the club, in part.
I'm yet to see any improvement in fitness from Juande's diet and he's been here since October.
I'm yet to see any improvement in fitness from Juande's diet and he's been here since October.
AngerManagement
Well-Known Member
- May 15, 2004
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Its a difficult one to decide upon because to date there certainly is no tangible evidence to display improved fitness.
Plus any examples giving either way could easily be discredited by suggesting various other factors are the cause or atleast supplement the cause any example given i.e. Arsenal 5-1 win, cup final win, Man U peformance/draw.
Press releases and stories that are used as evidence can also be discredited as spin or simply fabrication designed to fill column inches i.e. Ghaly refusing to train with Birmingham, although Bruce also made similar comments in video footage (could argue Bruce was covering a truth that made his club look bad)
So it comes down to what you choose to believe, its perfectly plauseable that either could be true (fitness has been improved/it hasn't)
I dont believe citing the lackluster run in to the season to strengthen ones claims that fitness has not been improved makes a great deal of sense.
Clearly the team had little to play for in the league once uefa cup entry was attained and releagtion had been seen off.
Football at the highest level (like any other top sport) can be desided on very fine margins. So if you have a squad of players who have little to play for no matter how hard you try to motivate them you are not going to get the best out of them, they simply wont be as hungry as players who are playing for something important to them.
I would say personally there has been examples of improved fitness, desire and tactical impact since Ramos arrived. Mostly in the Carling cup but they would be Man City away, the semi final legs against Arsenal and the Chelsea cup final.
Of course it can be argued that other factors effected this (i.e. better players at his disposal), but personally I believe these were displayed of what Ramos has brought to the team.
I think it was noticable that in the PSV game while we had a dissapointing first leg, we were certainly the team pushing the issue more in the latter stages and extra time in the away leg, you could argue this was an example of us pocessing the greater desire and fitness.
Also I would say that it could be argued that Ramos himself was not as motivated for the run in league games (those that had little effect on our season)
He certainly was less creative with his substitutions then he had been before we were safe from relegation and while every game was 'important'.
Remember he was a manager accessing his squad, maybe part of this squad assessment was to see how self motivating they could be and how much effort they would put in in real game scenerios with limted influence from him.
He may have been using the run in to see the weaknesses in the squad, a step back to take two or three forward for the start of next year.
Ultimately there is as a said no tangible evidence either way thus far as to wheter Ramos has improved fitness (desire and whatever else). The proof will be the coming season and what we achieve/how we play when the big kick off arrives.
I really dont understand why conversations still revert back to Jol, he is gone and has a new job, good luck to him but his tenure with us is a thing of the past and now irrelavnt to our future
One thing i will say about the Jol era (and I know I am contridicting myself by talking about it) is that my aunty was the bank manager for many of our squad members during the time he was in charge and as such had alot of interaction with many of the players.
In the week before the West Ham game (our cup final that year) she said they were all very nervous and many of them said as much to her, they were worried about the game.
Her reporting this back to me at the time instilled no confidence in my, I want the players to be looking forward to the game, be hungry for the game, be confident that they were going to go out there and smash West Ham and storm into the CL.
Again other factors effected the game, but personally I would have liked the management team to have groomed a squad of players with a winning mentality to the extent where they were looking forward to big games and thriving under such pressure.
(Although I will add for the sake of devils advocate that the Arsenal game at Highbury was also a big pressure game and that same team produced one of their best performances on that day, so its unfair to suggest they were incapable of doing so and who knows they may have done so again if not for being struck down with illness.)
To conclude, I am an optimst and I am looking forward to next season bringing a wind of change that sees a Spurs side producing top quality performaces and results over the course of the year.
I expect the defence to be less pregnable and the freak and late goals to be brought down to a normal level (whilst maintaining our excellent scoring ratios)
The signings thus far have been encouraging, if this continues we will have the right players at our disposal. Ramos is a proven winner and has even done so for us already, so we will need to trust him to be the best man to lead this squad of 'right players' to achieve what they should do in the coming summer.
I would be very refreshed to see more positivity from Spurs fans in general, all the doom and gloom and moaning that our fans are so widely associated in recent years bugs the life out of me.
I know we have constantly under achieved in...well ever since I have known football, but I am a believer in negative things happen to negative people so I would like the fans and especially crowd to show more belief and support and hope that that translates to the players.
thfcsteff
Well-Known Member
- Jul 30, 2005
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Ridiculous to assume that Comolli is in charge of the canteen FFS...if he interferred with that, he'd be slaughtered! Imagine the furor Jol and co would've raised...he might well have suggested changes but ben shot down.
And yes, these days I think you'll find that Comolli is closer to a glorified chief scout than any single defined role at the club (even though he is technically the DoF)...
When a club playes a manager and his staff millions of pounds a year, the last thing they should be doing is micro-managing the fucking canteen!!!!!!
And yes, these days I think you'll find that Comolli is closer to a glorified chief scout than any single defined role at the club (even though he is technically the DoF)...
When a club playes a manager and his staff millions of pounds a year, the last thing they should be doing is micro-managing the fucking canteen!!!!!!
Lilbaz
Just call me Baz
- Apr 1, 2005
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Still haven't seen my mate but I do know for a fact that when Spurs lost to West Ham (dodgy lasagne) he had called the cheff at the hotel they were staying and had given recomendations of what they could eat and what ingredients to use, this had been agreed with the clubs nuetritionist (spelling sorry I'm a fat bastard I thought a nuetritionist was something to do with small lizardy things) nothing to do with Jol or Ghandi. Who appointed the lizard boy I have no idea.
SpurSince57
Well-Known Member
- Jan 20, 2006
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A post that just about sums up your level.
'As far as I'm concerned, Comolli shouldn't be at the training grounds. He should be scouting for players. Glorified talent scout/coach appointer.'
:stupid: :duh: :rofl:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=ov...s=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a
That should do you for starters.
SpurSince57
Well-Known Member
- Jan 20, 2006
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He's not 'technically' the club's Sporting Director. What a ridiculous statement. He is the Sporting Director, with a very wide-ranging remit. That includes the medical side of things, which will include the players' diet. And whilst, yes, he is not 'in charge of the canteen' if there had been anything seriously unhealthy about the food on offer, he would have insisted something be done about it, yes? Pretty obviously, there wasn't anything too much wrong.
Ramos clearly has extremely strong views about diet and he may well be correct. I'm no nutritionist and neither is anyone else on here (well, there may be one or two). If he feels that will help the players' performance, great. That isn't the point at issue, though; once it had come out that he was micro-managing the canteen, as you put it, we had the press giggling over stories that the team was 100 kilos overweight, that the players were drinking fruit juice (my God!), putting ketchup on their food (the horror!), and tucking into the odd chocolate muffin (scandalous!). This translated for many on here that the players were subsisting on pies, Glasgow salads and lardy cake (and probably deep-fried Mars bars too). It followed, of course, that this was all Jol's fault.
But then, we don't pay the manager and his staff pots of money to micro-manage the canteen, do we?
Bobishism
*****istrator
- Aug 23, 2004
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Nothing was as contrived as that. Any comments made after the sacking were individual opinions of players. That Ramos found the fitness levels unacceptable was his own judgement and not intended as a deliberate criticism on Jol's setup. Most stories though were entirely fictional creations and conspiracy theories.
muffwah
Active Member
- Feb 8, 2007
- 585
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what a ridiculous post. Why the fuck would Comolli be in charge of the player's diets? That would be down to the manager and coaches.
You miss Jol by any chance?
SpurSince57
Well-Known Member
- Jan 20, 2006
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I think I've already explained this. Let me try again.
No, I don't imagine he would be sitting around drawing up menus. I would, however, expect him to take some interest in the matter since diet falls within his remit; as Sporting Director he takes overall responsibility for medical matters, which will include diet. It's in his job description. If the menu on offer pre-Ramos were as grossly unhealthy as has been claimed, I rather think he'd have noticed and suggested some improvement might be in order, don't you?
If you're looking for ridiculous posts, may I suggest this?
'As far as I'm concerned, Comolli shouldn't be at the training grounds. He should be scouting for players. Glorified talent scout/coach appointer.'
SpunkyBackpack
Well-Known Member
- Dec 8, 2005
- 7,831
- 9,372
Right, in a completely foolish and unneeded post im venturing back into Spurs Chat to weigh in on the SS57 bashing
Commolli replaced Arnesen didnt he? We all remember how he came in and as part of his job shook up pretty much everything to do with the backroom, that being the academy, the physio setup and coaching doohickies, its not exactly a massive leap of imagination to beleive that nutrition/diet/cateen layout falls under some part of Commollis control. He may have nothing to do with it but its pretty likely he could/did alter it if he wanted to.
Quite where this most nitpicking of pointless arguing in the world of the slightly irrelevent is coming from i have no idea and barely care.
*edit*
see what you made me do! i type so slowly the only point i had to make was made while i made it!
stupid thread make me waste my time......mumblegrubfunglegrumble....gits....
Commolli replaced Arnesen didnt he? We all remember how he came in and as part of his job shook up pretty much everything to do with the backroom, that being the academy, the physio setup and coaching doohickies, its not exactly a massive leap of imagination to beleive that nutrition/diet/cateen layout falls under some part of Commollis control. He may have nothing to do with it but its pretty likely he could/did alter it if he wanted to.
Quite where this most nitpicking of pointless arguing in the world of the slightly irrelevent is coming from i have no idea and barely care.
*edit*
see what you made me do! i type so slowly the only point i had to make was made while i made it!
stupid thread make me waste my time......mumblegrubfunglegrumble....gits....
Houdini
No better cure for the blues than some good pussy.
- Jul 10, 2006
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- 78,758
So, who decides what should be on the menu?
Has anyone seen a menu from the training ground or elsewhere?
If our squad are anything like the Chelsea squad used to be, then it will be straight down the deli or chip shop after training for a kebab and pasties!
Has anyone seen a menu from the training ground or elsewhere?
If our squad are anything like the Chelsea squad used to be, then it will be straight down the deli or chip shop after training for a kebab and pasties!
