Ratings vs Chelsea

MOM

  • Lloris

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Chiiriches

    Votes: 1 0.4%
  • Fazio

    Votes: 15 5.8%
  • Verts

    Votes: 1 0.4%
  • Davies

    Votes: 2 0.8%
  • Bentaleb

    Votes: 151 58.8%
  • Mason

    Votes: 1 0.4%
  • Lennon

    Votes: 1 0.4%
  • Lamela

    Votes: 6 2.3%
  • Eriksen

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Kane

    Votes: 65 25.3%
  • Paulinho

    Votes: 1 0.4%
  • Chadli

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Soldado

    Votes: 2 0.8%
  • Undecided

    Votes: 11 4.3%

  • Total voters
    257

Coyboy

The Double of 1961 is still The Double
Joined
Dec 3, 2004
Messages
14,360
#61
One cross, slightly behind Kane does not deserve equal credit as giving a goal away does debit. It wasn't just the initial bamboozling, it was also the simple laziness of then not tracking him, despite probably being quicker. It was a really standard and simple one dimensional piece of play, he had nothing else to think about at that moment, but very important and he cost us enormously. And he compounded this by wasting one of the few times we got into a good position in the box in the second half. Also saw much less of the football than everyone else, and was rightly subbed.
One mistake against a world class player, whose shot could well have been saved at the near post. There's no mathematical formula needed, just a fair acknowledgement.

So if the ball had been an inch lower it wouldn't have deserved credit? It was an excellent cross, even if it wasn't placed on top of Kane's head. He made a mistake and took his eye of the player, it happens. Wingers see less of the ball by definition so that's a meaningless statement.

It's the lazy throwaway comments of being "inconsequential" and "normal service resumed" that just once again reveal your bias and jaundiced view.
 

alfie103

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 4, 2005
Messages
3,010
#62
As a fan living in the sticks with family commitments I don't get to see as many games as I'd like.
With that in mind I'd like to say a big thank you to @Bus-Conductor for his write ups in this thread.
They are considered, informative and give a view of the performance free from the usual lazy media clichés.
Cheers mate, keep up the good work.
Is this BC's other account?
 

Bus-Conductor

SC Supporter
Joined
Oct 19, 2004
Messages
39,482
#63
One mistake against a world class player, whose shot could well have been saved at the near post. There's no mathematical formula needed, just a fair acknowledgement.

So if the ball had been an inch lower it wouldn't have deserved credit? It was an excellent cross, even if it wasn't placed on top of Kane's head. He made a mistake and took his eye of the player, it happens. Wingers see less of the ball by definition so that's a meaningless statement.

It's the lazy throwaway comments of being "inconsequential" and "normal service resumed" that just once again reveal your bias and jaundiced view.

I am biased against insipidity and jaundiced by years of it from Lennon.
 

Coyboy

The Double of 1961 is still The Double
Joined
Dec 3, 2004
Messages
14,360
#64
I am biased against insipidity and jaundiced by years of it from Lennon.
Which leads to a failure to give him credit where it's due. Maybe I was too scarred by 90s and early 00s mediocrity but I prefer to appreciate the good that he has brought to the team over the last 9 years which has coincided with our most consistent league finishes in decades.
 

mpickard2087

Fantastic Member
Joined
Jun 13, 2008
Messages
19,230
#65
This game was a bit of a weird one for me. As a team we had a bright start, and indeed for most of the game we did ok. However I personally thought that although the team performance was not too bad, quite a few individuals had poor games.

I can see why Poch made the change he did, although I would have played a midfield anchor. We looked stretched across the midfield last night when Chelsea did get the ball down and play. Eriksen and Lennon in particular got nowhere near their efforts on Sunday, when arguably we needed even more from them.

Defensively things were a bit soft, and we pissed the good start away with a couple of very soft goals conceded... You can't switch off for a second at this level. You have to be precise.

With the ball we were mostly composed, and kept trying to play our game. Though I think Chelsea were happy for us to have the ball at times. After the opening spell though we didn't really seem to have the tools to break them down. As I said last night, I thought we were too narrow a lot of the time, and it was noticeable how Chelsea made the pitch much bigger and asked more questions by stretching our defensive shape. When we did get it wide, often through short passes and then working an overlap, we arguably created our best moments.

We also have to be more efficient, a lot of the ball we had was wasted through plain bad decisions. Whether that be Kane holding onto it for too long after a good initial burst. Lamela/Eriksen overplaying, players taking too many extra touches before releasing it, wrong passing choices made, poor movement off the ball... All were common. Chelsea just didn't seem to muck about in comparison and made the right decisions at times and just looked more polished.

It wasn't a disaster, but it shows how much more we have to do...

Lloris - Poor game, mostly stemming from his kicking.

Chiriches - Poor first half, improved a bit in the second. Partly culpable for the first goal.

Fazio - Did ok. Him and Vertonghen need to talk to each other more though, no one leading that defence.

Vertonghen - Very disappointing. Never looked settled. The 2nd goal I'm not sure what he was doing, and three times prior to that Drogba had peeled off him and received the ball around the edge of the box, so the warning signs were there. I also doubt he will want to see the 3rd again. Not his finest night.

Davies - Ok-ish. Offered nothing going forward though when we needed some width at times in the second half. For the 3rd goal I think its avoidable if he calls an offside trap, he can see all along the line...

Lennon - Switched off twice for the opening goal. I thought his tracking back and pressing was disappointing, nowhere near Sunday's energy. One great cross for Kane's header, that was about it. Very average.

Mason - Never got settled. Gave the ball away and was chasing the game a bit.

Bentaleb - Towards the end he looked tired and made a couple of errors, but I thought he was far and away our standout player. Composed on the ball and looks more of a presence in the centre of the park. Really encouraging performance.

Eriksen - Much the same as Lennon, in that he didn't hit the heights of Sunday in terms of hard work. With the ball ok but nothing of any real quality or purpose.

Lamela - A bit frustrating at times, but did ok. Second half was a bit quiet until he was subbed.

Kane - Looks to be gaining more and more belief each game, and was unlucky not to open the scoring. What I will say is that, although he did well at times and caused problems, he needs to use the ball quicker because a number of times he dawdled and opportunities were wasted or he was crowded out. His hold up play also needs to get better, a few times when we needed it to stick up top it didnt. I guess he will only learn through the experience of this calibre of opposition though.

Subs:

Paulinho - Lively to start with, but there is so much inefficiency to his game particularly when it comes to passing. Defensively didnt offer a great deal.

Chadli - Ok-ish.

Soldado - Did he touch the ball?
 
Last edited:

jair1970

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2012
Messages
4,487
#66
To my mind some of the most encouraging points are that the replacements for the injured/ostracized/whatever 4, Ade, Kaboul, Rose and Capoue are all playing really well: Kane, Fazio, Davies and Bentaleb.
 

yiddotilidie

Active Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2005
Messages
4,002
#67
More often than not you win or lose a game in the middle of the park. Chelsea have Matic Fabrecack, with Oscar, Harzard et al adding the end product.

In all fairness, we had Mason and Bentaleb up against those two and a defence that simply isn't good enough to compete with Chelseas' front line.

Noone on here seriously thought we would cause an upset because of one good performance against Everton did they?

Bentaleb is a very decent prospect for the future and Mason is new to the prem even tho he's 23 or whatever. It was David v Goliath!

Onto the next game....
 

prawnsandwich

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 19, 2014
Messages
6,035
#68
You went on a mad bender of posting some seriously niave and boneheaded crap last night pal, including this.

I'm seriously not surprised that you're the sort of fan who looks at a 3-0 scoreline and thinks 'well we got fucking battered, we played well shit' when on the balance of play, we gave it our all and tried our best, no team would have got through Chelsea's defence last night. They're a class above everyone else in this league, but had individual errors not cost us from players who did play poorly i.e chiriches and lloris, then we would have been bang in the game, so to say we played shit would be well wide of the mark. Even Mourinho praised us afterwards.

Also, your bias towards Townsend and Adebayor is laughable. If you genuinely think they would have improved us last night, after their recent form and general attitude, then give up on football, it really isn't for you.
Well Sir Spamalot (thanks for more tins) if you think getting thrashed 3-0 means we played well but were unlucky I suggest you buy a pair of glasses and take up tiddlywinks.
Mourinho was patronising. One or two players may well have played OK but we put out the wrong team and played the wrong tactics.
And for absolute certain Townsend is better than Lennon and Ade is better than Soldado.
 

yiddotilidie

Active Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2005
Messages
4,002
#69
Well Sir Spamalot (thanks for more tins) if you think getting thrashed 3-0 means we played well but were unlucky I suggest you buy a pair of glasses and take up tiddlywinks.
Mourinho was patronising. One or two players may well have played OK but we put out the wrong team and played the wrong tactics.
And for absolute certain Townsend is better than Lennon and Ade is better than Soldado.
I agree to an extent, we played well for 20minutes but were put to bed after that....but there's no way on God's green earth that Adebayor offers more than Soldado....no way! But then, we seem to be polishing two turds! I have never ever taken to Adebayor, I just can't. But he's had one good spell at Spurs...the rest of it he tried to kid us into him making an effort.
 

Gilzeanking

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 7, 2005
Messages
4,613
#70
Noone on here seriously thought we would cause an upset because of one good performance against Everton did they?

It was David v Goliath!

Onto the next game....
This is my point....obviously Poch did think that because he went toe to toe trying to outplay Chelski and win at Stamford Bridge . Not smart imo .
 

THFCjosh

Active Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
372
#71
We may have dominated play and looked threatening for the first 19mins but after we barely threatened the goal after their first. But against a team like Chelsea we need to be clinical otherwise they will score and park the proverbial bus, which they did.

However, signs are looking promising Bentaleb and Kane in particular looking to be better than any of our signings the last 2 years maybe with the exception of Eriksen. Mason I think needs a break as he's given the ball away quite a lot recently which giving him the benefit of the doubt is probably down to fatigue. Fazio seems to finally be settling in and putting in a couple of solid displays.

The pressing game that Poch is famous for seems to be drilled into the players now and I reckon our next few games will show how far we've come in the last few weeks since out loss against Stoke.

Hopefully good things to come.
 

yiddotilidie

Active Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2005
Messages
4,002
#73
This is my point....obviously Poch did think that because he went toe to toe trying to outplay Chelski and win at Stamford Bridge . Not smart imo .
Yep, but then do we have the personnel to park the bus against Chelsea? I don't think we do. I think we're a team in limbo, between two styles and he needs the January window to get some more in that will suit how he wants to play....round pegs and square holes at the mo imo.
 
Joined
Jan 27, 2011
Messages
499
#74
whats more interesting is people who were supposedly watching the game saying all he does is give it away. He also made more tackles than everyone in our front 6, but again 'all he does is stupid fouls'

idiots.
Comments like this are making it impossible to have a sensible debate about how Lamela needs to improve.

Lloris also seldom gave the ball away, but when he did it was a pretty important moment wouldn't you say?

Should we applaud his pass completion stats? No because performance is never solely about statistics in isolation.

Kane wasn't good because he ran 8 miles vs Everton - it was because the 8 miles he ran were mostly the correct runs - to press as a unit.

Lamela is a gifted player who is trying very hard - some of his touches are sublime - but he's too often naive and selfish in his decisions.

That's why for all the step overs, flicks, and desperate running around, he's not been anywhere near as productive as a player of his talent should be.

Stewart Downing has been far more productive this season - with about 8% of Lamela's talent.

There has to be an explanation surely? It can't be dismissed as bad lack, or playing in a poor Spurs team - he's part of that team.

He simply has to start making more patient decisions, and trust his team mates to give him the ball back in better positions.

Until that penny drops he shouldn't be starting.
 

vigospur

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 10, 2006
Messages
1,115
#75
My MoM was the Tottenham crowd in the Shed End. Different class.
Those that want shed loads of money spent need to see how little excitment Chelsea supporters get from having a top team.
Add. My grandson was the Club mascot. Unforgettable.
 
Joined
May 22, 2014
Messages
65
#76
Chelsea were in 2nd gear for the whole of the 2nd half,they were in training ground mode. If we had nicked a goal they would have stepped it up and just got another two.

As for Lamela,he is a total waste of time. He can't control a ball,he just cuts inside and loses possession,he always looks like he is going to get booked with numerous clumsy tackles. He is a fish out of water in The PL. Can only hope someone gives us some money for him in Jan. As for thos drag backs,God give me strength

Adebayor,don't make me laugh. The guy is a disgrace and should never wear the white shirt again.

We once again made errors,we are good at that. Lennon and Chiriches for the first,Lloris for the 2nd and Vertonghen was woeful for the 3rd. He is not as good as he thinks he is,that is a certainty.

Eriksen was good against Everton,but back to type against Chelsea ,was he even playing. He is supposed to be a creative midfielder,is that not why we bought him. He has to do a lot more creating,it is his job to unlock defences.

We need some ins and outs in Jan,but any hope of top 4 is about as far away as Father Christmas coimng down my chimney anytime soon
 

JohannTHFC

Active Member
Joined
Aug 2, 2014
Messages
795
#77
Bentaleb was the best player on the pitch for me. Amazing gem we have on our hands here, still can't believe he's only 20 with how confident he was on the ball against the best side in the league. Kane close second.
 

Blackcanary

Dame sans merci
Joined
Jul 15, 2012
Messages
5,129
#78
Chelsea were in 2nd gear for the whole of the 2nd half,they were in training ground mode. If we had nicked a goal they would have stepped it up and just got another two.

As for Lamela,he is a total waste of time. He can't control a ball,he just cuts inside and loses possession,he always looks like he is going to get booked with numerous clumsy tackles. He is a fish out of water in The PL. Can only hope someone gives us some money for him in Jan. As for thos drag backs,God give me strength

Adebayor,don't make me laugh. The guy is a disgrace and should never wear the white shirt again.

We once again made errors,we are good at that. Lennon and Chiriches for the first,Lloris for the 2nd and Vertonghen was woeful for the 3rd. He is not as good as he thinks he is,that is a certainty.

Eriksen was good against Everton,but back to type against Chelsea ,was he even playing. He is supposed to be a creative midfielder,is that not why we bought him. He has to do a lot more creating,it is his job to unlock defences.

We need some ins and outs in Jan,but any hope of top 4 is about as far away as Father Christmas coimng down my chimney anytime soon
I'm as critical of Ade as the next person...but I draw the line at critiquing him for a match when he wasn't even playing!
 

SpursDave88

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 31, 2012
Messages
1,884
#79
weird one for me. As a team we had a bright
My MoM was the Tottenham crowd in the Shed End. Different class.
Those that want shed loads of money spent need to see how little excitment Chelsea supporters get from having a top team.
Add. My grandson was the Club mascot. Unforgettable.
I don't disagree with your assessment of the crowd...but to imply that we are better off having a poor team as a result is just nonsense. We as fans are easily please because of our lack of success. We haven't won at Chelsea since 1990 so them comfortably beating us at Stamford Bridge isn't exactly something that gets them off their seats, it's the equivalent of us beating QPR or Fulham at home.
 
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