Ratings vs Villa

[Sp3akerboxxx]

Mason and Bentaleb get leniency on here because we have literally zero other options. Does anyone really think that any midfield combination of Dembele, Paulinho, Stambouli, and Capoue would have performed any better out there today?

Mason and Bentaleb are the best that we have currently. Bentaleb has a lot of potential and Mason will be a very useful squad player that fulfills a number of quotas. I wouldn't part with either of them over the 4 rivals that they currently have in the squad

 

[Blackcanary]

Mason and Bentaleb get leniency on here because we have literally zero other options. Does anyone really think that any midfield combination of Dembele, Paulinho, Stambouli, and Capoue would have performed any better out there today?

Mason and Bentaleb are the best that we have currently. Bentaleb has a lot of potential and Mason will be a very useful squad player that fulfills a number of quotas. I wouldn't part with either of them over the 4 rivals that they currently have in the squad

We'll never know, will we? Because we will continue with the same ineffective pairing into infinity until the universe is swallowed by a black hole.

 

[Blake Griffin]

so mason and bentaleb are the new scapegoats then.

 

[Frenchalex25]

Mason and Bentaleb get leniency on here because we have literally zero other options. Does anyone really think that any midfield combination of Dembele, Paulinho, Stambouli, and Capoue would have performed any better out there today?

Mason and Bentaleb are the best that we have currently. Bentaleb has a lot of potential and Mason will be a very useful squad player that fulfills a number of quotas. I wouldn't part with either of them over the 4 rivals that they currently have in the squad

We'll never know if "any midfield combination of Dembele, Paulinho, Stambouli and Capoue would have performed any better
out there today" because except from Paulinho recently and very few times for Dembele, Stambouli and Capoue have never been given a chance.
Considering the way Mason and Bentaleb are currently playing and Spurs now having almost nothing to play for (except a EL place), I would like to see our younger players or new players given a chance (Yedlin, Stambouli, Capoue).

In a certain way, this would be much more intelligent and useful than sticking the same players every week end.

 

[Blackcanary]

so mason and bentaleb are the new scapegoats then.

I don't think they should be scapegoated for anything. But they are excellent examples of out of form players who are still continuing to play week in, week out, which deserves to be questioned.

 

[hughy]

Never thought I'd see the day when rose would be MOTM as standard...

 

[Blake Griffin]

I don't think they should be scapegoated for anything. But they are excellent examples of out of form players who are still continuing to play week in, week out, which deserves to be questioned.

what players do we have who are "in form?" rose ... who else?

 

[Francis Gibbs]

Worryingly Danny Rose is now not only the best fullback in the club but is also close to being our best attacking option

 

[Shea]

7 - Rose
6 - Vorm, Dier, Fazio, Bentaleb, Chadli, Kane
5 - Eriksen, Mason
4 - Chiriches, Townsend

The subs all failed to really make an impact so I wouldn't give any of them more or less than a default rating although perhaps Lamela did enough in the short time he was on the pitch to suggest he's worth a start next time out through work rate alone

 

[Sp3akerboxxx]

We'll never know, will we? Because we will continue with the same ineffective pairing into infinity until the universe is swallowed by a black hole.

We have tried all of the other pairings, and those who had hair on this forum ripped it all out when they played.

Are bentaleb and mason being utilised incorrectly? Yes. Are they "swindon town level" as posters have said on this forum today? Certainly not.

 

[Sp3akerboxxx]

We'll never know if "any midfield combination of Dembele, Paulinho, Stambouli and Capoue would have performed any better
out there today" because except from Paulinho recently and very few times for Dembele, Stambouli and Capoue have never been given a chance.
Considering the way Mason and Bentaleb are currently playing and Spurs now having almost nothing to play for (except a EL place), I would like to see our younger players or new players given a chance (Yedlin, Stambouli, Capoue).

In a certain way, this would be much more intelligent and useful than sticking the same players every week end.

We played all of the players you have mentioned in some form or another on our last run of bad form.

Memories on here are shocking. Literally the best way to raise your stock as a spurs player in the fans eyes is to just not play for a few weeks.

 

[Blackcanary]

what players do we have who are "in form?" rose ... who else?

Ha! Yes, good point, there is a general malaise.

I think the crux of my argument here would be that, even where we have suitable players to come in and replace out of form ones, it's just not happening. Which must be really disheartening for people like Dembele, Stambouli and Lamela who could probably be capable but aren't getting a sniff.

 

[Frenchalex25]

We have tried all of the other pairings, and those who had hair on this forum ripped it all out when they played.

Are bentaleb and mason being utilised incorrectly? Yes. Are they "swindon town level" as posters have said on this forum today? Certainly not.

This is false.
Why do you write "pairings".
Its' isn't because MoPo mostly play the same 2 midfielders (Mason & Bentaleb) that it is stricly forbidden to get 3 midfielders
in some games also.
Not sure Capoue or Stambouli have been "much tried".

 

[Sp3akerboxxx]

This is false.
Why do you write "pairings".
Its' isn't because MoPo mostly play the same 2 midfielders (Mason & Bentaleb) that it is stricly forbidden to get 3 midfielders
in some games also.
Not sure Capoue or Stambouli have been "much tried".

I agree that it should be a midfield 3. I say pairings because we have been playing with a central midfield 2 all season, and I don't imagine what will change anytime soon.

Capoue was dropped for a series of abject, and frankly apathetic displays. When you couple that with the rumours that he balked at the idea of intense training sessions then it is not difficult to see why we haven't seen him return to the side, along with adebayor and kaboul.

The only player who it could be argued hasn't been given a fair crack of the whip would be stambouli. However he wasn't exactly pulling up trees in the appearances he managed to make either.

I implore you to simply go through the match threads where they played and you will see the frustration the fans had with all of the alternatives you have listed.

We simply need a new central midfielder and I am not convinced that giving game time to players who have not played well in the past, and will most likely be gone in the summer benefits us in any way.

Give mason and bentaleb (who have been the midfield combo in all of our best performances this season) the game time to improve as players. You will not see much development out of the alternatives due to their age.

 

[TH1239]

I agree that it should be a midfield 3. I say pairings because we have been playing with a central midfield 2 all season, and I don't imagine what will change anytime soon.

Capoue was dropped for a series of abject, and frankly apathetic displays. When you couple that with the rumours that he balked at the idea of intense training sessions then it is not difficult to see why we haven't seen him return to the side, along with adebayor and kaboul.

The only player who it could be argued hasn't been given a fair crack of the whip would be stambouli. However he wasn't exactly pulling up trees in the appearances he managed to make either.

I implore you to simply go through the match threads where they played and you will see the frustration the fans had with all of the alternatives you have listed.

We simply need a new central midfielder and I am not convinced that giving game time to players who have not played well in the past, and will most likely be gone in the summer benefits us in any way.

Give mason and bentaleb (who have been the midfield combo in all of our best performances this season) the game time to improve as players. You will not see much development out of the alternatives due to their age.

Our three best performances this season came against Arsenal, Chelsea, and Liverpool. Against Chelsea, Mason went off early injured and Dembele came in for him, so Mason was not really apart of that great performance. Against Liverpool, the aforementioned duo were exceptionally poor. Only against Arsenal did Mason and Bentaleb play well (and frankly, like the entire team, that was mostly in an outstanding second half).

 

[JohannTHFC]

Danny Rose is the only player whos given us 100% from start of the season to now.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

The Genius/Idiot conundrum

Most people thought AVB was an idiot for sticking rigidly to a system the believed was stunting the creativity of his team. Personally I thought it was bordering on genius getting a squad deplete of brains (once Modric, VDV, King had gone for good) and containing the likes of Dempsey, to achieve a higher points tally than the previous year, and then to keep clocking up points at a healthy rate after Bale had gone too. We know Sherwood was a fucking idiot because of the banal bullshit he continually spews, some of it literally completely fiction, but there are those (well, @eddiebailey really) who also think he's a genius who managed to keep clocking up points at a healthy rate post AVB.

And so it is with Pochettino. I'm on record of never being convinced he's a genius. And I think some of the things he's done, especially in the last 3 months have "idiotic" written all over them, but there are times I watch this lot and think it's just genius getting them to this position of (wherever it is we are in the league now) having CL mentioned, even if only as a forlorn pipe dream. Just as it was when AVB and Sherwood did it.

I look at our team sometimes and think, is this lot really better than 66% of this league ? I mean, is it ? Is Pochettino a genius or idiot ? The truth is, I think both.

On days like today it's really easy to see everything as wrong. Going by comments I've seen plenty of in the match thread the CM pair seem to copping much of the flack. I think people need to rewind to the early part of the season and the West Brom home game we also lost 0-1 in identical circumstances. Then it was Dembele and Capoue getting all the blame.

And you know what, for as long as I can remember on SC, the blame has invariably been most heavily weighted toward the CM's we've had. And in all those years they have been CM2's, and the common denominator is that nearly all of those CM2 pairings have been surrounded by stupid work shy wankers. Players who fuck away possession cheaply and then want to stand around and watch as every other **** flaps around trying to recover their fuck up.

Now, inevitably, it's Mason and Bentaleb's turn. Two dynamic, hard working footballers with technique and reasonable brains, one of whom is fucking 19 yo. The other having his first season of senior top flight football. These two aren't perfect. They make the odd mistake but most of what they are doing is pretty much what any very decent CM would be doing in these circumstances. Just as Capoue and Dembele did under the same circumstances.

What we really need is for our manager to start walking the philosophy talk. The most important part of that, for me, means players that don't want to work their bollocks off at a good tempo, and with some cognitive appreciation for the 10 men they are playing with, should not be anywhere near this team. It's even starting to rub off on Kane now, he seems to have got this idea that he's too good to press now.

The second part of that should be to realise that it takes real top notch CM's to play a CM2 at the highest level and maybe switching tactics/formation might just optimise the players we have. Maybe try a 433 ?

This squad is short of brains, we all know this, it's not just our problem, it's football's problem. But what we are not short of right now is kids that have been schooled to work hard and play for each other, and will be absolutely desperate for a chance. I'm not saying they will all be the long term (or even medium) solution, but if they are not, the very least you will have done is let every lazy wanker know they won't be tolerated, and if they want to play, at the very least, even when they are being stupid and fucking careless, must work their nuts off and apply it with some collective theory.

I'm sure many are saying it's the fact that we are playing so many kids that's the problem. Well that is bollocks, because we've been a lazy team without the ball for as long as I can remember. If we weren't so fucking lazy without the ball under Redknapp we'd have been challenging for at least 2nd place in those last couple of years. King, Modric, Parker, Bale, VDV, Adebayor, I mean come on…

It isn't the kids. It isn't the CM's. It isn't even fucking Chiriches. We need a coach who can teach players what's required of them as a bare minimum. We need a coach who can make players understand that the performances against Arsenal and Liverpool were a benchmark, not a fucking treat.

Once again Pochettino's selections and application of them was flawed. Chadli in the centre for example. Townsend and Chadli playing for example.

I'm reading a lot of love for Rose because of his "attitude". That's great, but a couple of weeks ago I pointed out his constant inability to stop crosses coming in from his side (I remember it because I said it's the one thing Walker does better than him) and he once again stood too far off Bacuna and allowed him to make an easy cross. So I'm loving that you are all appreciating Rose's chippy up and at em approach, but it would be lovely if he hadn't contributed so heavily to the winning goal.

Individuality:

Vorm - Not loads to do but made one excellent save.

Chiriches - Not good.

Dier - Benteke gave both our CB's problems. Had better days for sure.

Fazio - See Dier.

Rose - Was at fault for the goal. Wasted the couple of chances he got to create something too. Apart from that he was great.

Mason - Tough day up against Villa's 4312 - him and Bentaleb were effectively 2v4 at times.

Bentaleb - For me, despite a couple of misplaced passes he had a very decent game. He was industrious and tenacious, saw shitloads of the ball and tried to help us play.

Chadli - Though his clumsiness and poor touch are annoying at times and without the ball he's not great he was having a reasonably OK game by his standards and I was surprised he was yanked before Townsend.

Eriksen - He saw plenty of the ball but once again his end product was very, very disappointing. His touch and execution at vital moments needs to be better.

Townsend - Poor.

Kane - He's not pressing like he was, and his decision making - i.e. running into traffic or shooting when he has a better pass on - wasn't great.

 

[Spursh]

Vorm 5

Chiriches 3
Fazio 6
Dier 5
Rose 7

Mason 6
Bentaleb 5

Townsend 5
Chadli 6
Eriksen 4

Kane 7

 

[ricardomcd]

Eriksen was awful and in my opinion has been poor for weeks. I can accept the lack of scoring (last goal 31st Jan) but am disappointed to see that he is failing to influence play when he is such a talented player. We are devoid of ideas when it comes to breaking teams down. No matter what we do with Eriksen he just can't seem to get involved. Today he just did everything in such a lazy way. His touch was loose and his passing lacked any creativity, he was happy to play the easy ball and so were his team mates.

I don't blame Bentaleb or Mason but I don't absolve them either. I just think the big issue is that we really lacking creativity from wide positions and the attacking players behind Kane seem incapable of making any sort of chances for him. He didn't have a sniff today so then he started to play selfishly trying to make chances for himself. He did come more to life when Soldado came on.

I'd be tempted to play 442 for the rest of the season with Soldado and Kane because quite simply Eriksen, Lamela, Townsend and Chadli offer absolutely nil threat. I recognise that Soldado doesn't offer much himself but this is out of desperation.

PS - I was worried this style of play might leave the team tired and now I think I might be right. Our poor performance have started since we have failed to play in the 'Poch way'. I can't believe that having understood what he wanted us to do the squad are now confused again, this doesn't make sense. I just suspect that the players are knackered and can't do what he wants them to do.

PPS - think that we will recruit in the summer but we will work with a smaller squad. No Europa league will be a blessing so I forgive these crap results.

 

[ultimateloner]

the fact that sherwood got the better of us away from home and with worse quality players sums up everything that is wrong with us currently.