Tottenham Vs Wigan: Match Thread

[SteveH]

Hey guys,

UNDER ORDERS?
I'm beginning to wonder if AVB is 'under orders' - compiracy theory I know - but it happens everywhere and may be only temporary...
I'm wondering if Levy has 'mentioned' to AVB the importance of keeping our US players in the first team for a while - due to the NBC deal and all the potential US income we may get if our support base over there continues to grow.

http://www.cartilagefreecaptain.com...espn-tottenham-hotspur-united-states-contract

It is getting beyond 'strange' that someone like AVB would continue to field Friedel when everyone and his dog can see that Lloris is world class and although I really appreciate Friedel, there is no other way for Lloris to settle into Premiership football than .... well, playing in it!!!
As for Dempsey, I was glad to see him sign - instead of no-one - because he might chip in a few goals when he comes on as a sub for Defoe or Ade or even as a temporary second striker if we're chasing a game - but there is NO WAY his performances so far should keep him in the team and it does seem clear he will never be the permanent number 10, so why aren't we trying Falque or Ade at 10 temporarily?

The only other massive issue is Walker and I'm wondering if AVB is the ultra patient type (more than me anyway, but that's not saying much) in that he is hoping players like Dempsey and Walker will regain their confidence by playing week in week out.
Naughton has not failed in any way as far as I can tell, so there is no real excuse for keepig Walker in at the moment unless AVB is hoping he'll snap out of it. I never thought I'd rather see VERTS at LB - but if it means Walker is dropped and Naughton plays at RB - it might be worth it. He is a liability at the moment defensively.

I just hope that US deal is what Lloris is aware of and that it's only a temporary move to get sales going or something - but really - we are severely undermining the overall success of the team if it is.

UNDER ORDERS I'd play:

..................Friedel
Naughton Gallas Caulker Verts
............Sandro Dembele
........Lennon Dempsey Bale
....................Ade

without any restrictions, I'd play:

..................Lloris
Naughton Gallas Caulker Verts
............Sandro Dembele
.........Lennon Falque Bale
.....................Ade

Without any injuries, I'd play:

..................Lloris
Naughton Kaboul Verts BAE
.............Sandro Parker
.......Lennon Dembele Bale
....................Ade

Well.... I can see your thinking here.

Which is more than I can say regarding AVB at the moment.

 

[kcmei]

avb is no good

 

[JAYSTAR]

Well.... I can see your thinking here.

Which is more than I can say regarding AVB at the moment.

Hey Steve,

I really rate AVB so I have been getting more and more confused at him persisting with players so out of form or lacking confidence that i've begun to wonder if something else is going on. Then yesterday someone posted the US stuff and I thought 'great move Levy, we need the commercial side to grow if we want to before a bigger club...' and then it dawned on me (just like in my own job,) sometimes the boss (levy) has a certain agenda which he will ask his managers to implement.. Even if temporarily the 'department' suffers from a lack if morale. I think Defoe stormed off because he suspected Dempsey was being kept on for the wrong reasons.
That said, walker needs to be dropped anyway and Defoe needs to make way for Ade regardless. Livermore has had his chance and hudd is totally unfit so Carroll should come in as cover for dembele until Jan.

 

[tomo]

So Levy told AVB that even if we are losing a game and the fans are getting restless whatever you do don't take Dempsey off even if it tactically makes sense because he's from the US of A...............hmmm, ha ha ha.
I can appreciate Levy happily signing Dempsey because he is from the US for commercial as well as footballing reasons but the above its a little far fetched.
Managers are stubborn. To change it tacticly means to publicly show that they have got it tacticly wrong in the first place. AVB obviously has a great deal of belief in that system and thought it would eventually pay off against Wigan even though it was showing little sign of doing so.
However, he's not so aloof that he hasn't changed it before, like he did against QPR, so why he didn't yesterday only he can tell you - but I am sure it was for nothing other than football reasons however frustrating.
One thing that can't get lost in this is that the players need to try harder and that includes the fans favourites of Bale, Lennon and Adebayor. It didn't look like morale was great yesterday and AVB obviously needs to sort it in this area but you don't need to feel on cloud 9 to put in 100% and want to win.

 

[SteveH]

Hey Steve,

I really rate AVB so I have been getting more and more confused at him persisting with players so out of form or lacking confidence that i've begun to wonder if something else is going on. Then yesterday someone posted the US stuff and I thought 'great move Levy, we need the commercial side to grow if we want to before a bigger club...' and then it dawned on me (just like in my own job,) sometimes the boss (levy) has a certain agenda which he will ask his managers to implement.. Even if temporarily the 'department' suffers from a lack if morale. I think Defoe stormed off because he suspected Dempsey was being kept on for the wrong reasons.
That said, walker needs to be dropped anyway and Defoe needs to make way for Ade regardless. Livermore has had his chance and hudd is totally unfit so Carroll should come in as cover for dembele until Jan.

I wish you were right. But AVB just does not look like he is sadly going to work - I hope I'm wrong. I don't see him changing his ways which i believe is the crux of the matter.

AVB's Spurs has been woeful for the most part. He yes has not been helped by injuries but that happens and we have to deal with it.

He may need to play 442 and I can't see him making any changes to his management methodology - I really can't.

I think I've seen enough over the past few months that sadly makes me think AVB is not for Spurs.

Please don't use the Man U game as counter argument....that result/game was great but truly bizarre.

We are playing poor football and have done for most of this season.

I dont get any pleasure in saying this - but lets get real, Spurs fans.

 

[OnTheUp]

I wish you were right. But AVB just does not look like he is sadly going to work - I hope I'm wrong. I don't see him changing his ways which i believe is the crux of the matter.

AVB's Spurs has been woeful for the most part. He yes has not been helped by injuries but that happens and we have to deal with it.

He may need to play 442 and I can't see him making any changes to his management methodology - I really can't.

I think I've seen enough over the past few months that sadly makes me think AVB is not for Spurs.

Please don't use the Man U game as counter argument....that result/game was great but truly bizarre.

We are playing poor football and have done for most of this season.

I dont get any pleasure in saying this - but lets get real, Spurs fans.

Amen

 

[Spursidol]

BAE wants a word with a few 'fans' - please read from the bottom




16h Benoit Assou-Ekotto ‏@AssouEkotto
@ThfcCarly even in the bad game we to hear from u! Coze in football they is GOOD TIME AND BAD TIME!!! Is the football!

-Ekotto ‏@AssouEkotto
@Gunning_It nooo lol u just support arsenal thats all... Lol

6h Gunning It ‏@Gunning_It
All this 'LOL' from @AssouEkotto must stop... U sound like a teenage girl

15h Benoit Assou-Ekotto ‏@AssouEkotto
@JamestheyidJim so dont support us! Com wotch and go bk at home...WHL is not a CINEMA! Fans com to support in BAd or GOOD moment( TRUE FANS)

Benoit Assou-Ekotto ‏@AssouEkotto
@JamestheyidJim it can help man... Lol to remind to us as u r behind US! And for the other team to remnind them as they R at WHL!!! Lol


1h Benoit Assou-Ekotto ‏@AssouEkotto
@briansweeney9 we loose last season againts them too... And we finish 4! So no worry ! Season is long...

26m Benoit Assou-Ekotto ‏@AssouEkotto
@JamestheyidJim just give him a time...and in 1 or 2 year we ll c'...if he is good for us or no...-) lol

 

[OnTheUp]

BAE wants a word with a few 'fans' - please read from the bottom




16h Benoit Assou-Ekotto ‏@AssouEkotto
@ThfcCarly even in the bad game we to hear from u! Coze in football they is GOOD TIME AND BAD TIME!!! Is the football!

-Ekotto ‏@AssouEkotto
@Gunning_It nooo lol u just support arsenal thats all... Lol

6h Gunning It ‏@Gunning_It
All this 'LOL' from @AssouEkotto must stop... U sound like a teenage girl

15h Benoit Assou-Ekotto ‏@AssouEkotto
@JamestheyidJim so dont support us! Com wotch and go bk at home...WHL is not a CINEMA! Fans com to support in BAd or GOOD moment( TRUE FANS)

Benoit Assou-Ekotto ‏@AssouEkotto
@JamestheyidJim it can help man... Lol to remind to us as u r behind US! And for the other team to remnind them as they R at WHL!!! Lol


1h Benoit Assou-Ekotto ‏@AssouEkotto
@briansweeney9 we loose last season againts them too... And we finish 4! So no worry ! Season is long...

26m Benoit Assou-Ekotto ‏@AssouEkotto
@JamestheyidJim just give him a time...and in 1 or 2 year we ll c'...if he is good for us or no...-) lol

I love BAE but have to respectfuly disagree. Fans who have been following Spurs for 20 plus years know that getting owned by Wigan in your own back yard just isn't acceptable and deserves criticism. It wasn't just the result, the performance was dreadful and as other fans have noted this has been a feature of other games this season.

I doubt the majority of those booing were directing it at the players anyway. Much more likely the manager.

Hurry back BAE!!!!!

 

[TheGreenLily]

I wish you were right. But AVB just does not look like he is sadly going to work - I hope I'm wrong. I don't see him changing his ways which i believe is the crux of the matter.

AVB's Spurs has been woeful for the most part. He yes has not been helped by injuries but that happens and we have to deal with it.

He may need to play 442 and I can't see him making any changes to his management methodology - I really can't.

I think I've seen enough over the past few months that sadly makes me think AVB is not for Spurs.

Please don't use the Man U game as counter argument....that result/game was great but truly bizarre.

We are playing poor football and have done for most of this season.

I dont get any pleasure in saying this - but lets get real, Spurs fans.

I wonder why?

Because, dumbass fans, media and whole load of other shit jsut wont give the guy a break and everyone expects him to perform miracles with an utterly destroyed team.

Jesus fucking Christ.

 

[OnTheUp]

I wonder why?

Because, dumbass fans, media and whole load of other shit jsut wont give the guy a break and everyone expects him to perform miracles with an utterly destroyed team.

Jesus fucking Christ.

Yes, it's the fans and media's fault that we got beat by Wigan and are generally playing rubbish football this year.

*Queue debunked regurgitated injury, AVB inherited poor team excuses.

 

[Spurs_Bear]

I wonder why?

Because, dumbass fans, media and whole load of other shit jsut wont give the guy a break and everyone expects him to perform miracles with an utterly destroyed team.

Jesus fucking Christ.

Don't fucking tar all the fans with the same brush sunshine.

Some of us travel home and away to support the fucking team, you don't even watch the games you listen to them on the fucking radio!

 

[Sweetsman]

Again, personal attacks instead of football debate.

You think I want to be dis-liked?

It wasn't a personal attack, but here is one. I get fed up to the back teeth with jerks like you and your supposedly joined up thinking. Making grandstanding statements about it not being acceptable to owned by Wigan just illustrates what a fuckwit you are. If you got your head out of the Redknapp shaped hole it is in, you might want to ask yourself why it is that over the years we have had poor results against the likes of Wigan or how it is that this allegedly poor Wigan team owned Arsenal (with RVP in situ) last year. I wouldn't bother though as the few neurones in your head might give up the fucking ghost.

 

[Misfit]

My manlove for Benny grows. Wub.

 

[JimmyG2]

You can't make a silk purse out of a cows bum.
This s ia measurably inferior team to last years.
Vertonghen is a find and Caulker too.
But AVB has been dealt a bad hand by Levy, and injuries.
He hasn't been that clever in playing his cards but 10 games in
he doesn't deserve the boo boys at WHL
or the kind of abuse he is getting on here.

Friedel and Gallas are both accidents waiting to happen these days,
Walker has peaked at a very early age, Dempsey and Sigurdsson are
probably not good enough, they are certainly no VDV
Dembele is possibly a decent player but no Modric.

Lets exploit the transitional nature of the year and get some youngsters bloodied.
Mid table is fine by me as long as AVB sorts it out, faces down the boo brigade
and stops looking over his shoulder at the ghosts from W.London.

 

[SteveH]

I wonder why?

Because, dumbass fans, media and whole load of other shit jsut wont give the guy a break and everyone expects him to perform miracles with an utterly destroyed team.

Jesus fucking Christ.

Nah sorry TheGreenLily - the media have much bigger fish to fry now.

Its got nothing to with AVB 's history anymore - its to do with now!

And in the now we/Spurs are failing. Yes we are fifth but don't ask me for how much longer.

We are just very good at playing football this season - except for spasmodic, brief and bizarre moments like at ManU.

Dont let us hide behind "fickle Spurs fans not backing the manager" or as you say "the Media don't like AVB" its now irrelevant and a distraction.

We want AVB to succeed. But that is not going to make it happen - Sadly.

Time to face upto fact the "early" signs are far from good.

My question is how long does "early" last?

 

[Spursidol]

Maybe time to get some perspective

James Maw ‏@JamesMawFFT
Feb-Apr 2012 Spurs won 3 in 13. Feb-May 2011 Spurs won ONE in 13. Imagine the fuss if that had happened under AVB.

Hate losing, but time to figure out how to play through the current injury list - my take is to involve more u 21's who are looking pretty good in places where the first team is weak, coach them into the positions we need to fill and play some in Europa League matches and even some in Prenmieship matches. Maybe we unearth a gem or two.

Anyone saying 'lets buy in the transfer window' needs to remember that's two months away - lots of games in that time.

 

[TheGreenLily]

Yes, it's the fans and media's fault that we got beat by Wigan and are generally playing rubbish football this year.

*Queue debunked regurgitated injury, AVB inherited poor team excuses.

Then you obviously have no idea of the psychological effects that the media and fans can have a persons mentality or frame of mind, thus by proxy through your way of thinking, fans have no baring on a black players mentality when subjected to 90 minutes of monkey chants.

Did we lose to the likes of Wigan under Harry.... Can I point you to the one win in ten games last season?

And yes, it is ok to get beat by Wigan at home. It happens, we are in transition and still have a lot work to do. I hate us playing like shit, pisses me off no end, but I willing to suffer this shit, so when AVB has had the chance to really build squad in his image and more than likely fucking over most teams in the EPL on our way to achieving something special.... I AM WILLING TO FUCKING SUFFER IT and stand by the man who has a genuine chance of taking us places.

KA-PEESH

 

[Shell]

FFS that was a dire game , should have known - even the bus I was on crashed on the way to the lane .What happened ? Only token tackles going on , terrible passing , very odd subs - the team looked totally feckless and out of ideas as did AVB .Lets hope it's only up from here

 

[SteveH]

Maybe time to get some perspective

James Maw ‏@JamesMawFFT
Feb-Apr 2012 Spurs won 3 in 13. Feb-May 2011 Spurs won ONE in 13. Imagine the fuss if that had happened under AVB.

Hate losing, but time to figure out how to play through the current injury list - my take is to involve more u 21's who are looking pretty good in places where the first team is weak, coach them into the positions we need to fill and play some in Europa League matches and even some in Prenmieship matches. Maybe we unearth a gem or two.

Anyone saying 'lets buy in the transfer window' needs to remember that's two months away - lots of games in that time.

Lets hope things turn round - but I'm very nervous of a slide down the table when I look at the majority of the performances this season. I cannot even think of getting anything from playing the likes of Man C, Arsenal, even West Ham and Liverpool.

 

[TheGreenLily]

Nah sorry TheGreenLily - the media have much bigger fish to fry now.

Its got nothing to with AVB 's history anymore - its to do with now!

And in the now we/Spurs are failing. Yes we are fifth but don't ask me for how much longer.

We are just very good at playing football this season - except for spasmodic, brief and bizarre moments like at ManU.

Dont let us hide behind "fickle Spurs fans not backing the manager" or as you say "the Media don't like AVB" its now irrelevant and a distraction.

We want AVB to succeed. But that is not going to make it happen - Sadly.

Time to face upto fact the "early" signs are far from good.

My question is how long does "early" last?

Easy to bury your head, when most of the first team are injured, back up is awful and not playing well, the fans a cheering a player who produces absolutely fuck all in most games, then booing a manager who has a mountain of shit in his lap.

It's a cop out, just like most people you want instant miracles, never was going to happen, and to clear up the harry mess is going to take a very long time.