AVB vs. the home support

[Ossie'sAardvark]

so you cant answer the question, or provide any facts.

Thanks

No I cant be bothered its a different thing.
Can I ask you one please. Are you increasing in prolonged volume as you get older?

 

[CowInAComa]

I dont think this all needs to turn into an old vs young debate, which would be totally wanky. Clearly there is room for everyone and watching the old clips if anything it looked like an older crowd

But I do think its an interesting discussion point, that I hadnt even considered before, that an ageing set of fans because of the way season tickets are distributed and maintained may someday needs to be addressed.

My two pennies worth, its the guys in the middle age group 30s/40s who have had a few in the local before who are the most vocal complainers and presumably they were the ones who made the 'better' atmosphere 20 years ago.

 

[Ossie'sAardvark]

I dont think this all needs to turn into an old vs young debate, which would be totally wanky. Clearly there is room for everyone and watching the old clips if anything it looked like an older crowd

But I do think its an interesting discussion point, that I hadnt even considered before, that an ageing set of fans because of the way season tickets are distributed and maintained may someday needs to be addressed.

My two pennies worth, its the guys in the middle age group 30s/40s who have had a few in the local before who are the most vocal complainers and presumably they were the ones who made the 'better' atmosphere 20 years ago.

Very sensible. I concur, my lips are sealed even though I was disliked.....Boohoo.

 

[playboypaul]

It cracks me up, it really does.......

"I don't like it, I pay lots of money to watch this shit so I am entitled to say what I like and moan and boo at The Lane if that's what I want to do."

So these 'supporters', or that's at least what they think they are, continue to pay lots of their hard earned money for something they don't like....?

Therein, if you get my meaning, you see the problem.

 

[dimiSpur]

I think you are getting all the "Oh When The..." confused my friend. The Saints fans sang their 'saints' version a hell of a lot

So you're saying I was unable to comprehend whether the people around me were singing or whether it was the people on the other side of the ground?

They sang one rendition of it the whole game. They were horrific. We sang "you're Southampton and you don't sing at all" to them. Maybe we all got confused though

 

[parklane1]

My comment wasn't a swipe at older supporters, I know they have a singsong .I'm glad we appeal to all ages, Young people make more noise than the old...Fact. It wasn't my info, but it made me think a bit.

My post was not really a answer to yours but another member, however you may be right about the young making more noise then the older fans, mostly bitching because after 9 games we are not at the top.

 

[parklane1]

that's your fact!?

What relevance does that have to the people in the ground?

As you say, none at all.

 

[parklane1]

Older fans may contribute to the lack of atmosphere, but more importantly these are not the fans that are creating a negative, poisonous, detrimental atmosphere. And it those that are the real problem. The main issue for me are the streams of abuse, moaning and criticism.

The winner.

 

[parklane1]

I dont think this all needs to turn into an old vs young debate, which would be totally wanky. Clearly there is room for everyone and watching the old clips if anything it looked like an older crowd

But I do think its an interesting discussion point, that I hadnt even considered before, that an ageing set of fans because of the way season tickets are distributed and maintained may someday needs to be addressed.

My two pennies worth, its the guys in the middle age group 30s/40s who have had a few in the local before who are the most vocal complainers and presumably they were the ones who made the 'better' atmosphere 20 years ago.

You started it by trying to take away my ST

 

[alfie103]

I went to the game against Hull and I bought a programme where i spotted that swearing had been banned. I couldn't believe it. The fact you have to be seated doesn't create help the situation. The fact that football has become more family orientated has led to this i believe.

 

[chrissivad]

As you say, none at all.

it doesnt as how many people from OAP homes are in the ground or school kids..

The average age of people attending premiership games has reduced over the last few years

Contrary to my claim that crowds at its matches are growing ever older, whiter and more male, the League’s most recent survey of those attending games found that the average age is actually coming down and that more female and ethnic minority supporters than ever before are attending top flight games.

At the time of the last survey in 2004/05 the average age of the Premier League supporter was 44. Last year it was down to 41. At that sort of rate of decline, there might actually be an audience in 20 years time.

Moreover, the survey found that 39 per cent of those who come to matches are aged 18-34. As for minorities, the survey reported that the Premier League has never been more diverse in the range of those it attracts. 23 per cent of the 5.2 million people who attended a live match last season were female, while 11% were from an ethnic minority. The significance of that figure is that ethnic minorities actually make up 8% of the wider population. So they enjoy greater representation at Premier League games than in society as a whole.

Encouraging figures, without doubt. Certainly more encouraging than my dismissal of the Premier League crowd as overwhelmingly ageing, male and white. Though I would add that it is not mere anecdotal evidence which suggests things have got much older.

There is statistical evidence to back up the belief that football used to be something young people did on their own. Back in the 1970s, a survey conducted by Manchester United revealed that the average age of those standing on the Stretford End was 17. Now across the Premier League it is more than double that.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...rent-full-of-old-white-men-after-all-....html

Now i know that this isnt a full reflection on the age of the crowd at the Lane, but i dont remember sitting with a bunch of OAP's when i was down.

too many people would rather complain about players than sing, cheer them on during a game, there are enough bodies there to make even the west stand be heard...

 

[alfie103]

It cracks me up, it really does.......

"I don't like it, I pay lots of money to watch this shit so I am entitled to say what I like and moan and boo at The Lane if that's what I want to do."

So these 'supporters', or that's at least what they think they are, continue to pay lots of their hard earned money for something they don't like....?

Therein, if you get my meaning, you see the problem.

I can understand where that person is coming from though. You want to see value for what you are paying for. Imagine paying money to go a rubbish film at the cinema. You come out and say 'what a load of rubbish, I wasted my money on that!'.

To complain and moan is a natural reaction if you don't think you are getting value for money and especially since Tottenham's ticket prices are some of the dearest in England, most expect something for their money. I'm not saying we should all moan as it is affecting the players and not helping the matter but there are two sides to it.

 

[E17yid]

I can understand where that person is coming from though. You want to see value for what you are paying for. Imagine paying money to go a rubbish film at the cinema. You come out and say 'what a load of rubbish, I wasted my money on that!'.

To complain and moan is a natural reaction if you don't think you are getting value for money and especially since Tottenham's ticket prices are some of the dearest in England, most expect something for their money. I'm not saying we should all moan as it is affecting the players and not helping the matter but there are two sides to it.

Please not the cinema analogy.

 

[parklane1]

Please not the cinema analogy.

It surprises me that it took so long for someone to mention it in this thread.

 

[alfie103]

Please not the cinema analogy.

Haha, has it been used many times before. I apologise about the poor choice of analogy.

 

[NEVILLEB]

AVB will get support from the Spurs fans, because we are great fans.

But he's now got to step up too. If he wants to push us then he's got to push himself too.

 

[MattyP]

I don't buy into the age theory, but then I wouldnt as I turned 40 this year.

I make as much noise today as I did 20 years ago. The younger people around me generally make less noise than the people who's season ticket they have acquired, unless they have been on the booze all day, in which case they chant only using consonants so it kind of loses something.

So, I don't think it can be attributed to specific members (season ticket holders v members) or age groups, based on my specific experience.

 

[bomberH]

I've had time to think about all this now. I've always been really supportive of players and management, often against the general view, and I've often been quite critical of some of our fans.

But.... AVB is out of order with all this. He's given at least 3 separate post match interviews, each one with further cutting comments about our support. The 'We had to do it alone' comment is pretty rank, even if true. I'm not sure I can remember any manager saying stuff like this about their team in recent years. What he's done is given other clubs' fans golden material and we will now become synonymous with shit fans/atmosphere, much like 'the library'.

He could've said something in the programme notes (I bet there's something tomorrow saying how wonderful we are). I've been to games a million times worse than that, atmosphere wise. I remember loads of fans proper booing against Sunderland at half time.... and we were one nil up! The atmosphere in this game, despite being crap, didn't warrant this attack from AVB. A mention in the programme notes or Spurs TV etc, could've got the message across and done the job. Instead, our fans are now the laughing stock.

Every club's fans have better away support than home. I know Arsenal fans, Chelsea fans, Utd fans, West Ham fans etc who all say their home atmosphere is often shit unless it's a big game. And I'm sure the same goes for City (nowadays) & a few others. It's not just a Spurs thing and I hope all fans quietly realise that.

Sunday games plus dull football plus economic climate plus whinging ****s plus high expectations plus 10 behind the ball equals lack of atmosphere.

Despite all the above, I actually completely agree with AVB's sentiments. I hope this doesn't backfire on him (or us). We've been quite crap at home (fans) for a few years now, mainly since we got good again. But he's out of order for using the terms he has during 3 separate interviews. I'm also angry because I'm a fan who does sing, cheer, never boos, enjoys etc, so I'm being lumped in with these fuckers who do the opposite of all that. It's such a difficult one this, but despite him being generally correct, there are ways and means... and in my opinion, he's gone about it in completely the wrong manner.

 

[Archibald&Crooks]

I've had time to think about all this now. I've always been really supportive of players and management, often against the general view, and I've often been quite critical of some of our fans.

But.... AVB is out of order with all this. He's given at least 3 separate post match interviews, each one with further cutting comments about our support. The 'We had to do it alone' comment is pretty rank, even if true. I'm not sure I can remember any manager saying stuff like this about their team in recent years. What he's done is given other clubs' fans golden material and we will now become synonymous with shit fans/atmosphere, much like 'the library'.

He could've said something in the programme notes (I bet there's something tomorrow saying how wonderful we are).

In interview, programme notes, I think however he did it, it would have been picked up by the media and a big deal made out of it.

 

[easley91]

It may give others material, but he's right. It's not just one thing either, it's a mix of a lot of factirs that have affected home atmospheres (not just Tottenham). You cannot pinpoint one factor and change it. Because it will mot change anything.

There ARE people who go just to watch a match in person, because they like to watch it in the ground and not on the box. You can't just say 'don't sing? no ticket for you'.