So, you got what you wanted...

[Davo99]

Mate.........the drugs were strong this summer, I take it?

He's spot on. When we needed players being added and integrated we signed little or nothing. We didn't slowly build and add to something we were trying to mould. Window after window passed with nothing and then we sold Bale and just went nuts and signed every **** and his mate all in one go. Not how it's done.

 

[MikeCOYS]

We've gone from lower table to being a constant presence around the Champions League spots. We play in Europe every year, we have broken dozens of decades-long hoodoos!

Year after year we're slowly bridging the gap between us and the so called top 4. We were unfortunate that previous seasons we were either robbed off CL by lucky Chelsea win in the final, and also not to qualify when we've racked up record points last year.

Having said that, being the typical Spurs, the team had to drop points against shit teams and don't gain the upperhand when other top teams are losing. We only try hard when we desperately need it. Why can't they try hard from the start and try to build a bigger lead? Instead of giving themselves a much bigger task to do by losing and then try win the next two games against top teams?

Although no matter how silly this is it happens every year. You'd thought the boys would have learnt their lessons by now -_-

 

[jambreck]

I don't see any huge increase in silverware!

Ah, right, so when you said that "the only way we've come forward as a club (under Levy) is financially", you were ignoring every way of measuring how we might have progressed other than the specific measure of winning trophies?

I can see your point. But I can't help feeling that it's incredibly limited.

But never mind. Carry on.

 

[jambreck]

He's spot on. When we needed players being added and integrated we signed little or nothing. We didn't slowly build and add to something we were trying to mould. Window after window passed with nothing and then we sold Bale and just went nuts and signed every **** and his mate all in one go. Not how it's done.

Riiiiight.....so we didn't sign Hugo Lloris, Jan Vertonghen, Emmanuel Adebayor, Moussa Dembele, Clint Dempsey, Gylfi Sigurdsson and Lewis Holtby last season?

Or we did sign them but, collectively, they constitute "little or nothing"? It was another window of "inaction"?

 

[jambreck]

Glenn fucking Hoddle?

Really?

That's how you refer to a legend at this club?

Behave.

 

[Caco]

Ah, right, so when you said that "the only way we've come forward as a club (under Levy) is financially", you were ignoring every way of measuring how we might have progressed other than the specific measure of winning trophies?

I can see your point. But I can't help feeling that it's incredibly limited.

But never mind. Carry on.

Is that not what competing in football is about? I know what you're saying but I would rather see Spurs win a Europa League than compete in the champions league as an example. But never mind, I'll carry on!

 

[Davo99]

Riiiiight.....so we didn't sign Hugo Lloris, Jan Vertonghen, Emmanuel Adebayor, Moussa Dembele, Clint Dempsey, Gylfi Sigurdsson and Lewis Holtby last season?

Or we did sign them but, collectively, they constitute "little or nothing"? It was another window of "inaction"?

Why have you got to sound like a dick? Just talk man there's no need to be a smart arse.

So you've been happy with every single window? When we'd need a striker we'd sign two defenders and a goalkeeper. When we still need a striker and a defender we'd sign something else. A lot of the deals seemed to be just good deals for players that were available at good prices rather than what we actually needed to be bringing in. And the past window was just crazy. It's not that we haven't bought good players it just the timing and how the players were bought that wasn't the best.

 

[jambreck]

Is that not what competing in football is about? I know what you're saying but I would rather see Spurs win a Europa League than compete in the champions league as an example. But never mind, I'll carry on!

I wouldn't say that competing at football is all about winning trophies. If it was, a good 80 Premier League and Football League clubs might as well pack up right now, wouldn't you say?

But all those other things that I mentioned, that you didn't apparently deem to be important........do you think it possible that they might help to get us closer to regularly winning trophies and thereby fulfilling the sole purpose of competing at football, according to your definition?

I agree with you, by the way, that I would love to see us winning the Europa League. Hopefully, you can agree with me that we're more likely to have a chance of doing so now that we regularly finish in the top 5 or 6 and qualify for Europe rather than when we regularly finished in lower table and could only dream of qualifying for Europe prior to Levy taking over.

 

[jambreck]

Why have you got to sound like a dick? Just talk man there's no need to be a smart arse.

So you've been happy with every single window? When we'd need a striker we'd sign two defenders and a goalkeeper. When we still need a striker and a defender we'd sign something else. A lot of the deals seemed to be just good deals for players that were available at good prices rather than what we actually needed to be bringing in. And the past window was just crazy. It's not that we haven't bought good players it just the timing and how the players were bought that wasn't the best.

Apologies. Was following your lead.

 

[ohtottenham!]

Regularly getting top 4 and thereby competing in the CL is an indication of a stronger team, stronger squad etc., Those clubs are also more likely to win the Europa League after getting knocked out of the earlier CL rounds. Competing in the CL also gives clubs added revenue and the ability to keep good players, and attract top-quality targets. Give me regular top 4 and CL any day of the week, and we'd be in a better position to win the EL anyway.

 

[jambreck]

If he walked I couldn't fucking blame him. He didn't deserve all the bollocks he got, he deserved a lot better. I know recent results weren't great but he has his team sold from underneath him, gets another thrown together and thrown at him and when he's not doing even better than the year before he gets sacked. It's embarrassing yet so, so typical.

Sounds suspiciously as though you're saying that Spurs were a one man team last season.

Let me get this right.......are you trying to support AVB or attack him?

 

[guy]

Which part of 18 months of dull, limp, anti football do people not comprehend?

AVB was going backwards not progressing. He had his chance to show some, any progression. Nope, he blew it. He got sacked. Move on

How you can feel sorry for him I have no idea. He gets paid millions, and gets millions more for being sacked FFS (something like 10mill from us and the chavs), for doing his job badly. Fk me I wish I could do that. He promised us attacking football and delivered the exact opposite.

 

[jambreck]

And that is precisely the point - that AVB was judged before he took the reins. That refusal - outright, petty, unreasoned, child-tantrum level refusal - is at least partly to blame for our current predicament.

My esteem to those who actually picked up the point - that during AVB's tenure, as a group we felt it more important to rail against the coach, to sow negativity and discord among the fans than to get behind the man.

And my pity for those of you who STILL. DON'T. GET. IT.

That for all your harping, all your complaining, all your booing, all your hatred, all your mindless armchair management opinions which are backed up with not one joy of actual, professional, experience, we're still in the shit.

You're all so keen to blame someone else - AVB, 'Arry, Adebayor, Levy... Don't you bear some of the fucking responsibility? When do you stand and get counted? When do you learn that all the shit you've been pouring out for the last 16 months has contributed to this miasmic shitstorm we're in right now? And that next time, instead of getting on the manager's back just cause he's not YOUR first choice, you actually support him - even if you think he's not the right man.

Pull your heads out of the sand, get behind the club (and for those who say 'I support the club, not the manager' - the manager is PART of the club, morons!) and stop grinding axes.

We cannot continue like this - it has to stop! I stopped posting on SC because I got tired of the constant sniping, the constant attacks on the manager, the players, the chairman. Not once did I see any of the snipers turn around and say, 'you know what? I bear some of the responsibility for this.'

No, no, no. It was always, 'I pay my money, I have a right to boo', or 'I can criticise all I want - I've been to the Lane 4 billion times'.

Guys, it has to stop. We are damaging ourselves and our club. I know I've gone on a bit of a screed-fest here, but I was trying to make a point, and I apologise for the fury and the ire. Whatever happens next, we have to come back together. We need to celebrate our commonality - our love for our club.

Regardless of income, colour, religion or gender, we are all the same in this one thing.

Please, for the love you have for your club, can we come back together? Can we stop the negativity, can we stop the sniping?

Whatever happens next, let's face it together - without having battle lines drawn. And that applies to all of us - we've all been guilty of vitriol and acting resentfully.

The time to stop is now.

You keep on lecturing us, at length, about the need to stop sniping and to show unity. Yet you have started (and continue to contribute to) possibly the most divisive thread on this forum.

I fully supported AVB. I really wanted him to succeed. I still think that he could have, given time. But equally, I fully understand why others had had enough - including AVB himself, it seems. And Levy, of course. So I don't feel the need to point accusing fingers at those who didn't share my faith in AVB - especially since such behaviour could only ever add to the negativity that you claim to abhor.

I also think that you are massively overstating any manifest negativity in the stadium itself. There really was very little booing. And absolutely no chanting against the manager. The atmosphere at the Lane has been flat rather than toxic.

 

[jambreck]

All AVB wanted from Levy was Moutinho.

Absolute bollocks.

I know that even you don't believe that. He wanted far more than that. And fair enough. No harm asking.

But as much as AVB might have wanted Moutinho, transfers aren't simple transactions. You can't just point at what you want and instantly have it. Transfers involve multiple parties (and Moutinho's potential transfer involved more than most). There is no set price. You can't just walk into a shop and buy a player. There is no ebay style "Buy Now" facility.

Levy tried to buy Moutinho for AVB. But he was not able to do so. It happens. We had to move on.

 

[ohtottenham!]

We are the most under-achieving big club in the country; no major trophy since '91, no title since '61. Yet, we still have one of the largest and most loyal fanbases across the land. That's not only a point of pride, but an indication of fan loyalty and love for the club, despite the lack of success. I understand the OP's frustration with the negativity of some folks, and I agree with him, but there's always been a diversity of opinion among Spurs' fans. Being constructively critical of a coach is to be expected if it's deserved. My own opinion is, we were damn right to pull the plug. AVB had mitigating factors in his defence, but just not enough of them, and things really didn't look like they were changing. The "are you happy?" scolding tone does not help any kind of constructive debate IMO.

 

[jambreck]

It's going to take some time to undo the mess AVB left behind. It bears repeating that sacking Harry was one of the dumbest decisions Levy has made and now he's dug a bloody awful hole of losing for us to try to clamber out of.

Harry dug his own grave.

But let's not revisit it, eh?

 

[yankspurs]

Today was fun for all of about 10 minutes when we fired in about 20 crosses that were all shit crosses. Lets be real here, we NEVER had control of the game. The entire game was just Lennon and Townsend running at them, never getting in the box. Defoe was absolutely pitiful, as per usual. The game changed hands when Ade came off not because of having 5 in the midfield again, but because the tactics stay the exact same. Just run at them and hope Defoe can hold up a ball and stay on sides(Tim has not watched Defoe in a while, has he?). No fucking ball control. Dembele and Siggy were absent all game due to the tactics. In attack, we were essentially playing with 3 men(Lennon, Townsend and Ade). Honestly, I HATED the football we played. Im sick of that bullshit "We got our Tottenham back." Fuck off to QPR, why dont you. This Harry shit we saw today was just that, shit. We have the players to run a 4231 and 433. Not a fucking 442 flat and regress back to Harry. "But he got us 4th with it!" Yeah and Andre got us our highest points total ever in the Premier League with the 4231 using the players fit for a 442. Now we have players for a 4231 and 433. The only thing that was missing was freedom. AVB's instructions were too strict and he shit the bed on team selections too much. That is not a fucking reason to go 442. Fuck off back to the youth squad or go be Harry's butt buddy at QPR, Tim and get the fuck away from my first team. Ugh. I pray to god that we bring in an actual manager tomorrow.

 

[ohtottenham!]

Levy tried to buy Moutinho for AVB. But he was not able to do so. It happens. We had to move on.

On that point, I actually agree that Levy should have done more to either acquire Moutinho or a similar player. We don't have one, and I can see quite clearly that a Moutinho would have made a difference. But, by the same token, that outcome actually highlighted the fact that AVB wasn't the right long-term solution for us. Say if he we'd signed Moutinho, he did well, and then got injured, we'd still need a plan B. AVB didn't show that he could adapt and formulate strategy and tactics while considering, most crucially, the actual strengths and limitations of the players at his disposal. Getting Moutinho would have helped us for a while, but AVB would still have had to confront the other familiar challenges he showed he couldn't overcome. I won't even mention the strategy we had in our attacking third.

 

[guy]

If AVB wanted a moutinho type so much, why didn't he identify someone else, who was an attainable target, that plays the same way? The argument has no basis because AVB has since gone out and picked Paulinho and Capuoe, who play nothing like moutinho.

You cant tell me there's not a single other player on earth who plays the same way as Joao Moutinho

 

[Fergus]

I was pro-AVB, even after the Man City result, as City would have trounced a lot of teams playing the way they did. However, I have been watching Spurs since 1961 (I know......) and I have seen some terrible performances, but last Sunday was the first time I ever saw a Tottenham Hotspur team give up before half time against anyone. That kind of disease requires immediate and radical surgery.