Tottenham Vs Stoke: Match Thread

chris_theo said:

Under AVB like some others I really started to dislike football. Never looked forward to any games, no sense of joy watching our team, now I feel like we can attack again and the chains have been broken!

So what if it was 'only Stoke' today, it was also 'only West Ham' but we got beat by the same margin. Regardless of the results against the two scums, if we attack and actually try to win the game I'll be happy.

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davidmatzdorf said:

It's not really fair to start analysing today's match without pointing out that Stoke were largely inept. They have the personnel for a good, solid defence, but their midfield was so incapable of controlling possession today that their defence was put under continuous pressure throughout the match and had to play beyond themselves to keep the score down to 3. Crouch became visibly fed up as the second half wore on, having virtually no supply of the ball and no support at all, from Walters or anyone.

Even their wingers rarely saw the ball, because our 2 man midfield totally controlled the game, before and after Paulinho was replaced by Capoue. As I wrote twice here since the West Brom game, you can get away with playing 4-4-2 if you pass accurately, which we did - and if your strikers help out in midfield when required, which both Adebayor and Soldado did today. There was no single five-minute period of today's match when Stoke's midfield had even a toehold on the game. Dembélé, Paulinho and then Capoue totally dominated them, with great assistance from Eriksen drifting in and cutting back from his ostensible position on the left. It wasn't that Stoke failed to close down - it's just that our midfielders fought harder and with more skill and usually came out with the ball.

The much-abused Naughton, restored to his natural position for the first time in ages in the league, had an admirable game, solid in defence and creative in attack, including arguably the best pass of the whole match, on about 15 minutes into the space behind Stoke's left back for Lennon to attack. I always get the impression that Fryers is playing within himself, conservatively, as if he wants to establish himself as a competent defender before he tries anything ambitious. That's not a bad plan for a young fullback, but today he didn't really have much option, as Eriksen was rarely giving him any protection or an attacking partner. No matter, because Stoke hadn't the wit or the pace to take advantage. He did well and handled his corner of the defence calmly.

Adebayor may not have scored (both strikers fluffed too many chances), but he had an excellent game in every other respect, chasing down, winning the ball, helping out in defence, making up the numbers in midfield when required, holding up the ball and passing intelligently.

There is little to say about our defenders, because both of them and the goalkeeper had a quiet afternoon. Stoke had two shots. We had twenty.

And that is where we have to say 'however'. The game should have been over and out of sight before half time. We could easily have gone in 3-0 ahead and really should have scored 5 or 6 today. But, as usual, we didn't, we kept everyone waiting for a half-hour for the first goal, despite repeated sieges on Stoke's penalty area, and we didn't score the second until an hour had passed. We still need 20 chances to score a goal. We managed to score 3 from 20 shots today, but there were at least another 15 attacks that should have produced shots, but didn't.

For an hour, it looked very much like one of numerous other nervous matches this season when we mounted waves of attacks without reward, with the score at 0-0 or 1-0. This time we scored the second goal and the game was over from that point, because Stoke never looked like scoring. But I kept thinking that Man City or Liverpool or Arsenal would have scored 5 or more against Stoke the way they played today.

A word about entertainment. Sherwood's side is fun to watch. AVB's side, although it was similarly effective at garnering points, was not fun to watch. Playing 4-4-2 might not be the way to win the league, but the second half against Southampton was football to enjoy and so was this entire match. If we can get 7 points from 3 games, scoring 7 goals and conceding 3, playing this way, then perhaps the wails and waves of fury (before the match) about Sherwood's 'incompetent', 'naive' and 'insane' decisions just make those who hold them look plain stupid. It isn't about the team selection and it isn't about the notional formation. It's about getting the players to play with a sense of freedom and confidence.

It cannot be coincidence that we have just scored 3 goals in a game for the second time in 3 matches under Sherwood. Under AVB this season, we scored 3 goals in a league game exactly 0 times.

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hillbilly said:

After seeing Stoke mount, I think, one single attack on goal, you wonder why any of their fans bother to travel to away games. Dedication!

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Sum Monsterism said:

I think you're the only one suggesting AVB is a "tactical genius" which is odd, given your obvious dislike of the guy. In the words of the big man: You've vexed me.

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davidmatzdorf said:

It's not really fair to start analysing today's match without pointing out that Stoke were largely inept. They have the personnel for a good, solid defence, but their midfield was so incapable of controlling possession today that their defence was put under continuous pressure throughout the match and had to play beyond themselves to keep the score down to 3. Crouch became visibly fed up as the second half wore on, having virtually no supply of the ball and no support at all, from Walters or anyone.

Even their wingers rarely saw the ball, because our 2 man midfield totally controlled the game, before and after Paulinho was replaced by Capoue. As I wrote twice here since the West Brom game, you can get away with playing 4-4-2 if you pass accurately, which we did - and if your strikers help out in midfield when required, which both Adebayor and Soldado did today. There was no single five-minute period of today's match when Stoke's midfield had even a toehold on the game. Dembélé, Paulinho and then Capoue totally dominated them, with great assistance from Eriksen drifting in and cutting back from his ostensible position on the left. It wasn't that Stoke failed to close down - it's just that our midfielders fought harder and with more skill and usually came out with the ball.

The much-abused Naughton, restored to his natural position for the first time in ages in the league, had an admirable game, solid in defence and creative in attack, including arguably the best pass of the whole match, on about 15 minutes into the space behind Stoke's left back for Lennon to attack. I always get the impression that Fryers is playing within himself, conservatively, as if he wants to establish himself as a competent defender before he tries anything ambitious. That's not a bad plan for a young fullback, but today he didn't really have much option, as Eriksen was rarely giving him any protection or an attacking partner. No matter, because Stoke hadn't the wit or the pace to take advantage. He did well and handled his corner of the defence calmly.

Adebayor may not have scored (both strikers fluffed too many chances), but he had an excellent game in every other respect, chasing down, winning the ball, helping out in defence, making up the numbers in midfield when required, holding up the ball and passing intelligently.

There is little to say about our defenders, because both of them and the goalkeeper had a quiet afternoon. Stoke had two shots. We had twenty.

And that is where we have to say 'however'. The game should have been over and out of sight before half time. We could easily have gone in 3-0 ahead and really should have scored 5 or 6 today. But, as usual, we didn't, we kept everyone waiting for a half-hour for the first goal, despite repeated sieges on Stoke's penalty area, and we didn't score the second until an hour had passed. We still need 20 chances to score a goal. We managed to score 3 from 20 shots today, but there were at least another 15 attacks that should have produced shots, but didn't.

For an hour, it looked very much like one of numerous other nervous matches this season when we mounted waves of attacks without reward, with the score at 0-0 or 1-0. This time we scored the second goal and the game was over from that point, because Stoke never looked like scoring. But I kept thinking that Man City or Liverpool or Arsenal would have scored 5 or more against Stoke, the way they played today.

A word about entertainment. Sherwood's side is fun to watch. AVB's side, although it was similarly effective at garnering points, was not fun to watch. Playing 4-4-2 might not be the way to win the league, but the second half against Southampton was football to enjoy and so was this entire match. If we can get 7 points from 3 games, scoring 7 goals and conceding 3, playing this way, then perhaps the wails and waves of fury (before the match) about Sherwood's 'incompetent', 'naive' and 'insane' decisions just make those who hold them look plain stupid. It isn't about the team selection and it isn't about the notional formation. It's about getting the players to play with a sense of freedom and confidence.

It cannot be coincidence that we have just scored 3 goals in a game for the second time in 3 matches under Sherwood. Under AVB this season, we scored 3 goals in a league game exactly 0 times.

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idontgetit said:

Average player positions today. Almost a 4-3-3

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SargeantMeatCurtains said:

Im going today....i've never seen Spurs lose at the lane...

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davidmatzdorf said:

It's not really fair to start analysing today's match without pointing out that Stoke were largely inept. They have the personnel for a good, solid defence, but their midfield was so incapable of controlling possession today that their defence was put under continuous pressure throughout the match and had to play beyond themselves to keep the score down to 3. Crouch became visibly fed up as the second half wore on, having virtually no supply of the ball and no support at all, from Walters or anyone.

Even their wingers rarely saw the ball, because our 2 man midfield totally controlled the game, before and after Paulinho was replaced by Capoue. As I wrote twice here since the West Brom game, you can get away with playing 4-4-2 if you pass accurately, which we did - and if your strikers help out in midfield when required, which both Adebayor and Soldado did today. There was no single five-minute period of today's match when Stoke's midfield had even a toehold on the game. Dembélé, Paulinho and then Capoue totally dominated them, with great assistance from Eriksen drifting in and cutting back from his ostensible position on the left. It wasn't that Stoke failed to close down - it's just that our midfielders fought harder and with more skill and usually came out with the ball.

The much-abused Naughton, restored to his natural position for the first time in ages in the league, had an admirable game, solid in defence and creative in attack, including arguably the best pass of the whole match, on about 15 minutes into the space behind Stoke's left back for Lennon to attack. I always get the impression that Fryers is playing within himself, conservatively, as if he wants to establish himself as a competent defender before he tries anything ambitious. That's not a bad plan for a young fullback, but today he didn't really have much option, as Eriksen was rarely giving him any protection or an attacking partner. No matter, because Stoke hadn't the wit or the pace to take advantage. He did well and handled his corner of the defence calmly.

Adebayor may not have scored (both strikers fluffed too many chances), but he had an excellent game in every other respect, chasing down, winning the ball, helping out in defence, making up the numbers in midfield when required, holding up the ball and passing intelligently.

There is little to say about our defenders, because both of them and the goalkeeper had a quiet afternoon. Stoke had two shots. We had twenty.

And that is where we have to say 'however'. The game should have been over and out of sight before half time. We could easily have gone in 3-0 ahead and really should have scored 5 or 6 today. But, as usual, we didn't, we kept everyone waiting for a half-hour for the first goal, despite repeated sieges on Stoke's penalty area, and we didn't score the second until an hour had passed. We still need 20 chances to score a goal. We managed to score 3 from 20 shots today, but there were at least another 15 attacks that should have produced shots, but didn't.

For an hour, it looked very much like one of numerous other nervous matches this season when we mounted waves of attacks without reward, with the score at 0-0 or 1-0. This time we scored the second goal and the game was over from that point, because Stoke never looked like scoring. But I kept thinking that Man City or Liverpool or Arsenal would have scored 5 or more against Stoke, the way they played today.

A word about entertainment. Sherwood's side is fun to watch. AVB's side, although it was similarly effective at garnering points, was not fun to watch. Playing 4-4-2 might not be the way to win the league, but the second half against Southampton was football to enjoy and so was this entire match. If we can get 7 points from 3 games, scoring 7 goals and conceding 3, playing this way, then perhaps the wails and waves of fury (before the match) about Sherwood's 'incompetent', 'naive' and 'insane' decisions just make those who hold them look plain stupid. It isn't about the team selection and it isn't about the notional formation. It's about getting the players to play with a sense of freedom and confidence.

It cannot be coincidence that we have just scored 3 goals in a game for the second time in 3 matches under Sherwood. Under AVB this season, we scored 3 goals in a league game exactly 0 times.

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TottenhamMattSpur said:

Not gonna lie, I've no idea what vexed means or in what context you mean it.

I wasn't suggesting avb was a genius in any way other than sarcastic.

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SargeantMeatCurtains said:

I'll take credit for that result then lads.

Cheers

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davidmatzdorf said:

It's very difficult, after a result like today's, to take it seriously when people get hot and bothered at me, just because I sometimes point out, sometimes drily, sometimes with sarcasm, that, basically, a lot of the members here are fuckwits of the first order.

Intemperate, abusive, vicious about our own players and managers without cause, absolutely certain of themselves and with zero justification. Just read back the pre-match thread: the rants about 4-4-2, the blistering rage - before the match - about team selection, the contempt for 2 or 3 individual players who were amongst our best performers today.

I prefer to keep my judgments to myself until after the event. Which I will now compose.

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Goofster said:

Still can't let go of the shit attitude of Adebayor for example when Lamela had his shot blocked out for a corner and Adabayor instantly got on his back for not passing to him. That's not gonna give the team mates confidence now will it? Piss poor attitude.

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idontgetit said:

Agree about that Ade was getting ratty towards the end of the game, you could tell he really fancied himself for a goal once they started flying in and was annoyed he was getting a go. Shouted twice at Lamela when Lamela had taken the correct options and then we he had a chance to play Lamela in on goal he took a shot instead which was blocked three yards away. The guy was a beast all game but his attitude does my head in, it's always going to creep into his game

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