what do we need?

[joey55]

O right, this is the kind of thing i'm getting at. Does anyone have any knowledge or strong suspictions as to a new formation or the role in which players may be implimented.

Did Sevilla play 4-4-2 or a 4-2-3-1.

And surely we can't just play Berbatov on his own, you just can't leave Keane out!

He largelly played 442. The 4231 is a popular formation in Spain and many including myself have suggested it for us. However, I'm not so sure the WHL faithful would accept it. It's such a boring way to play football. Capello lost his job at Madrid despite winning the title with it, because the football is so terrible to watch. Two deffensive midfield players and little width isn't exaclty the Tottenham way. If we are in the top 4 it'll be fine, but I suspect if we spend most of the time in the UEFA Cup spots, then the crowd would want to be entertained a little more.

 

[milkman]

mmm... I think we need a new stadium! :up:

 

[lukespurs7]

He largelly played 442. The 4231 is a popular formation in Spain and many including myself have suggested it for us. However, I'm not so sure the WHL faithful would accept it. It's such a boring way to play football. Capello lost his job at Madrid despite winning the title with it, because the football is so terrible to watch. Two deffensive midfield players and little width isn't exaclty the Tottenham way. If we are in the top 4 it'll be fine, but I suspect if we spend most of the time in the UEFA Cup spots, then the crowd would want to be entertained a little more.

yea but say we played that, surely with bale,hutton,dos santos,lennon,modric,keane,berby? we'd play nice footy anyway.

 

[SpurSince57]

He largelly played 442. The 4231 is a popular formation in Spain and many including myself have suggested it for us. However, I'm not so sure the WHL faithful would accept it. It's such a boring way to play football. Capello lost his job at Madrid despite winning the title with it, because the football is so terrible to watch. Two deffensive midfield players and little width isn't exaclty the Tottenham way. If we are in the top 4 it'll be fine, but I suspect if we spend most of the time in the UEFA Cup spots, then the crowd would want to be entertained a little more.

Isn't 4-2-3-1 just a fancy way of describing a variant of 4-5-1?

Not that 4-5-1 need be defensive—our 1986-87 side should be ample proof of that—but if it isn't to be, you need the players to make it work.

With, currently, three strikers to keep happy, playing just the one up front (which, effectively, means either Berbatov or Bent, because with the best will in the world I can't see Keano turning into Clive Allen) seems a non-starter to me.

 

[fortworthspur]

in order of priority:

1. CB, assuming King is forever hobbled

everything else depends on Berbatov. Im assuming King is done. If Berbs stays, get another keeper then worry about midfield. If Berbs leaves, get another striker that can retain possession and distribute like him or a quality attacking CM. If you opt for the creative, attacking mid, a 4th striker is still needed. then a keeper. either way, if Berbs goes, Id find some creativity in attack before another keeper.




God please, let Berbatov stay.

 

[Bulletspur]

Based on what we have now ie King, GDS, Modric and Berbatov, our priority would now be a goal keeper (whether or not Robbo stays) and Defensive midfielder in the mould of Carrick / Makalele.

However if King still injured and Berbatov was to leave it would be a different story...............

 

[Mullers]

We need a GK jaaskelainen is a good shout, a CB I suggest Tal Ben Haim. DM, heard good things about Del la Red, Makoun, Veloso. I'd love us to get Xabi Alonso but there isn't much chance Liverpool will sell to us. Maybe bring in another good creative passer in midfield, Granero was linked with us at one stage or Lucho. Bring in Bentley and SWP at a combined cost of 25-30m get rid of Lennon for say 10m. Buy another LB (Nicky shorey) so that we have an option to push Bale or Gilberto further forward. If Tanio goes to Hamburg bring in Stephen Appiah or Kim Kallstrom.

 

[DC_Boy]

Hi Mullers Very much agree with the general drift of your post, which is that our squad is still way too thin to be considered top 4 contenders -

we definitely need 3 or 4 more good or better players in key positions before we're looking like we can do anything re champs lge

 

[Mullers]

Hi Mullers Very much agree with the general drift of your post, which is that our squad is still way too thin to be considered top 4 contenders -

we definitely need 3 or 4 more good or better players in key positions before we're looking like we can do anything re champs lge

Hi DC. To be honest I don't expect us to be challenging the top four next season. I'm really looking for us to be top of that chasing pack and hopefully give some payback especially to Newcastle.

 

[DC_Boy]

Hi DC. To be honest I don't expect us to be challenging the top four next season. I'm really looking for us to be top of that chasing pack and hopefully give some payback especially to Newcastle.

agreed re top 4 - it's just that quite a few posters seem to think we're top 4 contenders already - as you say we ain't -

however such has been the determination we've already shown in the transfer market since Ramos came - I won't rule out a massive buying spree that does get us into contention by this time in September - but history tells me it won't happen :violin:

 

[Mullers]

agreed re top 4 - it's just that quite a few posters seem to think we're top 4 contenders already - as you say we ain't -

however such has been the determination we've already shown in the transfer market since Ramos came - I won't rule out a massive buying spree that does get us into contention by this time in September - but history tells me it won't happen :violin:

I never thought we were top four contenders even when Jol was in charge. I think people have been spoiled by two top five finishes. As pointed out we need squad capable of competing with the top four on a consistent basis rather than just waiting and hoping for one of the top four to have a bad season.

 

[lukespurs7]

blimey mullers if we got them we'd be title contenders not just top4. I'd like to think with modric and dos santos we are pushing closer to the top4 standard and if we get a CB and GK then that'll be lovely. Any more i.e Upgrade winger(Bentley) upgrade DM(Veloso) we'd be turning into some team!

 

[Mullers]

blimey mullers if we got them we'd be title contenders not just top4. I'd like to think with modric and dos santos we are pushing closer to the top4 standard and if we get a CB and GK then that'll be lovely. Any more i.e Upgrade winger(Bentley) upgrade DM(Veloso) we'd be turning into some team!

I don't know how good Dos Santos is to be honest. I've heard good things about the guy. Modric I rate highly, my worry is that we become to reliant on him in Center midfield. Look at the options Man U, Chelsea and Arsenal have in midfield. We need to have those kind of options too. I was disappointed when we didn't upgrade the midfield last season.

 

[Kendall]

A capable, no-nonesense midfield boss, a capable, no-nonesense central defender who can play week in week out and a steady, non-flashy keeper.

An additional right-sided midfielder would be a bonus as we only have 1.

 

[knilly]

a solid dependable GK

and a quality DM to stop stops raining in on our solid dependable GK from outside our area.

other than that a central defender who's a threat from set peices and we've got the makings of a fantastic squad.

 

[mill]

He largelly played 442. The 4231 is a popular formation in Spain and many including myself have suggested it for us. However, I'm not so sure the WHL faithful would accept it. It's such a boring way to play football. Capello lost his job at Madrid despite winning the title with it, because the football is so terrible to watch. Two deffensive midfield players and little width isn't exaclty the Tottenham way. If we are in the top 4 it'll be fine, but I suspect if we spend most of the time in the UEFA Cup spots, then the crowd would want to be entertained a little more.

I disagree with you there, 4321 can be very attacking if you set your team up for attack with qaulity attacking players, Portugal played that way they other night and they weren't defensive. You can say 442 is defensive or attacking depends how the team play.


Barca play

Valdes
Zambrotta Puyol Milito Abidal
Toure
Xavi Deco
Messi Ronaldinho
Eto'o

Thats widely regarded as one of the best attacking teams in the world a 433

Valdes
Zambrotta Puyol Milito Abidal
Toure Xavi
Messi Deco Ronaldinho
Eto'o
Same team in 4231 I wouln't call that boring

 

[joey55]

I disagree with you there, 4321 can be very attacking if you set your team up for attack with qaulity attacking players, Portugal played that way they other night and they weren't defensive. You can say 442 is defensive or attacking depends how the team play.


Barca play

Valdes
Zambrotta Puyol Milito Abidal
Toure
Xavi Deco
Messi Ronaldinho
Eto'o

Thats widely regarded as one of the best attacking teams in the world a 433

Valdes
Zambrotta Puyol Milito Abidal
Toure Xavi
Messi Deco Ronaldinho
Eto'o
Same team in 4231 I wouln't call that boring

These are fair points, but I think you have to distinguish between a 433 and a 4231, otherwise they'd just both be called 433. The key difference being the "2" part, which is usually occupied by 2 DMs. The classic example being Real Madrid under Capello, with Emerson and Diarra. I think what we are talking about in this thread is usuing 2 DMs in front of our back 4. I know on the TV graphics the other night they had Portugal down as a 4231, but if you go to the telegraph website and check the player density, you'll see Moutinho and Deco played in front of Petit who played in the holding role. But, having said that, the Dutch played 2 holding players and were good to watch.

 

[Bulletspur]

agreed re top 4 - it's just that quite a few posters seem to think we're top 4 contenders already - as you say we ain't -

however such has been the determination we've already shown in the transfer market since Ramos came - I won't rule out a massive buying spree that does get us into contention by this time in September - but history tells me it won't happen :violin:

I never thought we were top four contenders even when Jol was in charge. I think people have been spoiled by two top five finishes. As pointed out we need squad capable of competing with the top four on a consistent basis rather than just waiting and hoping for one of the top four to have a bad season.

I agree with both. Although finishing fifth on two recent occasions, I still dont consider us top four material just yet. There is still alot to be done but we are heading in the right direction.

 

[yanno]

The key difference being the "2" part, which is usually occupied by 2 DMs. The classic example being Real Madrid under Capello, with Emerson and Diarra. I think what we are talking about in this thread is usuing 2 DMs in front of our back 4. I know on the TV graphics the other night they had Portugal down as a 4231, but if you go to the telegraph website and check the player density, you'll see Moutinho and Deco played in front of Petit who played in the holding role. But, having said that, the Dutch played 2 holding players and were good to watch.

You're correct that 4-2-3-1 can mean two out-and-out holding DMs, and under Capello at Real Madrid it often did. But Schuster sometimes played 4-2-3-1 this season and always had at least one "passing" DM, usually Gago, and his "3" would be very attacking. Sometimes Schuster even stuck Guti or Sneijder next to Gago and dropped Diarra, so his "2" were hardly out-and-out holding DMs. When Benitez used 4-2-3-1 at Liverpool late in the season, Xabi Alonso would usually play alongside Mascherano, so again there was a passer next to a destroyer.

In the Spurs context, if Ramos plays with wingers and Modric centrally next season, then we need at least one out-and-out DM. Modric could certainly play the Gago/Xabi Alonso role in a 4-2-3-1, although personally I'd rather play him nearer the opposition penalty area.

 

[DJS]

I think the top priority now is a good quality defensive midfield.

Next, a goalkeeper (either to compete or replace Robinson). If Robbo leaves another goalkeeper will be needed.

Then a centre back - some people have said Ben Haim and I'd agree with that (although now Grant has left situation at Chelski may have changed).

Other players that would be nice if obtainable are David Bentley and Nicky Shorey but the ones above are more pressing.

Oh and of course persuading Berbs to stay would probably top that lot! :up: