Southampton Vs Tottenham: Match Thread

[XSuicideBunnyX]

If ever a quote sums up a Spurs fan - complimenting one player while ****ing off another.

Dembele was trying to do 3 men's jobs. Benteleb was excellent though the Southampton team were tiring and behind when he came on. Can't compare the 2 on one game.

Dembele looked injured, and he is better than this.

Just to clarify, I wasn't trying to slag Dembélé - it's just I was noting how easy Bentaleb was making the game look compared to Dembélé, and that this was Bentaleb's senior debut at 19, making it even more significant.

 

[Bofbro]

I love it when journos get called out for doing poor research.

What happened to the 10 year contract then. lol.

 

[spursbhoy67]

Is Tim Sherwood making selections and decisions for the good of the team or for the good of his CV?

They can be mutually beneficial but I think it is more a case of the latter.

Will be very interesting to see how the next few games go. The media onslaught in support of his appointment will only increase.

I hope Levy takes his time and does not make a knee jerk appointment of Sherwood. I am sure he will do fine with decreased expectations for the rest of the season but not sure he is the right man for the long term.

From my perspective Sherwood has been a part of the coaching pyramid so an integral part of AVBs extended staff.

He has done everything to distance himself from the previous manager so am I wrong to assume he never really shared AVBs vision for the club. That in truth could be more of an issue because it suggests there are philosophical problems behind the scenes.

I stand by assertion that Sherwood is a good interim appointment but not a good long term one.

 

[Spursidol]

From my perspective Sherwood has been a part of the coaching pyramid so an integral part of AVBs extended staff.

.

Not correct. AVB was the first team head coach.

Sherwood was Technical Co-ordinator, mainly dealing with Spurs youth set up, and not part of AVB's coaching staff

 

[samsonlevi]

if any of you have the game recorded (like me so I can re watch...sad I know) look at the footage on 63:55 of our bench celebrating our 3rd goal....in particular Ramsey... he doesnt celebrate, however I dont think this is because hes not happy but rather because of his calmness and inteligence/forward thinking to what now has to happen!! Hes the brains/Sherwood is the Balls!!

 

[Tit&Ham]

Whenever we attacked, there were men in the box and most of time the ball went wide and then went into the box. That's the difference, really, playing 4-4-2.

Whenever Southampton attacked, there was a fucking great hole where one has become accustomed to seeing Sandro or Capoue or Dembélé and the Southampton players, especially Lallana, were able to pass straight through that hole. That's also the difference playing 4-4-2.

If we want one, we have to put up with the other. Today it worked well enough to win because we had a motivated, liberated Adebayor with a point to prove. For those mounting an 'I told you so argument' and berating AVB for not playing Adebayor, I think you're missing the point. Adebayor plays well when he feels comfortable with his manager. By contrast, he drifts about looking lost when he doesn't feel that the manager loves him. He didn't get on with AVB and there would have been little point in playing him, because he probably would have been a waste of space. The relationship had deteriorated too badly for it to be rescued. He does apparently get on with Sherwood - and the fact that Sherwood clearly has confidence in Adebayor will reinforce that - and the result was Ade at his absolute best: not only scoring two very good goals, but closing down, passing, winning and protecting possession, occupying defenders and creating all manner of problems on the wings. He's one of the world's hardest-to-play strikers when he plays like this.

The great question, of course, is how Sherwood can keep him doing this. The second question is how we can organise our defence to deal with playing two strikers. As long as Adebayor keeps generating so much energy, defending from the front and taking up so much bloody space, we might get away with it, although I'd feel more comfortable with Sandro or Capoue in a more defined defensive role. The moment he has a niggle or gets into a bad mood, we'll be as wide-open as we were in the first 20 minutes today.

If Lennon gets fully fit again, the 4-4-2 defensive problem will be minimised further, because he is so useful in slowing down opposition counter-attacks. If Vertonghen and Chiriches can play together in the centre at last, then their mobility and anticipation will also help - I'm an admirer of Dawson, but if we're going to play this way, then we need two swift, ball-playing central defenders to go with our swift, ball-playing goalkeeper.

Today's other big news is Nabil Bentaleb [not 'Bentelab', please], not only because he played calmly, maturely and confidently and passed accurately, but because of what it demonstrates about Sherwood's management skills. If he knows nothing else, Tim knows about our youth players - putting Bentaleb on the bench and bringing him on after only 55 minutes, in preference to Capoue or Holtby, took serious cojones, but he didn't hesitate at all. It was an unlikely substitution and it worked beautifully. I didn't think Dembélé was too bad today, in a very demanding role, but Bentaleb was a clear improvement and slotted right into the presumably-unfamiliar formation.

Let's not underestimate the achievement of scoring three goals today: Southampton were a good team playing pretty well today and we still put three past them at their house. With more accurate shooting from both sides, we could have won that game 5-4 instead of 3-2. It wasn't only Soldado who missed chances, our opponents skied a few good ones as well. But we deserved the win on the strength of the second half show, all pressure and drive and direct attacking play.

I'm not convinced it's the way of the future, but it's a hell of a lot more fun to watch than the endless prowling outside the box, ignoring gaps and delaying through-balls.

It will be very interesting to see how long Sherwood persists with this approach, whether he uses it against top quality opposition, how long it will be before it backfires (it will, eventually) and what will happen then.

Take a bow, sir! Lovely post...

 

[LexingtonSpurs]

Just some random thoughts after not seeing the game today, only reading about it.

First, great win. Much needed confidence boost all the way around.

Not a fan of Sherwood as manager yet, but I have to give credit where it is due. He made some significant changes to the line-up, at a time when he needed a win, more than he needed to be "popular". Lamela in for Townsend was easy to make, but less so bringing on Eriksen and Soldado. For better, or worse, Spurs have to play with the players they have - can't afford wholesale changes in January to adopt to a new style. So its good to see those guys all on the field at the same time, and see some positive play.

4-4-2 feels like taking a step backwards, but as important as the formation/tactics, is getting the right people on the pitch. Hard to argue with how Soldado and Ade looked when paired together. If that means two strikers, I'll take it. It will cause other teams to adjust how they defend/line-up.

We'll see how it plays out long-term, but if the wide midfielders pinch in a little and play a little more narrow, and use Walker and Rose to create width out wide, I think we'll be ok offensively and defensively. Spurs seem to be overloaded at CM right now, but some can play out wide, and I think Eriksen could even rotate at Striker if we had to - I'd rather see Soldado/Eriksen or Ade/Eriksen than bring Defoe back into the line-up right now.

I hope Townsend never plays on the right side again. I can live with him rotating with Lamela on the left, but when Townsend is on the right he is an offense killer. Sorry, he just is. He has two moves, try to get in the box and draw a foul, and cut in and take a low percentage shot. Neither helps the offensive flow. At least on the left, he can cross, or make the short pass to a cutter or a trailer.

The defense will settle a little bit when everyone is healthy. It would be nice to recall Bennie to rotate in on the left, and I would love to see a rotation in the middle of Vertonghen, Vlad, and Kaboul.

 

[spursbhoy67]

Not correct. AVB was the first team head coach.

Sherwood was Technical Co-ordinator, mainly dealing with Spurs youth set up, and not part of AVB's coaching staff

The pyramid was supposed to be top to bottom. All teams playing the same way. Players brought in to fit the system. Players promoted through the ranks. Everyone was supposed to be on the same page with a club philosophy.

I thought we were but it seems not to have been the case.

 

[Tit&Ham]

AVB really did make a huge mistake in marginalising Ade.

Another example of stubbornness getting the better of somebody. Three goals in two games, where we have been so short in that department, is damning.

You can't say that. Not a single person wanted to play adebayour last year After 20-30 poor displays.

You can blame alot on avb, but not this.

That being said, let's hope he keep performing like this! Happy times

 

[walworthyid]

I'm not gonna lie, I think our defense would have been a lot more stable had Benny not been sent to QPR too. God only knows how many points we could have gained just having those two as options earlier on in the season.

I strongly suspect that BAE will be brought back in Jan. He is a far better player than rose in every possible way.

 

[Spursidol]

The pyramid was supposed to be top to bottom. All teams playing the same way. Players brought in to fit the system. Players promoted through the ranks. Everyone was supposed to be on the same page with a club philosophy.

I thought we were but it seems not to have been the case.

Think you are confusing two things. AVB was first team coach - that doesn't mean he was in overall charge opf all playing matters.

 

[bigpalacios]

I liked some of our attacking play today but I think we need at least one defensive minded player in the midfield or Tim will be the second coming of Ossie Ardiles.

 

[XSuicideBunnyX]

I strongly suspect that BAE will be brought back in Jan. He is a far better player than rose in every possible way.

Woah, woah, woah, woah, woah. Slow down there. Benny's a great guy and all, but seriously, the way Rose is playing, he's a much better fit for the team than Assou-Ekotto. Rose's pace and crossing ability is seriously underrated. Having Benny as back-up is still a great idea however.

 

[walworthyid]

Woah, woah, woah, woah, woah. Slow down there. Benny's a great guy and all, but seriously, the way Rose is playing, he's a much better fit for the team than Assou-Ekotto. Rose's pace and crossing ability is seriously underrated. Having Benny as back-up is still a great idea however.

Rose is not better than Benny. Not even close. But each to their own.

 

[XSuicideBunnyX]

Rose is not better than Benny. Not even close. But each to their own.

Can you please explain how Benny's better? Not to come off as abrasive, but I just don't see how.

 

[OnTheUp]

Can you please explain how Benny's better? Not to come off as abrasive, but I just don't see how.

Stronger, more aggressive, more skillfull. When he and Bale linked up under Harry we had the best left side in the PL.

 

[Spursidol]

Lots of people commenting on 442 today - personally not a big fan of a traditional 442 but like all formations it depends how its played.

IMO Sherwood had to play Adebator today to show his confidence in him (and this could get Adebayor back to being a topo goalscorer for Spurs).

Equally he has to play Soldado, our record signing whose goalscoring knack seems to have gone.

The masterstroke is that both Adebayor and Soldado can drop off and play on the wings delivering pretty decent cosees and passes into the box for the other. End result is an unpredictable attack which Southampton found it difficult to defend aganst. Well done the Sherwood/Ramsey combo for making it work - IMO they deserve credit for telling Adebayor and Soldado to drop off when the other was not

I think we''ll see that a couple more times, as much to get Soldado scoring again, before the two get rotated - reason is that I cannot see both playing in every PL, Europa and FA cup match....but they might.

When thet are rotated I hope to see us going back to more of a 4231/433/4411 formation, which will allow us to play one defensive midfielder or at least one motre in midfield - today I think the work rate and movement of both strikers represented at least half an extra body in midfield, bit that may not always be the case.

Delighted to see Sherwood have the balls to bring on Bentaleb - longterm we need to bring through younsters, and we have lots of talent. It would have been too easy to simply bring on Holtby or Capoue instead. Of course Sherwood cannot bring on a youngster in every game, but he's shown what any good manager should be doing from time to time.

Think he will look at most of the squad in the next few games (assuming he's in charge for a couple more games). Glad to see Lamela and Eriksen play today - hope they get start more games, but at the moment there stiull seems to be a thought that Lamela is still struggling with the PL game. Hope I get proved wrong on that in the short term.

 

[XSuicideBunnyX]

Stronger, more aggressive, more skillfull. When he and Bale linked up under Harry we had the best left side in the PL.

I imagine you could have put many fullbacks with Bale and you'd have the best left side in the Prem. And I don't think Benny is more skillful - Rose used to be a winger after all! And as for agression, Rose can get more than stuck in. And he's defo beefed up compared to a couple of seasons ago - I don't see him bundled off the ball very often, if at all.

 

[Spursidol]

Stronger, more aggressive, more skillfull. When he and Bale linked up under Harry we had the best left side in the PL.

IMO Rose is still developing his style, BAE seems not to be playing as well for QPR as he did at Spurs under Harry - but maybe that's because he's playijg wiith less talented players. I'm certainly in favour of bringing BAE back to Spurs, but whether he'll regain his old form is something we will have to see.

Rose is pretty skillful, so not sure BAE is necessarily that much better, but BAE is certainly more experienced.

 

[muppetman]

I strongly suspect that BAE will be brought back in Jan. He is a far better player than Rose in every possible way.

I can't agree with this. Benni has become a superb Left Back in his absence. In actual fact he was a decent left back who had good technical skills.

Rose on the other hand is not as technical but is so much more suited to the role of a full back. Able to bomb up and down the flank all day, provide width, pull defenders away and cross the ball when required.

I love Benni and think he is a very cool dude but he is nowhere near as good as people like to think and if he came back tomorrow we'd have all the same old threads we did before - where he switches off, loses his man, when attacking he gets to the half way line and stops.


I don't think that Rose is good enough as I think the full backs are really important to the way that we play (I'm also really worried about a long term injury to Walker as Fredericks is not good enough for more than the odd cameo and let's just forget Naughton is in the squad!). We should still in January buy a left back - Luke Shaw would be perfect but will be waaaaay too much money.