Ratings vs Arsenal

[Spurger King]

Fucking hell, you're unbelievable. You probably fucking expect us to outplay Arsenal, which is never ever going to happen at this moment in time.


For all your long posts and supposed knowledge/tactical genius, I actually think I know more about football than you.

Crazy stuff.

Nah.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Just read your ratings. Think that's very harsh considering our recent struggles. I thought we defended well and limited Arsenal to very few clear cut chances.

In fact, we had the better clear cut chances. I agree our passing, decision making and overall attacking play lacked quality but had we produced more, in that respect, we could of been talking about an impressive victory tonight.

I know were this debate will be heading though - possession football versus soaking up pressure and countering. And you know what, we adopted the latter today and it should of won us the game - a prospect nobody believed possible before kick off.

Yet, like last season, there we had 57% and lost it.

It's not just about possession v not possession Mr P. We were shit without the ball. watch what Dortmund did to Arsenal. I'm not expecting us to be that good, but we could have pressed them, and maybe caused them some problems and counter attacked without taking too many risks.. We had 11 touches of the ball in their fucking end.

If you're going to tell me you enjoyed that bollocks more than last season or think those tactics, if that's what they were, are more viable than even risk averse possession then you are a lost cause Mr P.

That today was the bottom level of tactical basics. Turn up, park and pray. Any **** can come up with that plan.

@Blake Griffin probably invented it in his bedroom on his 11th birthday.

 

[Blake Griffin]

Just read your ratings. Think that's very harsh considering our recent struggles. I thought we defended well and limited Arsenal to very few clear cut chances.

In fact, we had the better clear cut chances. I agree our passing, decision making and overall attacking play lacked quality but had we produced more, in that respect, we could of been talking about an impressive victory tonight.

I know were this debate will be heading though - possession football versus soaking up pressure and countering. And you know what, we adopted the latter today and it should of won us the game - a prospect nobody believed possible before kick off.

Yet, like last season, there we had 57% and lost it.

i much preferred today's display compared to last season's, i also knew bus would hate it. last season we may well have had 57% of the ball but it took us until around the 93rd minute to do anything with it and we were continually robbed in dangerous areas whilst going side-to-side, we had hugo to thank for not getting turned over by three or four. i'm also fairly sure arsenal were happy to allow us to have the ball rather than us actually "out-footballing" them. today i never felt we were in any particular danger of conceding and we looked threatening(but kept messing it up) on the counter.

 

[Dan Yeats]

Wow - that's as close to unanimous as I've ever seen one of these polls!

 

[Mr Pink]

It's not just about possession v not possession Mr P. We were shit without the ball. watch what Dortmund did to Arsenal. I'm not expecting us to be that good, but we could have pressed them, and maybe caused them some problems and counter attacked without taking too many risks.. We had 11 touches of the ball in their fucking end.

If you're going to tell me you injured that bollocks more than last season or think those tactics, if that's what they were, are more viable than even risk averse possession then you are a lost cause Mr P.

That today was the bottom level of tactical basics. Turn up, park and pray. Any **** can come up with that plan.

@Blake Griffin probably invented it in his bedroom on his 11th birthday.

The bottom line is we limited their chances and we should of scored more.

I think given the lack of confidence we've been showing recently it was a hard working performance, and we defended well..albeit deeply.

What disappointed me was our counter attacking at times, we should of hurt them more - let them off the hook too much. Our very first counter we had three on one and Lamela, IIRC, fucked up the pass...it would of developed into a certain one on one with their keeper had he got the pass right.

When you're up against a better footballing team, and away in their back yard, you just have to respect that and reflect it in your game plan.

In any case its the best way to play against Arsenal - congest the central areas just outside the box and look to counter them.

We did that tonight and have taken something from the game, and possibly should of had more.

It doesn't mean we have to use it again anytime soon. Its a NLD, as Poch said its emotional.

We got a result and I don't give a fuck what anyone says, I would of bitten your arm off for a draw before kick off - with no thought whatsoever as to how we managed it.

 

[mpickard2087]

It's not just about possession v not possession Mr P. We were shit without the ball. watch what Dortmund did to Arsenal. I'm not expecting us to be that good, but we could have pressed them, and maybe caused them some problems and counter attacked without taking too many risks.. We had 11 touches of the ball in their fucking end.

If you're going to tell me you enjoyed that bollocks more than last season or think those tactics, if that's what they were, are more viable than even risk averse possession then you are a lost cause Mr P.

That today was the bottom level of tactical basics. Turn up, park and pray. Any **** can come up with that plan.

@Blake Griffin probably invented it in his bedroom on his 11th birthday.

I agree with some of what you say BC, the front four could have pressed the ball, or specifically got in behind the ball a lot better at times and our lack of quality on the counter needs to be better if we play that way again, but to be honest I didn't mind our all out defence efforts. I've said after a couple of these thrashings now, I'm happy for us to put in a solid defensive effort in these 'big' games and take a draw. We aren't presently good enough to go up against these teams and try and out-football them. Maybe in the future, not currently. I'm content with a gritty defensive display and not losing.

It's against the cannon fodder of the league that I expect much more...

 

[Marty]

Alright. Sufficiently unclenched, woken up after a quick nap on the couch. Ratings time.

We could/should have pressed better even with a gameplan that was designed to soak up and counter. I thought we far too often let them get all the way to our box before they faced a Spurs player.

But for me the only real mistake Poch made was not putting Bentaleb straight on for Eriksen. Lennon contributed maybe a tiny bit if I'm generous in shutting Chambers down but did naff all else. Meanwhile Capoue and Mason tired, they went through us like butter and eventually and inevitably we conceded. We were far more solid once Bentaleb came on.

The back five did all that was asked of them and then some, especially Kaboul and Rose. Don't know what Danny's been doing over the summer but it's worked. Possibly England's best LB on current form.

Lloris - 8 - A couple of great saves, especially the Mertesacker header. Vital.

Naughton - 7 - Was only in trouble when isolated against several Goons. Did very well one-on-one.
Kaboul - 8.5 - Got in the way of everything, played like he did pre-injury. MOTM.
Vertonghen - 7 - A couple of uncostly brainfarts but it's nice to see him back in the XI. Vastly superior to Chiriches.
Rose - 7.5 - Solid and tried to get forward a bit too.

Capoue - 7 - Did well but faded.
Mason - 7 - As good a league debut as we could've hoped for. Tired simultaneously with Capoue around the 60 min mark, which was very unfortunate.

Lamela - 7 - Great pass for the goal, still headless chicked at times but marks for effort.
Eriksen - 5.5 - One good involvement and it lead to the goal. Clearly uncomfortable with this set-up.
Chadli - 6.5 - Did very little apart from score, which earns an extra point. Good finish.

Adebayor - 4 - I know it's hard being a striker in a team set up primarily to sit back and counter. But he could at least have tried.

-----

Lennon - 5 - Disappointing cameo, again.
Bentaleb - 7 - Solidified the team and helped us maintain the point.

 

[THFCSPURS19]

Nah.

Probably not more knowledgable but definitely more realistic....

 

[tottenmal]

Kaboom was just fantastic today. Leaving the pub all the arsenal fan walking next to me kept on saying (apart from it was our cup final blah blah) was that Kabool was phenomenal. He gave it all today. Let him and verts get a run of games together and let's see what happens

 

[Mr Pink]

I agree with some of what you say BC, the front four could have pressed the ball, or specifically got in behind the ball a lot better at times and our lack of quality on the counter needs to be better if we play that way again, but to be honest I didn't mind our all out defence efforts. I've said after a couple of these thrashings now, I'm happy for us to put in a solid defensive effort in these 'big' games and take a draw. We aren't presently good enough to go up against these teams and try and out-football them. Maybe in the future, not currently. I'm content with a gritty defensive display and not losing.

It's against the cannon fodder of the league that I expect much more...

Exactly, and even more pertinent - is we arn't good enough to go up against them when we're so early in our development under Pochettino, that's extremely evident right now.

Arsenal thought they were in for a feast tonight given the way we've been playing lately.

In the short term he's adjusted his style to get some improvement and confidence back.

Deserves credit for that IMO.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

i much preferred today's display compared to last season's, i also knew bus would hate it. last season we may well have had 57% of the ball but it took us until around the 93rd minute to do anything with it and we were continually robbed in dangerous areas whilst going side-to-side, we had hugo to thank for not getting turned over by three or four. i'm also fairly sure arsenal were happy to allow us to have the ball rather than us actually "out-footballing" them. today i never felt we were in any particular danger of conceding and we looked threatening(but kept messing it up) on the counter.

Unlike the plethora of chances we created today ?

Weird how Arsenal didn't go for letting us out football them today, seeing as it worked so well for them last year.

 

[guiltyparty]

I was waiting for BC to pop up and redress the balance. Lovely stuff

I'm not quite as disappointed as that, as I thought we'd get tonked, but I agree with a lot of it. Especially the pub footballer comment - our attacking was largely awful. I can't believe some of these guys are pro footballers sometimes - the constant miscontroling, wayward passing, the lack of composure bar the goal, which was incredibly uncharacteristic but very welcome, our forever useless corners, the fact that Adebayor is permanently deep or wide so we have no one up top.

None of the front four came out with much credit I thought. Feels like I was watching a different game. We defended well, Kaboul (MOTM) and Rose especially, Lloris had a worldy, Mason gave a decent showing in a hard game and Arsenal gave the ball back to us as much as we did to them. The first half was an awful game of football to watch.

Really, I thought today showed how average both teams are currently, to be honest. But I'd have snatched a 1-1 before the game, as clearly Pochettino would, as we played to nick a goal from the off. A necessary evil perhaps. Onwards

 

[Mr Pink]

Unlike the plethora of chances we created today ?

Weird how Arsenal didn't go for letting us out football them today, seeing as it worked so well for them last year.

BC, we created much better quality chances today than we did last season there.

You're seriously not disputing that are you?

 

[thinktank]

I just know that there will be idiots on here calling that a tactical master class. I call that a tactical apology scribbled on a post it note and stuck on a fridge door.

Glenn Roeder could have come up with that. In fact he probably did. Fuck knows every other shit **** with zero ambition has come up with the same plan.

That's assuming it was "a plan".

Yay, we went away to Arsenal, parked a bus, skanked a goal and then parked it some more, then lost a goal, then parked it some more. I can hardly contain myself.

West Brom showed much more ambition and tactical nous against us last week. As did West Ham against Liverpool.

We weren't even great without the ball. Just because you want to contain and sit a bit deeper doesn't mean you don't press the football. In fact, if you want to play counter attacking football, it's fucking obligatory.

Chadli and Eriksen were ambling around engaging no fucker, and Adebayor needs a fucking PCP suppository. The bloke just walked around like it he was at a garden party at the imperial Togalise majesty's summer residence. How the fuck is Pochettino picking him right now. I'd rather Kane up front right now.

The only time Eriksen actually tackled anyone it resulted in a goal. If only we'd actually tried that more often ?

As a result of Chadli, Adebayor ad Eriksen's ten yard walking exclusion zone, Arsenal found it piss easy to walz through the the lines and this put extreme pressure on Capoue and Mason, neither were great, but Mason in a CM2 in this game was stupider than what Sherwood did in his first game last season. The boy spent most of the game chasing his tail and rarely finding it. This isn't a outright criticism of Mason, I hope he has a role to play in easier games, better tactically organised, but he wasn't great today - no one was.

Lamela was like an Argentine Townsend for the first half. He clearly has ability, and his tenacity and willingness to try and engage the opposition when he hasn't got the ball is commendable, but he's really got to compose himself at times and do the fucking simple thing. Lay a simple ball off to someone in a good position. Don't commit a stupid foul after the ref has just warned you about totting up. Credit for his work off the ball today and setting up another goal, but he's still got some learning to do.

Mind boggling to me was when we were hanging on for dear life did Pochettino not take off one of the forward players and put Bentaleb in. Try and shore up the midfield and cut off the supply that was continually pumping at us and inevitably led to a goal. I didn't mind Eriksen going off so much, but the straight swap for Lennon was tactically moribund.

Vertonghen and, particularly, Kaboul did what you want CB's to do on days like today, which is throw themselves at everything. That's great but I wouldn't expect a pair of CB's to do any less really. I was probably more impressed by the performance of Rose, who's energy and chippy tenacity was about the only thing you could call "positive". He refused to let Oxlade-Chamberlin have an easy day.

The three of four times we found ourselves in their half we looked like pub footballers, wasting the simplest chances to do something vaguely constructive. All bar once.

Individual stuff

Lloris - World class save that earned us a point.

Naughton - Decent performance on the back foot.

Kaboul - Strong.

Vertonghen - Decent game.

Rose - Good game.

Capoue - Pass of the game (on either side) for Chadli. Fighting fires the rest of the game. OK

Mason - Tough baptism. I don't think he was the right choice for this game, and didn't really have much influence on it, but hopefully he'll get easier chances to shine.

Eriksen - Ironic that the only time he engaged anyone it ended up with a goal. Shame he (and we) didn't do it more. Largely very disappointing in every other way.

Chadli - Fucked his first great chance horribly. Took his second one well. Was a passenger for the most part apart from those two moments.

Lamela - The boy's got talent, and he does produce something of quality nearly every time he plays, but he needs to do simple things sometimes too. Good effort off the ball.

Adebayor - Has Defoe performed some kind of Voodoo and got in his body ?

Subs - Who cares.


Early days, blah blah fucking blah.

Haha yeah, you don't fool me BC, I know a 'play bentaleb instead of Mason' post when I see it.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

I agree with some of what you say BC, the front four could have pressed the ball, or specifically got in behind the ball a lot better at times and our lack of quality on the counter needs to be better if we play that way again, but to be honest I didn't mind our all out defence efforts. I've said after a couple of these thrashings now, I'm happy for us to put in a solid defensive effort in these 'big' games and take a draw. We aren't presently good enough to go up against these teams and try and out-football them. Maybe in the future, not currently. I'm content with a gritty defensive display and not losing.

It's against the cannon fodder of the league that I expect much more...

I wouldn't have minded us sitting a bit deeper and taking a risk averse approach at all, but we didn't press them at all, there was no counter attacking just waiting for Arsenal to fuck up on the edge of our box and someone going on a lone charge up the pitch until he realised he was on his own.

I love a decent counter attacking strategy, but that involves you actually proactively trying to catch them on the hop. We were so shocked to have the ball the few times we did it caught us on the hop.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Haha yeah, you don't fool me BC, I know a 'play bentaleb instead of Mason' post when I see it.

How about both, with Capoue in the middle.

 

[guiltyparty]

i much preferred today's display compared to last season's, i also knew bus would hate it. last season we may well have had 57% of the ball but it took us until around the 93rd minute to do anything with it and we were continually robbed in dangerous areas whilst going side-to-side, we had hugo to thank for not getting turned over by three or four. i'm also fairly sure arsenal were happy to allow us to have the ball rather than us actually "out-footballing" them. today i never felt we were in any particular danger of conceding and we looked threatening(but kept messing it up) on the counter.

But Arsenal were terrible till we scored. They were there for the taking today, really really poor

We treated them like they were Barcelona

 

[THFCSPURS19]

I guarantee you if we 'went for it', we would have left our defence exposed so many times and would've been beaten by 3 or 4

 

[The Long Suffering One]

Ade's first NLD as a vice-captain and he plays like as if it was pre-season.. I'm sorry but if you can't be bothered to turn up for the the mother of all league games in your capacity as an assistant captain, notwithstanding the fact that you behave likewise in other games as well, then I hope he gets sold off in Jan or next summer.

 

[fortworthspur]

Kaboul was fantastic, as noted by just about everybody. A proper Captain today. Ericksen was woeful, apart from the tackle that set up the goal. We conceded the middle and possession most of the game and it wasnt because Mason and Capoue weren't trying. Ade showed why Soldado deserves a run of games, or even Kane. His role is now limited to loitering in the corner and then passing it back to the midfield. Everybody else put in a good shift and earned a deserved point. Good game for the club.