`Arry Out, Guus In For Tottenham...

[Krafty]

God forbid we give a manager more than five minutes to get success.

The reason why the 'top 4', as much as I hate the concept, have been the top 4 for so long is because they have not only invested a lot of money, but they have had plenty of time to build solid foundations, team wise, to get continued success. Even for Abramovich Chelsea were winning cups and doing well in Europe. Arsenal had success even before Wenger took charge, and Utd and Liverpool have always been up there.

Its quite clear the squad has moved in the right direction but Harry is still not completely satisfied. He'd probably want to move at least 3 or 4 big name players, and get at least 2 players in to compete immediately for a first team place.

 

[StartingPrice]

mg:hey boyo..your not johnathon woss are you?goodfellas now s.o.t.lambs:rofl:

Not a fan of Wossy - but do study films.

 

[Leachie]

Looks like this one can be put to bed?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/8513955.stm

 

[Donki]

Some member really do have to listen to themselves, Harry hasn't even had a full season from start to finish and already you can say he isn't going to take us any further....... WHAT THE F*@K are you talking about. We have been a laughing stock, known as a manager merry go round for the last 10-15 years and your wanting to go and do it again. What for? Saved us from relegation, fighting for 4 spot and playing some good football. Yes in the last few weeks we haven't been playing as well as at the start of the season but people that happens. We have had problems at CB, problems at LM/LW problems at RM/RW and we are still up there. There is a reason that more teams are dropping points and that is the PL is getting strobger and stronger, and in certain matches the players have let themselves and the team down there is only so much a manger can do.

Please for the love of god get behaind the team and manager and give them your full support, its balls saying "i don't want him out im just saying". Grow some balls get off the fence and have courage in your convictions. Its funny how the turn around in Bale and Bentley hasnt been linked in any way to Harry, its just been them doign it on their own. Give the man some credit.

 

[IamCelestial]

I personally don't like Harry much. I also don't think we should think of replacing him. One can argue that he doesn't have what it takes to get us to the promise land of 4th, but we have no idea until given some time.

this :clap:

 

[Pinto]

Also in agreement that I don't like Harry that much but he has to be given more time. He has only been in the job for a little over a year. Maybe in 3 or 4 years if we are sitting midtable and not getting cups then we get rid of him but until then he gets my full support.

 

[Dan Ashcroft]

Success breeds consistency, not consistency success.

I'd be delighted if we made this trade up, it would take us back into the big league at last.

 

[barry]

I don't like Harry but I'd forgo my disdain for success. Fuck, if it meant success I'd have sol cambell as our manager, with the slightly less treacherous judas iscariot as his number 2.

 

[nferno]

yes please.

 

[SpurSince57]

People are probably thinking I'm being a idiotic dumbwit...but I'm not trying to be! We all want to see Spurs succeed.

That table is largely irrelevant because Gross, Francis, Graham, etc, would have better overall stats with the squad we have currently. Vega, Iversen, Sinton et al, cannot compete with Lennon, Palacios, Defoe...

I'm not trying to say "sack him now", and I didn't say "let's get Hiddink, I just referenced an article from F365.

I think he has done an good job, as I mentioned before, but we could/should be in a better position, as we have hit a few brick walls this season. I just think there is a glass ceiling where Redknapp is concerned, and it will lead to opportunites being missed.

Redknapp's successes have been overplayed, laregely due to Ramos's failures.

I often think there is a club mentality issue at Spurs. It's been present for years and years. And it's probably why we all get grief from our workmates, frends, etc. We have underachieved for years, and although that's not Redknapp's fault, he isn't the man to transform us. We choke too much...It's like we have a fear of doing well. In the League Cup we should have beaten Utd, but we lacked the belief. In the long-term, Redknapp isn't the man to see us challenge consistently.

And Random became our manager because, er, Martin Jol was 'tactically naive', couldn't take us to the next level, and wasn't 'the man to see us challenge consistently'.

Right…

 

[SelbYido]

And Random became our manager because, er, Martin Jol was 'tactically naive', couldn't take us to the next level, and wasn't 'the man to see us challenge consistently'.

Right…

Not to mention a lack of 'decisive' substitutions, a tendency to be stereotyped as a jocular 'man-manager' type & a record of challenging at all...?

There are similarities, I s'pose...

 

[johnmc]

Some member really do have to listen to themselves, Harry hasn't even had a full season from start to finish and already you can say he isn't going to take us any further....... WHAT THE F*@K are you talking about. We have been a laughing stock, known as a manager merry go round for the last 10-15 years and your wanting to go and do it again. What for? Saved us from relegation, fighting for 4 spot and playing some good football. Yes in the last few weeks we haven't been playing as well as at the start of the season but people that happens. We have had problems at CB, problems at LM/LW problems at RM/RW and we are still up there. There is a reason that more teams are dropping points and that is the PL is getting stronger and stronger, and in certain matches the players have let themselves and the team down there is only so much a manger can do.

Please for the love of god get behind the team and manager and give them your full support, its balls saying "i don't want him out I'm just saying". Grow some balls get off the fence and have courage in your convictions. Its funny how the turn around in Bale and Bentley hasn't been linked in any way to Harry, its just been them doing it on their own. Give the man some credit.

"Donki get out of here with your sensible arguments" :stupid::up:

 

[KentuckyYid]

Might as well lock this thread now. Apparantly he's signed a two year contract with Turkey

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...nk-snubs-Liverpool-Chelsea-agrees-Turkey.html

 

[StartingPrice]

1) Success breeds consistency, not consistency success.

2) I'd be delighted if we made this trade up, it would take us back into the big league at last.

1) Very pithy, very aphoristic - so, just how much success did Fergie have in his first 5 (FIVE) years?

2) Personally, I agree with this. As I said above. IMHO it is very previous of US to be talking about shipping 'Arry out as a dead donkey ripe for flogging, and he hasn't even had a full season in charge, and we can't actually say he can't take us any further until he's, like, failed, my attitude to managers is exactly the same as with players. If, for whatever reason (say, for instance, 'Arry really does want to retire from football at the end of the season), we woke up tomorrow morning and, say, Mourinho was manager, and he did make us genuine big time, who would I be to question it too much, and why wuold I want to? (Please no 'Mourinho's style of play' debates, that would miss the point). My concern is the success of the club, no one twitchy, slightly dodgy, and very affluent manager. While I believe he is as good as we are gonna get, and the stability of keeping him is gonna outweigh the risk of getting someone no better, and potentially worse, why mess with it?

 

[EastLondonYid]

:clap: spot on taff.
seriously agree mate.:clap:

1) Very pithy, very aphoristic - so, just how much success did Fergie have in his first 5 (FIVE) years?

2) Personally, I agree with this. As I said above. IMHO it is very previous of US to be talking about shipping 'Arry out as a dead donkey ripe for flogging, and he hasn't even had a full season in charge, and we can't actually say he can't take us any further until he's, like, failed, my attitude to managers is exactly the same as with players. If, for whatever reason (say, for instance, 'Arry really does want to retire from football at the end of the season), we woke up tomorrow morning and, say, Mourinho was manager, and he did make us genuine big time, who would I be to question it too much, and why wuold I want to? (Please no 'Mourinho's style of play' debates, that would miss the point). My concern is the success of the club, no one twitchy, slightly dodgy, and very affluent manager. While I believe he is as good as we are gonna get, and the stability of keeping him is gonna outweigh the risk of getting someone no better, and potentially worse, why mess with it?

 

[StartingPrice]

:clap: spot on taff.
seriously agree mate.:clap:

Taff! Bluddy sod ya then:razz:

 

[si_yidarmy]

what a silly thread

 

[SpurSince57]

Do Jose Mourinho sides play good football though?

His Chelsea team by and large were quite boring, aside from the time he had Duff and Robben deployed as wingers either side of Drogba.

You can't go by Inter, what was Porto's style of play as I can't remember what they were like under him.

Klinsmann is relatively unproven, Hiddink has a wealth of experience.

As does Redknapp. ;-)

They play highly effective football, not necessarily entertaining football. I think it's reasonable to say that Mourinho would play the percentage game ('I do not entertain!' says Maximus) most of the time, but would do something totally wacko and gung-ho when circumstances dictated.

This type of thread is so utterly retarded.

 

[arnoldlayne]

1) Very pithy, very aphoristic - so, just how much success did Fergie have in his first 5 (FIVE) years?

2) Personally, I agree with this. As I said above. IMHO it is very previous of US to be talking about shipping 'Arry out as a dead donkey ripe for flogging, and he hasn't even had a full season in charge, and we can't actually say he can't take us any further until he's, like, failed, my attitude to managers is exactly the same as with players. If, for whatever reason (say, for instance, 'Arry really does want to retire from football at the end of the season), we woke up tomorrow morning and, say, Mourinho was manager, and he did make us genuine big time, who would I be to question it too much, and why wuold I want to? (Please no 'Mourinho's style of play' debates, that would miss the point). My concern is the success of the club, no one twitchy, slightly dodgy, and very affluent manager. While I believe he is as good as we are gonna get, and the stability of keeping him is gonna outweigh the risk of getting someone no better, and potentially worse, why mess with it?

YEAR ONE 1986-87 11th
YEAR TWO 1987-88 2nd
YEAR THREE 1988-89 11th
YEAR FOUR 1989-90 FA Cup winners. 13th
YEAR FIVE 1990-91 European Cup Winner's Cup winners, 6th, Football League Cup runner-up
YEAR SIX 1991-92 League Cup winners, 2nd
YEAR SEVEN 1992-93 League Champions for 1st time under OWF
YEAR EIGHT 1993-94 League Champions, F.A. Cup Winners (8th time), Football League Cup runner-up

Pretty poor record for the first 5 years really

 

[StartingPrice]

YEAR ONE 1986-87 11th
YEAR TWO 1987-88 2nd
YEAR THREE 1988-89 11th
YEAR FOUR 1989-90 FA Cup winners. 13th
YEAR FIVE 1990-91 European Cup Winner's Cup winners, 6th, Football League Cup runner-up
YEAR SIX 1991-92 League Cup winners, 2nd
YEAR SEVEN 1992-93 League Champions for 1st time under OWF
YEAR EIGHT 1993-94 League Champions, F.A. Cup Winners (8th time), Football League Cup runner-up

Pretty poor record for the first 5 years really

:clap: Er, wait a minute, actually, no:roll:

Were you about back in the day, 'cos actually I was and I can tell you absolutely, without any suspicion whatsoever, that in the fourth year (and way, way beefore) United fans were clamouring for his head. They were very close to going out of the FA Cup, 13th was just not considered good enough. Even way into his 5th year (do the math:roll the Mancs were saying that one FA Cup and not even challenging for the league just wasn't good enough. Like I said, maybe you just weren't there, because the whole point about 'Fergie-to-United-Gate' was that he was brought in to end their mammoth wait for a league title (that they felt they were entitled to:roll. I can actually remember explaining to United supporting mates who were so clamouring (for his head) that he was a very good manager who they should be patient with - in the 5th year of his management. So, yeah, by the standards they were setting, and the money they were spending, finishing outside the top 10 in 3 out of 5 years was seen as pretty damned miserable actually, the FA Cup was a very lucky one, and pretty much saved his bacon if only temporarily, and only at the end of the fifth year when they got to the final and won the CWC was it seen as acceptable that he should remain coach...because, believe me, there were United fans who would have emasculated him just for not finishing in the top 4 (as the BIG was back in the day).

Ah, I can see how you are pinned. You think that because that would seem like a good haul to you, now, as a Spurs fan, that it would have been seen as acceptable to a United fan back in the day. It wasn't. For a start, we know that we are not capable of competing with Chelsea, United, Citeh, and probably ArseScum and Liverpool in the transfer market (or until recently this was true), whereas United had been dominating the transfer market of the day. Secondly, we have been working on 5 year plans, and working on building our position to eventually challenge our way into the Big 5, Fergie was brought in to make them challengers with immediate effect.

So, yeah, by the standards set for Fergie when he was hired that was a pretty poor record, AS A MATTER OF FACT!:wink:

Also, as the debate was about firing 'Arry and hiring Hiddinck, it should be seen in that context. 'Arry is set to be shipped out (if some have there say) because in his very first (full) year we are challenging for 4th and the FA Cup (and we don't know how that will turn out, yet). In his first full year, Fergie's United didn't win any trophies and didn't finish i the top 10. By this standard 'Arry should geet at least to the end of this year and then another 3, with the envisaged goal not (truthfully) being as high as United anyway. So, my original point that Fergie was given time before he achieved success and that this is conspicuously what has been abssent with our coaches is highly valid. Also, as I was responding to a post which claimed that success bred consistency, and not the other way round, then, as you will see from the above analysis of Fergie's first five years, my contention that Fergie got stability and consistency way before he got success is also factually correct.

So, what was your point