Do we need Dier now?

Discussion in 'Spurs Chat' started by Maske2g, Aug 26, 2017.

  1. Clark28

    Clark28 Well-Known Member

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    Yes we need Dier, it's a long season and if Vic or a CB were to get injured we'll be thanking our lucky stars that Dier is still here.
     
  2. Bus-Conductor

    Bus-Conductor SC Supporter

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    So every international player is world class ?

    I think that's a pretty ridiculous statement unless your interpretation of world class is different to most peoples?
     
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  3. Bus-Conductor

    Bus-Conductor SC Supporter

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    My views of Dier as a CM/DM are pretty well known, I think he's a very poor one in most respects, he can't press very well because he's easily spun, he doesn't want to receive the ball if there's anyone within five yards of him, his movement off the ball is lethargic and unimaginative, his passing is ultra safe, lacks any incision whatsoever and he kills tempo. Everyone seems to be saying "his flexibility is key to how we play" but this is bollocks too, being able to retreat 10 yards into the back line is not some tactical road to Damascus, having a CM who could tackle, move and pass quickly with a modicum of incisiveness would be far more tactically liberating.

    And anyone quoting his England's performances in his defence as a CM are fucking bonkers, they were amongst some of the worst individual (by Dier) and team performances (influenced by Dier trundling) I've seen from England lately, (I mean seriously - Scotland FFS ?) and when you consider the body of work we are comparing them to, that's a pretty damning statement.

    But what I don't understand is some of the heavy criticism of Dier as a CB. I think as a CB, if you take on board his age and experience, he's doing well. I think he's well on the way to being another Alderweireld; a player who didn't become the finished article until he was around 25/26, was a "squad" player at AMadrid, and had to take a loan move to a mid table PL club to get regular football. But Dier has similar qualities, they are both robust, tenacious types, comfortable on the ball but not great at moving with it, can read the game from CB (in Dier's case this will improve as it has with Alderweireld) and are leader types, especially Dier.

    I just wish Poch had never put him into CM, because I think he now sees CB as a demotion, I think if he just concentrated on playing CB he'd be a damn fine PL CB eventually, a a perfectly good one already, (I think he's already as good there as the likes of Maguire and Keane etc).
     
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  4. Ionman34

    Ionman34 SC Supporter

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    Good point and I like your reasoning.
    If such is the case, and Dier really does up his game, he'll really elevate himself into the elite for that role, if he manages to oust Wanyama who was, arguably, as effective as Kante last season.
     
  5. Ionman34

    Ionman34 SC Supporter

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    Nothing idiotic about it at all, as evidenced by some of the replies that have weighed him up against his peers.
    The general consensus is that Dier should stay, that doesn't preclude the discussion though. He does polarise opinion and there are valid arguments that he appears to be slipping down the pecking order, in the opinion of more than a few posters anyway. Just as valid are the arguments regarding his mentality and his overall value to the squad, not just in a specific role but in all the intangibles like mentality and contribution to the team spirit.

    On the whole I think it's been quite a good debate with a variety of views put forward and discussed.
     
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  6. glacierSpurs

    glacierSpurs Well-Known Member

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    Yes, no question about it.
     
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  7. cockerel downunder

    cockerel downunder Active Member

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    I think you are probably right as things stand but that doesn't mean he can't improve given a full season in midfield and training as a midfielder. I'm sure they can improve his agility with dedicated exercises, they managed to make Kane faster and rose more robust!
     
  8. FreddieYid

    FreddieYid Well-Known Member

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    He's our 3rd best CB (until Davison proves otherwise).

    He's our 2nd best DM.

    Is he amazing? No.

    Is he important? Yes. Both on and off the pitch.
     
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  9. cockerel downunder

    cockerel downunder Active Member

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    Sorry to go off topic but quick question: if the transfer forum suddenly disappears does that imply one has been tapped with the proverbial ban stick?
     
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  10. Bulletspur

    Bulletspur The Reasonable Advocate

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    Really?

    Very strange indeed!
     
  11. FreddieYid

    FreddieYid Well-Known Member

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    Yep
     
  12. Bulletspur

    Bulletspur The Reasonable Advocate

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    Sanchez is definitely better than him as both a CB and DM. Wanyama and Dembele are also better than him as a DM. So 4th at best in both positions. And I say at best because you could reasonably throw Wimmer and Winks in the mix
     
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  13. mpickard2087

    mpickard2087 Fantastic Member

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    Agree with all that, apart from that he is a leader, which everyone seems to think but I just don't see.

    I think its worrying if Poch has promised him he can play primarily in midfield from now on.
     
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  14. Tottenham_God

    Tottenham_God Well-Known Member

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    Yes, i dont think anyone will be accusing Mark Milligan of being world class anytime soon
     
  15. Shadydan

    Shadydan Well-Known Member

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    Have you seen Sanchez play as a DMF?
     
  16. agrdavidsfan

    agrdavidsfan Ledley's Knee!

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    I think he's actually one of the only players that seems to have regressed under poch.

    He needs to sharpen up his foot work he seems to take an age to make decisions
     
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  17. 'O Zio

    'O Zio Active Member

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    Spot on.
     
  18. Maske2g

    Maske2g SC Supporter

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    60 million.

    Christ. He cant tie Wanyama’s laces.
     
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  19. ernie78

    ernie78 Well-Known Member

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    Been disappointing this season, was my favourite player a few seasons back but hasn’t been the same since England’s shambolic Euros
     
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  20. WiganSpur

    WiganSpur Well-Known Member

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    I don't rate him in central midfield as much as I do at centre back nowadays.
     
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