Attacking purchases under Poch

[Metalhead]

No, basically we need to spend wiser with less scatter gun on hope for potential because our scouts don’t seem to be particularly good at finding gens.

Yes, if Levy doesn’t want a £1bn white elephant on his hands he needs to step up our purchasing and wages budgets. Come next season we will have the highest gate receipts in the league. Our top price executive seats will cost £7,000 per season compared to £4,000 at the goons. You can’t expect us, the fans, to pay more than any other club to watch the team and then serve up second tier product.

Well let's hope that he can find another gem like Suarez:

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...o-liverpool-to-sign-luis-suarez-a7572371.html

 

[brendanb50]

I get the point the OP is making here but the comparison actually doesn't aid the point particularly.

First off - i know we're addressing our relative thriftiness vs. our rivals but short term, this will not change. I don't want to quash opinion on the subject but i'd bet my house that there will not be significant overspend in fees or wages short term - we simply do not have the commercials to compete with City, Chelsea and United in particular and equally with the goons or Liverpool. Wanting this to change is one thing and it will once our stadium begins paying for itself but until then, for your own good fellas - expect more of the same.

The other point the comparison actually highlights IMO is that the other teams are generally as hit and miss as we are in signing players. OK when City buy quality and it works out, it tends to be on an immediate, top draw level (less adapting, bedding in, quicker results) but equally they did waste £63m on Bony, Roberts (who is still young and may come good eventually) and Nolito. The thing worth noting here is that they can afford to piss £63m up the wall - hell they can afford to throw £150m up the wall if they choose to and we generally can't - not without either balancing the books to a zero or minus net spend or by making our money back on the player when they don't work out.

Another key thing which slightly dampens the point made is that we have outscored many of the teams noted in the past few seasons consistently, so we're not too hard done by.

For what it's worth i agree with the points i think we're driving at here - a big issue from my perspective in the past few seasons (or longer) is that we lack the ability to really change up in an attacking sense from the bench and throw a new threat into the game. Lamela was our only real option for that at the weekend.

When our squad is fully fit it may be a bit more favourable than Lamela alone but our attacking options definitely fall short compared to our defense and midfield (who i think we can switch up almost completely and still have strength and quality showing). I've seen a few things suggesting we may be more active this window than previous but lets face it - only if the right player is available at the right price - we won't be throwing silly money at the problem.

 

[JUSTINSIGNAL]

The real irony is that in past seasons we have targeted Martial, Depay and Sane only for them or their clubs to reject us in favour of a bigger pay day.

It's not that we don't go after quality attacking players, it's more that our direct rivals also do too. And we just can't compete with them so we have to change tack and take punts, which, by their very nature, will sometimes work out and sometimes not.

As with most of these threads the real frustration fans have is that we just don't have enough money.

 

[Thewobbler]

His first choices seem out of financial reach so we end up with the Nkoudous and njies who just aren't up to it it seems.

The problem now is the likes of zaha and co are going to be costing big money so either levy puts up or we keep ending up with 2nd rate players and being nearly men.

 

[SugarRay]

I don't understand, the play off final where Eriksen single-handedly dragged his country to the world cup is literally an example of him turning up in a big game.

Relatively speaking, I guess it can be argued as such. It’s a play off though, to qualify for a tournament. Against a very, very, very average opponent. In ‘Tottenham terms’ it’s similar to beating Southampton to secure a finish in the top 4 perhaps.

The genuine big games, World Cup wise, don’t start until the summer, in the actual tournament.

 

[Shadydan]

Relatively speaking, I guess it can be argued as such. It’s a play off though, to qualify for a tournament. Against a very, very, very average opponent. In ‘Tottenham terms’ it’s similar to beating Southampton to secure a finish in the top 4 perhaps.

The genuine big games, World Cup wise, don’t start until the summer, in the actual tournament.

It's a high pressure game, when Ronaldo scored the hat trick against Sweden to take his team to the Euro's and when Messi did the same against Ecuador to take his team to the world cup they were heralded and rightly so so why can't Eriksen against similar opposition?

It's a bit of a strange thing to say in all honesty, in our big games he's always been on of our better players, either scoring or assisting.

 

[brendanb50]

His first choices seem out of financial reach so we end up with the Nkoudous and njies who just aren't up to it it seems.

The problem now is the likes of zaha and co are going to be costing big money so either levy puts up or we keep ending up with 2nd rate players and being nearly men.

On the whole i agree - we do need to catch these 'top' targets earlier (like we did with Modric/Berbatov but that was a while back now), although i do think we find smart ways around these potential budgetary issues, like catching players who's deals are running down or those with specific contract 'get-outs' like Dier/Alderweireld.

 

[LexingtonSpurs]

I love SC!

SC Collective: "We hate that teams like City and Chelsea can go out and buy titles!!!"

Same SC Collective: "We want to be more like City and Chelsea!!! Poch Out, Levy Out!!!"

 

[dontcallme]

I love SC!

SC Collective: "We hate that teams like City and Chelsea can go out and buy titles!!!"

Same SC Collective: "We want to be more like City and Chelsea!!! Poch Out, Levy Out!!!"

Yes it is strange that a site with thousands of members have opposing views.

 

[St José Dominguez]

Our attacking players in today's market have a combined value of close to £400m. Apart from City the value will be as much or more than all our rivals.
You don't have to necessarily pay £50m to create a £50m player the following year.
Think people are getting way too carried away just because we and our players are in shit form. We've got fantastic attacking players but are probably one short.

 

[jurgen]

The real irony is that in past seasons we have targeted Martial, Depay and Sane only for them or their clubs to reject us in favour of a bigger pay day.

It's not that we don't go after quality attacking players, it's more that our direct rivals also do too. And we just can't compete with them so we have to change tack and take punts, which, by their very nature, will sometimes work out and sometimes not.

As with most of these threads the real frustration fans have is that we just don't have enough money.

This is true, but our punts seem very 'punty' these days. We're usually told via ITK that we have a big long list of options, but more often than not lately, it seems we must be plumbing the depths at the last minute. The hype wonderkids won't come to us now, there's too much money in it for them.

However, someone like Son was a perfect level player for us, pretty young, at a very good price, not sure why we haven't tried for more players of his type of profile. Someone with a few years of real productivity at a good (i.e. Europa) level club but who is young enough to step up and financially attainable. Same with Eriksen although he was cheap because of his contract, he was young yet had proven himself very well at his current level.

But most of the punts we have gone for have barely any first team starts in a lower status league, or at most one good season / a year of semi-regular games behind them. They aren't the same profile of player we have had most success with.

 

[Guntz]

Well let's hope that he can find another gem like Suarez:

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...o-liverpool-to-sign-luis-suarez-a7572371.html

Suarez was doing the business at that time for Ajax and Uruguay, so he wasn't totally unknown property.

Trouble is for every Suarez there's a Janssen, just have to get lucky every once in a while.

 

[Janice]

And...?

And if we had a match against a c rated team which is a knockout i wouldnt get overexcited if any one of our starting eleven got a hat trick.
Against a b or a rated team then thats what people are talking about.
About eriksen going missing in a large proportion of games against the big batters not ireland ffs.

He gets goals against c rated teams last few seasons with aplomb but is,still not,world class because of,it

 

[jurgen]

Suarez was doing the business at that time for Ajax and Uruguay, so he wasn't totally unknown property.

Trouble is for every Suarez there's a Janssen, just have to get lucky every once in a while.

Suarez had a few seasons of banging goals in, Janssen had half a season. One had proven himself consistently great at his level, the other was a huge punt given a half-season burst could be put down to amazing form.. therein lies the difference.

 

[Shadydan]

And if we had a match against a c rated team which is a knockout i wouldnt get overexcited if any one of our starting eleven got a hat trick.
Against a b or a rated team then thats what people are talking about.
About eriksen going missing in a large proportion of games against the big batters not ireland ffs.

He gets goals against c rated teams last few seasons with aplomb but is,still not,world class because of,it

See my point about Messi and Ronaldo scoring hat tricks to take their countries to major tournaments which have been highly regarded, so if they can get ratings off the back of a performance which carried their countries to tournaments against 'c' rated teams then why can't Eriksen?

Also your ratings are entirely subjective, Denmark are hardly Germany and if they are playing for a finals berth it means they both finished in similar positions in their respective groups which mean that both teams were a good match for each other.

 

[tiger666]

Suarez had a few seasons of banging goals in, Janssen had half a season. One had proven himself consistently great at his level, the other was a huge punt given a half-season burst could be put down to amazing form.. therein lies the difference.

Jannsen scored 27 in a full season in 15/16. Before that scored 19 and 10 in the previous two seasons in the division below. Rather more than half a season.

 

[rossdapep]

Suarez was doing the business at that time for Ajax and Uruguay, so he wasn't totally unknown property.

Trouble is for every Suarez there's a Janssen, just have to get lucky every once in a while.

You also have to rely on expert scouting. I don't think it's out of stretch to say some scouts are much better than others. The guy at Sevilla for example. It was clear to see that Suarez was a brilliant prospect, he was dynamic and had the winning attitude. Whereas Janssen was much more of a penalty area striker, hardly fleet footed and looking a little heavy. Big differences between the two.

I personally think we messed up massively with Janssen and similary with Llorente because we should NOT have been looking for a rotation for Kane we should have been looking for a dynamic player - like Salah. Someone who can play anywhere in the front 4.

 

[Metalhead]

Suarez was doing the business at that time for Ajax and Uruguay, so he wasn't totally unknown property.

Trouble is for every Suarez there's a Janssen, just have to get lucky every once in a while.

We seem to get it right in many other parts of the team but not so much up front.

 

[JUSTINSIGNAL]

This is true, but our punts seem very 'punty' these days. We're usually told via ITK that we have a big long list of options, but more often than not lately, it seems we must be plumbing the depths at the last minute. The hype wonderkids won't come to us now, there's too much money in it for them.

However, someone like Son was a perfect level player for us, pretty young, at a very good price, not sure why we haven't tried for more players of his type of profile. Someone with a few years of real productivity at a good (i.e. Europa) level club but who is young enough to step up and financially attainable. Same with Eriksen although he was cheap because of his contract, he was young yet had proven himself very well at his current level.

But most of the punts we have gone for have barely any first team starts in a lower status league, or at most one good season / a year of semi-regular games behind them. They aren't the same profile of player we have had most success with.

I'm pretty sure we have. For example, ITK said we were on the verge for signing Keita Balde only for him to turn around and say he wanted to sign for Juventus instead. Then he ended up at Monaco as he knows they have no problem selling him on if he makes a success of his time there.

Point is, we obviously do target this level of player but the stars need to align for it to all go through. We haven't got a boat load of cash to throw around to tempt the player/club so everything really does need to work in our favour to get these deals done.

 

[jonathanhotspur]

This is a matter of grave concern, as far as I am concerned. If you go back a couple of summers, to when we needed a ball-playing central midfielder, and came home with Wanyama (as good as he is at what he does) instead, it was somewhat perplexing. It suggested Poch was a safety first coach.

His failure to sign technically proficient players over 6 or 7 transfer windows reflects badly on someone. I mean, the way we have compensated for our lack of creativity is with a ferocious high press, but that is not sustainable over a season. We are a possession-based side, jammed to the rafters with players who are, by and large, incapable of one- and two-touch football. What the hell type of philosophy is that?

Poch's been saying we need to get our business done earlier in the window, and I am glad to hear him turning up the heat on Levy. To think we could have had Zaha a long time ago, if only we didn't take the piss with our offers. Poch had the horn for him, he still has the horn for him, we need someone like him, but how much has all the dicking around cost us? And how many scouts have we hired and fired over the last couple of seasons, only to be faced with the same old rubbish of not addressing our most pressing needs?

The transfer window just gone by was a crock of shit. One attacking player added to the mix, the rest, defenders and a keeper. Our first eleven has been picking itself for too long now. Everyone knows how we are going to line up. Our attacking players have nobody to challenge them for their place, and they're complacent. It's shockingly negligent.