Tottenham vs Liverpool: Match Thread

[NEVILLEB]

All the problems we had last season are still evident. As other's have said in this thread, we seem to lack the mentality. Players just seem too 'laid back'. Give the ball away constantly. I can't remember a Spurs side that gifts the ball away so sloppily. The way our heads drop when we're on the cosh is embarrassing. I'm not looking forward to meeting the likes of Chelsea, Man Citeh, (and I hate to say it), ARSEnal...over 90 minutes they will get so many chances and pump goals past us.

Fazio needs to start. Kaboul can warm the bench. Townsend is a liability. Vertonghen is over-rated. Lloris's distribution is awful in a Spurs shirt. It's like none of them think before they act.

There seems to be an air of 'party time' in the player's heads. That split second of relaxation and not taking things too seriously, costs us. Kyle Walker and Sandro's silly pranks are windows into this mentality at the club, and it's those vital seconds of not taking things too seriously that costs us.

Top four? Not a chance. Europa League winners? Not a chance. You can neg rate this all you want, but it's only the truth.

The reason Redknapp brought in players like Parker, Friedel and Gallas was because of their strong mentality and leadership.

Levy didn't understand this policy as he can't make a profit from them.

Sadly, AVB and Levy dismantled the squad Redknapp had built and created a disjointed mess. All our leaders have gone.

Hopefully Poch will rebuild and sort out the balance we need to succeed. Levy needs to trust him and stop interfering.

 

[NEVILLEB]

I never noticed that yesterday, what an awful decision by Lennon he made it so easy for him.

He gambled in the final third. Not such a terrible decision. If the Liverpool player had turned the other way, Lennon would have been in possession just outside their box.

 

[talkshowhost86]

Looking back at it with a bit of perspective, the thing that worried me most about yesterday was that the performance didn't appear to be anything to do with us trying to implement a new system.

The players just didn't perform.

All three goals were from silly mistakes, our creative players were all pretty terrible and even with a large chunk of the possession we looked completely unable to do anything with it.

We can have all the systems in the world, and there was evidence of the pressing working in the first 10-15 minutes, but if the players don't perform then it doesn't really matter what formation we're playing.

Hopefully it was just an off day, and with a couple of weeks now to get their heads sorted they'll come back stronger after the international break. But there were some performances yesterday that were genuinely worrying.

 

[NEVILLEB]

Looking back at it with a bit of perspective, the thing that worried me most about yesterday was that the performance didn't appear to be anything to do with us trying to implement a new system.

The players just didn't perform.

All three goals were from silly mistakes, our creative players were all pretty terrible and even with a large chunk of the possession we looked completely unable to do anything with it.

We can have all the systems in the world, and there was evidence of the pressing working in the first 10-15 minutes, but if the players don't perform then it doesn't really matter what formation we're playing.

Hopefully it was just an off day, and with a couple of weeks now to get their heads sorted they'll come back stronger after the international break. But there were some performances yesterday that were genuinely worrying.

The spine of the team is weak.

It starts with a disjointed defence sitting behind a new, unbalanced centre midfield pairing.

Dier is a positive but the left back position is still a joke.

Two holding midfielders and we still conceded 3 goals at home.

We need a new CM leader to make us tick.

 

[haxman]

Two holding midfielders and we still conceded 3 goals at home.

We need a new CM leader to make us tick.

True, but you can't predict brainfarts like what Townsend and Dier had. That is a continuation of last year, individual mistakes which get heavily punished.

 

[JerryGarcia]

Looking back at it with a bit of perspective, the thing that worried me most about yesterday was that the performance didn't appear to be anything to do with us trying to implement a new system.

The players just didn't perform.

All three goals were from silly mistakes, our creative players were all pretty terrible and even with a large chunk of the possession we looked completely unable to do anything with it.

We can have all the systems in the world, and there was evidence of the pressing working in the first 10-15 minutes, but if the players don't perform then it doesn't really matter what formation we're playing.

Hopefully it was just an off day, and with a couple of weeks now to get their heads sorted they'll come back stronger after the international break. But there were some performances yesterday that were genuinely worrying.

I think it might be that when two teams face each other who both intend to press with a high line, something just has to give. It could just be Liverpool's experience under Rodgers and the timing of their play that did us. We had the ball but we couldn't do much with it because our players were rushed and hacked at every time they had a chance to break. We need to learn to cope with this but luckily there aren't any teams who we'll face that press better than Liverpool at the moment.

 

[Gassin's finest]

He gambled in the final third. Not such a terrible decision. If the Liverpool player had turned the other way, Lennon would have been in possession just outside their box.

You guys realise that clip is from last seasons game at Anfield right?

 

[DEFchenkOE]

Well what a difference a week and having to play a good team makes. After an easy start to the season, yesterday's game came as something of shock to the same bunch who trounced an abject QPR last week. Liverpool played the perfect away game I hate to say; let us have the ball, we passed it and passed it and passed it around, as soon as we get in the final 3rd they pressed and we ran out of cutting edge... whereas by contrast they had Sturridge, Sterling and Balotelli causing our back four no end of bother. When Danny Rose can't close down and catch Jordan Henderson then you know something is up. Which is a shame because Rose was one of the better (and by better I mean less shite) players today.

Dier is a CB, not a RB, and an inexperienced one as it goes. So not picking up Sterling is a by product of that. But then Liverpools front 3 were everything that our 4 weren't... dynamic, pacey, and supporting each other. By contrast Eriksen, Lamela and Chadli were plodding and unimaginative. Eriksen was dire, being everywhere where the ball wasn't, Lamela was on the ball a lot but was slow in his decisions and broke out the slowest set of step overs this side of Peter Crouch. Chadli wasn't even shite, he just had zero impact on the game. At least he got our solitary shot on target, which he elected to try and drive straight down the keepers' throat. A foot or two either side... well, whatever. Adebayor just needs to shoot more. Was not strong enough, and should have drilled it in rather than attempt the lob when clear through.

In the end though, that penalty knocked the wind out of our sails. As hilariously terrible a dive as it was, Dier fell foul of his lack of experience and the way the premier league is these days. Heads dropped after that, and the response was to bring on the even slower Dembele, and the so-one-dimensional-if-he-stands-sideways-on-to-you-he-becomes-near-invisible Andros... rather than a second striker and just start pummeling the penalty area like teams who actually want to win do. And of course it was Townsend's dreadful Cruyff attempt that gave Moreno the clear daylight to run into and score. Although the equally plodding Capoue failed entirely to get across to cover, letting the game and midfielders pass him by like he did most of the afternoon.

In the end it was just same old same old lapdance football that has been a mainstay at the Lane for donkeys years, rearing its ugly head again. All build up, no penetration... while the other team have no problems going right ahead and fucking us. All the pressing from the last 4 games had disappeared, all the incisiveness of last week withered away, and Kaboul is back to his old self of being about as trustworthy in possession as a 9 year old with an Uzi. Pochettino just worked out how tough this job actually is, and is probably looking at November already.

Can't disagree with any of this. I'm still hoping that Capoue can be our main defensive mid but definitely needs to up his game if he wants to be successful. Won't get time to play at his own pace in this league.

Something I feel we are seriously lacking now is good dribblers, apart from Dembele I don't feel that any of our players are capable of beating a man in a one on one. Even when Dembele does do it it's usually pointless as he'll beat 2 men then make a pass backwards to where he just came from.

You could see our defence panicking whenever Sterling or Sturridge got the ball, they also have Henderson who (despite his critics here) can drive forward from midfield. Not to mention Coutinho, Lallana and Markovic who are all excellent dribblers.

All of our midfielders are passers, and if there's no movement then they're ineffective.

 

[DEFchenkOE]

i think we need to assess where the match was actually won...in midfield. Their central 3, which is how they played, chased all over the pitch WITH URGENCY. The only Spurs player not in defence to do that was Lamela, not loads, but a hell of a lot more than the other midfielders and attackers. Capoue and Bentaleb should be the engines of the team tearing up the opposition play but they just didnt. Henderson was better that both of them by some distance, as was Allen. Capoue was lost for the second and jogging for the third. Thats why we need a player like Schneiderlin - Urgency.

Hopefully this dude from Montpellier can do that role. Also need Dembele starting. he can carry the ball, just need Poch to run along side him to tell him when to pass the ball.

if someone could teach Dembele to pass, he's an automatic starter as we have nobody else in midfield that can do what he does. You're right about the midfield, sets the tone. And nobody would say that Henderson - Gerrard - Allen is an amazing trio but they compliment each other nicely and all work incredibly hard in contributing to the offence and defence. Allen may have dived for the pen but did we ever have our midfielders receiving the ball in their box like that?

 

[hodsgod]

He gambled in the final third. Not such a terrible decision. If the Liverpool player had turned the other way, Lennon would have been in possession just outside their box.

I think it was a school boy error, he didn't just sell himself he gave himself away. There was no way the Liverpool player was going to turn into him.

 

[Gaz_Gammon]

Typical modern football fan.

No fucking patience... Liverpool had a season like this in the Brendan Rodgers first year...

I know, I know, why don't we go out and spend £250 million on players every year and pay £250k a week in wages and push the club into unmanageable and unsustainable debt. So in a few years time, when are all supporting Arsenal, because Spurs went bankrupt, you can say you got season tickets worth.

The team has been strengthened, the defence is going to look a lot better and balanced once it is settled. Lamela is improving, even yesterday he never gave up and still tried to be positive, despite nothing coming off for him.

We have plenty of quality within the squad, we just have fans like you, who have no patience and expect us to buy the fucking league every year, so you can get your monies worth.

Lamela will have to improve far more than he has showed so far for me to see why we spent thirty million on him. He was woeful yesterday, and continues to be most underwhelming.




Flame away.

 

[TheGreenLily]

Lamela will have to improve far more than he has showed so far for me to see why we spent thirty million on him. He was woeful yesterday, and continues to be most underwhelming.

Flame away.

I agree, but at least he didn't give up and didn't hide from the ball, like so many of our players have done recently.

I respect for him that and it is still a little positive in a sea of shit.

 

[Gaz_Gammon]

Cool your jets mate, it is just a word.

There is no such thing as a bad word, context is king.



Fearing and banning words is what is obscene, not someone using it in an entirely innocuous setting.

Funny how all the press column football related articles i have read over the weekend doesn't mention the word "rape" a single time regarding a teams win, loss or draw. Pray tell why do you think that is?

It maybe just a word to you, but not to someone who has witnessed the aftermath and fallout of such an action.

 

[Deeyal]

Lamela will have to improve far more than he has showed so far for me to see why we spent thirty million on him. He was woeful yesterday, and continues to be most underwhelming.


Flame away.

Surely we have seen some signs of his Potential? I thought he was good against QPR (A poor QPR team, yes), and in pre-season. Obviously he will need to do it against the bigger teams, but we do need to have some patience. Remember, he spent about 98% of last season injured, and only made a handful of appearances so you almost have to treat this as his first season. He will need time to adapt to the Premier League. I hope he can do it quickly, but every player is different. I was amazed to see some of the vitriol being spewed out on twitter against the poor lad. These are the same people who were gushing over his performance last week!

As for the Liverpool game, yes, it's disappointing, but as others have pointed out, Rodgers, who was widely berated in his first season (Nickname David Brent), has had some time to build his team and get them to play the way he wants. Unfortunately, due to numerous reasons, we have had to start the season with a new manager once again, who has his own Philosophy and his own ideas of the types of players he wants in that system. Time is needed, but the question is, will the fans and chairman give it to him. Based on previous experience I have my doubts.

 

[whitesocks]

Im glad you said in theory because in reality these so called internationals have shown that they have the brain capacity of a 10 year old. The lack of football intelligence at times is shocking.

Pooch could have tried a 4-4-2 variation if nothing else -
all players know that.

It really is mystifying what improvement he thought he was implementing bringing on a half fit europa league level player. Despite what he must have seen in training and in the matches, surely, surely he can't rate Townsend on his current performance level?
It is another worry, and I just hope that with Hodgson in the crowd, Pooch was obligated to give England's great hope a run out.
That or Pooch was looking for a fall guy for a game that was already lost, partly down to his own tactical limitations. Townsend played his part well.

 

[Sp3akerboxxx]

Funny how all the press column football related articles i have read over the weekend doesn't mention the word "rape" a single time regarding a teams win, loss or draw. Pray tell why do you think that is?

It maybe just a word to you, but not to someone who has witnessed the aftermath and fallout of such an action.

I don't write football columns. You are getting heated over nothing at all. Rape is a word and I used it in an appropriate context. If you are this easily offended then I feel sorry for you. And if you are offended, so what? What happens when you are offended? Nothing, you're just offended.

 

[Gaz_Gammon]

Surely we have seen some signs of his Potential? I thought he was good against QPR (A poor QPR team, yes), and in pre-season. Obviously he will need to do it against the bigger teams, but we do need to have some patience. Remember, he spent about 98% of last season injured, and only made a handful of appearances so you almost have to treat this as his first season. He will need time to adapt to the Premier League. I hope he can do it quickly, but every player is different. I was amazed to see some of the vitriol being spewed out on twitter against the poor lad. These are the same people who were gushing over his performance last week!

As for the Liverpool game, yes, it's disappointing, but as others have pointed out, Rodgers, who was widely berated in his first season (Nickname David Brent), has had some time to build his team and get them to play the way he wants. Unfortunately, due to numerous reasons, we have had to start the season with a new manager once again, who has his own Philosophy and his own ideas of the types of players he wants in that system. Time is needed, but the question is, will the fans and chairman give it to him. Based on previous experience I have my doubts.

I don't disagree with any of that, but for me a thirty million pound player should be a standout against any PL opposition. What i saw from Lamela yesterday was a wilting flower of a performance.

 

[Gaz_Gammon]

I don't write football columns. You are getting heated over nothing at all. Rape is a word and I used it in an appropriate context. If you are this easily offended then I feel sorry for you. And if you are offended, so what? What happens when you are offended? Nothing, you're just offended.

Your either uneducated or just plain stupid. Possibly both.

I am not getting heated, and you can put that in any "appropriate context" you wish to.

End of.

 

[Sp3akerboxxx]

Your either uneducated or just plain stupid. Possibly both.

I am not getting heated, and you can put that in any "appropriate context" you wish to.

End of.

Not getting heated? Haha (*You're by the way)

You have the right to be offended by what I say, and I have the right to not give a fuck. If you perhaps channeled the energy you find in being offended by things you read on the internet into something more useful then you might achieve more in curtailing the root of the 'offence' that you perceive.

Not to justify myself in any way, but I have a degree from one of the most well respected universities in the world. So I am more educated than some and less educated than others.

Calling me stupid? Well, that's just offensive

 

[ajspurs]

I agree, but at least he didn't give up and didn't hide from the ball, like so many of our players have done recently.

I respect for him that and it is still a little positive in a sea of shit.

Lamela wasn't the worst of the bunch, in fact as of now I'm far more critical of Eriksen to be honest. My main gripe with Lamela is that a lot of his play is risky and 50/50. What I mean by that is that he doesn't quite have the right balance of trying something a bit adventurous and just keeping hold of the ball or doing something a bit more safe. I'm never convinced when he kind of comes to halt and tries a few step overs following with an attempt to go past his marker, a lot of the time it ends in him losing the ball.

He does seem to be the only bright and creative spark in our team at the minute though.