Rio Olympics 2016

UpTownSpur · Aug 22, 2016

nightgoat said:
That's not what I said, but fits with your constant revisionism. But I'd love to see you take your crackpot little theory to WADA. You'd get laughed out of the door. Or take the David Walsh approach and get the Times to publish your thesis on 'Why Novak Djokovic is a Drug Cheat Because He Lost One Match'. Both would be hilarious. I'll get those tanks ready...

As for Semenya, like I said it is not a case of clear absolutes. But her presence has clearly not deterred other athletes from competing. Semenya is not unbeatable. The time she ran in the final was only the 20th fastest of all time. She didn't even make the final of last year's World Championships. I get that you wish every women's event was contested solely by pretty little blonde girls, but unfortunately for you that is not the case.

Your delusion has been a great source of entertainment during these Olympics, especially the way you think I wouldn't reply because of a hashtag.

You seem quite ignorant of all the facts. She didn't make the World Championship finals last year because her, and indeed the silver medallist, were taking medication to bring their testosterone down to normal female levels, which were the rules at the that time. But earlier this year an Indian female athlete with testicles won a case at the Court of Arbitration for sport, and these rules were suspended for two years, allowing female athletes with testicles to compete without taking medication. What happened? The women with testicles' times started plummeting. Don't the female athletes without testicles have a right to feel aggrieved? The rules were changed just months before the race they'd been training their whole careers for. And to make matters worse, a third women with testicles, Wambui, has appeared on the scene from nowhere, and going into the final they knew there was next to no chance of even getting a bronze - when several had been aiming for gold previously.

It took Kelly Holmes and Mo Farah years to develop the experience and race craft to win medals, and runners like Bishop of Canada and our own Lynsey Sharp were reaching this time in their careers, only to see a runner barely out her teens, Wambui, running past them for bronze even, and silver and gold were off in the distance.

All the top times in the women's 800m were set during the era of PEDs and it should, in theory, be impossible to get near them, yet she got within a couple of seconds of it as a teenager! She could probably break the WR if she wanted and I think she was sandbagging in the final - there's quite a telling picture of her crossing the line looking like she's barely broken sweat, while everyone behind her is open mouthed and gasping for air. The dilemma for her that breaking the WR would bring too much additional attention.

I think we'll start to see the consequences of these events at next year's World Championships. I just don't think the women without testicles are gonna be able to find the motivation to train when they know they can't even compete for a bronze.

Arnoldtoo · Aug 22, 2016

I think there is a very difficult decision to be made with the hyperandrogenous athletes, which I suspect may eventually have to go against them.

What I am very sure of is that to refer to them in the way at least some have done in here, for an accident of birth, is contemptible.

talkshowhost86 · Aug 22, 2016

THFCSPURS19 said:
Now you're just trolling. Federer is arguably the best tennis player to ever live, but he hasn't managed to win the Mens' Singles event at the Olympics. Is he doping as well?

I'm a bit worried about the accusations flying around in here considering I too have never won an Olympic tennis medal.

talkshowhost86 · Aug 22, 2016

UpTownSpur said:
You seem quite ignorant of all the facts. She didn't make the World Championship finals last year because her, and indeed the silver medallist, were taking medication to bring their testosterone down to normal female levels, which were the rules at the that time. But earlier this year an Indian female athlete with testicles won a case at the Court of Arbitration for sport, and these rules were suspended for two years, allowing female athletes with testicles to compete without taking medication. What happened? The women with testicles' times started plummeting. Don't the female athletes without testicles have a right to feel aggrieved? The rules were changed just months before the race they'd been training their whole careers for. And to make matters worse, a third women with testicles, Wambui, has appeared on the scene from nowhere, and going into the final they knew there was next to no chance of even getting a bronze - when several had been aiming for gold previously.

It took Kelly Holmes and Mo Farah years to develop the experience and race craft to win medals, and runners like Bishop of Canada and our own Lynsey Sharp were reaching this time in their careers, only to see a runner barely out her teens, Wambui, running past them for bronze even, and silver and gold were off in the distance.

All the top times in the women's 800m were set during the era of PEDs and it should, in theory, be impossible to get near them, yet she got within a couple of seconds of it as a teenager! She could probably break the WR if she wanted and I think she was sandbagging in the final - there's quite a telling picture of her crossing the line looking like she's barely broken sweat, while everyone behind her is open mouthed and gasping for air. The dilemma for her that breaking the WR would bring too much additional attention.

I think we'll start to see the consequences of these events at next year's World Championships. I just don't think the women without testicles are gonna be able to find the motivation to train when they know they can't even compete for a bronze.

And the award for the most uses of the word 'testicles' in a post goes to.....

aussiespursguy · Aug 22, 2016

The Joker is no Doper! He is just a fantastic player.

talkshowhost86 · Aug 22, 2016

MaccSpurs said:
Are you young? Suggesting I am trolling because you do not understand makes me think you are young.

Anyway....

It's irrelevant because I am talking about Djokovic and you are going off on one, and now naming other players, because you have nothing valid to add.

Maybe you should stick to talking about football using FIFA 16 statistics

To be fair I'm not sure how you can add anything valid against an argument that is basically 'he lost one match therefore he's clearly on drugs'.

Gassin's finest · Aug 22, 2016

There's some disagreeable sods about these days isn't there?

Gb160 · Aug 22, 2016

Gassin's finest said:
There's some disagreeable sods about these days isn't there?

No there's not.

pffft · Aug 22, 2016

talkshowhost86 said:
And the award for the most uses of the word 'testicles' in a post goes to.....

Did you just call his post a load of bollocks?

MaccSpurs · Aug 22, 2016

talkshowhost86 said:
To be fair I'm not sure how you can add anything valid against an argument that is basically 'he lost one match therefore he's clearly on drugs'.

To be fair if you are not sure then don't add anything so thank you for this because this is the exact point I was making but boy did he try

Gassin's finest · Aug 22, 2016

MaccSpurs said:
To be fair if you are not sure then don't add anything so thank you for this because this is the exact point I was making but boy did he try

Are you old? Because disparaging someone by suggesting they are young, because you don't think they understand, and then making a quip about playing video games, makes me think that you are old.

Maybe you should stick to talking about how it was better in your day, when you used to tie an onion to your belt (which was the style at them time...)

MaccSpurs · Aug 22, 2016

Gassin's finest said:
Are you old? Because disparaging someone by suggesting they are young, because you don't think they understand, and then making a quip about playing video games, makes me think that you are old.

Maybe you should stick to talking about how it was better in your day, when you used to tie an onion to your belt (which was the style at them time...)

Don't be upset. It's not worth it

nightgoat · Aug 22, 2016

UpTownSpur said:
You seem quite ignorant of all the facts. She didn't make the World Championship finals last year because her, and indeed the silver medallist, were taking medication to bring their testosterone down to normal female levels, which were the rules at the that time. But earlier this year an Indian female athlete with testicles won a case at the Court of Arbitration for sport, and these rules were suspended for two years, allowing female athletes with testicles to compete without taking medication. What happened? The women with testicles' times started plummeting. Don't the female athletes without testicles have a right to feel aggrieved? The rules were changed just months before the race they'd been training their whole careers for. And to make matters worse, a third women with testicles, Wambui, has appeared on the scene from nowhere, and going into the final they knew there was next to no chance of even getting a bronze - when several had been aiming for gold previously.

It took Kelly Holmes and Mo Farah years to develop the experience and race craft to win medals, and runners like Bishop of Canada and our own Lynsey Sharp were reaching this time in their careers, only to see a runner barely out her teens, Wambui, running past them for bronze even, and silver and gold were off in the distance.

All the top times in the women's 800m were set during the era of PEDs and it should, in theory, be impossible to get near them, yet she got within a couple of seconds of it as a teenager! She could probably break the WR if she wanted and I think she was sandbagging in the final - there's quite a telling picture of her crossing the line looking like she's barely broken sweat, while everyone behind her is open mouthed and gasping for air. The dilemma for her that breaking the WR would bring too much additional attention.

I think we'll start to see the consequences of these events at next year's World Championships. I just don't think the women without testicles are gonna be able to find the motivation to train when they know they can't even compete for a bronze.

She was having to take testosterone suppressing medication in 2011 as well but still came second in the Worlds in Daegu (to a doped Russian). So you can't state that as the reason she didn't make the final in 2015.

Five of the fastest women's 800m times in history were set by Pamela Jelimo, all faster than Semenya's national record. If she hadn't been ruined by injury she'd most likely have been favourite for the 800m in Rio. It doesn't matter that Semenya ran 1:55 as a teenager. Usain Bolt ran within 0.02 seconds of the then 100m world record as a 19 year old.

David Rudisha looked barely out of breath when he won the men's 800m and every other competitor was bent over knackered.

Gassin's finest · Aug 22, 2016

MaccSpurs said:
Don't be upset. It's not worth it

UpTownSpur · Aug 22, 2016

nightgoat said:
She was having to take testosterone suppressing medication in 2011 as well but still came second in the Worlds in Daegu (to a doped Russian). So you can't state that as the reason she didn't make the final in 2015.

Five of the fastest women's 800m times in history were set by Pamela Jelimo, all faster than Semenya's national record. If she hadn't been ruined by injury she'd most likely have been favourite for the 800m in Rio. It doesn't matter that Semenya ran 1:55 as a teenager. Usain Bolt ran within 0.02 seconds of the then 100m world record as a 19 year old.

David Rudisha looked barely out of breath when he won the men's 800m and every other competitor was bent over knackered.

The rules about suppressing testosterone only began a few months before the 2011 and she was still benefiting from having had male levels of it to build her muscles up with, and the upper limit introduced was very generous and 5 times the normal female levels. Post the 2012 Olympics, she basically disappeared into obscurity, only re-emerging when the limits were removed.

I'm not sure what your point is about Bolt. He got close to the record as a teenager then smashed it a few years later, so Semenya should be capable of smashing the 800m record.

You only seem to be seeing it from her point of view, and not the people who have suffered from the unfair advantage she has. To be fair, it's taken a lot of balls to do what she's done.

Gb160 · Aug 22, 2016

Haha...Speedo have dropped Ryan Lochte as a sponsor.
Good.
Dickhead.

nightgoat · Aug 22, 2016

UpTownSpur said:
The rules about suppressing testosterone only began a few months before the 2011 and she was still benefiting from having had male levels of it to build her muscles up with, and the upper limit introduced was very generous and 5 times the normal female levels. Post the 2012 Olympics, she basically disappeared into obscurity, only re-emerging when the limits were removed.

I'm not sure what your point is about Bolt. He got close to the record as a teenager then smashed it a few years later, so Semenya should be capable of smashing the 800m record.

You only seem to be seeing it from her point of view, and not the people who have suffered from the unfair advantage she has. To be fair, it's taken a lot of balls to do what she's done.

The IAAF had her on a course of testosterone suppressing medication from 2009. They only legislated it in 2011, but she still beat everyone except a doped up Russian at the Worlds that year.

The point about Bolt was that you cast aspersion on Semenya getting to within 2 seconds of the world record as a teenager, as if that was some kind of validation of the attacks on her. But if Usain Bolt could get so close to the 100m world record at a similar age, does that not cast similar doubt on him? You can't have it both ways.

I can see the opposing viewpoint, but like I've said before, it's a complex situation which doesn't have an easy solution. She was born like that, it's not as if she has been surgically altered. Is it unfair, or even wrong to insist that an athlete has to take body-altering medication in order or compete? Yes it is, and it also starts to blur lines regarding performance enhancing doping. Does she have a genetic advantage over other athletes? Probably. Michael Phelps has a lung capacity twice that of the average man, but no one suggests that he should be doctored in order to make the competition 'fairer', or even banned from competition.

DIEHARD · Aug 22, 2016

Im depressed... nothing on tv now.

Fuck this life.

DIEHARD · Aug 22, 2016

MaccSpurs said:
Tell that to Lynsey Sharp who no matter how hard she trains will never, ever, ever win a race against men.

I just realised... she finished sixth.. she cant even win a race against women. So even without semenya she will have finished fifth.

Maybe she is just shit? Just putting it out there.

UpTownSpur · Aug 22, 2016

DIEHARD said:
I just realised... she finished sixth.. she cant even win a race against women. So even without semenya she will have finished fifth.

Maybe she is just shit? Just putting it out there.

The top three were all intersex with male levels of testosterone, and probably testicles like Semenya, so she would have got a bronze without them. We were actually robbed of a brilliant race between three or four athletes at the peak of their careers who all ran PBs - but instead we got a load of bollocks.

Forums

What's new

Matches

Sportsbook

Members

Rio Olympics 2016

Says it like it is

The thinking ape's ape

Mod-Moose

Mod-Moose

Well-Known Member

Mod-Moose

C'est diabolique

Well done boys. Good process

some kind of member

Well-Known Member

C'est diabolique

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

C'est diabolique

Says it like it is

Well done boys. Good process

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Says it like it is

Similar threads