2 Points From 8 Games / 39 Points from 24 Games

[DC_Boy]

while this has not been a typical spurs season it's been far more typical of the prem years than us getting a top 4 spot

I would earnestly advise against anyone waiting for next year as the year we crack the top 4 -

take each year as it unfolds, be happy angry whatever but our club is far more likely to finish around 7th/8th and have a good cup run with the occasional trophy than finish top 4 and as for actually breaking into the big 4 or making it a big 5 - that's the stuff of at least a decade's work I reckon and even then unlikely

 

[arnoldlayne]

Arnold

there's no doubt that MON is a good manager - but his record in england is not massively better than redknapp's

I believe he has won one, maybe two lge cups whereas HR has won an FA Cup

of course Harry has been in the job longer, but to be fair to both of them this is the first time either has managed a 'big' (don't like the term but it's convenient shorthand at times) English club

if we finish 7th and Villa 5th or 6th - given that we also made a cup final - then I would say HR's acheivement game for game since he joined will slightly edge MON's.

I believe we are neck and neck in the 'lge table post-Harry' (instead of 2009 AD we should have 2009 AHR

Hi

I think you're probably correct!

MON's problem INVHO is an inherent tendency to caution when he should be striking out, all guns blazing, seizing the moment.

Regardless of my personal views, etc I do think we will do quite well in the next couple of seasons as we have a fundamentally strongish squad and a manager who, like MON, should be a fairly steady hand. . One thing that will hopefully work in our favour should be HR's chance to hit the big time with plenty of resources in his favour. I hope he goes for all competitions hammer and tongs and I'll try and keep my gob and my personal views in check! (Although I won't be able to resist the odd dig!).

 

[arnoldlayne]

while this has not been a typical spurs season it's been far more typical of the prem years than us getting a top 4 spot

I would earnestly advise against anyone waiting for next year as the year we crack the top 4 -

take each year as it unfolds, be happy angry whatever but our club is far more likely to finish around 7th/8th and have a good cup run with the occasional trophy than finish top 4 and as for actually breaking into the big 4 or making it a big 5 - that's the stuff of at least a decade's work I reckon and even then unlikely

Looking at the stats which you highlighted in the gen football post I think you are probably correct, more's the pity.

 

[SpurSince57]

Don't be a prat Kendall. We all know that Harry has a much better balanced squad than Ramos have, he does not have Comolli building (or unbalancing) his first team and he also has a settled team with players who have (almost completely) adapted to the PL.

Success breeds confidence and better play, just as failure breeds doubt, loss of belief and worse team play. At times we played some scintillating stuff under Ramos and I still do believe that had some things ended up a little differently, Ramos could have done admirably well here.

That's not to take anything from Redknapp though, who has begun moulding us into a very impressive team. Just as you were right in predicting Redknapp turning good, you were wrong about Gomes being a complete flop in the league.

A little bit of humility would go a long way.

So easy to blame it all on Damo. Ramos was a total innocent who had the likes of Bentley foisted upon him by the Evil Gooner.

Really? FFS, do me a favour…

Why don't you and the others who bleat on about this ludicrously overhyped journeyman actually look at his record?

 

[simyid]

i agree with ss57 there is no way in hell commoli signed all the player and ramos hadnt nothing to do with it and he would just turn up at training with a whole set of new players. absolute RUBBISH!!! cause juande signed the players commoli just scouted them i can guarentee juande had the final say on watever players came into the club so if your gonna blame signings on someone blamie it on ramos. even then the signings commoli supposedly made arnt as bad as people make out e.g. ekotto, woodgate, corluka, berbatov, modric just to name a few. so for every bentley, bent and zokora theres a few of those signings.

 

[DC_Boy]

hi arnold

we all have our likes and dislikes when it comes to spurs players, managers etc- good for you for getting behind the team and putting personal views in the background - have some rep

 

[Gilzeanking]

So easy to blame it all on Damo. Ramos was a total innocent who had the likes of Bentley foisted upon him by the Evil Gooner.

Really? FFS, do me a favour…

Why don't you and the others who bleat on about this ludicrously overhyped journeyman actually look at his record?

YUK '57 , what a horrible outpouring of inappropriate malice . Lets get this right the current manager of the biggest club in the world ( and doing well) winner of many European titles with a small club is a ' Journeyman '

Presumably you are going to tell us from your exhalted position in the clouds that ' Arry is nothing like a journey man ? and we should look at his results ...with Southampton perhaps ?

The biggest idiot is me as it goes... I used to think you were a good poster 57 . Your lousy post has me looking for the ignore button .

 

[spurs4europe]

So easy to blame it all on Damo. Ramos was a total innocent who had the likes of Bentley foisted upon him by the Evil Gooner.

Really? FFS, do me a favour…

Why don't you and the others who bleat on about this ludicrously overhyped journeyman actually look at his record?

What, the guy who has brought Real to second in La Liga following an awful start? The guy who won 2 UEFA cups and took Sevilla to the Champions League? The guy who won a Carling Cup in his first season in a new league?

No, no, what am i thinking? Of course you are right 57, this guy is simply a fraud, of course. So why don't you do me a favour and actually think before you press the post button instead of being so bloody impulsive and shooting from the hip. But it's easy to do so why not, huh?

Of course Ramos is not completely inculpable. But to say that Comolli did not play a very large part in our downfall is just plain stupid.

Comolli bought some good players, especially young ones for the academy, which is proving to now be one of the best in Europe and gives us hope for a good future. But he also severly unbalanced the team through some dodgy first team transfers.

1) He failed to adequately replace outgoing players such as Carrick, Malbranque and Berbatov.
2) He made some unnecessary transfers by bringing in Bent and Bentley to name but two. Neither of these two are typical of the type of player valued by Jol (who likes technical footballers who can play technical football not dissimilar from Dutch teams - not Bent or Zokora) and Ramos (who likes fast tricky wingers - so not Bentley) respectively, so I think it is safe to assume Comolli was the chief instigator of these transfers.
3) When he did bring in quality players, he often bought foreign ones. I don't have a problem with this and actually believe that many foreign footballers are better educated in footballing terms and have better footballing brains. But typical of the Tottenham sydrome, he oversaw an unbelievably high player turnover and brought many foreign players all at once as opposed to slowly introducing them into an already settled team (I think Ramos is also culpable here, but as head of transfers with more experience in the PL than Ramos, Comolli should have known better). Moreover, he brought in players who took a long time to adapt to the League, such as Zokora, who is now a very good player for us but has taken 2 full years to fill the void that Carrick left (and now we buy Palacios). Other players like Modric, Gomes, Pavluychenko needed half a season to come to terms with the League.
4) He also failed to address certain deficiencies such as bringing in a left midfielder and a defensive midfielder during his tenure. And those he did address he often did badly: Zokora who needed 2 full years to adapt.

I would like to note that I am not blaming Comolli exclusively for all of the above, but he played a very large role in all of them and was the main constant factor in the failures of both Jol and Ramos, who have proved in the past to be and are now both extremely successful managers.

Ultimately though, you have zeroed in on a lesser point of my argument. My actual argument dealt much more with the issue that we played some good football under Ramos, who I belive would have been a success had he had a bit more luck, a bit more time to allow his top foreigners to adapt and had he been allowed to buy some players who he was clearly denied, as Redknapp was not.

Ramos wanted to buy Diarra, a rumour actually proven by Ramos saying he likes the player and then buying him at Real. However he was denied (by either Comolli or Levy) on the basis of our having Zokora (who was okay at the time, but nothing special) whereas Redknapp was able to buy Palacios (at not such a dissimilar price). Yes it might have Levy who said no, but the whole point of having Comolli there was not to be a yes man but to be an adviser to Levy, so Comolli would have had a large say anyway and so in my eyes carries a large (but not all) portion of the guilt in Ramos' downfall.

However your blatant bias against 'Wendy Random' as you have so maturely called him in the past is evident so I don't think even a reasoned argument would make you think otherwise.

 

[Lilbaz]

Ramos is a good coach no doubt, but he didn't have the understanding of the language or of the English game including mentality of players. I believe this turned some of the players against him.

Giving him more time was not an option as I believe we would be in Newcastles position looking at the prospect of Championship football next term.

Given, Harry may not be the manager to get us CL football next term, but then who is? We can't afford to get a Gerrard, Ronaldo or Lampard and can only hope that 1 of the top 4 has a mare next season.

 

[Hoowl]

What, the guy who has brought Real to second in La Liga following an awful start? The guy who won 2 UEFA cups and took Sevilla to the Champions League? The guy who won a Carling Cup in his first season in a new league?

No, no, what am i thinking? Of course you are right 57, this guy is simply a fraud, of course. So why don't you do me a favour and actually think before you press the post button instead of being so bloody impulsive and shooting from the hip. But it's easy to do so why not, huh?

Of course Ramos is not completely inculpable. But to say that Comolli did not play a very large part in our downfall is just plain stupid.

Comolli bought some good players, especially young ones for the academy, which is proving to now be one of the best in Europe and gives us hope for a good future. But he also severly unbalanced the team through some dodgy first team transfers.

1) He failed to adequately replace outgoing players such as Carrick, Malbranque and Berbatov.
2) He made some unnecessary transfers by bringing in Bent and Bentley to name but two. Neither of these two are typical of the type of player valued by Jol (who likes technical footballers who can play technical football not dissimilar from Dutch teams - not Bent or Zokora) and Ramos (who likes fast tricky wingers - so not Bentley) respectively, so I think it is safe to assume Comolli was the chief instigator of these transfers.
3) When he did bring in quality players, he often bought foreign ones. I don't have a problem with this and actually believe that many foreign footballers are better educated in footballing terms and have better footballing brains. But typical of the Tottenham sydrome, he oversaw an unbelievably high player turnover and brought many foreign players all at once as opposed to slowly introducing them into an already settled team (I think Ramos is also culpable here, but as head of transfers with more experience in the PL than Ramos, Comolli should have known better). Moreover, he brought in players who took a long time to adapt to the League, such as Zokora, who is now a very good player for us but has taken 2 full years to fill the void that Carrick left (and now we buy Palacios). Other players like Modric, Gomes, Pavluychenko needed half a season to come to terms with the League.
4) He also failed to address certain deficiencies such as bringing in a left midfielder and a defensive midfielder during his tenure. And those he did address he often did badly: Zokora who needed 2 full years to adapt.

I would like to note that I am not blaming Comolli exclusively for all of the above, but he played a very large role in all of them and was the main constant factor in the failures of both Jol and Ramos, who have proved in the past to be and are now both extremely successful managers.

Ultimately though, you have zeroed in on a lesser point of my argument. My actual argument dealt much more with the issue that we played some good football under Ramos, who I belive would have been a success had he had a bit more luck, a bit more time to allow his top foreigners to adapt and had he been allowed to buy some players who he was clearly denied, as Redknapp was not.

Ramos wanted to buy Diarra, a rumour actually proven by Ramos saying he likes the player and then buying him at Real. However he was denied (by either Comolli or Levy) on the basis of our having Zokora (who was okay at the time, but nothing special) whereas Redknapp was able to buy Palacios (at not such a dissimilar price). Yes it might have Levy who said no, but the whole point of having Comolli there was not to be a yes man but to be an adviser to Levy, so Comolli would have had a large say anyway and so in my eyes carries a large (but not all) portion of the guilt in Ramos' downfall.

However your blatant bias against 'Wendy Random' as you have so maturely called him in the past is evident so I don't think even a reasoned argument would make you think otherwise.

The issue I have with Ramos is that I think he didn't adapt well to the premiship and failed to get the best out of the players he had. I get the impression he tried to stick to a regime that worked for him in Spain but wasn't necessarily suited to the players he had at his disposal and the league. The squad may well have been unbalanced (that's another discussion) but he still had the personel to beat all three of Sunderland, Wigan and Hull at home but only achieved 1pt from the possible 9. That's just not good enough. Who knows if Ramos could succeed in the premiership. Obviously the ideal of a possesion game is a nice one, but we saw very little evidence that things were improving and Ramos could actually deliver. I think circumstances meant Levy was right to sack Ramos when he did.

 

[arnoldlayne]

So easy to blame it all on Damo. Ramos was a total innocent who had the likes of Bentley foisted upon him by the Evil Gooner.

Really? FFS, do me a favour…

Why don't you and the others who bleat on about this ludicrously overhyped journeyman actually look at his record?

Ha Ha!

I knew this would happen! The phrase Auto + Pilot don't do you justice when it comes to your opinions on Ramos.

While I would agree that Ramos is nowhere near as good as, say, Hiddink, Mourinho, etc, to describe him as above is unfair.

He's done OK at 2 clubs when he had resources (Seville/Real M) and gets a +/- at the other club where he had the resources (Spurs) in my book.

There are many continental managers who have had varying records at different clubs. Similarly, in Europe managers move around a lot and have shortish stays at any one club. Although, how some managers in England continue to get re-hired is beyond me - they seem to inhabit a twilight zone between TV punditry and management.

 

[Kendall]

Don't be a prat Kendall. We all know that Harry has a much better balanced squad than Ramos have, he does not have Comolli building (or unbalancing) his first team and he also has a settled team with players who have (almost completely) adapted to the PL.

Success breeds confidence and better play, just as failure breeds doubt, loss of belief and worse team play. At times we played some scintillating stuff under Ramos and I still do believe that had some things ended up a little differently, Ramos could have done admirably well here.

That's not to take anything from Redknapp though, who has begun moulding us into a very impressive team. Just as you were right in predicting Redknapp turning good, you were wrong about Gomes being a complete flop in the league.

A little bit of humility would go a long way.

Ramos had Modric, Lennon, JJ, Bent, Pavlyuchenko, Corluka, Woodgate, King, Assou-Ekotto, Zokora. He had Keane and Berbatov last year and still failed to get us in the top half.

Earlier this season was atrocious, new to the league or not. Good managers get the best out of players and adjust based on whos fit and who's not. Look at Moyes, he's been without strikers but Everton kept winning.

We never kept the ball better under Ramos at all, in fact we looked shakey and gittery under Ramos from start to finish. Ramos had a window of about 1 month where results were midly acceptable prior to the cup final, then we were a disgrace from February to October.

Its not great surprise that Comolli's signings are now flourishing under a manager who knows his way around this league. Pavlyuchenko, Modric, Assou-Ekotto, Corluka and Woodgate are all playing far far better now, I suppose Comolli gets no credit for brining those in? I just felt Ramos was incapable of coaching them and it shows.

 

[Stoof]

I still don't know why people use Ramos' records in Spain as if they're something to base an argument on. In a Premiership context they mean absolutely fuck all, as was ably demonstrated by Ramos and his attempt to remove our Premier League status.

Is it not that simple?

Ramos is good in Spain. Great. Brilliant.
Ramos is not good in England. Proven. Shown.

 

[Kendall]

Just like Kanoute ;-)

 

[donny1013]

Some people's opinions would lead you to believe we are doing shit. 'Arry has done a fantastic job. I couldn't give a frog's fat one that Ramos is doing well with Real or what he did at Sevilla. He couldn't speak English ffs, for me that was the main problem. Scolari's grasp of English was poor, he lasted 6 months, with a side full of top class internationals. Mourinho and Benitez both spoke perfect English when they arrived and quelle surprise they proved a success.

 

[Leachie]

Some people's opinions would lead you to believe we are doing shit. 'Arry has done a fantastic job. I couldn't give a frog's fat one that Ramos is doing well with Real or what he did at Sevilla. He couldn't speak English ffs, for me that was the main problem. Scolari's grasp of English was poor, he lasted 6 months, with a side full of top class internationals. Mourinho and Benitez both spoke perfect English when they arrived and quelle surprise they proved a success.

I thought Benitez spoke very little English when he arrived?

 

[spurs4europe]

Some people's opinions would lead you to believe we are doing shit. 'Arry has done a fantastic job. I couldn't give a frog's fat one that Ramos is doing well with Real or what he did at Sevilla. He couldn't speak English ffs, for me that was the main problem. Scolari's grasp of English was poor, he lasted 6 months, with a side full of top class internationals. Mourinho and Benitez both spoke perfect English when they arrived and quelle surprise they proved a success.

Ranieri spoke no english when he arrived at Chelsea all those years ago

 

[Destroyer]

So easy to blame it all on Damo. Ramos was a total innocent who had the likes of Bentley foisted upon him by the Evil Gooner.

Bentley will be bombed out in the summer.

 

[Michey]

I still don't know why people use Ramos' records in Spain as if they're something to base an argument on. In a Premiership context they mean absolutely fuck all, as was ably demonstrated by Ramos and his attempt to remove our Premier League status.

Is it not that simple?

Ramos is good in Spain. Great. Brilliant.
Ramos is not good in England. Proven. Shown.

No, it isn't that simple and i guess you know that so why you're posting stuff like that beats me.

- His first 20 games with Spurs had better results than our current manager. Yes it's true even though Redknapps stats are better now since we lost momentum last year having secured Premiership status and a place in Europe very early. Not bad from someone that "is not good in England. Proven. Shown"

- He made us look fuckin good beating Arsenal and Chelsea. But since you obviously doesn't agree i can inform you that...you missed something. Great games....

We're doing ok now and i'm happy to see Spurs gettin points and rise in the league. Not too much to discuss lately, apart from what happened at Blackburn. But to post dumb stuff like that is just childish since shit like that could happen to anyone when having their best players sold. You know what? I guess it even could happen to Redknapp, Wenger, Mourinho, Ferguson, etc and again...i guess you're aware of this. I mean you always talk of how many games you watch live etc. Perhaps a few games infront of a TV would make you see the bigger picture.

 

[Michey]

What, the guy who has brought Real to second in La Liga following an awful start? The guy who won 2 UEFA cups and took Sevilla to the Champions League? The guy who won a Carling Cup in his first season in a new league?

No, no, what am i thinking? Of course you are right 57, this guy is simply a fraud, of course. So why don't you do me a favour and actually think before you press the post button instead of being so bloody impulsive and shooting from the hip. But it's easy to do so why not, huh?

Of course Ramos is not completely inculpable. But to say that Comolli did not play a very large part in our downfall is just plain stupid.

Comolli bought some good players, especially young ones for the academy, which is proving to now be one of the best in Europe and gives us hope for a good future. But he also severly unbalanced the team through some dodgy first team transfers.

1) He failed to adequately replace outgoing players such as Carrick, Malbranque and Berbatov.
2) He made some unnecessary transfers by bringing in Bent and Bentley to name but two. Neither of these two are typical of the type of player valued by Jol (who likes technical footballers who can play technical football not dissimilar from Dutch teams - not Bent or Zokora) and Ramos (who likes fast tricky wingers - so not Bentley) respectively, so I think it is safe to assume Comolli was the chief instigator of these transfers.
3) When he did bring in quality players, he often bought foreign ones. I don't have a problem with this and actually believe that many foreign footballers are better educated in footballing terms and have better footballing brains. But typical of the Tottenham sydrome, he oversaw an unbelievably high player turnover and brought many foreign players all at once as opposed to slowly introducing them into an already settled team (I think Ramos is also culpable here, but as head of transfers with more experience in the PL than Ramos, Comolli should have known better). Moreover, he brought in players who took a long time to adapt to the League, such as Zokora, who is now a very good player for us but has taken 2 full years to fill the void that Carrick left (and now we buy Palacios). Other players like Modric, Gomes, Pavluychenko needed half a season to come to terms with the League.
4) He also failed to address certain deficiencies such as bringing in a left midfielder and a defensive midfielder during his tenure. And those he did address he often did badly: Zokora who needed 2 full years to adapt.

I would like to note that I am not blaming Comolli exclusively for all of the above, but he played a very large role in all of them and was the main constant factor in the failures of both Jol and Ramos, who have proved in the past to be and are now both extremely successful managers.

Ultimately though, you have zeroed in on a lesser point of my argument. My actual argument dealt much more with the issue that we played some good football under Ramos, who I belive would have been a success had he had a bit more luck, a bit more time to allow his top foreigners to adapt and had he been allowed to buy some players who he was clearly denied, as Redknapp was not.

Ramos wanted to buy Diarra, a rumour actually proven by Ramos saying he likes the player and then buying him at Real. However he was denied (by either Comolli or Levy) on the basis of our having Zokora (who was okay at the time, but nothing special) whereas Redknapp was able to buy Palacios (at not such a dissimilar price). Yes it might have Levy who said no, but the whole point of having Comolli there was not to be a yes man but to be an adviser to Levy, so Comolli would have had a large say anyway and so in my eyes carries a large (but not all) portion of the guilt in Ramos' downfall.

However your blatant bias against 'Wendy Random' as you have so maturely called him in the past is evident so I don't think even a reasoned argument would make you think otherwise.

Very good and objective post :clap: