The Harry Effect

Coyboy · Jan 23, 2009

Bus-Conductor said:
OK, RE Ramos take a look at this post/thread:

http://www.spurscommunity.co.uk/forums/showpost.php?p=1231503&postcount=22

What it demonstrates is for me the biggest single factor in our downfall at the start of this season. The difference that having Berbatov & Keane available for selection and not.

Now we can argue about how we may have got the best out of what we had, and I agree Ramos didn't always get that right this season, but I think he would certainly have got there, but the crucial thing is the vast difference in interaction that we had last year and this. And this was not Ramos's fault. This was Comolli's fault.

Other factors played a part like the new personnel bedding in and us generally not getting the rub, but these were secondary for me.

We lost the ability to play football in the final third of the pitch and are still struggling in this area which is why we haven't scored morte than 2 goals in the league and haven't won in 5/6 games.

This was not a problem of Ramos's making. Nor was it Redknapp's for that matter, but Ramos chose not to come out and blame everyone else. Perhaps he should have.

RE Redknapp

My opinion of Redknapp is that he is a poor and unimaginative coach and a poor tactition. I think he has had some of this leagues most exciting players under him at varios clubs at various times but has singularly failed to make any of those teams to enjyable to watch or achieve league success. Because to do this you must be able to do more than buy good players and pick good players. You must teach them how to play the game in the style you require and you must tell them exactly what is required of them every game and make sure they understand this.

In my opinion Redknapp buys good players, lets wankers like Bond "coach" them then gives them a bit of a gee-up pre match and hopes that they - being good players - will dig him out a result. This does happen but it is not a philosophy which works on a sustainable basis. It is an ad hoc approach with ad hoc results.

Like Terry Venables, I feel Redknapp's greatest skill is the ability to sing a song for the media. Keeping them happy is half way to keeping your job despite how shit you are at it.

Ok let's put aside the rumour that Ramos was happy to let Keane go, the very fact that Rednapp managed to get results with the same team disproves the theory that without Keane and Berbatov we could have expected to do no better than the worst ever start. Ramos had time to prepare a team certainly without Berbatov and without Keane. He didn't, they weren't a team. Under Rednapp, with all the mitigation that comes from taking over such an awful team, he has done well- not spectacularly Keane-first-season well but well nonetheless reflected in performances and results.

We scored four goals against Arsenal. That's the second time I have pointed out a pretty memorable fact. And we have scored more than two in cups. We didn't do that under Ramos against a crap Newcastle team and an ordinary Polish team. So in all your subjective polarised posts, let's get basic facts right ok?

Blaming Comolli is a red herring. He didn't assemble a team that could fight for top four, though whether it is player for player weaker than Villa is a moot point, but he certainly assembled at Ramos' request a team capable of challenging for the top half. Ramos failed to squeeze any juice out that lemon. He failed. Drastically. Undeniably.

Claiming Rednapp has not achieved league success with the players he has had and has not made them enjoyable to watch is debatable. For the size of club they are, West Ham and Pompey didn't do too badly under Rednapp. Pompey is especially a case in point as it is more relevant because it is more recent and more impressive. If we think we are in trouble this season and we are, what about Pompey when Rednapp returned? What about getting them up in the first case? If taking a team, a club like Pompey from the Championship to the top half of the premiership is not league success then what is? Pardon Rednapp please for not winning the league.

The only managers I can think of that have done better with similar budgets and constraints are David Moyes and Sam Allardyce. Now I like the former a lot and who knows maybe Levy tried to speak to him in October but plenty of people, maybe yourself, would not like us playing like Everton and I know they wouldn't Allardyce. So you are grumbling that Rednapp didn't take teams with of Pompey's and West Ham's size and make them CL league contenders playing champagne football. Maybe he hasn't done that because no one has. Not even Moyes' Everton in 2005. You even said earlier in this thread that with the squad they had Pompey should have been challenging for the top four.

First of all that is inadvertent praise for Rednapp for assembling that squad from relegation certainties months earlier and secondly are you serious, CL contenders? I think the fact that Rednapp's teams don't play the very football you and maybe a few others wants says more about you than it does him. As Joey said a few weeks ago, you can't blame a manager for not wanting to do things on or off the pitch that you want. You can disagree and say I would prefer he do x,y and z but it is absurd to go the extra mile or 1000 miles and say 'he's a prick' and then think you know how he operates on the training ground. You don't so leave it.

Michey · Jan 23, 2009

Bus-Conductor said:
Exactly how I feel. Great managers don't need to humiliate their players this way week after week. It's just him saying to the press "It's not me guv it's them useless wankers in there".

Good managers - and I don't just mean Wenger & Ferguson - don't ever hold their autopsy in public. Publicly they stand firm behind their players and privately deal with it. This inspires respect & loyalty.

No one can debate that.

If they haven't forgot how to think for themselves that is.

Rackybear · Jan 23, 2009

Forget about the arguement if the football is improved.

At the time it was neccesary to sack Ramos, because had he stayed, I think we would have been heading down.

For all his possession football and what not, we failed to create clear chances and never looked like scoring, when that happens the defence is always going to be a bit worried about conceding.

Staying in the premiership > Keeping Ramos in the hope he "eventually" turns it around.

My gripe is that the arrival of Harry did initally improve our results, but we remain in a relegation fight. However, I still think we are better off (points wise) since Harry has taken over. 2 points in 8 games was worst team in premiership history standard.

Bus-Conductor · Jan 23, 2009

Coyboy said:
Ok let's put aside the rumour that Ramos was happy to let Keane go, the very fact that Rednapp managed to get results with the same team disproves the theory that without Keane and Berbatov we could have expected to do no better than the worst ever start. Ramos had time to prepare a team certainly without Berbatov and without Keane. He didn't, they weren't a team. Under Rednapp, with all the mitigation that comes from taking over such an awful team, he has done well- not spectacularly Keane-first-season well but well nonetheless reflected in performances and results.

We scored four goals against Arsenal. That's the second time I have pointed out a pretty memorable fact. And we have scored more than two in cups. We didn't do that under Ramos against a crap Newcastle team and an ordinary Polish team. So in all your subjective polarised posts, let's get basic facts right ok?

Blaming Comolli is a red herring. He didn't assemble a team that could fight for top four, though whether it is player for player weaker than Villa is a moot point, but he certainly assembled at Ramos' request a team capable of challenging for the top half. Ramos failed to squeeze any juice out that lemon. He failed. Drastically. Undeniably.

Claiming Rednapp has not achieved league success with the players he has had and has not made them enjoyable to watch is debatable. For the size of club they are, West Ham and Pompey didn't do too badly under Rednapp. Pompey is especially a case in point as it is more relevant because it is more recent and more impressive. If we think we are in trouble this season and we are, what about Pompey when Rednapp returned? What about getting them up in the first case? If taking a team, a club like Pompey from the Championship to the top half of the premiership is not league success then what is? Pardon Rednapp please for not winning the league.

The only managers I can think of that have done better with similar budgets and constraints are David Moyes and Sam Allardyce. Now I like the former a lot and who knows maybe Levy tried to speak to him in October but plenty of people, maybe yourself, would not like us playing like Everton and I know they wouldn't Allardyce. So you are grumbling that Rednapp didn't take teams with of Pompey's and West Ham's size and make them CL league contenders playing champagne football. Maybe he hasn't done that because no one has. Not even Moyes' Everton in 2005. You even said earlier in this thread that with the squad they had Pompey should have been challenging for the top four.

First of all that is inadvertent praise for Rednapp for assembling that squad from relegation certainties months earlier and secondly are you serious, CL contenders? I think the fact that Rednapp's teams don't play the very football you and maybe a few others wants says more about you than it does him. As Joey said a few weeks ago, you can't blame a manager for not wanting to do things on or off the pitch that you want. You can disagree and say I would prefer he do x,y and z but it is absurd to go the extra mile or 1000 miles and say 'he's a prick' and then think you know how he operates on the training ground. You don't so leave it.

Blaming Comolli isn't a red herring at all. I have been one of Comolli staunchest defenders on here, but the as director of football who over saw the purchase of Bent for 16m, Bentley for 15m, the sale of Defoe, Berbatov and Keane in six months and the failure to provide adequate - if not anywhere near as good as I know that would be fucking hard - replacements he was the most culpable and I think his public admission of his disapointment in doing so spoke volumes. I think Everybody could see that going into a season in the ever more competitive EPL with Bent (incredibly limited and not really fitting with the style of football we were trying to play), Campbell (a championship standard kid) and Pav (having played a whole season of Russian football plus euros) was a real recipe for disaster.

I was disapointed that Ramos let the CC win spread some apathy into the squad, but we were safe, in europe and had very little motivation and some players knew they were leaving. Still not acceptable but slightly understandable.

I don't care what anyone says, in the first 8 games this season we put in some good footballing performances, but due to the inadequecy of strikers and the lack of the rub we didn't win. Don't fucking tell me that a team that has 30% of the ball deserves to win a game. It may suit your argument to say that but none of us with even the most rudimentary understanding of football really beieves that.

As for Redknapp, in my opinion he is a prick. He talks shit at every opportunity to engratiate himself with the football press. 10 games ago he was taking all the credit for turning us into a great team. Soon as he's had chance to work with the players and they stop passing and moving and go out to "not loose" and end up getting beat they are all ****'s and he can't put enough distance between himself and them.

Try reading the article by the guy that worked with him at southampton, it's not good reading. Basically Redkanpp sacked him for suggestingthat the players need him to be coaching them instead of sitting in his office reading the Racing Post while Kevin Bond teaches them how to run backwards on the training ground.

And the phalacy that he over achieved with Portsmouth is laughable. He spent alot of money at Portsmouth, more than Martin O'Neil at Villa or David Moyes at Everton. At West Ham he had players like Ferdinand, Cole , Lampard, Kanoute, Sinclair, Foe, DiCanio, Defoe, Carrick to name but a few at Portsmouth he had Diarra, Diop, Distin , James, Johnson, Kranjar, Muntari, Crouch, Defoe, Yakubu, Mendes.

Yet I didn't ever see one game where they played quality passing football and played anyone off the park. They were always sent out with the same game plan that we seem to have been lately.

If none of us are to comment on things we actually don't know for sure then this forum is pointless. You don't really want me leave it other wise you wouldn't be in here posting 1000 word replies. You would have left it.

yanno · Jan 23, 2009

Bus-Conductor said:
Try reading the article by the guy that worked with him at southampton, it's not good reading. Basically Redkanpp sacked him for suggestingthat the players need him to be coaching them instead of sitting in his office reading the Racing Post while Kevin Bond teaches them how to run backwards on the training ground.

I remember seeing a sequence on Sky where Chris Kamara wanders from the training ground, where Kevin Bond is trying to be sergeant-majorly with the players, to the manager's office, and walks inside to find 'Arry & Jim Smith with their feet up on the desk reading the Racing Post.

Admittedly it was a staged piece, but you can't imagine Jol or Ramos or O'Neill or Whinger being filmed in such circumstances - even in jest.

Then there's all that stuff about 'Arry telling Mandaric at a board meeting that Jim Smith was "useless", then denying it and blaming Mandaric, until they end up having a totally phoney lurve-in.

The likes of Clive Allen and Alex Inglethorpe seem to be proper coaches. I wish they'd been given a chance instead of Kevin Bond - a guy with a long and, um, tangled history with Redknapp - and an appalling coaching record.

Bus-Conductor · Jan 23, 2009

yanno said:
I remember seeing a sequence on Sky where Chris Kamara wanders from the training ground, where Kevin Bond is trying to be sergeant-majorly with the players, to the manager's office, and walks inside to find 'Arry & Jim Smith with their feet up on the desk reading the Racing Post.

Admittedly it was a staged piece, but you can't imagine Jol or Ramos or O'Neill or Whinger being filmed in such circumstances - even in jest.

Then there's all that stuff about 'Arry telling Mandaric at a board meeting that Jim Smith was "useless", then denying it and blaming Mandaric, until they end up having a totally phoney lurve-in.

The likes of Clive Allen and Alex Inglethorpe seem to be proper coaches. I wish they'd been given a chance instead of Kevin Bond - a guy with a long and, um, tangled history with Redknapp - and an appalling coaching record.

Me too. Kevin Bond coaching us worries the shit out of me. Even more than Redknapp. Seriously what the fuck can a thick donkey like Bond have in his coaching repertoire ? It';s a joke. he's there because he's one of the only ****'s in football stupid enough to say yes to everything Redknapp suggests.

DEFchenkOE · Jan 23, 2009

yanno said:
The likes of Clive Allen and Alex Inglethorpe seem to be proper coaches. I wish they'd been given a chance instead of Kevin Bond - a guy with a long and, um, tangled history with Redknapp - and an appalling coaching record.

If we were to get relegated I would like to see one of these two given the opportunity to manage the first team.

eddiebailey · Jan 23, 2009

yanno said:
The likes of Clive Allen and Alex Inglethorpe seem to be proper coaches. I wish they'd been given a chance instead of Kevin Bond - a guy with a long and, um, tangled history with Redknapp - and an appalling coaching record.

Yes, I'll go along with that, I am a big fan of Clive, and Inglethorpe seems to be getting the best out of his talented squad.

I still hold Harry was the right appointment for the circumstances we found ourselves in, but I must admit alarm bells rang with his choice of coaches.

yanno · Jan 23, 2009

eddiebailey said:
Yes, I'll go along with that, I am a big fan of Clive, and Inglethorpe seems to be getting the best out of his talented squad.

I still hold Harry was the right appointment for the circumstances we found ourselves in, but I must admit alarm bells rang with his choice of coaches.

I'd be happier if Clive was still next to Redknapp on the bench, rather than always seeming further and further away. I'm content with Joe Jordan as part of the coaching set-up: he is a genuinely ferocious "Bad Cop" character. But Kevin Bond....

I'm quietly confident that Palacios will be exactly the type of CM we desperately need: someone who can close down space, win the ball or break up opposition attacks through clever positioning, and use the ball quickly and simply. The kind of player who helps the team to play good football. And will help the likes of Modric to be more consistently influential.

And Defoe is a good player, even if he should never ever ever play up front, away from home, on his own, again.

But Redknapp has never been much of a coach, or very tactically astute, and I really wish he'd keep his mouth shut.

danielneeds · Jan 23, 2009

yanno said:
I remember seeing a sequence on Sky where Chris Kamara wanders from the training ground, where Kevin Bond is trying to be sergeant-majorly with the players, to the manager's office, and walks inside to find 'Arry & Jim Smith with their feet up on the desk reading the Racing Post.

Admittedly it was a staged piece, but you can't imagine Jol or Ramos or O'Neill or Whinger being filmed in such circumstances - even in jest.

I think the whole "Racing Post" story is a red herring basically made up by someone who thought starting a soccer school mean't he was god's gift to coaching and was pissed off when Redknapp frooze him out at Southampton.

Whatever faults he may have (and there are many in my mind), I would not doubt Redknapp's commitment to the job. The guy is 61, and is getting up at 5am and getting home around 8 in the evening. I don't think I would have the stomach for that and I am in my twenties.

al_pacino · Jan 23, 2009

I have no idea of Kevin Bonds quality as a coach but reading some of these posts reminds me of a call I heared on Talksport a couple of years ago from a (female)Man U fan, it went something along the lines of " Manchester united will win nothing with Mike Phelen on the bench". my point is can Kevin Bond or indeed any coach that works for many years in the pro game be that bad.

Bus-Conductor · Jan 23, 2009

al_pacino said:
I have no idea of Kevin Bonds quality as a coach but reading some of these posts reminds me of a call I heared on Talksport a couple of years ago from a (female)Man U fan, it went something along the lines of " Manchester united will win nothing with Mike Phelen on the bench". my point is can Kevin Bond or indeed any coach that works for many years in the pro game be that bad.

Dave Basset.

Bus-Conductor · Jan 23, 2009

Brian Kidd

Bus-Conductor · Jan 23, 2009

Glen Roeder

Coyboy · Jan 23, 2009

Bus-Conductor said:
Blaming Comolli isn't a red herring at all. I have been one of Comolli staunchest defenders on here, but the as director of football who over saw the purchase of Bent for 16m, Bentley for 15m, the sale of Defoe, Berbatov and Keane in six months and the failure to provide adequate - if not anywhere near as good as I know that would be fucking hard - replacements he was the most culpable and I think his public admission of his disapointment in doing so spoke volumes. I think Everybody could see that going into a season in the ever more competitive EPL with Bent (incredibly limited and not really fitting with the style of football we were trying to play), Campbell (a championship standard kid) and Pav (having played a whole season of Russian football plus euros) was a real recipe for disaster.

I was disapointed that Ramos let the CC win spread some apathy into the squad, but we were safe, in europe and had very little motivation and some players knew they were leaving. Still not acceptable but slightly understandable.

I don't care what anyone says, in the first 8 games this season we put in some good footballing performances, but due to the inadequecy of strikers and the lack of the rub we didn't win. Don't fucking tell me that a team that has 30% of the ball deserves to win a game. It may suit your argument to say that but none of us with even the most rudimentary understanding of football really beieves that.

As for Redknapp, in my opinion he is a prick. He talks shit at every opportunity to engratiate himself with the football press. 10 games ago he was taking all the credit for turning us into a great team. Soon as he's had chance to work with the players and they stop passing and moving and go out to "not loose" and end up getting beat they are all ****'s and he can't put enough distance between himself and them.

Try reading the article by the guy that worked with him at southampton, it's not good reading. Basically Redkanpp sacked him for suggestingthat the players need him to be coaching them instead of sitting in his office reading the Racing Post while Kevin Bond teaches them how to run backwards on the training ground.

And the phalacy that he over achieved with Portsmouth is laughable. He spent alot of money at Portsmouth, more than Martin O'Neil at Villa or David Moyes at Everton. At West Ham he had players like Ferdinand, Cole , Lampard, Kanoute, Sinclair, Foe, DiCanio, Defoe, Carrick to name but a few at Portsmouth he had Diarra, Diop, Distin , James, Johnson, Kranjar, Muntari, Crouch, Defoe, Yakubu, Mendes.

Yet I didn't ever see one game where they played quality passing football and played anyone off the park. They were always sent out with the same game plan that we seem to have been lately.

If none of us are to comment on things we actually don't know for sure then this forum is pointless. You don't really want me leave it other wise you wouldn't be in here posting 1000 word replies. You would have left it.

Ok let's just take each striker separately shall we rather than bundle them into a set of players Comolli managed to shed. Defoe was not getting into the team, he wanted to leave and his contract was running down. That's a no brainer. Berbatov wanted to leave, Levy wanted to get as much money as possible from that. It dragged on and on. Pav was his replacement. Keane wanted to leave, there are rumours that Ramos was happy to let him go. I am not sure about it so won't disguise it as fact as you have with some of your ridiculous and personal assertions about Rednapp and Bond. Either way he was sold and not replaced with Arshavin. Comolli failed there and Levy perhaps was naive to think he could get anything out of those Russian mercenaries.

But this is the important question, was that change in striking options enough to send us to the bottom of the table?

We didn't put in good footballing performances. Against Hull we were unlucky, but when you play well and lose to Hull you know you have problems. Arsenal certainly did/do and so did/do Newcastle. We might not have got a penalty at Wigan or Pompey but by the same token the latter scored two goals and the former almost scored but for Gomes and woodwork I believe. The 'rub' works both ways. Look at Bent's goals at Chelsea and Villa. Lucky. Look at our own goals at Boro and Krakow. Lucky. You make your own luck.

You are either being stupid, which I doubt, or deliberately betraying Rednapp's words because you are losing an argument you cannot win. When did Rednapp say he has made us into a 'great team'? When did he say all the players were ****s? What he has said is that but for a few-our awesome centre backs and Zokora basically- we lack character? You have been saying the same thing all season, that we lack leadership and mettle. If Rednapp puts a decent team out there with good players and you see Huddlestone lazing around or Taarabt trying to emulate Beckham in the twentieth minute of extra time and you see next to no one chasing opposition, that is Rednapp's fault.

People think Rednapp has some sort of love in with the press. When I see him speak lately, it doesn't look like he is best mates with Geoff Shreeves but is severely pissed off at some people's attitude. Compare that to Ramos' pathetic comments after the Stoke game and I would take Rednapp's candour every time. And then I would also point out that it is words to fill websites, evening papers and radio time and move on.

You are going back to that article by the South Coast samba star? You must be desperate.

When did I say he was a better coach than Moyes or O'Neil? The latter is world class and the former has such potential. Levy could have gone after either, maybe he could have got O'Neil pre Jol but he would have got neither in October. However both manage big clubs. As big as us they are. A Villa mate and this random Evertonian were trying to wind me up in the battler cruiser a while back saying both were bigger than us and maybe they are. Therefore each club has the infrastructure and draw that Pompey and even West Ham do not, not to mention bigger and better stadiums.

Despite that, Rednapp led West Ham to fifth and Pompey from relegation certainties to top half finishers and FA Cup winners. I bet their fans weren't thinking 'what a prick and an underachiever he is' when they were at Wembley having been looking at trips to God knows where a few months previously. Yes Rednapp did have some good players at both clubs. Funny that, he signed all of them and brought the rest through the youth ranks. Can you imagine how good Ferdinand et al would have been if Rednapp hadn't got his filthy hands on them?

Rednapp knows who to buy to build a team. Ramos selected some players we didn't need and others who look like they won't play much more here. Rednapp has signed a proven goalscorer and a battler in midfield. And yet so many posters will be waiting for the next 'over the hill' signing to 'prove'
their snobbish and prejudiced views of Rednapp are true. If we can get a Distin or a James vis-à-vis experience, then I won't be complaining.

And let me make a distinction for you mate. You can say 'I don't think Rednapp is a good coach because ....' but you cannot say without looking desperate that Rednapp is shit because this guy wrote a blog saying 'my enduring memory of Rednapp is reading the RC ergo he does it all the time'. You can do better than that.

One last question; given your two assertions that Ramos' Spurs were the best Spurs side in twenty years and that Rednapp is a prick, do you think you can cling to any objectivity and fair analysis?

Bus-Conductor · Jan 23, 2009

SpurSince57 · Jan 23, 2009

Bus-Conductor said:
Blaming Comolli isn't a red herring at all. I have been one of Comolli staunchest defenders on here, but the as director of football who over saw the purchase of Bent for 16m, Bentley for 15m, the sale of Defoe, Berbatov and Keane in six months and the failure to provide adequate - if not anywhere near as good as I know that would be fucking hard - replacements he was the most culpable and I think his public admission of his disapointment in doing so spoke volumes. I think Everybody could see that going into a season in the ever more competitive EPL with Bent (incredibly limited and not really fitting with the style of football we were trying to play), Campbell (a championship standard kid) and Pav (having played a whole season of Russian football plus euros) was a real recipe for disaster.

I was disapointed that Ramos let the CC win spread some apathy into the squad, but we were safe, in europe and had very little motivation and some players knew they were leaving. Still not acceptable but slightly understandable.

I don't care what anyone says, in the first 8 games this season we put in some good footballing performances, but due to the inadequecy of strikers and the lack of the rub we didn't win. Don't fucking tell me that a team that has 30% of the ball deserves to win a game. It may suit your argument to say that but none of us with even the most rudimentary understanding of football really beieves that.

As for Redknapp, in my opinion he is a prick. He talks shit at every opportunity to engratiate himself with the football press. 10 games ago he was taking all the credit for turning us into a great team. Soon as he's had chance to work with the players and they stop passing and moving and go out to "not loose" and end up getting beat they are all ****'s and he can't put enough distance between himself and them.

Try reading the article by the guy that worked with him at southampton, it's not good reading. Basically Redkanpp sacked him for suggestingthat the players need him to be coaching them instead of sitting in his office reading the Racing Post while Kevin Bond teaches them how to run backwards on the training ground.

And the phalacy that he over achieved with Portsmouth is laughable. He spent alot of money at Portsmouth, more than Martin O'Neil at Villa or David Moyes at Everton. At West Ham he had players like Ferdinand, Cole , Lampard, Kanoute, Sinclair, Foe, DiCanio, Defoe, Carrick to name but a few at Portsmouth he had Diarra, Diop, Distin , James, Johnson, Kranjar, Muntari, Crouch, Defoe, Yakubu, Mendes.

Yet I didn't ever see one game where they played quality passing football and played anyone off the park. They were always sent out with the same game plan that we seem to have been lately.

If none of us are to comment on things we actually don't know for sure then this forum is pointless. You don't really want me leave it other wise you wouldn't be in here posting 1000 word replies. You would have left it.

So Comolli was responsible for Berbatov wanting to bugger off to United and Ramos finally deciding Defoe he had no future here and possibly letting Keane know he wasn't good enough? It wouldn't be the first time Ramos pissed off players. After he jumped ship from Sevilla for the readies (possibly because they started last season almost as badly as we did, and if he'd stayed any longer Levy might have started asking the questions he should have asked before). Do you imagine we went after Pav and Arshavin solely because Comolli wanted them? That Ramos had absolutely no input at all? Pull the other one. Which of these muppets failed to realise that Pav would be cup-tied for Europe? One? Both?

You defend Comolli when it suits you. Summer 2007? All Jol's fault. Summer 2008? All Comolli's. Right…

The start of this situation was a continuation of last season. Not just after the CC, from before that. You seem to be alone in the conviction that we actually played well in the opening eight games.

Not that I'd have wanted Redknapp for manager, but you harp on about his previous whilst ignoring Wendy's less-than-illustrious record pre-Sevilla. The man who put the 'mal' into Malaga. Who lost four of his first five games at Espanyol, drew the other and then stomped out, blaming the board. Who kept Betis firmly in mid-table. Who managed seven wins in 38 games with Barcelona B. Whose only success was getting Rayo into the Primera and thence into Europe via the fair play league. Whoopee! As Churchill said of Attlee, a modest little man with much to be modest about.

And then he lucked into an outstanding squad at Sevilla and acquired an undeserved reputation as some kind of genius. I said 18 months ago that I had grave misgivings about him. Sorry for being right.

arnoldlayne · Jan 23, 2009

al_pacino said:
I have no idea of Kevin Bonds quality as a coach but reading some of these posts reminds me of a call I heared on Talksport a couple of years ago from a (female)Man U fan, it went something along the lines of " Manchester united will win nothing with Mike Phelen on the bench". my point is can Kevin Bond or indeed any coach that works for many years in the pro game be that bad.

Step forward Mr Maclaren, Mr Brian Robson, Mr Souness, Mr Southgate, etc

Bus-Conductor · Jan 23, 2009

SpurSince57 said:
So Comolli was responsible for Berbatov wanting to bugger off to United and Ramos finally deciding Defoe he had no future here and possibly letting Keane know he wasn't good enough? It wouldn't be the first time Ramos pissed off players. After he jumped ship from Sevilla for the readies (possibly because they started last season almost as badly as we did, and if he'd stayed any longer Levy might have started asking the questions he should have asked before). Do you imagine we went after Pav and Arshavin solely because Comolli wanted them? That Ramos had absolutely no input at all? Pull the other one. Which of these muppets failed to realise that Pav would be cup-tied for Europe? One? Both?

You defend Comolli when it suits you. Summer 2007? All Jol's fault. Summer 2008? All Comolli's. Right…

.

right.

arnoldlayne · Jan 23, 2009

danielneeds said:
I think the whole "Racing Post" story is a red herring basically made up by someone who thought starting a soccer school mean't he was god's gift to coaching and was pissed off when Redknapp frooze him out at Southampton.

Whatever faults he may have (and there are many in my mind), I would not doubt Redknapp's commitment to the job. The guy is 61, and is getting up at 5am and getting home around 8 in the evening. I don't think I would have the stomach for that and I am in my twenties.

I suggest you read the book "Broken Dreams" regarding Redknapp.

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The Double of 1961 is still The Double

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