Match Threads Spurs vs Man City - Match Thread - Day 9

[thebenjamin]

I think this is what Jose is coaching the players on. Kane did the same for Son’s goal.

Shout out to Aurier today, Ive been one of his critics but he has turned it around. I dont pay too much attention when fans say this manager or that has improved this or that player or not. I think in those instances where the player has improved its down the the player maturing or been managed by someone who sees what they do best and puts them in the role that suits them best. Aurier now, Jose indicates right from the start in the All Or Nothing documentary that he couldnt trust him (hinted about his rashness), also actually seems to have kept him from making any challenges in our penalty area for a time. Now Aurier has become trust worthy and dependable. He was very good today along with our whole defence. The results JM is getting at the moment is making me wonder if he was managing us the year Leicester won the title or Chelsea after that, if we would have won instead.
Lastly I recall some Spurs fans in the last year or so saying tosh like Kane isnt good enough. Shockers, looking like fools.

Best game he's had for us. Looked a top full back

 

[lis spur]

Our defensive performances have improved because Mourinho has the whole team playing coordinated and positionally astute defence.

He isn't playing games. Alderweireld's face told you that. It looks like a pulled or torn adductor and they take a l-o-n-g time to recover from.

We'll see how mature Rodon is now, because I don't expect that Sanchez or Tanganga will be handling the Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool and Leicester matches. Mourinho's defensive priorities are pretty clear already.

Agree on The Sanhez point.

 

[Seafordian Spurs]

What a stupid Tweet. Of course they cost more than our defence because he is comparing 13 players against our 4.

The thing with City's defense is bizarre. Remember when Mendy was a big deal for about 10 minutes before he got injured and has been shit since.....John Stones, the great English hope of non hoofball defense...and there as that bloke who they signed for tonnes from Porto who played well in his debut against Chelsea and was last seen on loan to Valencia.

Ahh well, fuck 'em.

 

[C0YS]

No easy games this season and Southampton ain't no mid table team based on their form over the last 12 months.

No, but that is not my point.

I said Southampton were an upper table team. The point is simple. We have played less of the top 6/7 than our rivals, so we will only know how well we are placed after we play them. Namely the next few weeks. That is it. Nothing that you said is in any way a response to what I was saying.

 

[pablo73]

I was saying all through the first half that we are not good enough defensively to sit back and concede so much possession.

Turns out I was wrong. Some brilliant defensive performances but special shout out to Dier and Hojberg. Kane was just on a another level.

 

[C0YS]

You've missed his point entirely. You're basing your assessment of "difficult matches" on our opponents' reputations. His whole point is that, if you base them instead on this season's performance, we have played clubs that have otherwise done well. We've played Everton, West Ham, Newcastle and Southampton, none of whom are anywhere near the relegation zone, plus both Manchester clubs - and we're top of the league.

Ok I get that, but it is still irrelevant to the fact that our rivals have played each other more than we've played them and therefore our position is a slightly different one. The fact that many teams we faced have patches of good form (though it's worth pointing out only West Ham were in anything resembling good form when we actually played them) is irrelevant.

The form table shows Southampton and West Ham in good form, but that's it. Which would actually still not place us as having a particularly tough run compared to others.

 

[Shadydan]

Ok I get that, but it is still irrelevant to the fact that our rivals have played each other more than we've played them and therefore our position is a slightly different one. The fact that many teams we faced have patches of good form (though it's worth pointing out only West Ham were in anything resembling good form when we actually played them) is irrelevant.

Chelsea have had an easier start than us.

Besides all that though I don't get this false position stuff, the table doesn't lie.

 

[Lenn0n]

Lots of really good points made in this chat. Id like to call out Sissoko (not that he was necessarily the best player on the pitch) who is doing a really good defensive job for us at the moment. In this match and in the last few - I have had a few moments when I thought thank God for Sissoko!

 

[RichieS]

That was absolute filth by Ndombele.

 

[handsomecake]

hook it into my veins you sexy ****s

 

[C0YS]

Chelsea have had an easier start than us.

Besides all that though I don't get this false position stuff, the table doesn't lie.

Well, it does, in fact, it lies all the time. At the end of the season. Yeah it doesn't. There is a reason that it used to be a thing that you only look at the table after 10 games. Chelsea haven't had a particularly tough run, but have faced 3 top 6/7 teams. I accept that the top 6 may no longer exist this season, They've also faced Southampton, but I don't think that's a big deal.

Man utd have faced 3
Liverpool have faced 3 (soon to be 4)
Man city have faced 4
Arsenal have faced 4
Leicester have faced 2 (as is probably reflected in their position, though soon to be 3)

These are likely to be our direct rivals unless something very extreme changes.

We've faced 2, before today, we'd played only one . That is low, and we are now going on an incredibly difficult run, where we essentially play all of them in a row. Now, let's talk about the table. If we get out of this run, with a 2 points per game average, we are in an extremely good position to challenge for the title. Even if we end up temporarily in 3rd or 4th position after this run. After this run, the table will, again be lying, as we would have gone through the traditionally 'big' games and we should be able to pick up more points in the run that follows.

Even in the form table, you would see that we have played 4 games of top 10 teams in form and 5 games of teams in the bottom half. Arsenal have had an incredibly tough run, so have Man city, and they rise up the table very quickly, unless something has gone wrong. The table is not particularly unusual for this time of the year.

In match week 9 last season

1. Liverpool.
Unusual Positions: 6th Palace. 14th Man utd

18/19

1. Man City
Unusual Positions: Man Utd 10th, Bournmouth 6th

17/18

1.Man City
Unusual Positions: Watford 6th Liverpool 9th

Now. The good thing is that the top after 9 matches has won the league. But none were close leagues, or particularly competitive. Many had a situation where the top 6 was really locked in and you had a two-tier league. The last two seasons, as tv money has made every PL team able to buy top class players from abroad and the league has got tighter. This season it looks even tighter than before. Where you have an incredibly poor bottom three but apart from that, it's all very tight. And you do have a number of teams underachieving, but not by much (Arsenal and Man city are 3 points from top 6 and Man utd at 2 points)

The league early in the season is particularly tight. Just look at us. 2 points a game is generally considered what you need to finish in the top 4 (normally it will lead to 3rd position). Chelsea, temporarily in second have that number. We have 20 points in 9 games. Only 2 points more. To win the league you need about 85 points. Normally a bit higher. The last three seasons have had unusually high league-leading numbers, but normally 85-90. We are set for 84 or 85 points with our current total. Which is title contention. So at the end of the season, if we maintain the same sort of point scoring. We would be 8 or 9 points above Chelsea. That's a decent gap. Currently, all that it would take is for Chelsea to beat us, or Chelsea to win and us to draw.

So, early season is very volatile and subject to very small things. One result has a major impact in league position and points per game totals. So, the league needs a certain number of games, it needs it to be able to settle, so one unusual result doesn't dramatically alter league position (as mentioned before the difference between 12th and 6th is 3 points). You also need more games so you have a fairly equal number of different kinds of games played. As the season moves on, it does more become about the next match etc, but early on everything is not settled, it's just generally much more likely to have unusual things happen because it only takes one random result to change things.

The thing is we have been victims to odd results that are not reflective of how we've actually played. We should be comfortably top right now. But we should have been comfortably top with only playing one of who are likely to be our main rivals. We also have a very unusual schedule this year. I don't ever remember having so many tough games lined up after each other, and the thing is, we could play perfectly well and still end up with very few points out of those games and if that were to happen (though this result does change things) we could easily be midtable. I don't think we will, but we conceivably could, without any of those results being particularly strange or unexpected.

We have started the season amazingly well, and we have every possibility to go through these 5 games and be in a dominant position, but before we play those five games, I'm not getting carried away. If we get 8 points out of those 5, I think we are set for a good season. If we get 10 points out of those 5, and no one runs away with it, I think we have title chances. If we get more than that. We are in a very strong position.

 

[sherbornespurs]

Us today.

 

[Shadydan]

Well, it does, in fact, it lies all the time. At the end of the season. Yeah it doesn't. There is a reason that it used to be a thing that you only look at the table after 10 games. Chelsea haven't had a particularly tough run, but have faced 3 top 6/7 teams. I accept that the top 6 may no longer exist this season, They've also faced Southampton, but I don't think that's a big deal.

Man utd have faced 3
Liverpool have faced 3 (soon to be 4)
Man city have faced 4
Arsenal have faced 4
Leicester have faced 2 (as is probably reflected in their position, though soon to be 3)

These are likely to be our direct rivals unless something very extreme changes.

We've faced 2, before today, we'd played only one . That is low, and we are now going on an incredibly difficult run, where we essentially play all of them in a row. Now, let's talk about the table. If we get out of this run, with a 2 points per game average, we are in an extremely good position to challenge for the title. Even if we end up temporarily in 3rd or 4th position after this run. After this run, the table will, again be lying, as we would have gone through the traditionally 'big' games and we should be able to pick up more points in the run that follows.

Even in the form table, you would see that we have played 4 games of top 10 teams in form and 5 games of teams in the bottom half. Arsenal have had an incredibly tough run, so have Man city, and they rise up the table very quickly, unless something has gone wrong. The table is not particularly unusual for this time of the year.

In match week 9 last season

1. Liverpool.
Unusual Positions: 6th Palace. 14th Man utd

18/19

1. Man City
Unusual Positions: Man Utd 10th, Bournmouth 6th

17/18

1.Man City
Unusual Positions: Watford 6th Liverpool 9th

Now. The good thing is that the top after 9 matches has won the league. But none were close leagues, or particularly competitive. Many had a situation where the top 6 was really locked in and you had a two-tier league. The last two seasons, as tv money has made every PL team able to buy top class players from abroad and the league has got tighter. This season it looks even tighter than before. Where you have an incredibly poor bottom three but apart from that, it's all very tight. And you do have a number of teams underachieving, but not by much (Arsenal and Man city are 3 points from top 6 and Man utd at 2 points)

The league early in the season is particularly tight. Just look at us. 2 points a game is generally considered what you need to finish in the top 4 (normally it will lead to 3rd position). Chelsea, temporarily in second have that number. We have 20 points in 9 games. Only 2 points more. To win the league you need about 85 points. Normally a bit higher. The last three seasons have had unusually high league-leading numbers, but normally 85-90. We are set for 84 or 85 points with our current total. Which is title contention. So at the end of the season, if we maintain the same sort of point scoring. We would be 8 or 9 points above Chelsea. That's a decent gap. Currently, all that it would take is for Chelsea to beat us, or Chelsea to win and us to draw.

So, early season is very volatile and subject to very small things. One result has a major impact in league position and points per game totals. So, the league needs a certain number of games, it needs it to be able to settle, so one unusual result doesn't dramatically alter league position (as mentioned before the difference between 12th and 6th is 3 points). You also need more games so you have a fairly equal number of different kinds of games played. As the season moves on, it does more become about the next match etc, but early on everything is not settled, it's just generally much more likely to have unusual things happen because it only takes one random result to change things.

The thing is we have been victims to odd results that are not reflective of how we've actually played. We should be comfortably top right now. But we should have been comfortably top with only playing one of who are likely to be our main rivals. We also have a very unusual schedule this year. I don't ever remember having so many tough games lined up after each other, and the thing is, we could play perfectly well and still end up with very few points out of those games and if that were to happen (though this result does change things) we could easily be midtable. I don't think we will, but we conceivably could, without any of those results being particularly strange or unexpected.

We have started the season amazingly well, and we have every possibility to go through these 5 games and be in a dominant position, but before we play those five games, I'm not getting carried away. If we get 8 points out of those 5, I think we are set for a good season. If we get 10 points out of those 5, and no one runs away with it, I think we have title chances. If we get more than that. We are in a very strong position.

Football is played on grass mate not on paper, you're unnecessarily over analysing things. You can't say for sure what games are easier than others because you're ignoring too many factors. Aston Villa was meant to be an easier game than Chelsea was for Liverpool for example.

So no the table doesn't lie, teams being in a false position is just nonsense hence why league positions gets decided by points and not potential.

 

[rossdapep]

Well, it does, in fact, it lies all the time. At the end of the season. Yeah it doesn't. There is a reason that it used to be a thing that you only look at the table after 10 games. Chelsea haven't had a particularly tough run, but have faced 3 top 6/7 teams. I accept that the top 6 may no longer exist this season, They've also faced Southampton, but I don't think that's a big deal.

Man utd have faced 3
Liverpool have faced 3 (soon to be 4)
Man city have faced 4
Arsenal have faced 4
Leicester have faced 2 (as is probably reflected in their position, though soon to be 3)

These are likely to be our direct rivals unless something very extreme changes.

We've faced 2, before today, we'd played only one . That is low, and we are now going on an incredibly difficult run, where we essentially play all of them in a row. Now, let's talk about the table. If we get out of this run, with a 2 points per game average, we are in an extremely good position to challenge for the title. Even if we end up temporarily in 3rd or 4th position after this run. After this run, the table will, again be lying, as we would have gone through the traditionally 'big' games and we should be able to pick up more points in the run that follows.

Even in the form table, you would see that we have played 4 games of top 10 teams in form and 5 games of teams in the bottom half. Arsenal have had an incredibly tough run, so have Man city, and they rise up the table very quickly, unless something has gone wrong. The table is not particularly unusual for this time of the year.

In match week 9 last season

1. Liverpool.
Unusual Positions: 6th Palace. 14th Man utd

18/19

1. Man City
Unusual Positions: Man Utd 10th, Bournmouth 6th

17/18

1.Man City
Unusual Positions: Watford 6th Liverpool 9th

Now. The good thing is that the top after 9 matches has won the league. But none were close leagues, or particularly competitive. Many had a situation where the top 6 was really locked in and you had a two-tier league. The last two seasons, as tv money has made every PL team able to buy top class players from abroad and the league has got tighter. This season it looks even tighter than before. Where you have an incredibly poor bottom three but apart from that, it's all very tight. And you do have a number of teams underachieving, but not by much (Arsenal and Man city are 3 points from top 6 and Man utd at 2 points)

The league early in the season is particularly tight. Just look at us. 2 points a game is generally considered what you need to finish in the top 4 (normally it will lead to 3rd position). Chelsea, temporarily in second have that number. We have 20 points in 9 games. Only 2 points more. To win the league you need about 85 points. Normally a bit higher. The last three seasons have had unusually high league-leading numbers, but normally 85-90. We are set for 84 or 85 points with our current total. Which is title contention. So at the end of the season, if we maintain the same sort of point scoring. We would be 8 or 9 points above Chelsea. That's a decent gap. Currently, all that it would take is for Chelsea to beat us, or Chelsea to win and us to draw.

So, early season is very volatile and subject to very small things. One result has a major impact in league position and points per game totals. So, the league needs a certain number of games, it needs it to be able to settle, so one unusual result doesn't dramatically alter league position (as mentioned before the difference between 12th and 6th is 3 points). You also need more games so you have a fairly equal number of different kinds of games played. As the season moves on, it does more become about the next match etc, but early on everything is not settled, it's just generally much more likely to have unusual things happen because it only takes one random result to change things.

The thing is we have been victims to odd results that are not reflective of how we've actually played. We should be comfortably top right now. But we should have been comfortably top with only playing one of who are likely to be our main rivals. We also have a very unusual schedule this year. I don't ever remember having so many tough games lined up after each other, and the thing is, we could play perfectly well and still end up with very few points out of those games and if that were to happen (though this result does change things) we could easily be midtable. I don't think we will, but we conceivably could, without any of those results being particularly strange or unexpected.

We have started the season amazingly well, and we have every possibility to go through these 5 games and be in a dominant position, but before we play those five games, I'm not getting carried away. If we get 8 points out of those 5, I think we are set for a good season. If we get 10 points out of those 5, and no one runs away with it, I think we have title chances. If we get more than that. We are in a very strong position.

I posted this last week but us and Chelsea have played 6 teams the same.

We've got 16 points from them.
Chelsea have taken 12 from those 6 games.

We didn't beat Newcastle but we did beat United, West Brom and Southampton when they didn't.

And if we beat them next week we take a massive advantage as they need to beat City to get close to levelling it up.

 

[Dov67]

Bizarre that for all City’s possession and quality I was far more nervous against Burnley and wba than I was this evening. A few heart stopping moments but generally thought we were in control

 

[JCRD]

Us today.

Never seen Indian Jones... But that was funny... Didn't realise it was a comedy...

 

[slartibartfast]

Never seen Indian Jones... But that was funny... Didn't realise it was a comedy...

I thought you were ok.
Shows how wrong you can be
Sort your life out lol.

 

[rossdapep]

...oh and the teams Chelsea have played that we haven't are Sheff Utd, Crystal Palace and Liverpool.

They beat the first two but we have every chance of beating those. They lost to Liverpool and I wouldnt put it past Jose to give us a masterclass.


A lot of games to go but don't fall for this narrative that we haven't played anyone yet or our games have been easy.

 

[JCRD]

I thought you were ok.
Shows how wrong you can be
Sort your life out lol.

It really does look shit but that YouTube clip cracked me up

 

[wrd]

Well, it does, in fact, it lies all the time. At the end of the season. Yeah it doesn't. There is a reason that it used to be a thing that you only look at the table after 10 games. Chelsea haven't had a particularly tough run, but have faced 3 top 6/7 teams. I accept that the top 6 may no longer exist this season, They've also faced Southampton, but I don't think that's a big deal.

Man utd have faced 3
Liverpool have faced 3 (soon to be 4)
Man city have faced 4
Arsenal have faced 4
Leicester have faced 2 (as is probably reflected in their position, though soon to be 3)

These are likely to be our direct rivals unless something very extreme changes.

We've faced 2, before today, we'd played only one . That is low, and we are now going on an incredibly difficult run, where we essentially play all of them in a row. Now, let's talk about the table. If we get out of this run, with a 2 points per game average, we are in an extremely good position to challenge for the title. Even if we end up temporarily in 3rd or 4th position after this run. After this run, the table will, again be lying, as we would have gone through the traditionally 'big' games and we should be able to pick up more points in the run that follows.

Even in the form table, you would see that we have played 4 games of top 10 teams in form and 5 games of teams in the bottom half. Arsenal have had an incredibly tough run, so have Man city, and they rise up the table very quickly, unless something has gone wrong. The table is not particularly unusual for this time of the year.

In match week 9 last season

1. Liverpool.
Unusual Positions: 6th Palace. 14th Man utd

18/19

1. Man City
Unusual Positions: Man Utd 10th, Bournmouth 6th

17/18

1.Man City
Unusual Positions: Watford 6th Liverpool 9th

Now. The good thing is that the top after 9 matches has won the league. But none were close leagues, or particularly competitive. Many had a situation where the top 6 was really locked in and you had a two-tier league. The last two seasons, as tv money has made every PL team able to buy top class players from abroad and the league has got tighter. This season it looks even tighter than before. Where you have an incredibly poor bottom three but apart from that, it's all very tight. And you do have a number of teams underachieving, but not by much (Arsenal and Man city are 3 points from top 6 and Man utd at 2 points)

The league early in the season is particularly tight. Just look at us. 2 points a game is generally considered what you need to finish in the top 4 (normally it will lead to 3rd position). Chelsea, temporarily in second have that number. We have 20 points in 9 games. Only 2 points more. To win the league you need about 85 points. Normally a bit higher. The last three seasons have had unusually high league-leading numbers, but normally 85-90. We are set for 84 or 85 points with our current total. Which is title contention. So at the end of the season, if we maintain the same sort of point scoring. We would be 8 or 9 points above Chelsea. That's a decent gap. Currently, all that it would take is for Chelsea to beat us, or Chelsea to win and us to draw.

So, early season is very volatile and subject to very small things. One result has a major impact in league position and points per game totals. So, the league needs a certain number of games, it needs it to be able to settle, so one unusual result doesn't dramatically alter league position (as mentioned before the difference between 12th and 6th is 3 points). You also need more games so you have a fairly equal number of different kinds of games played. As the season moves on, it does more become about the next match etc, but early on everything is not settled, it's just generally much more likely to have unusual things happen because it only takes one random result to change things.

The thing is we have been victims to odd results that are not reflective of how we've actually played. We should be comfortably top right now. But we should have been comfortably top with only playing one of who are likely to be our main rivals. We also have a very unusual schedule this year. I don't ever remember having so many tough games lined up after each other, and the thing is, we could play perfectly well and still end up with very few points out of those games and if that were to happen (though this result does change things) we could easily be midtable. I don't think we will, but we conceivably could, without any of those results being particularly strange or unexpected.

We have started the season amazingly well, and we have every possibility to go through these 5 games and be in a dominant position, but before we play those five games, I'm not getting carried away. If we get 8 points out of those 5, I think we are set for a good season. If we get 10 points out of those 5, and no one runs away with it, I think we have title chances. If we get more than that. We are in a very strong position.

You're not taking into account that certain teams styles suit playing the so called top 6, you're presuming that everybody will have the same results vs the perceived hierarchy of the league. However when you look at Ours results this season, Leicester and Wolves over recent seasons you can say that that logic is flawed.